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honolulu2786


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 18, 2013 5:12 pm    Post subject: detroit goes belly up. Reply with quote

Been thinking about the news of detroit filing bankruptcy. There are much smarter people than me on here so ill ask you guys. Does this mean anything for the future of the lions? I understand they are a private company. But do you see where this could effect our team in any way?
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Honalulufan20


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 18, 2013 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not the organization itself. Players will still get paid, Ford field will still be there, etc. You shouldn't see any changes to the personnel or anything.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 18, 2013 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chapter 9 isn't really going belly up. Is more a restructuring of debt. It allows the city to work out new terms, lower interest rates, and release from some debts. The city will still be there, but there will likely be restrictions on their spending for other things. It's not good for people employed by the city, such as what's left of law enforcement. But in the long run its hopefully the first steps in returning the city closer to what it once was.
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honolulu2786


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 18, 2013 11:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sllim Pickens wrote:
Chapter 9 isn't really going belly up. Is more a restructuring of debt. It allows the city to work out new terms, lower interest rates, and release from some debts. The city will still be there, but there will likely be restrictions on their spending for other things. It's not good for people employed by the city, such as what's left of law enforcement. But in the long run its hopefully the first steps in returning the city closer to what it once was.


Thank you for the clarification.
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Raiders4sho!


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 1:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would it be safe to assume that this might hurt the lions with logistical issues like public transit to games and possibly in getting a new stadium because tax payers will be more reluctant to vote towards the investment? Something to think about with the naming rights contract over half way over. Also how will affect bowl games etc?
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 2:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raiders4sho! wrote:
Would it be safe to assume that this might hurt the lions with logistical issues like public transit to games and possibly in getting a new stadium because tax payers will be more reluctant to vote towards the investment? Something to think about with the naming rights contract over half way over. Also how will affect bowl games etc?


Ford Field is only going to be 11 years old in late August. There wont be a need for a new stadium for quite some time.

As for bowl games (posted a couple days ago):

Quote:
The Detroit Lions announced today that they have entered into a six-year partnership with the Big Ten Conference for a bowl game that will be played at Ford Field beginning in 2014.

The game will be officially named once sponsorship agreements are in place. The inaugural game is tentatively scheduled for December 30, 2014 (pending TV broadcast schedule).


http://www.detroitlions.com/news/article-1/The-Detroit-Lions-announce-agreement-with-the-Big-Ten-for-Bowl-Game-at-Ford-Field/ed3156cf-d3cb-4de6-aec5-acedd35e02fb
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 5:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raiders4sho! wrote:
Would it be safe to assume that this might hurt the lions with logistical issues like public transit to games and possibly in getting a new stadium because tax payers will be more reluctant to vote towards the investment? Something to think about with the naming rights contract over half way over. Also how will affect bowl games etc?


The only potential impact this will have on the Lions is likely increases to property taxes.

As for naming rights I can't see FORD not continuing to bid on naming rights. Its sort of a no brainer.
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nagahide13


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2013 6:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is actually kind of a step in the right direction. It will help stop the continuous downward spiral the city has been going through for the last 50ish years. I don't really see a ton changing day to day for most people... and if Detroit sports have existed through the bad times, (mostly through private funding), I don't see them having any more issues than they've had already.

Mr. I passing would and will have a far greater impact.
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nagahide13 wrote:
This is actually kind of a step in the right direction. It will help stop the continuous downward spiral the city has been going through for the last 50ish years. I don't really see a ton changing day to day for most people... and if Detroit sports have existed through the bad times, (mostly through private funding), I don't see them having any more issues than they've had already.

Mr. I passing would and will have a far greater impact.


Its to bad the federal government doesn't get involved after the proceedings are completed. They have a tremendous debt problem on their own but until such time as there is funding a mechanisms to stop servicing the mostly abandoned areas of the city problems will continue. The city simply can't continue to service areas that have inadequate tax receipts to justify the expense.

If the Feds funded the rehabilitation of these areas by tearing down the vacant structures, removing schools and relocating the few people still in these areas it would make a huge impact on the financial viability of the city.

The precedent was set in 1975 when the Feds bailed out NYC and not only helped fund operations but provided loan guarantees until 86 which allowed them to get on the right side of a balanced budget.

They gave massive bailouts to GM and Chrylser and I really don't see how Detroit can ever be viable unless they can get out from under the financial burden of providing funding to the derelict areas.

The other tragedy here is what impact there will be for retired police, firefighters and other civil servants. People work their whole lives contributing to their pensions and through no fault of their own get impacted far more seriously than those who caused the mess.
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

diehardlionfan wrote:
nagahide13 wrote:
This is actually kind of a step in the right direction. It will help stop the continuous downward spiral the city has been going through for the last 50ish years. I don't really see a ton changing day to day for most people... and if Detroit sports have existed through the bad times, (mostly through private funding), I don't see them having any more issues than they've had already.

Mr. I passing would and will have a far greater impact.


Its to bad the federal government doesn't get involved after the proceedings are completed. They have a tremendous debt problem on their own but until such time as there is funding a mechanisms to stop servicing the mostly abandoned areas of the city problems will continue. The city simply can't continue to service areas that have inadequate tax receipts to justify the expense.

If the Feds funded the rehabilitation of these areas by tearing down the vacant structures, removing schools and relocating the few people still in these areas it would make a huge impact on the financial viability of the city.

The precedent was set in 1975 when the Feds bailed out NYC and not only helped fund operations but provided loan guarantees until 86 which allowed them to get on the right side of a balanced budget.

They gave massive bailouts to GM and Chrylser and I really don't see how Detroit can ever be viable unless they can get out from under the financial burden of providing funding to the derelict areas.

The other tragedy here is what impact there will be for retired police, firefighters and other civil servants. People work their whole lives contributing to their pensions and through no fault of their own get impacted far more seriously than those who caused the mess.
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IDOG_det wrote:
diehardlionfan wrote:
nagahide13 wrote:
This is actually kind of a step in the right direction. It will help stop the continuous downward spiral the city has been going through for the last 50ish years. I don't really see a ton changing day to day for most people... and if Detroit sports have existed through the bad times, (mostly through private funding), I don't see them having any more issues than they've had already.

Mr. I passing would and will have a far greater impact.


Its to bad the federal government doesn't get involved after the proceedings are completed. They have a tremendous debt problem on their own but until such time as there is funding a mechanisms to stop servicing the mostly abandoned areas of the city problems will continue. The city simply can't continue to service areas that have inadequate tax receipts to justify the expense.

If the Feds funded the rehabilitation of these areas by tearing down the vacant structures, removing schools and relocating the few people still in these areas it would make a huge impact on the financial viability of the city.

The precedent was set in 1975 when the Feds bailed out NYC and not only helped fund operations but provided loan guarantees until 86 which allowed them to get on the right side of a balanced budget.

They gave massive bailouts to GM and Chrylser and I really don't see how Detroit can ever be viable unless they can get out from under the financial burden of providing funding to the derelict areas.

The other tragedy here is what impact there will be for retired police, firefighters and other civil servants. People work their whole lives contributing to their pensions and through no fault of their own get impacted far more seriously than those who caused the mess.
This entire post... Applause


You know, I don't live in Detroit and never have but the city means a great deal to me. I support a charity there called young Detroit builders because the work they do matters.

My loyalty stems from my childhood. I grew up in Edmonton Alberta during the days of a 6 team NHL. In those days there wasn't an NHL draft so each NHL team had a geographical area which was a protected. As a side note NHL expansion was actually driven by American team owners who were trying to break Montreals grip on a larger protected area which gave them a huge advantage.

Edmonton was part of the Red Wings protected area. As a result the Red Wings put money into minor hockey development camps and actually sponsored some of the AA teams in town. As a youngster all the older boys went into the Detroit organization. Ed Joyal, Bruce McGregor, Norm Ullman and my Dad's favourite player John Bucyk who was ahead of my time.

I've only personally purchased two sports Jerseys for myself but I was given a Red Wings #7 Norm Ullman Jersey which hangs in my closet to this day.

Anyway as a youngster Detroit was important to me and I've never forgotten that. Its also a very important city historically in the United States. Its been an easy target for those looking to poke fun at or put down a metropolitan area but most don't realize Detroit is the most accurate barometer for the social and financial health of the country.

Detroit lead the way as an industrial powerhouse becoming the city with the highest per capita incomes in the U.S.A. It was the social conscience of the country in the mid sixties. It started to lose its lustre in the 70's as import automobiles began their influx to North America slowly but steadily reducing domestic sales. Next came steel dumping which negatively impacted the big steel producing cities. Detroit, Pittsburgh, Hamilton. Computers, electronics imports all had a negative impact on North American manufacturers. Next Ronald Reagan declared war on unions convincing everyone unions were negative. This had a long lasting negative impact on Detroit and other blue collar cities further eroding jobs and suppressing wages. All the while corporations like Walmart told suppliers what price they would pay for merchandise and lead the movement to take manufacturing jobs overseas. What can be said about corporations that don't pay wages sufficient to live on.

I could write volumes but these are just the rambling s of a sad old man.

All that I can really say is Detroit has always lead the way, both up, and down. Numerous other cities have severe urban decay and budgetary issues. All levels of Government are fighting their own economic demons with states like California always one step ahead of insolvency. Instead of people looking at Detroit as a wake up call they put their nose in the air and blame the voters, politicians and businessmen choosing to ignore the writing on the wall in their own neck of the woods.

Its a sad, sad state of affairs and it troubles me. I wish I was empowered to make a difference. If I somehow won a lottery I know where the bulk of it would go.

Everytime I drive across the bridge or join final approach when I'm flying into town I look at the abandoned high rise buildings. Detroit has the finest examples of gothic architecture and almost all of it will be lost because the buildings are largely deserted, boarded up and in disrepair.

Sorry guys. I don't mean to ramble. Its just this is one of the few places I can say such things and someone might understand.
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Typical_Lions


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

diehardlionfan wrote:
IDOG_det wrote:
diehardlionfan wrote:
nagahide13 wrote:
This is actually kind of a step in the right direction. It will help stop the continuous downward spiral the city has been going through for the last 50ish years. I don't really see a ton changing day to day for most people... and if Detroit sports have existed through the bad times, (mostly through private funding), I don't see them having any more issues than they've had already.

Mr. I passing would and will have a far greater impact.


Its to bad the federal government doesn't get involved after the proceedings are completed. They have a tremendous debt problem on their own but until such time as there is funding a mechanisms to stop servicing the mostly abandoned areas of the city problems will continue. The city simply can't continue to service areas that have inadequate tax receipts to justify the expense.

If the Feds funded the rehabilitation of these areas by tearing down the vacant structures, removing schools and relocating the few people still in these areas it would make a huge impact on the financial viability of the city.

The precedent was set in 1975 when the Feds bailed out NYC and not only helped fund operations but provided loan guarantees until 86 which allowed them to get on the right side of a balanced budget.

They gave massive bailouts to GM and Chrylser and I really don't see how Detroit can ever be viable unless they can get out from under the financial burden of providing funding to the derelict areas.

The other tragedy here is what impact there will be for retired police, firefighters and other civil servants. People work their whole lives contributing to their pensions and through no fault of their own get impacted far more seriously than those who caused the mess.
This entire post... Applause


You know, I don't live in Detroit and never have but the city means a great deal to me. I support a charity there called young Detroit builders because the work they do matters.

My loyalty stems from my childhood. I grew up in Edmonton Alberta during the days of a 6 team NHL. In those days there wasn't an NHL draft so each NHL team had a geographical area which was a protected. As a side note NHL expansion was actually driven by American team owners who were trying to break Montreals grip on a larger protected area which gave them a huge advantage.

Edmonton was part of the Red Wings protected area. As a result the Red Wings put money into minor hockey development camps and actually sponsored some of the AA teams in town. As a youngster all the older boys went into the Detroit organization. Ed Joyal, Bruce McGregor, Norm Ullman and my Dad's favourite player John Bucyk who was ahead of my time.

I've only personally purchased two sports Jerseys for myself but I was given a Red Wings #7 Norm Ullman Jersey which hangs in my closet to this day.

Anyway as a youngster Detroit was important to me and I've never forgotten that. Its also a very important city historically in the United States. Its been an easy target for those looking to poke fun at or put down a metropolitan area but most don't realize Detroit is the most accurate barometer for the social and financial health of the country.

Detroit lead the way as an industrial powerhouse becoming the city with the highest per capita incomes in the U.S.A. It was the social conscience of the country in the mid sixties. It started to lose its lustre in the 70's as import automobiles began their influx to North America slowly but steadily reducing domestic sales. Next came steel dumping which negatively impacted the big steel producing cities. Detroit, Pittsburgh, Hamilton. Computers, electronics imports all had a negative impact on North American manufacturers. Next Ronald Reagan declared war on unions convincing everyone unions were negative. This had a long lasting negative impact on Detroit and other blue collar cities further eroding jobs and suppressing wages. All the while corporations like Walmart told suppliers what price they would pay for merchandise and lead the movement to take manufacturing jobs overseas. What can be said about corporations that don't pay wages sufficient to live on.

I could write volumes but these are just the rambling s of a sad old man.

All that I can really say is Detroit has always lead the way, both up, and down. Numerous other cities have severe urban decay and budgetary issues. All levels of Government are fighting their own economic demons with states like California always one step ahead of insolvency. Instead of people looking at Detroit as a wake up call they put their nose in the air and blame the voters, politicians and businessmen choosing to ignore the writing on the wall in their own neck of the woods.

Its a sad, sad state of affairs and it troubles me. I wish I was empowered to make a difference. If I somehow won a lottery I know where the bulk of it would go.

Everytime I drive across the bridge or join final approach when I'm flying into town I look at the abandoned high rise buildings. Detroit has the finest examples of gothic architecture and almost all of it will be lost because the buildings are largely deserted, boarded up and in disrepair.

Sorry guys. I don't mean to ramble. Its just this is one of the few places I can say such things and someone might understand.


Good post and thanks for the info regarding the connection between Edmonton and the Detroit Red Wings. I had no idea.
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Typical_Lions wrote:
diehardlionfan wrote:
IDOG_det wrote:
diehardlionfan wrote:
nagahide13 wrote:
This is actually kind of a step in the right direction. It will help stop the continuous downward spiral the city has been going through for the last 50ish years. I don't really see a ton changing day to day for most people... and if Detroit sports have existed through the bad times, (mostly through private funding), I don't see them having any more issues than they've had already.

Mr. I passing would and will have a far greater impact.


Its to bad the federal government doesn't get involved after the proceedings are completed. They have a tremendous debt problem on their own but until such time as there is funding a mechanisms to stop servicing the mostly abandoned areas of the city problems will continue. The city simply can't continue to service areas that have inadequate tax receipts to justify the expense.

If the Feds funded the rehabilitation of these areas by tearing down the vacant structures, removing schools and relocating the few people still in these areas it would make a huge impact on the financial viability of the city.

The precedent was set in 1975 when the Feds bailed out NYC and not only helped fund operations but provided loan guarantees until 86 which allowed them to get on the right side of a balanced budget.

They gave massive bailouts to GM and Chrylser and I really don't see how Detroit can ever be viable unless they can get out from under the financial burden of providing funding to the derelict areas.

The other tragedy here is what impact there will be for retired police, firefighters and other civil servants. People work their whole lives contributing to their pensions and through no fault of their own get impacted far more seriously than those who caused the mess.
This entire post... Applause


You know, I don't live in Detroit and never have but the city means a great deal to me. I support a charity there called young Detroit builders because the work they do matters.

My loyalty stems from my childhood. I grew up in Edmonton Alberta during the days of a 6 team NHL. In those days there wasn't an NHL draft so each NHL team had a geographical area which was a protected. As a side note NHL expansion was actually driven by American team owners who were trying to break Montreals grip on a larger protected area which gave them a huge advantage.

Edmonton was part of the Red Wings protected area. As a result the Red Wings put money into minor hockey development camps and actually sponsored some of the AA teams in town. As a youngster all the older boys went into the Detroit organization. Ed Joyal, Bruce McGregor, Norm Ullman and my Dad's favourite player John Bucyk who was ahead of my time.

I've only personally purchased two sports Jerseys for myself but I was given a Red Wings #7 Norm Ullman Jersey which hangs in my closet to this day.

Anyway as a youngster Detroit was important to me and I've never forgotten that. Its also a very important city historically in the United States. Its been an easy target for those looking to poke fun at or put down a metropolitan area but most don't realize Detroit is the most accurate barometer for the social and financial health of the country.

Detroit lead the way as an industrial powerhouse becoming the city with the highest per capita incomes in the U.S.A. It was the social conscience of the country in the mid sixties. It started to lose its lustre in the 70's as import automobiles began their influx to North America slowly but steadily reducing domestic sales. Next came steel dumping which negatively impacted the big steel producing cities. Detroit, Pittsburgh, Hamilton. Computers, electronics imports all had a negative impact on North American manufacturers. Next Ronald Reagan declared war on unions convincing everyone unions were negative. This had a long lasting negative impact on Detroit and other blue collar cities further eroding jobs and suppressing wages. All the while corporations like Walmart told suppliers what price they would pay for merchandise and lead the movement to take manufacturing jobs overseas. What can be said about corporations that don't pay wages sufficient to live on.

I could write volumes but these are just the rambling s of a sad old man.

All that I can really say is Detroit has always lead the way, both up, and down. Numerous other cities have severe urban decay and budgetary issues. All levels of Government are fighting their own economic demons with states like California always one step ahead of insolvency. Instead of people looking at Detroit as a wake up call they put their nose in the air and blame the voters, politicians and businessmen choosing to ignore the writing on the wall in their own neck of the woods.

Its a sad, sad state of affairs and it troubles me. I wish I was empowered to make a difference. If I somehow won a lottery I know where the bulk of it would go.

Everytime I drive across the bridge or join final approach when I'm flying into town I look at the abandoned high rise buildings. Detroit has the finest examples of gothic architecture and almost all of it will be lost because the buildings are largely deserted, boarded up and in disrepair.

Sorry guys. I don't mean to ramble. Its just this is one of the few places I can say such things and someone might understand.


Good post and thanks for the info regarding the connection between Edmonton and the Detroit Red Wings. I had no idea.


Most people don't know about the geographic areas because it was a long time ago.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2013 5:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

diehardlionfan wrote:
IDOG_det wrote:
diehardlionfan wrote:
nagahide13 wrote:
This is actually kind of a step in the right direction. It will help stop the continuous downward spiral the city has been going through for the last 50ish years. I don't really see a ton changing day to day for most people... and if Detroit sports have existed through the bad times, (mostly through private funding), I don't see them having any more issues than they've had already.

Mr. I passing would and will have a far greater impact.


Its to bad the federal government doesn't get involved after the proceedings are completed. They have a tremendous debt problem on their own but until such time as there is funding a mechanisms to stop servicing the mostly abandoned areas of the city problems will continue. The city simply can't continue to service areas that have inadequate tax receipts to justify the expense.

If the Feds funded the rehabilitation of these areas by tearing down the vacant structures, removing schools and relocating the few people still in these areas it would make a huge impact on the financial viability of the city.

The precedent was set in 1975 when the Feds bailed out NYC and not only helped fund operations but provided loan guarantees until 86 which allowed them to get on the right side of a balanced budget.

They gave massive bailouts to GM and Chrylser and I really don't see how Detroit can ever be viable unless they can get out from under the financial burden of providing funding to the derelict areas.

The other tragedy here is what impact there will be for retired police, firefighters and other civil servants. People work their whole lives contributing to their pensions and through no fault of their own get impacted far more seriously than those who caused the mess.
This entire post... Applause


You know, I don't live in Detroit and never have but the city means a great deal to me. I support a charity there called young Detroit builders because the work they do matters.

My loyalty stems from my childhood. I grew up in Edmonton Alberta during the days of a 6 team NHL. In those days there wasn't an NHL draft so each NHL team had a geographical area which was a protected. As a side note NHL expansion was actually driven by American team owners who were trying to break Montreals grip on a larger protected area which gave them a huge advantage.

Edmonton was part of the Red Wings protected area. As a result the Red Wings put money into minor hockey development camps and actually sponsored some of the AA teams in town. As a youngster all the older boys went into the Detroit organization. Ed Joyal, Bruce McGregor, Norm Ullman and my Dad's favourite player John Bucyk who was ahead of my time.

I've only personally purchased two sports Jerseys for myself but I was given a Red Wings #7 Norm Ullman Jersey which hangs in my closet to this day.

Anyway as a youngster Detroit was important to me and I've never forgotten that. Its also a very important city historically in the United States. Its been an easy target for those looking to poke fun at or put down a metropolitan area but most don't realize Detroit is the most accurate barometer for the social and financial health of the country.

Detroit lead the way as an industrial powerhouse becoming the city with the highest per capita incomes in the U.S.A. It was the social conscience of the country in the mid sixties. It started to lose its lustre in the 70's as import automobiles began their influx to North America slowly but steadily reducing domestic sales. Next came steel dumping which negatively impacted the big steel producing cities. Detroit, Pittsburgh, Hamilton. Computers, electronics imports all had a negative impact on North American manufacturers. Next Ronald Reagan declared war on unions convincing everyone unions were negative. This had a long lasting negative impact on Detroit and other blue collar cities further eroding jobs and suppressing wages. All the while corporations like Walmart told suppliers what price they would pay for merchandise and lead the movement to take manufacturing jobs overseas. What can be said about corporations that don't pay wages sufficient to live on.

I could write volumes but these are just the rambling s of a sad old man.

All that I can really say is Detroit has always lead the way, both up, and down. Numerous other cities have severe urban decay and budgetary issues. All levels of Government are fighting their own economic demons with states like California always one step ahead of insolvency. Instead of people looking at Detroit as a wake up call they put their nose in the air and blame the voters, politicians and businessmen choosing to ignore the writing on the wall in their own neck of the woods.

Its a sad, sad state of affairs and it troubles me. I wish I was empowered to make a difference. If I somehow won a lottery I know where the bulk of it would go.

Everytime I drive across the bridge or join final approach when I'm flying into town I look at the abandoned high rise buildings. Detroit has the finest examples of gothic architecture and almost all of it will be lost because the buildings are largely deserted, boarded up and in disrepair.

Sorry guys. I don't mean to ramble. Its just this is one of the few places I can say such things and someone might understand.


The city is essentially a disaster zone right now. It was once arguably the greatest city in the US, but is now pretty easily the worst.

All I have to go on is personal experience, skeletal remains of the paradise lost, and stories from my family.

What you're saying isn't lost. It's understood. And the feeling is pretty universal for anyone with any experience of the city. It's as sad as sad can be.

I think the best example I can think of is a book I read when I was younger... It's called something like "Detroit then and now". One of the most powerful images is the old opera house. It's now a parking garage, but all of the art on the interior walls remains.



Bah.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 27, 2013 12:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I work and spend time in the city, though I don't live there.

It's not "essentially a disaster zone" and there really are no totally abandoned areas. There are lots of areas where two out of every three houses and businesses are empty, but the third one still remains.

The downtown area and Woodward corridor up to Midtown are relatively thriving, much better now than they were ten years ago, for instance. But the city proper is very large in terms of square miles and there are lots of areas which are obviously depressed and in bad shape.

There are two major problems, which have been with the city for forty years. One is, a city which once held nearly two million people now has 700,000. Less people, less business, less tax revenue. The second problem is, the tax revenue which is there has been stolen and wasted by corruption. Despite those problems, major businesses still work and thrive there, they have for many years and they still will.
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