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Malik


Joined: 18 Dec 2011
Posts: 4377
PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Everyone's familiar with Luck, RGIII, Cam, and Russell Wilson's debut numbers as a rookie. Here are some other for comparison over the past several years.

Matt Ryan - 9/13 161 yards 1td (note 62 of those yards came from 1 pass!)
Michael Turner had 22 carries for 220 yards and 2 touchdowns and Jerious Norwood had 14 carries for 93 yards and 1 touchdown.
Falcons won this game versus the Detroit Lions that ended the season going 0-16.

Joe Flacco - 15/29 129 yards 1 rushing TD
Le'Ron McClain had 19 carries for 86 yards and Ray Rice had 22 caries for 64 yards.
Ravens won this game against the Cincinnati Bengals who finished 4-11-1

Andy Dalton - 10/15 81 yards 1TD
Cendric Bendson had 25 carries for 121 yards and 1TD.
Bengals won this game against the Cleveland browns who finished 4-12.

Matthew Stafford - 16/37 205 yards 3int
Kevin Smith had 15 carries for 20 yards
Lions lost this game to the Saints who went on to win the Super Bowl.

Sam Bradford - 33/55 253 yards 1td 3ints
Steven Jackson 22 carries for 81 yards

I don't think it means much. I'm just posting it for comparison sake. Outside of Cam Newton, there wasn't a rookie who started game 1 who had to pass that often that didn't have a run game to aid him. Luck is the only other one but he was bad in his opener then had a much better week 2. [/b]
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GaNg GrEeN


Joined: 04 Nov 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Geno can show tonight that he truly is the future. He has the arm, speed and ability to take down the pats in there building. I have faith in the kid. Sky's the limit for him.
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Spiel612


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldn't look too much into first games. Sanchez went 18/31 for 272 with 1 TD and 1 INT. And by all accounts he looked really, really good.
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Sciz


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spiel612 wrote:
I wouldn't look too much into first games. Sanchez went 18/31 for 272 with 1 TD and 1 INT. And by all accounts he looked really, really good.
Yeah, you can't really judge a QB until teams get the chance to see his flaws and attack them. Plenty of QBs start out playing well, but only the really good ones can adapt once defenses know their tendencies.
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Davey


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sciz wrote:
Spiel612 wrote:
I wouldn't look too much into first games. Sanchez went 18/31 for 272 with 1 TD and 1 INT. And by all accounts he looked really, really good.
Yeah, you can't really judge a QB until teams get the chance to see his flaws and attack them. Plenty of QBs start out playing well, but only the really good ones can adapt once defenses know their tendencies.


Indeed. Sanchez started off pretty well and didn't have his "welcome to the NFL" moment until week four of his rookie season in New Orleans.
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Bobikus


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Keep in mind though that was also in a game where the running game excluding Sanchez's runs had 184 yards on 37 carries. Sanchez did look decent enough for a young player though until the offensive cast around him stopped being as good.
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K9


Joined: 30 Jul 2013
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 7:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As a semi-former Jets fan, Geno Smith is bringing me back. I was impressed w/his play and poise in the Patriots game. He seems to be less with the drama and being a rookie his maturity level so far, has been impressive. That and he doesn't wear a headband, so there's that...
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jg6041


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

K9 wrote:
As a semi-former Jets fan, Geno Smith is bringing me back. I was impressed w/his play and poise in the Patriots game. He seems to be less with the drama and being a rookie his maturity level so far, has been impressive. That and he doesn't wear a headband, so there's that...


Just to be fair:


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rickyt31


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 7:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

He has the right ideas, just need to put more power in his throws. Those soft floating passes will get snatched by DB's all year. But it's good that he got his butt kicked this early, now he can show how much of a "film junkie" he really is and learn from his mistakes.

I didn't like him that much going into the draft, but I like his potential. He has to improve his numbers if he doesn't want Idzik to draft another QB next year.
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K9


Joined: 30 Jul 2013
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jg6041 wrote:
K9 wrote:
As a semi-former Jets fan, Geno Smith is bringing me back. I was impressed w/his play and poise in the Patriots game. He seems to be less with the drama and being a rookie his maturity level so far, has been impressive. That and he doesn't wear a headband, so there's that...


Just to be fair:



That's a good LoL! The guy has skillz but doesn't look good on him either.. Let's hope Geno can get to his level (w/o the hairband)
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Warpticon


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not a Jets fan at all, (Dolphins fan) but I came here wondering what the reaction to last night's game was.

He made a lot of mistakes toward the end, but although they looked bad, the decision making was mostly sound. I wouldn't have thrown the ball that became the second pick, but it was completable if it wasn't thrown short. The first pick was on a play that showed some quality improvisation, and if the ball placement had been decent, that's a first down and a potential huge play. The third one was a horrible pass. I don't know why he throw so many balls downfield dangerously short. I know he doesn't have a weak arm. Maybe it was the weather, maybe it was form, but it has to get better.

There are a handful of observations I made; first, his timing on certain patterns, most notably fast patterns that move across the field, is not good. I think it's most likely just an experience thing with those types of routes, but it's so important to playing NFL QB at a high level that he has to get it down eventually or it will put a cap on his potential.

The second is that his pocket presence needs a lot of improvement. He kind of drops back like he's playing madden; just sprints back and waits like 3 yards behind both tackles until somebody breaks free, then he takes off running toward the sidelines. He doesn't step up in the pocket at all when there are opportunities to, and then he steps right into the pressure when there's no room to do anything. For a guy with pretty good athleticism, he doesn't really use it well back there.

The good thing for Jets fans is that all his mistakes are coachable; I didn't see anything that jumped out at me as "well, that's just what he is." In fact, overall I saw a good amount of poise and resilience, which are important traits in a quarterback. I expect him to have an up-and-down year, but I suspect he'll have a number of quality performances before the year is up.
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sandwhich


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Warpticon wrote:
I'm not a Jets fan at all, (Dolphins fan) but I came here wondering what the reaction to last night's game was.

He made a lot of mistakes toward the end, but although they looked bad, the decision making was mostly sound. I wouldn't have thrown the ball that became the second pick, but it was completable if it wasn't thrown short. The first pick was on a play that showed some quality improvisation, and if the ball placement had been decent, that's a first down and a potential huge play. The third one was a horrible pass. I don't know why he throw so many balls downfield dangerously short. I know he doesn't have a weak arm. Maybe it was the weather, maybe it was form, but it has to get better.

There are a handful of observations I made; first, his timing on certain patterns, most notably fast patterns that move across the field, is not good. I think it's most likely just an experience thing with those types of routes, but it's so important to playing NFL QB at a high level that he has to get it down eventually or it will put a cap on his potential.

The second is that his pocket presence needs a lot of improvement. He kind of drops back like he's playing madden; just sprints back and waits like 3 yards behind both tackles until somebody breaks free, then he takes off running toward the sidelines. He doesn't step up in the pocket at all when there are opportunities to, and then he steps right into the pressure when there's no room to do anything. For a guy with pretty good athleticism, he doesn't really use it well back there.

The good thing for Jets fans is that all his mistakes are coachable; I didn't see anything that jumped out at me as "well, that's just what he is." In fact, overall I saw a good amount of poise and resilience, which are important traits in a quarterback. I expect him to have an up-and-down year, but I suspect he'll have a number of quality performances before the year is up.


I respect that you came in here and gave an honest assessment as a rival fan. Thanks for that. Glad to hear another perspective that really doesn't have bias.

I pretty much agree with everything you said.
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Jetsman82


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My dad and I had a conversation about Geno this morning. He is confused by all the talk that he had a "good" game, as some of the talking heads have said.

The best I could say is that he kind of passes the ever ambiguous "eye test". The three INT's really cast a dark cloud on the night, but it never really looked like Geno didn't belong out there. After watching Sanchez the past few years, we've all seen what a QB looks like when he looks lost and confused. Despite the 3 INT's, I didn't get the sense Geno was lost or confused.

The first INT was simply him trying to do too much. The window was there, but it had to be perfect, and it wasn't. A little bit of bad luck that it was tipped in the air as well.

The second INT was a little more troubling. Gates actually did a good job on his release, but Geno didn't place the ball in the right spot. The good news is it was a good read. You can argue Gates should have fought for it, but it would have been a spectacular play by him to just break it up.

The third INT is pretty much what happens when a raw WR and QB try to execute a back shoulder throw. This is actually the only throw I think Geno made a bad read on. IIRC, the Pats had an over-under coverage there, which allowed Talib to play the back shoulder throw. I think the throw surprised Hill, to be honest.

Geno gets a lot more wiggle room as a rookie compared to Sanchez. If Sanchez had that kind of night, we'd be crucifying him. As a rookie, we expect Geno to improve some, even if that's not always realistic.
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rdelaney89


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 12:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sandwhich wrote:
Warpticon wrote:
I'm not a Jets fan at all, (Dolphins fan) but I came here wondering what the reaction to last night's game was.

He made a lot of mistakes toward the end, but although they looked bad, the decision making was mostly sound. I wouldn't have thrown the ball that became the second pick, but it was completable if it wasn't thrown short. The first pick was on a play that showed some quality improvisation, and if the ball placement had been decent, that's a first down and a potential huge play. The third one was a horrible pass. I don't know why he throw so many balls downfield dangerously short. I know he doesn't have a weak arm. Maybe it was the weather, maybe it was form, but it has to get better.

There are a handful of observations I made; first, his timing on certain patterns, most notably fast patterns that move across the field, is not good. I think it's most likely just an experience thing with those types of routes, but it's so important to playing NFL QB at a high level that he has to get it down eventually or it will put a cap on his potential.

The second is that his pocket presence needs a lot of improvement. He kind of drops back like he's playing madden; just sprints back and waits like 3 yards behind both tackles until somebody breaks free, then he takes off running toward the sidelines. He doesn't step up in the pocket at all when there are opportunities to, and then he steps right into the pressure when there's no room to do anything. For a guy with pretty good athleticism, he doesn't really use it well back there.

The good thing for Jets fans is that all his mistakes are coachable; I didn't see anything that jumped out at me as "well, that's just what he is." In fact, overall I saw a good amount of poise and resilience, which are important traits in a quarterback. I expect him to have an up-and-down year, but I suspect he'll have a number of quality performances before the year is up.


I respect that you came in here and gave an honest assessment as a rival fan. Thanks for that. Glad to hear another perspective that really doesn't have bias.

I pretty much agree with everything you said.


I also agree, thank you for this.
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Davey


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 12:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not for nothing, I think this is important to stress - Geno Smith is being thrown in an offense that wants to attack downfield and in general throw the ball often, and is being completely let loose. There's no handcuffs or holding of hands. What Geno Smith is doing now, he'll be doing three years from now too, if he and MM are both still around. We're not taking it slowly, it's a true trial-by-fire. We're not trying to scheme to limit mistakes. And thus it's inevitable they're going to happen.

Geno's best moments he was let down by teammates and his biggest mistakes went punished by New England. You can't say a quarterback that threw three interceptions, including one that directly cost the Jets an opportunity to tie the game, played well. You can say though that he had impressive moments, showed poise, toughness and command over an aggressive offense in just his second game as a professional, and you can hope that he has the mental fortitude and intelligence to not let his mistakes bother him and learn from them in the future.

I came away impressed for the most part, prior to the poor ending of the game, he was a rookie quarterback operating an aggressive offense and was making the plays to give the Jets scoring opportunities in a hostile environment. There's something to be said for that - he's certainly not coming off as mentally fragile. The un-coachable stuff seems to be there. And that makes me more comfortable in starting him from day one than I was before the season, or even a few days ago.
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