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JTagg7754


Joined: 09 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bitty wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
bitty wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
bitty wrote:
In the one game Pryor played his decision making was pretty good he saw the open WR and made players with his feet.
His footwork is horrible which causes problems with his accuracy and rainbows the ball to much but that stuff isn't decision-making.


He threw across his body to the middle of the field numerous times. Overall, his decision making was nothing to get excited about for that game. He did good and he did bad. Thing is, once he's playing a team that has something to play for and is actually talented w/ time to prep for him, he will not look as good and I'm 100% certain of that.


And you're right but that's true with all QB.


It's true but those that have more natural ability will be able to get away w/ it more. If you throw lob passes across your body to the middle of the field, you're going to have a bad time once defenses key on this.


In my opinion if Pryor didn't show improvement by now he'll be playing WR. ( I think he should have all a long)
Pryor's physical attributes match up to Megatron.


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raidr4life


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JTagg7754 wrote:
raidr4life wrote:
Oh man! All we did is start a thread for JTagg to spew his Pryor hatred. Bottom line is Pryor is getting a chance to compete this year and 90% of the fans want to see where the chips fall instead of listen to JTagg tell us over and over again why he thinks Pryor sucks.


You confuse "hatred" for "realism"..... I'm not shocked.
I'm not shocked you call your "hatred"..... "realism"

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JTagg7754


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

raidr4life wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
raidr4life wrote:
Oh man! All we did is start a thread for JTagg to spew his Pryor hatred. Bottom line is Pryor is getting a chance to compete this year and 90% of the fans want to see where the chips fall instead of listen to JTagg tell us over and over again why he thinks Pryor sucks.


You confuse "hatred" for "realism"..... I'm not shocked.
I'm not shocked you call your "hatred"..... "realism"

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You must know me better than I know me. Good to know.
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raidr4life


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JTagg7754 wrote:
TiberiusRising wrote:

For one my track record speaks for itself.

Secondly I think Wilson can be a good QB as well. However to say he has been showing improvement is a stretch imo. He came in hot and wasnt as good towards the end. I will say to his credit you really cant judge improvement from two weeks or so of camp.Now if you are saying it sounds as if he looked better in practice than he looked on the field in college last season then yes. However this is just practice and he may practice well. Hell Leinart was the king of camp but looked like doo doo on the gamedays. Kind of the same argument some have for Pryor going the other way.


Well I guess we have to leave it at that b/c I don't know your track record. All I know is you admittedly don't like putting things into context which is why I asked for an explanation.

I admit Wilson cooled off but can we really expect him to maintain that momentum all the way? He's a rookie, he will have his off and on days but the promise he's shown thus far > Pryor's. Overall though, I agree w/ the point you made.
As far as Wilson is concerned I, like all our fans should be, hope he can become something we need someone to emerge, but you couldn't wait to once again take your pot shots at Pryor based on reports from a rookie camp, then claim your just reporting the news. Wlson hasn't been talked about since. My view of him is based on real action in fact the last real action he had before being drafted to show scouts what he can do was the Senior Bowl where he looked like hot garbage.
That being said I'm not going to brand him a failure based on that one game, but it is more telling than a rookie camp. Lets see what NFL coaching can do for him, instead of branding him a savior and the next coming after a rookie camp report.
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JTagg7754


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

raidr4life wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
TiberiusRising wrote:

For one my track record speaks for itself.

Secondly I think Wilson can be a good QB as well. However to say he has been showing improvement is a stretch imo. He came in hot and wasnt as good towards the end. I will say to his credit you really cant judge improvement from two weeks or so of camp.Now if you are saying it sounds as if he looked better in practice than he looked on the field in college last season then yes. However this is just practice and he may practice well. Hell Leinart was the king of camp but looked like doo doo on the gamedays. Kind of the same argument some have for Pryor going the other way.


Well I guess we have to leave it at that b/c I don't know your track record. All I know is you admittedly don't like putting things into context which is why I asked for an explanation.

I admit Wilson cooled off but can we really expect him to maintain that momentum all the way? He's a rookie, he will have his off and on days but the promise he's shown thus far > Pryor's. Overall though, I agree w/ the point you made.
As far as Wilson is concerned I, like all our fans should be, hope he can become something we need someone to emerge, but you couldn't wait to once again take your pot shots at Pryor based on reports from a rookie camp, then claim your just reporting the news. Wlson hasn't been talked about since. My view of him is based on real action in fact the last real action he had before being drafted to show scouts what he can do was the Senior Bowl where he looked like hot garbage.
That being said I'm not going to brand him a failure based on that one game, but it is more telling than a rookie camp. Lets see what NFL coaching can do for him, instead of branding him a savior and the next coming after a rookie camp report.


It's a conversation about Pryor, smarty.... did you eat paint chips as a kid?

No one is branding Wilson a "savior" or "next coming" either as you're the only person to bring it up. I simply said he's got more promise than Pryor b/c it's evident that he does. Again, this isn't a cheap shot, it's common sense to anyone w/ even a little bit of knowledge about football.
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raidr4life


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JTagg7754 wrote:
raidr4life wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
TiberiusRising wrote:

For one my track record speaks for itself.

Secondly I think Wilson can be a good QB as well. However to say he has been showing improvement is a stretch imo. He came in hot and wasnt as good towards the end. I will say to his credit you really cant judge improvement from two weeks or so of camp.Now if you are saying it sounds as if he looked better in practice than he looked on the field in college last season then yes. However this is just practice and he may practice well. Hell Leinart was the king of camp but looked like doo doo on the gamedays. Kind of the same argument some have for Pryor going the other way.


Well I guess we have to leave it at that b/c I don't know your track record. All I know is you admittedly don't like putting things into context which is why I asked for an explanation.

I admit Wilson cooled off but can we really expect him to maintain that momentum all the way? He's a rookie, he will have his off and on days but the promise he's shown thus far > Pryor's. Overall though, I agree w/ the point you made.
As far as Wilson is concerned I, like all our fans should be, hope he can become something we need someone to emerge, but you couldn't wait to once again take your pot shots at Pryor based on reports from a rookie camp, then claim your just reporting the news. Wlson hasn't been talked about since. My view of him is based on real action in fact the last real action he had before being drafted to show scouts what he can do was the Senior Bowl where he looked like hot garbage.
That being said I'm not going to brand him a failure based on that one game, but it is more telling than a rookie camp. Lets see what NFL coaching can do for him, instead of branding him a savior and the next coming after a rookie camp report.


It's a conversation about Pryor, smarty.... did you eat paint chips as a kid?

No one is branding Wilson a "savior" or "next coming" either as you're the only person to bring it up. I simply said he's got more promise than Pryor b/c it's evident that he does. Again, this isn't a cheap shot, it's common sense to anyone w/ even a little bit of knowledge about football.
You obviously been eating paint chips because I can go find your post when the report came out about Wilson looking good in rookie camp, and you jumped all on his nuts, while telling everybody how Pryor was third string, and Wilson could start all based on a rookie camp, "smarty"
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bitty


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JTagg7754 wrote:
raidr4life wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
TiberiusRising wrote:

For one my track record speaks for itself.

Secondly I think Wilson can be a good QB as well. However to say he has been showing improvement is a stretch imo. He came in hot and wasnt as good towards the end. I will say to his credit you really cant judge improvement from two weeks or so of camp.Now if you are saying it sounds as if he looked better in practice than he looked on the field in college last season then yes. However this is just practice and he may practice well. Hell Leinart was the king of camp but looked like doo doo on the gamedays. Kind of the same argument some have for Pryor going the other way.


Well I guess we have to leave it at that b/c I don't know your track record. All I know is you admittedly don't like putting things into context which is why I asked for an explanation.

I admit Wilson cooled off but can we really expect him to maintain that momentum all the way? He's a rookie, he will have his off and on days but the promise he's shown thus far > Pryor's. Overall though, I agree w/ the point you made.
As far as Wilson is concerned I, like all our fans should be, hope he can become something we need someone to emerge, but you couldn't wait to once again take your pot shots at Pryor based on reports from a rookie camp, then claim your just reporting the news. Wlson hasn't been talked about since. My view of him is based on real action in fact the last real action he had before being drafted to show scouts what he can do was the Senior Bowl where he looked like hot garbage.
That being said I'm not going to brand him a failure based on that one game, but it is more telling than a rookie camp. Lets see what NFL coaching can do for him, instead of branding him a savior and the next coming after a rookie camp report.


It's a conversation about Pryor, smarty.... did you eat paint chips as a kid?

No one is branding Wilson a "savior" or "next coming" either as you're the only person to bring it up. I simply said he's got more promise than Pryor b/c it's evident that he does. Again, this isn't a cheap shot, it's common sense to anyone w/ even a little bit of knowledge about football.



I am he has shown everything needed to be an elite QB even if it was in short spurts.
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Ro4DPoY


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JTagg7754 wrote:
Ro4DPoY wrote:

He can eventually become great, all it takes is getting better at what he lacks in. He's in his third season, who knows what'll happen in the coming couple of seasons.


No, he won't eventually become great and I can assure you that. I know, I could be wrong, but I can say that w/ 99% certainty. He has sucked and lacked progression his entire NFL "career". So he's just going to one day start throwing accurate, spiraling passes after years of not doing it? That's just blind homerism.

Dude sucks. Once everyone realizes it, we can move on.

Hell, there's not even a guarantee he makes the 53 man roster this off-season LOL


I didn't say he will, I just said he can lol..that it's possible, nothings impossible. Some players will never become great, I was just pointing out that if you give anyone 15 years to progress you might eventually see it happen.
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JTagg7754


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

raidr4life wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
raidr4life wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
TiberiusRising wrote:

For one my track record speaks for itself.

Secondly I think Wilson can be a good QB as well. However to say he has been showing improvement is a stretch imo. He came in hot and wasnt as good towards the end. I will say to his credit you really cant judge improvement from two weeks or so of camp.Now if you are saying it sounds as if he looked better in practice than he looked on the field in college last season then yes. However this is just practice and he may practice well. Hell Leinart was the king of camp but looked like doo doo on the gamedays. Kind of the same argument some have for Pryor going the other way.


Well I guess we have to leave it at that b/c I don't know your track record. All I know is you admittedly don't like putting things into context which is why I asked for an explanation.

I admit Wilson cooled off but can we really expect him to maintain that momentum all the way? He's a rookie, he will have his off and on days but the promise he's shown thus far > Pryor's. Overall though, I agree w/ the point you made.
As far as Wilson is concerned I, like all our fans should be, hope he can become something we need someone to emerge, but you couldn't wait to once again take your pot shots at Pryor based on reports from a rookie camp, then claim your just reporting the news. Wlson hasn't been talked about since. My view of him is based on real action in fact the last real action he had before being drafted to show scouts what he can do was the Senior Bowl where he looked like hot garbage.
That being said I'm not going to brand him a failure based on that one game, but it is more telling than a rookie camp. Lets see what NFL coaching can do for him, instead of branding him a savior and the next coming after a rookie camp report.


It's a conversation about Pryor, smarty.... did you eat paint chips as a kid?

No one is branding Wilson a "savior" or "next coming" either as you're the only person to bring it up. I simply said he's got more promise than Pryor b/c it's evident that he does. Again, this isn't a cheap shot, it's common sense to anyone w/ even a little bit of knowledge about football.
You obviously been eating paint chips because I can go find your post when the report came out about Wilson looking good in rookie camp, and you jumped all on his nuts, while telling everybody how Pryor was third string, and Wilson could start all based on a rookie camp, "smarty"


Do you understand that everything we're talking about now is hypothetical? How we're talking about the probability of something based off of what we previously know of the person?? I've actually "been on Wilson's nuts" since his junior season at Arkansas so you're minimally right about that. Is Pryor not the third best QB based on the reports coming from camp this season? Would you say he's beating out Wilson b/c we all know Flynn is going to start barring Tyler taking the job and yes, Tyler has the ability to. I'm almost certain you've never seen him play though. Pryor needs to look out for McGloin putting in all that hard work, playing w/ a chip on his shoulder, and consistently proving tons of doubters wrong LOL.
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JTagg7754


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ro4DPoY wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
Ro4DPoY wrote:

He can eventually become great, all it takes is getting better at what he lacks in. He's in his third season, who knows what'll happen in the coming couple of seasons.


No, he won't eventually become great and I can assure you that. I know, I could be wrong, but I can say that w/ 99% certainty. He has sucked and lacked progression his entire NFL "career". So he's just going to one day start throwing accurate, spiraling passes after years of not doing it? That's just blind homerism.

Dude sucks. Once everyone realizes it, we can move on.

Hell, there's not even a guarantee he makes the 53 man roster this off-season LOL


I didn't say he will, I just said he can lol..that it's possible, nothings impossible. Some players will never become great, I was just pointing out that if you give anyone 15 years to progress you might eventually see it happen.


LOL You are absolutely correct assuming their athleticism and natural ability can progress after 15 years, you're very right.
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JTagg7754


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bitty wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:


No one is branding Wilson a "savior" or "next coming" either as you're the only person to bring it up. I simply said he's got more promise than Pryor b/c it's evident that he does. Again, this isn't a cheap shot, it's common sense to anyone w/ even a little bit of knowledge about football.



I am he has shown everything needed to be an elite QB even if it was in short spurts.


LOL OK, so you are. I'm fine w/ that. I believe his biggest obstacle will be facing opposition and how he reacts to getting hit around again like he did in AK. But yes, based on natural ability, IMO, he's the best QB on the team. It's all a question of him being able to translate that onto the field.
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JTagg7754 wrote:
TiberiusRising wrote:

Go look them up yourself. I am not going to waste my time finding them for someone who really doesn't care about anything but his own opinion. I think you are mislead to believe that someone has to improve in all areas immediatley in order to show improvement. There are many more aspects to the QB position than simply throwing a tight spiral which has been proven too not be required to be a successful NFL QB. However you dont just fix "wobbly passes" by doing the wobbly pass exercise or taking the wobbly pass injection. You do it by working on your mechanics and footwork. Once all those pieces come into place the issue resolves itself. Both of which he has been working on. Look I cant honestly say if he will end up being good or not. However I can say he would probably win us more games than some of the guys who came through here the past decade and deserves a fair shot at succeeding which I think he is now getting this year.


No, see, I want you to find them b/c I want to see your definition of the term. This is what I was eluding to in a prior discussion b/c you don't comment on thoughts, just posts. You see the problem w/ that is terms are subjective and "improving" is one of those terms. So I need your definition of "improving" (or examples in this manner) to accurately gauge your post. I like how you feel I think my opinions are all that matters though. Such a cop out from having any kind of discussion.

Not all areas, but the areas of most concern which are mechanics, footwork, accurate, and velocity.

I know he's been working on those things but you know what hasn't happened? He's still inconsistent and has not improved on the number of times he is accurate and has thrown good spirals. That's called not progressing..... exactly what I said has happened. People can work on things all their lives but that doesn't mean they'll ever get good enough to succeed. Hell, take golf for example. I think the top .2% of players who play all the time are labeled as "professionals". Why? B/c they're better than Joe Schmo who goes out to the range 5 times a week and plays 72 holes a week. Why? B/c they have more natural talent. Want to know why there's people who can study for 1 hour and ace any test while Susie Sunshine studies for 1 month and can't do better? B/c those aforementioned people are naturally smarter.

Pryor could work his tail off and his improvement could slightly get better, that's fantastic!! Know what though? His "best" still isn't better than some people's "average". Hell, look at Wilson and Pryor. Great reviews of Wilson thus far. Talking about his improvements while his inconsistencies. Pryor's reviews are more along the lines of "same ol ish". Wilson, far more younger w/ as many coaching changes who took an absolute beating last season, just has more natural talent and it's showing in practices already. Pryor is the fat, slower brother of the athlete. He may become the athlete at one point, but when it happens, will it be too late or will anyone even care enough to give him that chance? He's just taking too long to show minimal improvement (according to you at least b/c I haven't seen it) while Wilson has taken far less time to show much more improvement.


There about 4 months apart in age, as for the athlete comment....Pryor ran a 4.38 40 and slung a 60 yarder in camp, athleticism isn't an issue it's decision making and footwork.
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JTagg7754


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ro4DPoY wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
TiberiusRising wrote:

Go look them up yourself. I am not going to waste my time finding them for someone who really doesn't care about anything but his own opinion. I think you are mislead to believe that someone has to improve in all areas immediatley in order to show improvement. There are many more aspects to the QB position than simply throwing a tight spiral which has been proven too not be required to be a successful NFL QB. However you dont just fix "wobbly passes" by doing the wobbly pass exercise or taking the wobbly pass injection. You do it by working on your mechanics and footwork. Once all those pieces come into place the issue resolves itself. Both of which he has been working on. Look I cant honestly say if he will end up being good or not. However I can say he would probably win us more games than some of the guys who came through here the past decade and deserves a fair shot at succeeding which I think he is now getting this year.


No, see, I want you to find them b/c I want to see your definition of the term. This is what I was eluding to in a prior discussion b/c you don't comment on thoughts, just posts. You see the problem w/ that is terms are subjective and "improving" is one of those terms. So I need your definition of "improving" (or examples in this manner) to accurately gauge your post. I like how you feel I think my opinions are all that matters though. Such a cop out from having any kind of discussion.

Not all areas, but the areas of most concern which are mechanics, footwork, accurate, and velocity.

I know he's been working on those things but you know what hasn't happened? He's still inconsistent and has not improved on the number of times he is accurate and has thrown good spirals. That's called not progressing..... exactly what I said has happened. People can work on things all their lives but that doesn't mean they'll ever get good enough to succeed. Hell, take golf for example. I think the top .2% of players who play all the time are labeled as "professionals". Why? B/c they're better than Joe Schmo who goes out to the range 5 times a week and plays 72 holes a week. Why? B/c they have more natural talent. Want to know why there's people who can study for 1 hour and ace any test while Susie Sunshine studies for 1 month and can't do better? B/c those aforementioned people are naturally smarter.

Pryor could work his tail off and his improvement could slightly get better, that's fantastic!! Know what though? His "best" still isn't better than some people's "average". Hell, look at Wilson and Pryor. Great reviews of Wilson thus far. Talking about his improvements while his inconsistencies. Pryor's reviews are more along the lines of "same ol ish". Wilson, far more younger w/ as many coaching changes who took an absolute beating last season, just has more natural talent and it's showing in practices already. Pryor is the fat, slower brother of the athlete. He may become the athlete at one point, but when it happens, will it be too late or will anyone even care enough to give him that chance? He's just taking too long to show minimal improvement (according to you at least b/c I haven't seen it) while Wilson has taken far less time to show much more improvement.


There about 4 months apart in age, as for the athlete comment....Pryor ran a 4.38 40 and slung a 60 yarder in camp, athleticism isn't an issue it's decision making and footwork.


They're only 4 months apart? No kidding? Hmm... shows I'm not their autobiographer Smile

That's part of athleticism. Having all the pieces and being able to put them in place. Russell could whip the ball forever and ran a good 40 time based on his weight. I certainly wouldn't call him an elite athlete. It's obviously a subjective term b/c I remember the stupid argument going on around here about whether Peyton Manning was an athlete or not but IMO, you need to have a good all-around game to be considered one. Not just a one trick pony who does that one trick very well.
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just want to point out that I'm not on the Pryor bandwagon, I'm on the Raiders return to grace wagon meaning if Pryor becomes our Keapernick or Wilson becomes Rodgers or Flynn turns into Eli Manning that's who I'm going to root for. I just enjoy talking football. I'm on the Raiders go 12-4 stomp the Broncos bandwagon. Those comparisons aren't who I believe they'll become I'm just saying I want a winner.
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raidr4life


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JTagg7754 wrote:
raidr4life wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
raidr4life wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
TiberiusRising wrote:

For one my track record speaks for itself.

Secondly I think Wilson can be a good QB as well. However to say he has been showing improvement is a stretch imo. He came in hot and wasnt as good towards the end. I will say to his credit you really cant judge improvement from two weeks or so of camp.Now if you are saying it sounds as if he looked better in practice than he looked on the field in college last season then yes. However this is just practice and he may practice well. Hell Leinart was the king of camp but looked like doo doo on the gamedays. Kind of the same argument some have for Pryor going the other way.


Well I guess we have to leave it at that b/c I don't know your track record. All I know is you admittedly don't like putting things into context which is why I asked for an explanation.

I admit Wilson cooled off but can we really expect him to maintain that momentum all the way? He's a rookie, he will have his off and on days but the promise he's shown thus far > Pryor's. Overall though, I agree w/ the point you made.
As far as Wilson is concerned I, like all our fans should be, hope he can become something we need someone to emerge, but you couldn't wait to once again take your pot shots at Pryor based on reports from a rookie camp, then claim your just reporting the news. Wlson hasn't been talked about since. My view of him is based on real action in fact the last real action he had before being drafted to show scouts what he can do was the Senior Bowl where he looked like hot garbage.
That being said I'm not going to brand him a failure based on that one game, but it is more telling than a rookie camp. Lets see what NFL coaching can do for him, instead of branding him a savior and the next coming after a rookie camp report.


It's a conversation about Pryor, smarty.... did you eat paint chips as a kid?

No one is branding Wilson a "savior" or "next coming" either as you're the only person to bring it up. I simply said he's got more promise than Pryor b/c it's evident that he does. Again, this isn't a cheap shot, it's common sense to anyone w/ even a little bit of knowledge about football.
You obviously been eating paint chips because I can go find your post when the report came out about Wilson looking good in rookie camp, and you jumped all on his nuts, while telling everybody how Pryor was third string, and Wilson could start all based on a rookie camp, "smarty"


Do you understand that everything we're talking about now is hypothetical? How we're talking about the probability of something based off of what we previously know of the person?? I've actually "been on Wilson's nuts" since his junior season at Arkansas so you're minimally right about that. Is Pryor not the third best QB based on the reports coming from camp this season? Would you say he's beating out Wilson b/c we all know Flynn is going to start barring Tyler taking the job and yes, Tyler has the ability to. I'm almost certain you've never seen him play though. Pryor needs to look out for McGloin putting in all that hard work, playing w/ a chip on his shoulder, and consistently proving tons of doubters wrong LOL.
Now I'm certain you don't know crap since I may have watched Wilson play more than you have. Show me a report that say Pryor is now third string and Wilson is getting all the second team reps. You wont. Because nobody wins jobs in June.
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