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Jadeveon Clowny or Teddy Bridgewater???
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Who would be your choice for the #1 overall pick?
Jadeveon Clowny
43%
 43%  [ 16 ]
Teddy Bridgewater
56%
 56%  [ 21 ]
Total Votes : 37

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Estonianzulu


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Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Posts: 26330
Location: Middle of Nowhere VA
PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 12:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

buno67 wrote:

draft a QB 2nd rd who is talented or trade back up into the 1st for a QB means the outlook is you want to win with defense but have a QB who could still make plays for you.


This almost never works out. You either luck into a late round guy who explodes into success (Brady, Warner) or you draft a first rounder. Since 2000, only 2 2nd round QB's have made the Super Bowl, and one didn't do it with the team that drafted him.

If you don't believe Bridgewater is the franchise, don't waste a 2nd round pick on another Colt McCoy.
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Dawgpoun8017


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 12:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The only two teams in recent history who have win titles on their defense alone are the ravens first title and the Tampa bay title. Look at the patriot titles, those defenses were nothing special by any means
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Thomas5737


Joined: 23 Dec 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 12:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dawgpoun8017 wrote:
The only two teams in recent history who have win titles on their defense alone are the ravens first title and the Tampa bay title. Look at the patriot titles, those defenses were nothing special by any means


QB's don't win titles by themselves either.
When the Patriots actually won titles their defense was special.

If Bridgewater grades out at 86 for you and Clowney at 91 and you need a QB, yeah, you probably still take the QB. It would all depend on how we would hypothetically grade them out.
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Dawgpoun8017


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love clowney I am a huge fan of his but I personally do not think he is a better prospect than Julius peppers, while peppers has been an amazing defender, he hasn't won anything, those patriot defenses were nothing special athletically, what made those defenses great was they all bought into the scheme, they were well coached, disciplined and stuck together, but they didn't have any players that popped out at you athletically. That was a veteran laden defense
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Thomas5737


Joined: 23 Dec 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thomas5737 wrote:
Dawgpoun8017 wrote:
The only two teams in recent history who have win titles on their defense alone are the ravens first title and the Tampa bay title. Look at the patriot titles, those defenses were nothing special by any means


QB's don't win titles by themselves either.
When the Patriots actually won titles their defense was special.

If Bridgewater grades out at 86 for you and Clowney at 91 and you need a QB, yeah, you probably still take the QB. It would all depend on how we would hypothetically grade them out.


Good post.

Thanks.

Thanks to Simon and Garfunkel I started thinking. Teddy always reminds me of their song and I wondered if there was any semblance or hidden answers behind it.

Looking at the title itself "Bridge over troubled water" If we take out Bridgewater that leaves us with over troubled. Does that mean our troubles will be over or that we will be over troubled?

In the lyrics, there is also this:
When you're weary
Feeling small
When tears are in your eyes
I will dry them all

It is like Teddy is singing it directly to the fan base.

Want more?

Too bad, here it comes.

Your time has come to shine
All your dreams are on their way

See how they shine
If you need a friend
I'm sailing right behind
Like a bridge over troubled water
I will ease your mind
Like a bridge over troubled water
I will ease your mind.

Yeah its okay, I got choked up too.




When I think of Clowney in song, it is usually Stealers Wheel (already a bad omen) "stuck in the middle with you" You know, Clowney to the left of me, jokers to the right...

So, here we go.
"Well I don't know why I came here tonight,
I got the feeling that something ain't right"

Yeah, not a good sign.

More:
"Yes I'm stuck in the middle with you,
And I'm wondering what it is I should do,
It's so hard to keep this smile from my face,
Losing control, yeah, I'm all over the place"

To me it doesn't even sound like Clowney wants to be here, and we don't need a cancer like that in our locker room.

I'm changing my vote to Teddy
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bungleodeon


Joined: 19 Mar 2009
Posts: 9312
PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thomas5737 wrote:
Dawgpoun8017 wrote:
The only two teams in recent history who have win titles on their defense alone are the ravens first title and the Tampa bay title. Look at the patriot titles, those defenses were nothing special by any means


QB's don't win titles by themselves either.
When the Patriots actually won titles their defense was special.

If Bridgewater grades out at 86 for you and Clowney at 91 and you need a QB, yeah, you probably still take the QB. It would all depend on how we would hypothetically grade them out.
I don't understand all this talk about titles. We've only made the playoffs once since the return. Most of the really good QB's in the league manage to help get their teams to the playoffs more often than not, and I'm totally happy with our team avoiding being doormats for another decade.
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pmk


Joined: 21 Jun 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 4:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thomas5737 wrote:

Good post.

Thanks.

Thanks to Simon and Garfunkel I started thinking. Teddy always reminds me of their song and I wondered if there was any semblance or hidden answers behind it.

Looking at the title itself "Bridge over troubled water" If we take out Bridgewater that leaves us with over troubled. Does that mean our troubles will be over or that we will be over troubled?

In the lyrics, there is also this:
When you're weary
Feeling small
When tears are in your eyes
I will dry them all

It is like Teddy is singing it directly to the fan base.

Want more?

Too bad, here it comes.

Your time has come to shine
All your dreams are on their way

See how they shine
If you need a friend
I'm sailing right behind
Like a bridge over troubled water
I will ease your mind
Like a bridge over troubled water
I will ease your mind.

Yeah its okay, I got choked up too.




When I think of Clowney in song, it is usually Stealers Wheel (already a bad omen) "stuck in the middle with you" You know, Clowney to the left of me, jokers to the right...

So, here we go.
"Well I don't know why I came here tonight,
I got the feeling that something ain't right"

Yeah, not a good sign.

More:
"Yes I'm stuck in the middle with you,
And I'm wondering what it is I should do,
It's so hard to keep this smile from my face,
Losing control, yeah, I'm all over the place"

To me it doesn't even sound like Clowney wants to be here, and we don't need a cancer like that in our locker room.

I'm changing my vote to Teddy
Are you trying to say that Clowney will cut off an opponent's ear? Because if so I think we need to draft him for entertainment value alone. Hopefully it's Roethlisburgers...
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bulldog


Joined: 18 Nov 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I went with clowney.

Only bc we can call him Clowney the Brownie.

And im also assuming we made the playoffs and traded our whole draft to move up to #1. Cameron emerged as a huge asset at TE. Greco balled out at guard. Gibson or Bademosi become a centerfielder. And someone claimed the #2 cb spot.

Totally possible.
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Jimmytruckstop


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 9:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LOL @ people taking a de over a qb for this team

QB has the ball in his hands for every offensive possession. In a league where the rules are heavily favored for passing. Where having a top 7 qb basically puts that team into playoff contention every year

Vs

A de who can be taken out of half of the other teams offense by running the other way. Where he can be doubled or tripled every play of the game. A tight end stays an extra half second to chip and a guard sliding protection or a back staying in the backfield.a lot of guys can have an impact on the defensive end. Save for a couple of running backs, only one guy on offense is going to be able to provide that type of impact on offense.


Buno, you brought up Jim Kelly. Wasn't Bruce smith, a pretty good de also on his team?

Which actually shows you need a good all around team (and luck) to win and imo the best and fastest way to get there is having your qb spot solidified.


Silly thread.
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buno67


Joined: 15 Mar 2007
Posts: 31337
PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jimmytruckstop wrote:
LOL @ people taking a de over a qb for this team

QB has the ball in his hands for every offensive possession. In a league where the rules are heavily favored for passing. Where having a top 7 qb basically puts that team into playoff contention every year

Vs

A de who can be taken out of half of the other teams offense by running the other way. Where he can be doubled or tripled every play of the game. A tight end stays an extra half second to chip and a guard sliding protection or a back staying in the backfield.a lot of guys can have an impact on the defensive end. Save for a couple of running backs, only one guy on offense is going to be able to provide that type of impact on offense.


Buno, you brought up Jim Kelly. Wasn't Bruce smith, a pretty good de also on his team?

Which actually shows you need a good all around team (and luck) to win and imo the best and fastest way to get there is having your qb spot solidified.


Silly thread.


Ok you say you can take out a DE by running the other way. wouldnt that be a huge advantage to the defense that they will know that the DE is on the left that the offense will run to the right. Giving the defense an advantage that they will know the direction of the run?

You bring up all these points about double/triple teaming a DE, using a TE, sliding a G, or keeping a back. Ok if Clowney is getting double to triple teamed, that means someone like Taylor, Mingo, or Kruger isnt being accounted for, so those guys now have an advantage. TE staying in a second longer doesnt allow him to get into his route fast enough and could take him out of the play with how quick QBs have to get rid o the ball. Guard sliding out looking to help with a DE could miss a blitzing Kruger or Mingo. Having an RB stayin in to help block means he isnt running into the flat. If the back is just blocking than it means we have another defender in coverage or another defender putting pressure on the QB. Yes you could say they are taking Clowney out of the game but look at the effect he is having on the rest of the defense and the offense. Clowney is signel handling altering running schemes and pass blocking schemes.

Ok, your saying having a top7 QB means you will make the playoffs, are you saying Teddy is going to be a top10 QB? because I dont see him being a top7 or a top10 QB

Teddy wont be a top10 QB IMO but Clowney would make us a top10 defense. Him and Mingo could be a nasty duo
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Jimmytruckstop


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Courtney Brown seemed legit once as we'll. I can do that too.

It's silly to call one player a bust and another a stud and make your decision solely on that.

Assuming both players become multiple pro bowlers or your decision makers peg both to be pro bowl caliber players you take the qb every time. It's the most important position in the game for a reason


All things somewhat relative, basketball you take the center, baseball you take pitching, football you take the qb

Pretty easy
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TeHDruiD


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2013 7:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

buno67 wrote:
Ok, your saying having a top7 QB means you will make the playoffs, are you saying Teddy is going to be a top10 QB? because I dont see him being a top7 or a top10 QB

Teddy wont be a top10 QB IMO but Clowney would make us a top10 defense. Him and Mingo could be a nasty duo


In your honest opinion, was Joe Flacco a top 10 QB the last few years? It wasn't until the playoffs until he displayed elite ability and lead his team to the Super Bowl. Up until the playoffs, he was becoming quite the joke due to how bad he was playing. However without him they don't make it to and win the Super Bowl

What we need is a QB who can lead us to the playoffs every year. After that, it becomes a guessing match of which QB is going to light it up and lead his team, but you have to get there first

Flacco wasn't a top 10 QB at all, but they don't do what they did without him because he performed at the highest level when they needed him the most. Their isn't a position on the football field that comes close to the impact that a QB brings. We will remain the joke of the league until we finally get a QB (hopefully Weeden shines this year) who can win games in a methodical manner. Little to no turnovers, big plays etc. No other single player can do that but a QB. Every position is important, but you honestly don't get to the Super Bowl unless you have a QB. Their are a few exceptions, but they're rare

Also you said you seen a QB similiar to Bridgewater in the past few drafts named RGIII, but what you fail to see is he's also the reason that the Redskins are always going to be considered a playoff contender. If you could promise me the playoffs with a DE I'd be in, but I don't think it's possible because you need to score points

I also understand that you have to hold opponents on defense, no denying that, but the most important position needs addressed before anything else can work imo
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cattleman78


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 4:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If we end up with the first pick that means we had a lot of injuries and also a lot of players had a very bad season besides Weeden. If a q.b. is rated high enough than he has to be the pick. The best thing that could happen though is the team with the number two pick wanted Clowney and would trade us their 1st and 2nd round picks [maybe even more] for Clowney. If the Browns have two or three q.b's. rated about the same they could trade down even farther.
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brooks1957


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 8:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Him. When his team needed him the most, he delivered big time. A game changer. And the fact this was against my LEAST favorite team is a bonus.http://youtu.be/ENuZHnQlqX0
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buno67


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 9:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

brooks1957 wrote:
Him. When his team needed him the most, he delivered big time. A game changer. And the fact this was against my LEAST favorite team is a bonus.http://youtu.be/ENuZHnQlqX0


He has played in and started I the SEC or the semi NFL league for the past 3years. His transition to the NFL would be a short learning curve IMO. You look at Teddy, he plays in a weak, very weak conference. The toughest team he has faced in two years was last years Florida team and he and his his coaches had weeks to prepare for it, so it takes a little from it. We have seen too many guys light it up in a season and fall on their face the season after.

IMO it's all about finding the right QB for your system. It seems like in years past the browns have been trying to find a QB and then building a system around them. They need to find build a system than get a QB that fits its. The great thing is we are in that situation. We have a QB who fits our system perfectly unlike years last, except for DAs tenure here
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