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Ponder 2013: Is He Is or Is He Ain't Our QB?
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ktarinze


Joined: 08 Oct 2010
Posts: 1365
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 10:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vike daddy wrote:
jshowers wrote:
I don't think there is too much discussion to be had on this matter anymore.

good luck with that!

Laughing


I think he actually may be right here. Even the lot that supported Ponder has said he is not the future, will it be discussed probably. Especially with this QB scenario we have. I don't even know who is starting the next game. If it is cassel this thread will probably die down. If not, then it will keep going.
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byuvike88


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 4:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seeing that Cassel has been named the starter for this weeks game, and it is not because of Ponder's injury that he is starting, is his career basically done? Do you think if the Vikings get any trade offers for him that they pull the trigger? Maybe another team out there looking for a young guy to try out for the rest of the season?
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byuvike88


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I should say, his career in Minnesota.
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vikingsrule


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 6:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

byuvike88 wrote:
I should say, his career in Minnesota.


at least as a starter, im still not convinced his career is over as a backup.
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Sir Fobos


Joined: 12 Dec 2010
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 3:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

With the addition of Freeman and the release of MBT it seems possible that Ponder will be assuming the role of emergency QB as soon as next week against the Giants. The Vikings' 3rd QB is usually inactive on game day, which is a far cry from being the unquestioned Week 1 starter a short time ago.

I wonder if this spells the end for Ponder, or if he can progress significantly in a reserve role until he gets another chance - in Minnesota or elsewhere.
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ArcticNorseman


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ponder, Cassel and Freeman . . . 3 QBs with NFL starting experience, all on one roster fighting for one job.

I'm not sure I've seen a roster have 3 QBs with such different skillsets, and if Freeman, with his size and arm, shows the leadership and smarts he needs then he'll win the starting job -- and the team should be better offensively. Right now, that's not the Achilles heel of this team . . . well, if you include turnovers from the offense, that's a major factor contributing to the 1-3 start.

I'd be surprised if Ponder gets another start in a Vikings uniform, which is unfortunate because I think he should've been pretty good . . . so, he fades off into the sunset much like Brady Quinn, Tim Couch and numerous other NFL QBs.
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Krauser


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not with a bang but a whimper.

Some of Ponder's passing stats improved this year (YPA, average depth of target, total yards) but that improvement should mostly be credited to the better WRs, a non-Harvin game plan that involved more downfield passing, and the rest of the team being considerably worse than 2012 (so they weren't protecting leads).

The decline in Ponder's passer rating and other efficiency stats is almost entirely due to the INTs. Which is a fair indicator of how much they hurt the team's chances of winning (and in retrospect, how his 2012 numbers were compatible with a winning team even if they weren't a major part of that success).

Don't think a repeat/continuation of his 2012 performance (short passing, few turnovers) would've won them many games this year. The defense has been way worse, the running game has been hit and miss and the O line got dominated by the Lions and Browns. They also had some bad luck: lost all 4 out of 4 fumbles between Ponder and Peterson in games 1-3 and had a couple of dropped TDs. They probably deserved to win either the Bears or Browns game but the team looked no better than 6-10 with Ponder starting the rest of the year.

In the end Ponder hasn't shown that he can be a productive passer (downfield targets, yards, TDs) without turning the ball over. His 2013 performance is quite a bit like his rookie season in 2011, when he threw downfield more but with limited success and too many INTs. 2012 is the outlier: the game plan and coaching allowed him to either throw short or throw it away, and the running game, defense and special teams were enough to carry the team even when Ponder contributed little beyond not screwing up.

I think the team did what it could to support him: officially unquestioned starter when healthy until late this week, added WR talent and kept the O-line together, called a game plan well suited to his strengths and weaknesses. You never know about coaching behind the scenes, but for whatever reason he didn't improve much, not nearly enough.

Spielman always said Ponder was being evaluated and they would know what they had in him after 30 starts. The Browns game was his 30th, doubt he gets another except as a backup in case of injury. Cassel was the plan to replace him (as was reported a couple of times, the "short leash" article among others). Freeman being on Spielman's long-time wish list and a potential legitimate franchise QB makes it that much easier to move on.

Ponder would make a decent backup here next year. He's cheaper than Cassel, who probably won't want to stay if Freeman takes over as starter and does well enough to earn a long-term contract from the Vikings.
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Worm Guts


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vikingsrule wrote:
byuvike88 wrote:
I should say, his career in Minnesota.


at least as a starter, im still not convinced his career is over as a backup.


I think the odds are that he's gone at the end of the season. I think out of Ponder, Freeman and Cassel only 1 will be with the team next season.
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SteelKing728


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

byuvike88 wrote:
Seeing that Cassel has been named the starter for this weeks game, and it is not because of Ponder's injury that he is starting, is his career basically done? Do you think if the Vikings get any trade offers for him that they pull the trigger? Maybe another team out there looking for a young guy to try out for the rest of the season?


His days as a starter are likely done, but I think sometime before the trade deadline, or after the season we'll be looking to trade him.

I mean, he has to have some value. Put him in a good situation and I could see it work.

But realistically, what are we looking at? I've been back and forth on this, but I think, as of right now, he'd be worth a 5th round pick. If Freeman works out, I'd definitely take it!
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vikingsrule


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SteelKing728 wrote:
byuvike88 wrote:
Seeing that Cassel has been named the starter for this weeks game, and it is not because of Ponder's injury that he is starting, is his career basically done? Do you think if the Vikings get any trade offers for him that they pull the trigger? Maybe another team out there looking for a young guy to try out for the rest of the season?


His days as a starter are likely done, but I think sometime before the trade deadline, or after the season we'll be looking to trade him.

I mean, he has to have some value. Put him in a good situation and I could see it work.

But realistically, what are we looking at? I've been back and forth on this, but I think, as of right now, he'd be worth a 5th round pick. If Freeman works out, I'd definitely take it!


I doubt anyone would trade for Ponder. As for being in a good situation, its hard to find a better one than what the Vikes have for a young QB. MN has a few good receivers, Peterson, and a good enough Oline to suffice. Sure the defense has had issues this year, but if the offense could have done a better job at getting more TDs and less short FGs, we could be looking at a 3-1 record possibly and not be having this discussion about Ponder.
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Worm Guts


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SteelKing728 wrote:
byuvike88 wrote:
Seeing that Cassel has been named the starter for this weeks game, and it is not because of Ponder's injury that he is starting, is his career basically done? Do you think if the Vikings get any trade offers for him that they pull the trigger? Maybe another team out there looking for a young guy to try out for the rest of the season?


His days as a starter are likely done, but I think sometime before the trade deadline, or after the season we'll be looking to trade him.

I mean, he has to have some value. Put him in a good situation and I could see it work.

But realistically, what are we looking at? I've been back and forth on this, but I think, as of right now, he'd be worth a 5th round pick. If Freeman works out, I'd definitely take it!


If nobody was willing to trade anything for Freeman, why would someone trade a pick for Ponder?
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Freakout


Joined: 05 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Worm Guts wrote:
SteelKing728 wrote:
byuvike88 wrote:
Seeing that Cassel has been named the starter for this weeks game, and it is not because of Ponder's injury that he is starting, is his career basically done? Do you think if the Vikings get any trade offers for him that they pull the trigger? Maybe another team out there looking for a young guy to try out for the rest of the season?


His days as a starter are likely done, but I think sometime before the trade deadline, or after the season we'll be looking to trade him.

I mean, he has to have some value. Put him in a good situation and I could see it work.

But realistically, what are we looking at? I've been back and forth on this, but I think, as of right now, he'd be worth a 5th round pick. If Freeman works out, I'd definitely take it!


If nobody was willing to trade anything for Freeman, why would someone trade a pick for Ponder?


You are ignoring Freeman's contract.
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vikingsrule


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In addition to Ponder lacking "character flaws". Ponder is no doubt a good guy and the type of person you want on your team. Teams were turned off by Freeman.
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Sir Fobos


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 11:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vikingsrule wrote:
Teams were turned off by Freeman.


I don't know if there is any evidence to support that assumption. Once Freeman was cut, Tampa was stuck with the remainder of Freeman's contract, rather than any future suitors. At that point multiple teams became interested in Freeman. Freeman chose the Vikings out of at least 4 or 5 interested parties who are in need of a quality QB.
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rpmwr19


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arif Hasan ‏@ArifHasanDN 2m
NFLN says Ponder sat down with Spielman twice and was told: "sink or swim" and that he has to earn job back. Ponder was receptive. #Vikings


Tough love from the GM.
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