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Preseason Week 1: Giants vs. Steelers
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bzane


Joined: 23 Jan 2006
Posts: 520
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IR0NM1KE wrote:
Lets be brutally honest about this, no matter who wins the job(s) our LB corps are going to be brutal. Until we make a serious move and address this problem we can expect horrendous play for the forseeable future.


Okay, I get it, but really, who have the Giants EVER had at linebacker that were much better than Paysinger-Herzlich etc., etc.-?

Well, okay, Lawrence Taylor..... guess I have to concede that one, ha! Ha! Oh, and well du-u-uh, his running mate, Carl Banks- him too. Oh, okay, Harry Carson, right, right. Same group. Hall of Fame guy, now that I think about it? Oh, yeah, and Brad Van Pelt, just before those guys. Yes, I'll concede on him, too. Oh! Jesse Armstead! How'd I forget him?!? Wow! He was pretty good for a number of years. Whoops- Sam Huff! Before my time, but from what I hear..... Jeez, I guess I'd have to add Gary Reasons, from that whole 3-4 1980's bunch. Solid complementary guy..... Gosh, I guess they really HAVE dropped off at LB, the last few years!
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GiantAl


Joined: 16 Mar 2012
Posts: 245
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Currys movement is not great. I wouldnt expect anything out of him.

LBs in general are very poor. Unless the DL improves alot, this defense will be the same as last year.
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Vulcan_Prime


Joined: 07 Dec 2010
Posts: 200
Location: New York
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bzane wrote:
IR0NM1KE wrote:
Lets be brutally honest about this, no matter who wins the job(s) our LB corps are going to be brutal. Until we make a serious move and address this problem we can expect horrendous play for the forseeable future.


Okay, I get it, but really, who have the Giants EVER had at linebacker that were much better than Paysinger-Herzlich etc., etc.-?

Well, okay, Lawrence Taylor..... guess I have to concede that one, ha! Ha! Oh, and well du-u-uh, his running mate, Carl Banks- him too. Oh, okay, Harry Carson, right, right. Same group. Hall of Fame guy, now that I think about it? Oh, yeah, and Brad Van Pelt, just before those guys. Yes, I'll concede on him, too. Oh! Jesse Armstead! How'd I forget him?!? Wow! He was pretty good for a number of years. Whoops- Sam Huff! Before my time, but from what I hear..... Jeez, I guess I'd have to add Gary Reasons, from that whole 3-4 1980's bunch. Solid complementary guy..... Gosh, I guess they really HAVE dropped off at LB, the last few years!


Not a single one of our linebackers currently have a multi year deal and that is really an indictment on the confidence of this unit. We keep starting special team players instead of actual linebackers year after year and wonder why this unit continuously underperforms.

Jerry should have signed Daryl smith or karlos dansby instead of conner and mundy. I mean Mundy didn't show anything and he's automatically starting in front of sash and hill?

Maybe jerry nucks the trend a third year running and drafts competent safeties and limebackers because we just don't have any money to sign marginal players anymore.
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Vulcan_Prime


Joined: 07 Dec 2010
Posts: 200
Location: New York
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bzane wrote:
IR0NM1KE wrote:
Lets be brutally honest about this, no matter who wins the job(s) our LB corps are going to be brutal. Until we make a serious move and address this problem we can expect horrendous play for the forseeable future.


Okay, I get it, but really, who have the Giants EVER had at linebacker that were much better than Paysinger-Herzlich etc., etc.-?

Well, okay, Lawrence Taylor..... guess I have to concede that one, ha! Ha! Oh, and well du-u-uh, his running mate, Carl Banks- him too. Oh, okay, Harry Carson, right, right. Same group. Hall of Fame guy, now that I think about it? Oh, yeah, and Brad Van Pelt, just before those guys. Yes, I'll concede on him, too. Oh! Jesse Armstead! How'd I forget him?!? Wow! He was pretty good for a number of years. Whoops- Sam Huff! Before my time, but from what I hear..... Jeez, I guess I'd have to add Gary Reasons, from that whole 3-4 1980's bunch. Solid complementary guy..... Gosh, I guess they really HAVE dropped off at LB, the last few years!


Not a single one of our linebackers currently have a multi year deal and that is really an indictment on the confidence of this unit. We keep starting special team players instead of actual linebackers year after year and wonder why this unit continuously underperforms.

Jerry should have signed Daryl smith or karlos dansby instead of conner and mundy. I mean Mundy didn't show anything and he's automatically starting in front of sash and hill?

Maybe jerry nucks the trend a third year running and drafts competent safeties and limebackers because we just don't have any money to sign marginal players anymore.
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Biggsam49


Joined: 05 Jul 2012
Posts: 818
PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2013 12:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bzane wrote:
IR0NM1KE wrote:
Lets be brutally honest about this, no matter who wins the job(s) our LB corps are going to be brutal. Until we make a serious move and address this problem we can expect horrendous play for the forseeable future.


Okay, I get it, but really, who have the Giants EVER had at linebacker that were much better than Paysinger-Herzlich etc., etc.-?


Our LBers in past years were usually just "below average." This cast is just awful.

Pierce was very talented. Even Boley (in his better years[or year]) was much better than Herz or Paysinger.

Goff was also much better than this. What could have been...
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shotgundraw


Joined: 03 Aug 2013
Posts: 39
PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2013 2:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gmen wrote:
IR0NM1KE wrote:
Lets be brutally honest about this, no matter who wins the job(s) our LB corps are going to be brutal. Until we make a serious move and address this problem we can expect horrendous play for the forseeable future.

I'm not giving up hope yet. I think we just have the wrong ones currently starting. Once the new comers pick up the playbook, I expect them to be in the starting lineup. Connor started and played well for the Cowboys last season. Curry certainly looks the part at 260.


Connor was in on about half the snaps after taking the starting job in week 8.

He might actually be our best LB right now. In run defense that's for sure.
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bballbkd1001


Joined: 04 Feb 2009
Posts: 3908
PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2013 2:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I saw ojomo (however you spell it) had a sack and a half. He's been awesome in preseasons. Is it his year to play??
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dkebones


Joined: 15 Mar 2007
Posts: 3620
Location: Giants fan in the Seahawk's backyard...
PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2013 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Biggsam49 wrote:

Goff was also much better than this. What could have been...





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reckless123


Joined: 02 Jun 2011
Posts: 11211
PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2013 7:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dkebones wrote:
Biggsam49 wrote:

Goff was also much better than this. What could have been...






Goff was somewhat a coverage liability but he very much contributed to the run game. Which one of our LBers actually help in that regard?
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bballbkd1001


Joined: 04 Feb 2009
Posts: 3908
PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2013 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Past couple of years, I've saw herz as a more athletic goff. Just as good in run stopping, a little better in pass coverage.
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reckless123


Joined: 02 Jun 2011
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 7:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bballbkd1001 wrote:
Past couple of years, I've saw herz as a more athletic goff. Just as good in run stopping, a little better in pass coverage.


No Goff actually stopped the run. From what ive seen Herz hasnt. If Goff was more athletic he actually wouldve been a pro bowler.
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dkebones


Joined: 15 Mar 2007
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Location: Giants fan in the Seahawk's backyard...
PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

reckless123 wrote:
If Goff was more athletic he actually wouldve been a pro bowler.



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Biggsam49


Joined: 05 Jul 2012
Posts: 818
PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dkebones wrote:



Prior to all the injuries, Goff was near elite vs the run. Solid tackler, could lay a big hit, great at getting through traffic and shedding blocks. And very smart, I believe he handled the adjustments.

We could really use that type of player. Would be the perfect complement to Jacquain.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=69d2cqTrM7w

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2011/04/06/secret-superstar-jonathan-goff-new-york-giants/
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reckless123


Joined: 02 Jun 2011
Posts: 11211
PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dkebones wrote:
reckless123 wrote:
If Goff was more athletic he actually wouldve been a pro bowler.




Why is that a joke? He was great in the run game but had was weak in coverage. If he was more athletic it would greatly help his coverage abilities. When i mean pro bowler, im talking at a pro bowl level not being voted. He was smart and had good instincts. He played the run exceptionally well.
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dkebones


Joined: 15 Mar 2007
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Location: Giants fan in the Seahawk's backyard...
PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 1:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Biggsam49 wrote:
dkebones wrote:



Prior to all the injuries, Goff was near elite vs the run. Solid tackler, could lay a big hit, great at getting through traffic and shedding blocks. And very smart, I believe he handled the adjustments.

We could really use that type of player. Would be the perfect complement to Jacquain.


definitely agree that he was a smart player. solid tackler and big hitter, fine. and don't get me wrong, i had alot of hope for him; i love players who come from "brainy" schools and aren't just straight-up jocks.

but it's easy to say (now that he's not on the team, and even out of football) that he was something that he wasn't. he was a two down linebacker; not that that necessarily takes anything away from his game, but how many linebackers make the pro bowl (that was the point i took contention with) not being a complete package.

similarly, it brings into focus just how low our expectations of the position is as fans. "what could've been..." really? that's how hard up we are for legit linebacker play that we have to hope for a two-down "nice player" linebacker over what's been put on the field the last couple years?

sad.
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