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Patriots Forum - Ranking the Roster #4 - Jerod Mayo
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goldfishwars


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mayo
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TomRalph


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jerod Mayo. Vocal leader of the defense and calls the plays etc. a true do-it-all LB and exactly what we need in a Patriots LB.

Don't think Nate Solder is quite that high, surprised he's seen so many votes this early, think Top 5 is a stretch, Top 10 definitely however.
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Billy Spikes


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just a reminder, this is ranking of the most important players on the roster, not rankings by who is the best player in his position/most talented.

Not saying that changes something because for me it's really close between Mayo and Solder but when you look our roster right now, if Solder were to miss the 2013 season the Patriots will have to move Vollmer to LT and who would start at RT? Will Svitek? who out of 61 career games started just 16? and missed the entire 2012 season with an injury? Marcus Cannon? who despite some improvement late in the season struggled for the most part of the 2012 season?

Not saying we're in that much of a better at LB if Mayo went out but we would at least have more options there with Jamie Collins/Rob Ninkovich/Steve Beauharnais.

It would be bad in both situations but i would feel just slightly better if it was Mayo missing time and not Solder because with all the new guys on the receiver positions i think the more protection Brady has the better and Solder talent wise can become a top 3 LT in the league if he continues to develop.
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I_GET_SAX


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 6:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TomRalph wrote:
Jerod Mayo. Vocal leader of the defense and calls the plays etc. a true do-it-all LB and exactly what we need in a Patriots LB.

Don't think Nate Solder is quite that high, surprised he's seen so many votes this early, think Top 5 is a stretch, Top 10 definitely however.


Agree wholeheartedly. Not sure how a guy who could have been #3 is now being overshadowed by a OT that has yet to reach near his full potential. I could see Chandler or McCourty in top 5 along with Mankind but not seeing the "now top 3 Patriot" Solder. Mayo for me. Than Mankind/C.Jones.
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I_GET_SAX


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Billy I truly feel Dante Scar could have Svitek's transition to starting RT be a lot smoother on all accounts than someone like a rookie or second yr LB stepping in for our captain and leader on D Mayo. By you saying that, to me your really under rating Mayo, and everything he brings statistical or tangible. We lost a stud at C last year when Koppen went to DEN, who would have thought Wendell would have us shrugging at that thought. Dan Connelly stepped in pretty seamlessly too IIRC.
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Billy Spikes


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I_GET_SAX wrote:
Billy I truly feel Dante Scar could have Svitek's transition to starting RT be a lot smoother on all accounts than someone like a rookie or second yr LB. By you saying that to me your really under rating Mayo, and eeverything he brings statistical or tangible. We lost a stud at C last year when Koppen went to DEN, who would have thought Wendell would have us shrugging at that thought. Dan Connelly stepped in pretty seamlessly too IIRC.


Well, first of all as i said, i don't mean to take a shot at Mayo or anything... i said it's very close for me and i was just thinking based on our situation on offense... not having quality protection for Brady would probably be slightly worse than losing a top LB like Mayo.

As far as Koppen, he hasn't really been a "stud" for the Pats in the recent years he played here. And we didn't lose him either, like in free-agency, he was released by the Pats and about a month later signed with the Broncos when they lost J.D. Walton to an injury.

Also playing on the interior is tougher than playing tackle.

Again, Mayo probably deserves the number 4 spot on most seasons but i put Solder just slightly above him because i believe he's more important this season.
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mcmurtry86


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I_GET_SAX wrote:
Billy I truly feel Dante Scar could have Svitek's transition to starting RT be a lot smoother on all accounts than someone like a rookie or second yr LB stepping in for our captain and leader on D Mayo. By you saying that, to me your really under rating Mayo, and everything he brings statistical or tangible. We lost a stud at C last year when Koppen went to DEN, who would have thought Wendell would have us shrugging at that thought. Dan Connelly stepped in pretty seamlessly too IIRC.


Koppen hadn't been better than average for 2+ years before he was cut by the Patriots and hadn't been a "stud" in half a decade.
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mcmurtry86


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 7:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Billy Spikes wrote:
Just a reminder, this is ranking of the most important players on the roster, not rankings by who is the best player in his position/most talented.

Not saying that changes something because for me it's really close between Mayo and Solder but when you look our roster right now, if Solder were to miss the 2013 season the Patriots will have to move Vollmer to LT and who would start at RT? Will Svitek? who out of 61 career games started just 16? and missed the entire 2012 season with an injury? Marcus Cannon? who despite some improvement late in the season struggled for the most part of the 2012 season?

Not saying we're in that much of a better at LB if Mayo went out but we would at least have more options there with Jamie Collins/Rob Ninkovich/Steve Beauharnais.

It would be bad in both situations but i would feel just slightly better if it was Mayo missing time and not Solder because with all the new guys on the receiver positions i think the more protection Brady has the better and Solder talent wise can become a top 3 LT in the league if he continues to develop.


Vollmer is a high quality LT. Not as good as he is at RT, but still a top 10 LT IMO (if healthy). Cannon is a serviceable RT - which is probably the least important position on the OL.

I'd feel much better with Vollmer at LT and Cannon (or even Svitek) at RT than with Spikes/Hightower trying to fill in for Mayo in their sub defense (which is 50%+ of their snaps).

In base 4-3, the Pats can survive without Mayo. Despite his struggles in the pass game at times, he's a far superior option than any of the "proven" guys and counting on Collins (or especially Beauharnais) for anything in sub coverage responsibilities seems like a stretch at this point.

I really think Mayo gets underrated around here. He's not a great coverage player but he's smart and knows his responsibilities. He doesn't often get lost and he rarely blows a zone. I think that would be far more difficult to replace given what we know about the Pats non-Mayo LB's right now than filling in at RT (whose primary job is to run block, which is Cannon's strength at this point of his development).

Now, if the Pats didn't have Vollmer, I think Solder would be a slam dunk more valuable player. Cannon is a better RT than any Patriots Mayo replacement is at Mayo's key responsibilities IMO.

If Collins or one of the others (Edds/Fletcher/Beauharnias/other) show up big in camp, I'd feel more comfortable saying Solder is more valuable. But until another LB shows an ability other to be a downhill thumper (Spikes, Hightower) I don't think we can assume anyone can adequately fill in for Mayo. Even Ninkovich can't and that would leave a big hole at DE unless we're projecting Cunningham/Bequette/Francis to step up. Although Ninkovich as a sub LB in a nickel 4-2-5 or 3-3-5 isn't something I'd be at all comfortable with.
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I_GET_SAX


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 7:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcmurtry86 wrote:
I_GET_SAX wrote:
Billy I truly feel Dante Scar could have Svitek's transition to starting RT be a lot smoother on all accounts than someone like a rookie or second yr LB stepping in for our captain and leader on D Mayo. By you saying that, to me your really under rating Mayo, and everything he brings statistical or tangible. We lost a stud at C last year when Koppen went to DEN, who would have thought Wendell would have us shrugging at that thought. Dan Connelly stepped in pretty seamlessly too IIRC.


Koppen hadn't been better than average for 2+ years before he was cut by the Patriots and hadn't been a "stud" in half a decade.


Admittedly "stud" was the wrong word to use. Was simply showing previous situations where an OL has shifted right in and how to some, myself included, it seems less of a stretch than taking Mayo out in favor for anybody at the roster "this year".
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ChazStandard


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 7:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcmurtry86 wrote:
Billy Spikes wrote:
Just a reminder, this is ranking of the most important players on the roster, not rankings by who is the best player in his position/most talented.

Not saying that changes something because for me it's really close between Mayo and Solder but when you look our roster right now, if Solder were to miss the 2013 season the Patriots will have to move Vollmer to LT and who would start at RT? Will Svitek? who out of 61 career games started just 16? and missed the entire 2012 season with an injury? Marcus Cannon? who despite some improvement late in the season struggled for the most part of the 2012 season?

Not saying we're in that much of a better at LB if Mayo went out but we would at least have more options there with Jamie Collins/Rob Ninkovich/Steve Beauharnais.

It would be bad in both situations but i would feel just slightly better if it was Mayo missing time and not Solder because with all the new guys on the receiver positions i think the more protection Brady has the better and Solder talent wise can become a top 3 LT in the league if he continues to develop.


Vollmer is a high quality LT. Not as good as he is at RT, but still a top 10 LT IMO (if healthy). Cannon is a serviceable RT - which is probably the least important position on the OL.

I'd feel much better with Vollmer at LT and Cannon (or even Svitek) at RT than with Spikes/Hightower trying to fill in for Mayo in their sub defense (which is 50%+ of their snaps).

In base 4-3, the Pats can survive without Mayo. Despite his struggles in the pass game at times, he's a far superior option than any of the "proven" guys and counting on Collins (or especially Beauharnais) for anything in sub coverage responsibilities seems like a stretch at this point.

I really think Mayo gets underrated around here. He's not a great coverage player but he's smart and knows his responsibilities. He doesn't often get lost and he rarely blows a zone. I think that would be far more difficult to replace given what we know about the Pats non-Mayo LB's right now than filling in at RT (whose primary job is to run block, which is Cannon's strength at this point of his development).

Now, if the Pats didn't have Vollmer, I think Solder would be a slam dunk more valuable player. Cannon is a better RT than any Patriots Mayo replacement is at Mayo's key responsibilities IMO.

If Collins or one of the others (Edds/Fletcher/Beauharnias/other) show up big in camp, I'd feel more comfortable saying Solder is more valuable. But until another LB shows an ability other to be a downhill thumper (Spikes, Hightower) I don't think we can assume anyone can adequately fill in for Mayo. Even Ninkovich can't and that would leave a big hole at DE unless we're projecting Cunningham/Bequette/Francis to step up. Although Ninkovich as a sub LB in a nickel 4-2-5 or 3-3-5 isn't something I'd be at all comfortable with.


Agree with this (thought I would still say McCourty #4 and Mayo #5). On a basic level, the Pats have shown time and again that their combination of depth, an elite QB and quality coaching means they can take hits to the O-line without feeling it much. I would find it hard to put any of the O-line in the top 6-7 in terms of value.
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finn54


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 9:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Billy Spikes wrote:
Just a reminder, this is ranking of the most important players on the roster, not rankings by who is the best player in his position/most talented.


If anything that would make me want to pick Mayo even more. He's probably the best leader on the team (except Brady).
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ChazStandard


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 10:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

finn54 wrote:
Billy Spikes wrote:
Just a reminder, this is ranking of the most important players on the roster, not rankings by who is the best player in his position/most talented.


If anything that would make me want to pick Mayo even more. He's probably the best leader on the team (except Brady).


Is he though? He's a smart player, and a pro's pro, but I wouldn't say he has the charisma to be a natural leader. Not in the way Wilfork or, to a lesser extent, Spikes does.
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Deadpulse


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 8:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mayo
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mcmurtry86


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChazStandard wrote:
finn54 wrote:
Billy Spikes wrote:
Just a reminder, this is ranking of the most important players on the roster, not rankings by who is the best player in his position/most talented.


If anything that would make me want to pick Mayo even more. He's probably the best leader on the team (except Brady).


Is he though? He's a smart player, and a pro's pro, but I wouldn't say he has the charisma to be a natural leader. Not in the way Wilfork or, to a lesser extent, Spikes does.


Being fiery doesn't equal being a leader. People downplay Mayo's leadership because he's not especially animated on the field but by all accounts he's the leader of the defense (or co-leader with Wilfork).

There's a whole lot more to being a leader than doing a dance and hi-fiving people after you personally make a nice play (which is most of Spikes 'leadership').
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PoWww


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jerod Mayo, without a doubt. Like others have said, for some reason his leadership seems to fly under the radar. I wouldn't want to see our defense without him.
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