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GDT: Nyg @ Dal - Wilson!!!!!
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NoFlyZone


Joined: 06 Jan 2013
Posts: 3680
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 3:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GmenSeattle wrote:
NoFlyZone wrote:
p.s. And don't get me wrong, I'm not really trying to bash Eli here. Someone decided to take a dig at Romo, that's why we're having this conversation Wink


No one took a dig at Romo. I just said that he is so good in the clutch which is why he has had so much success in the postseason. I said that because you said that Romo was the reason the Cowboys won as much as he did. Then you said football is a team sport so he can't do it all himself. Really I think you're just confused and that make sense when trying to talk positively about the "clutchness" of Romo.


Hmm...

mattbags2313 wrote:
The cowboys season rests on Dez's shoulders.We all know Romo is a choke waiting to happen


If that isn't a dig at Romo, then what is it? Clearly you're the one who's confused here.

As for Romo's clutchness, you are so uninformed Laughing :

http://www.dallascowboys.com/news/article-1/In-The-Clutch/EAA2AEFFBFA8458D8D77DB28D903FB43

http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/nfl-myth-busting-tony-romo-and-the-dallas-cowboys-are-americas-chokers/23434/



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NoFlyZone


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Biggsam49 wrote:
NoFlyZone wrote:

Romo was being bashed for his lack of post season success, so I was simply implying that Eli has had the better help around him to achieve what he has. When debating who is the better quarterback, all Giants fans can do is point out Eli's 2 Superbowl rings, and then proclaim Romo a choker because he has none. They don't take into account the situation both players have been in. I strongly believe Romo is a better quarterback than Eli, that's why I said the Cowboys would win less games with Eli as their quarterback.

As far as JPP goes, hes the only player on the Giants defense that has an argument over Lee. He wasn't exactly impressive last season though. I thought he was a bit overrated after his 2011 season, and so far he hasn't done anything to live up to the hype he gets.

p.s. And don't get me wrong, I'm not really trying to bash Eli here. Someone decided to take a dig at Romo, that's why we're having this conversation Wink



I like to cite playoff wins, not just SBs.. So its not 2-0, its 8-1. And if you include the "play and you're in" games, it'd be even worse.

I love the supporting case debate.

Oh how crazy boys fans were going around 08... TO was a Superstar, Felix Jones's ridiculous YPC would carry over as a starter, Marion>Jacobs, Witten was a top 3 TE, and the addition of Roy Williams to that team would make them unstoppable.

Eli was always getting trashed for our weapons. Wouldnt survive without Shockey.. then Plax.. then Smith... now Nicks isnt healthy so the offense is gunna suck.

And now Eli was only better because of the supporting case. Just won in 2011.. with a trash oline, and a defense who has 1 guy better than Sean Lee.. Laughing . Go figure.


What do you mean "Eli was only better because of the supporting cast"? He wasn't better, period. I never said or implied he was either. He simply had a very complete team around him both times he won the superbowl. He definitely did play pretty well himself, too.

I can't speak towards how fans were around here in '08, because I wasn't here. Felix could have been a good starter, but the guy was made out of glass. Witten IS a top 3 tight end, and he was then too. TO is one of the best to ever play the wide receiver position. So i'm not really sure what you're trying to say here.. Cowboy fans had reason to be optimistic in 2008, especially coming fresh off of a 13-3 season. There were several big issues with that team though, and obviously it completely fell apart. Even this year, we're better all accross the board than that team from 07-08 (with the exception of the O-line).
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GEE MEN


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Romo debate on clutchness ended years ago with Maddhatter (last year's Skins game was just another friendly reminder that Romo is the antithesis of clutch). Continuing it with every new/recent member of the cowboys forum that joins and contributes to our forum may be the definition of insanity. Getting into the "team game" versus individual stats has been argued ad nasueam for years (congrats gents we won those debates quite handily) Very Happy Let's try to keep the thread to the game (ignore my Avi and their mod's quote on me Sig).

As to the game, I am hopeful that the new dudes up the middle (Rogers, Patterson and Connors) improved the running game to the point that we can be competitive. If we can keep it close until the 4th QTR I like our chances but stopping the run will be key. I like what Patterson brought when given the time and I'd like to see him play alot. He could be our Kawika Mitchell-type of signing. Has plenty left in the tank. Our newly constituted OLINE is the line that I had hoped we'd trot out and I think we will find success in the run game. I was very impressed with Pugh not just in pass pro but in the run game. If Snee can get his head out from his rear end, it will be good to see Wilson running the counter to the right.

Myers should be used on 3rd downs -- I'd use Donnell early on to support Bear in 2 TE sets. That should help the run game as well.
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Desperado82 wrote:
I will never defend Romo again. I'm done. We may only have a shot at the playoffs or what have you because of him, but he will NEVER put us over the hump.


Last edited by GEE MEN on Sun Sep 01, 2013 3:41 pm; edited 2 times in total
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NoFlyZone


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I haven't been keeping up with news on Cruz, is he out of his boot yet?
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NoFlyZone


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GEE MEN wrote:
The Romo debate on clutchness ended years ago with Maddhatter (last year's Skins game was just another friendly reminder the Romo is the antithesis of clutch). Continuing it with every new/recent member of the cowboys forum that joins and contributes to our forum may be the definition of insanity.


Well if you're wrong you're wrong..

I can understand not wanting to bring it up though. Has little to do with the game coming up.
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GEE MEN


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 3:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NoFlyZone wrote:
GEE MEN wrote:
The Romo debate on clutchness ended years ago with Maddhatter (last year's Skins game was just another friendly reminder the Romo is the antithesis of clutch). Continuing it with every new/recent member of the cowboys forum that joins and contributes to our forum may be the definition of insanity.


Well if you're wrong you're wrong..

I can understand not wanting to bring it up though. Has little to do with the game coming up.


Stopping the run and limiting Cowboys big play ability will be big. We just need to keep it close.
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Desperado82 wrote:
I will never defend Romo again. I'm done. We may only have a shot at the playoffs or what have you because of him, but he will NEVER put us over the hump.
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Felix=Fast!


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

y'all can hate on sean lee all you want...i would too but dude is a stud. He got lit up by tate regardless of legality but he did not cry after he got lit up. And he will haunt Giants fans in their sleep.

And i too think Romo sucks...id be a fool to continue to put my hope in him.
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GEE MEN


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Cowboys are taking this game as their Super Bowl. Seems like they have been preparing for this game for weeks. That would make an opening day loss that the more embarrassing Surprised Just one more week!!!!!!!
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Desperado82 wrote:
I will never defend Romo again. I'm done. We may only have a shot at the playoffs or what have you because of him, but he will NEVER put us over the hump.
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GEE MEN


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Felix=Fast! wrote:
y'all can hate on sean lee all you want...i would too but dude is a stud. He got lit up by tate regardless of legality but he did not cry after he got lit up. And he will haunt Giants fans in their sleep.

And i too think Romo sucks...id be a fool to continue to put my hope in him.


I don't think anyone is hating on Lee. He's a good LB. Seemingly injury prone but good. I think what you may be seeing is a reaction to the overrating of yet another Cowboys player -- we've come accustomed to it. If you recall, it was the same noise when Jerruh "stole" Roy Williams from the Lions. At the time, We in Giants land laughed at the move and were proven right. Then it was the drafting of Felix Jones. Nobody would be able to stop him...too fast. We laughed. He didn't last. Then it was "Marty B". The "2 TE set" of Marty B and Witten was going to overwhelm the league. The Giants dominated them in the first encounter and we, again laughed. "Marty B", like Felix Jones, like Roy Williams, etc etc all fell unceremoniously from the top of the perch that Cowboys fans placed them .. and we laughed. Now we will all agree that Lee is good, I actually was hoping that the Giants would draft him-- but to suggest he is near the class of Bowman or Willis or some of the greats is well...laughable. Hopefully he stays healthy but he and Bruce Carter are a blade of grass away from their next injury-- kind of like our Andre Brown.

I am interested to see how Lee fares against Wilson with a year under Wilson's belt. Especially if Lee gets the assignment of Wilson 1 on 1 when Wilson splits out to WR or goes in a wheel route. Be careful what you ask for. Evil or Very Mad
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Desperado82 wrote:
I will never defend Romo again. I'm done. We may only have a shot at the playoffs or what have you because of him, but he will NEVER put us over the hump.
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redsoxsuck05


Joined: 16 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GEE MEN wrote:
Felix=Fast! wrote:
y'all can hate on sean lee all you want...i would too but dude is a stud. He got lit up by tate regardless of legality but he did not cry after he got lit up. And he will haunt Giants fans in their sleep.

And i too think Romo sucks...id be a fool to continue to put my hope in him.


I don't think anyone is hating on Lee. He's a good LB. Seemingly injury prone but good. I think what you may be seeing is a reaction to the overrating of yet another Cowboys player -- we've come accustomed to it. If you recall, it was the same noise when Jerruh "stole" Roy Williams from the Lions. At the time, We in Giants land laughed at the move and were proven right. Then it was the drafting of Felix Jones. Nobody would be able to stop him...too fast. We laughed. He didn't last. Then it was "Marty B". The "2 TE set" of Marty B and Witten was going to overwhelm the league. The Giants dominated them in the first encounter and we, again laughed. "Marty B", like Felix Jones, like Roy Williams, etc etc all fell unceremoniously from the top of the perch that Cowboys fans placed them .. and we laughed. Now we will all agree that Lee is good, I actually was hoping that the Giants would draft him-- but to suggest he is near the class of Bowman or Willis or some of the greats is well...laughable. Hopefully he stays healthy but he and Bruce Carter are a blade of grass away from their next injury-- kind of like our Andre Brown.

I am interested to see how Lee fares against Wilson with a year under Wilson's belt. Especially if Lee gets the assignment of Wilson 1 on 1 when Wilson splits out to WR or goes in a wheel route. Be careful what you ask for. Evil or Very Mad


Regardless of how good Sean Lee is, the Cowboys defense is average at best.

Not the most fearsome unit.
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Biggsam49


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NoFlyZone wrote:


What do you mean "Eli was only better because of the supporting cast"? He wasn't better, period. I never said or implied he was either. He simply had a very complete team around him both times he won the superbowl. He definitely did play pretty well himself, too.



I assumed you meant it was why Eli has been better than Romo in the past years. I didn't realize you actually feel Romo has been better than Eli over those years. I have no words for that. "Well if you're wrong you're wrong" I guess..

--

As for this game, I'm not sure what to expect. If JPP/Moore/Tuck all come out ready to play, I think we dominate the trenches on D and give Tony hell. If they don't, we watch Webster do his patented "watch WR run past me and point at him" or just get moss'd. (He gets moss'd soo much we should just say he CWeb'd the WR)

I don't think Cruz's injury was serious. Nicks was running hard last week. I think the O will be ready to go. The interior line might struggle a bit, thankfully Dallas doesn't have anything special inside to exploit it. Gimme a shootout: 38-34 GMen.
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NoFlyZone


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 1:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Biggsam49 wrote:
Gimme a shootout: 38-34 GMen.


I can't see the Giants offense scoring that many points tbh. I can't see the Cowboys defense giving up that many points in the season opener when they're also relatively healthy.

I'm predicting the Cowboys winning somewhere around 31-17. I just feel like the Cowboys can win far more of the individual matchups in game.
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NoFlyZone


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 1:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

redsoxsuck05 wrote:
GEE MEN wrote:
Felix=Fast! wrote:
y'all can hate on sean lee all you want...i would too but dude is a stud. He got lit up by tate regardless of legality but he did not cry after he got lit up. And he will haunt Giants fans in their sleep.

And i too think Romo sucks...id be a fool to continue to put my hope in him.


I don't think anyone is hating on Lee. He's a good LB. Seemingly injury prone but good. I think what you may be seeing is a reaction to the overrating of yet another Cowboys player -- we've come accustomed to it. If you recall, it was the same noise when Jerruh "stole" Roy Williams from the Lions. At the time, We in Giants land laughed at the move and were proven right. Then it was the drafting of Felix Jones. Nobody would be able to stop him...too fast. We laughed. He didn't last. Then it was "Marty B". The "2 TE set" of Marty B and Witten was going to overwhelm the league. The Giants dominated them in the first encounter and we, again laughed. "Marty B", like Felix Jones, like Roy Williams, etc etc all fell unceremoniously from the top of the perch that Cowboys fans placed them .. and we laughed. Now we will all agree that Lee is good, I actually was hoping that the Giants would draft him-- but to suggest he is near the class of Bowman or Willis or some of the greats is well...laughable. Hopefully he stays healthy but he and Bruce Carter are a blade of grass away from their next injury-- kind of like our Andre Brown.

I am interested to see how Lee fares against Wilson with a year under Wilson's belt. Especially if Lee gets the assignment of Wilson 1 on 1 when Wilson splits out to WR or goes in a wheel route. Be careful what you ask for. Evil or Very Mad


Regardless of how good Sean Lee is, the Cowboys defense is average at best.

Not the most fearsome unit.


They've played against the Giants offense very well the last two times they've met..
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GEE MEN


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NoFlyZone wrote:
They've played against the Giants offense very well the last two times they've met..


I am interested to see how Eli responds to this new Cowboys defense. Eli has historically (just my observation) looked more uncomfortable against 3/4 teams than 4/3 as has the Giants offense. So I expect Eli to be efficient and if the Cowboys don't pressure Eli it may be a long day for the Boys D. The Boys CBs are good but I think that the Safeties still can be exploited. Plus, Eli has done well against Kiffen defense-led teams (I think Eli sent Kiffen to the college ranks after the Tampa playoff loss years ago) so I think Eli and the offense should be ok.

One key to the Giants success will likely be none other than Hakeem Nicks. I didn't like what I saw from him in the preseason. He couldn't get separation and looked a bit slow, and he wasn't on the same page with Eli. Maybe he's still injured. If Nicks show that he's a threat and is doubled teamed then it opens up the running game and other receivers. Getting the running game going will be key.
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Desperado82 wrote:
I will never defend Romo again. I'm done. We may only have a shot at the playoffs or what have you because of him, but he will NEVER put us over the hump.
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CowboysTilIDie


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't argue that we, as Cowboy fans and as most fans do, overrate many of our players. But we are not overrating Sean Lee. When he is on the field, he is a top 5 MLB linebacker in this league and very possibly top 3. He's got to stay on the field though to reach that level of recognition. Shoot, he's already reached that level among some while not having played a full season yet. NFL.com has him as a preseason All-Pro.

There was a "Where does Sean Lee rank among MLBs in the league" thread back in February and many share the same thoughts as us (including 1 of your own Giant fans).

I'll sig bet anyone that if Sean Lee plays 16 games this year, he will be a Pro Bowler and and All-Pro.
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