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Vontae Leach
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Should we bring Leach into the fold?
Yay
50%
 50%  [ 14 ]
Nay
50%
 50%  [ 14 ]
Total Votes : 28

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justo


Joined: 05 Aug 2012
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

persiandud wrote:
All for it, Leach can help Lacy out.


One back, one te/fb sets lead to bigger run plays. Leach/Lacy/Nelson/Jones/Cobb, your move, defense.
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ugLymayNe


Joined: 31 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

justo wrote:
persiandud wrote:
All for it, Leach can help Lacy out.


One back, one te/fb sets lead to bigger run plays. Leach/Lacy/Nelson/Jones/Cobb, your move, defense.


I think Quarless and Mulligan will be a good players in that role. Not as good as Leach, but good. Those two can line up inline, wing, in the backfield...Quarless can even line up in the slot(well, lets see how he looks after the injury, but in the past he could).
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Kal-El


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

persiandud wrote:
All for it, Leach can help Lacy out.


Oh man... Leach and Lacy in the backfield would be very literal pain for opposing defenses.

BOOM, BOOM!
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rbens06


Joined: 07 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ketchup wrote:
dijatool wrote:
justo wrote:
When Lorenzo Neal joined the Chargers he was older than Leach is now. I'm for bringing Leach in. Kuhn isn't a better pass threat than five players we already have on the field (Lacy takes him out in 1 back shotguns sets, IMO) and Leach is a better blocker. If we get him for 6M for 3 years we'd only be paying like 450,000 more this year on the FB position if we cut Kuhn (doubt we'd keep two FB's on the roster). I'd give up 450,000 for 3 years of an elite blocking FB>one year of Kuhn

Do you recall why Leach left GB initially? He was terrible catching the ball, beyond awful. He has certainly improved in that area, but enough to be better at it than Kuhn?

Factor in everything else and it seems unlikely to happen.
Kuhn, in his last 2 seasons, caught 30 balls for 225 yards. Mind you, that's in a pass happy offense with the best QB in the league. Leach, in his past two season, caught 36 balls for 212 yards. Mind you, that's in a run heavy offense with a fringe top 10 QB.

So yes, he has improved enough to be called at least equal with Kuhn IMO.


To me it is not about the numbers when looking at the passing game for a couple of different reasons. First, I would guess that a lot of Leach's catches were in the flat, designed routes and a lot of Kuhn's were dump off, safety valve catches. I do not really have anything to back this up with other than the offenses we play. As you mentioned we are a pass happy team, but I think Rodgers accounts for the difference here. He is very efficient at spreading the ball around, hitting quick passes, and buying time for his receivers down field. As you mentioned, the Ravens are more run heavy offense that, from the few times I watched them play, Flacco does not hit as many quick passes, does not go through as many progression as Rodgers, and does not buy as much time with his legs as Rodgers. This typically leads to more dump offs to the backs. It does show that Leach is capable of being a solid pass catcher, but I do not think it makes him equal to Kuhn.

Second, Kuhn does a lot of pass blocking for Rodgers. This is the part of the passing game that I have not seen from Leach. Kuhn is good at reading a defense and being in the right spot. This is something that another back can do, but I have not seen any other back on our roster be trusted with it, which increases Kuhn's value to us. Additionally, Kuhn has done a good job at being a blocker first then scrapping off to being a quick dump off for Rodgers. It typically does not lead to many catches because Rodgers typically finds another, more down field, receiver.

As a whole the stats on catches might be similar, but the other things that go into the passing game give Kuhn an edge on Leach in my opinion.
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justo


Joined: 05 Aug 2012
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ugLymayNe wrote:
justo wrote:
persiandud wrote:
All for it, Leach can help Lacy out.


One back, one te/fb sets lead to bigger run plays. Leach/Lacy/Nelson/Jones/Cobb, your move, defense.
Quarless can even line up in the slot(well, lets see how he looks after the injury, but in the past he could).
I can't wait to see Q in the preseason.
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ugLymayNe


Joined: 31 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

justo wrote:
ugLymayNe wrote:
justo wrote:
persiandud wrote:
All for it, Leach can help Lacy out.


One back, one te/fb sets lead to bigger run plays. Leach/Lacy/Nelson/Jones/Cobb, your move, defense.
Quarless can even line up in the slot(well, lets see how he looks after the injury, but in the past he could).
I can't wait to see Q in the preseason.


I know! going to be interesting. Nelson-Lacy-Q-Cobb-Jones on offense would be a tough one to defend, if all is well. Hell, you can take off Jones or Cobb and put Finley on the field and run anything from 4 wide to I-formation...Pray


On a side note, one of the perks of living in GB I run into the players quite a bit......I saw Q out and he looks bigger than I remember him being when I saw him on the sideline of TC last year, at least in his upper body. Dude put on weight I think.
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dijatool


Joined: 17 Feb 2013
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ugLymayNe wrote:
justo wrote:
ugLymayNe wrote:
justo wrote:
persiandud wrote:
All for it, Leach can help Lacy out.


One back, one te/fb sets lead to bigger run plays. Leach/Lacy/Nelson/Jones/Cobb, your move, defense.
Quarless can even line up in the slot(well, lets see how he looks after the injury, but in the past he could).
I can't wait to see Q in the preseason.


I know! going to be interesting. Nelson-Lacy-Q-Cobb-Jones on offense would be a tough one to defend, if all is well. Hell, you can take off Jones or Cobb and put Finley on the field and run anything from 4 wide to I-formation...Pray


On a side note, one of the perks of living in GB I run into the players quite a bit......I saw Q out and he looks bigger than I remember him being when I saw him on the sideline of TC last year, at least in his upper body. Dude put on weight I think.

That's kind of the opposite of what he's said in interview and what the staff has hinted at. He said he's been focused on his legs so much since mid season last year that he needs to get back to working on his upper body. And someone, somewhere said something about him needing to get back up to 260 or so, where he was playing before the injury.

My impression was he's in the mid 250's right now, with great legs and stick arms. Very Happy
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CentralFC


Joined: 03 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dijatool wrote:
ugLymayNe wrote:
justo wrote:
ugLymayNe wrote:
justo wrote:
persiandud wrote:
All for it, Leach can help Lacy out.


One back, one te/fb sets lead to bigger run plays. Leach/Lacy/Nelson/Jones/Cobb, your move, defense.
Quarless can even line up in the slot(well, lets see how he looks after the injury, but in the past he could).
I can't wait to see Q in the preseason.


I know! going to be interesting. Nelson-Lacy-Q-Cobb-Jones on offense would be a tough one to defend, if all is well. Hell, you can take off Jones or Cobb and put Finley on the field and run anything from 4 wide to I-formation...Pray


On a side note, one of the perks of living in GB I run into the players quite a bit......I saw Q out and he looks bigger than I remember him being when I saw him on the sideline of TC last year, at least in his upper body. Dude put on weight I think.

That's kind of the opposite of what he's said in interview and what the staff has hinted at. He said he's been focused on his legs so much since mid season last year that he needs to get back to working on his upper body. And someone, somewhere said something about him needing to get back up to 260 or so, where he was playing before the injury.

My impression was he's in the mid 250's right now, with great legs and stick arms. Very Happy


I'm sure they're very stick-like Laughing
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Beast


Joined: 29 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I say we stick with Kuhn, he's a jack of all trades and most importantly is his pass blocking protecting Rodgers.

Also fans yell "KUUUUUUUUUUUUUHN!!!!" every time they see a FB run. And that would be awkward with Vontae Leach running the ball.


what?!?... I've seen/heard people yelled it for Korey Hall and even for Quinn Johnson once or twice...

I can understand confusing him with Korey Hall... but Quinn Johnson? They don't look the same!
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Madtown


Joined: 24 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Beast wrote:
I say we stick with Kuhn, he's a jack of all trades and most importantly is his pass blocking protecting Rodgers.

Also fans yell "KUUUUUUUUUUUUUHN!!!!" every time they see a FB run. And that would be awkward with Vontae Leach running the ball.


what?!?... I've seen/heard people yelled it for Korey Hall and even for Quinn Johnson once or twice...

I can understand confusing him with Korey Hall... but Quinn Johnson? They don't look the same!


I would pay a LOT of money to never hear "KUUUUUUUUUUUHN" again Very Happy

Still, as much as I'd love to see Leach blasting open holes, with this crop of young RB's I just don't see them getting rid of Kuhn for his pass blocking alone.
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DavidatMIZZOU


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Madtown wrote:
Beast wrote:
I say we stick with Kuhn, he's a jack of all trades and most importantly is his pass blocking protecting Rodgers.

Also fans yell "KUUUUUUUUUUUUUHN!!!!" every time they see a FB run. And that would be awkward with Vontae Leach running the ball.


what?!?... I've seen/heard people yelled it for Korey Hall and even for Quinn Johnson once or twice...

I can understand confusing him with Korey Hall... but Quinn Johnson? They don't look the same!


I would pay a LOT of money to never hear "KUUUUUUUUUUUHN" again Very Happy

Still, as much as I'd love to see Leach blasting open holes, with this crop of young RB's I just don't see them getting rid of Kuhn for his pass blocking alone.


I don't care about the "KUUUUUHN!" cheer, but I'd pay money not to see -1yards and a cloud of dust to go with it.
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DavidatMIZZOU


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DavidatMIZZOU wrote:
Madtown wrote:
Beast wrote:
I say we stick with Kuhn, he's a jack of all trades and most importantly is his pass blocking protecting Rodgers.

Also fans yell "KUUUUUUUUUUUUUHN!!!!" every time they see a FB run. And that would be awkward with Vontae Leach running the ball.


what?!?... I've seen/heard people yelled it for Korey Hall and even for Quinn Johnson once or twice...

I can understand confusing him with Korey Hall... but Quinn Johnson? They don't look the same!


I would pay a LOT of money to never hear "KUUUUUUUUUUUHN" again Very Happy

Still, as much as I'd love to see Leach blasting open holes, with this crop of young RB's I just don't see them getting rid of Kuhn for his pass blocking alone.


I don't care about the "KUUUUUHN!" cheer, but I'd pay money not to see -1yards and a cloud of dust to go with it.


Haha, just kidding.
You see the cloud of dust before his slow [inappropriate/removed] gets stuffed for the loss.
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Kal-El


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2013 12:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DavidatMIZZOU wrote:
Quote:
Quote:
I would pay a LOT of money to never hear "KUUUUUUUUUUUHN" again Very Happy

Still, as much as I'd love to see Leach blasting open holes, with this crop of young RB's I just don't see them getting rid of Kuhn for his pass blocking alone.


I don't care about the "KUUUUUHN!" cheer, but I'd pay money not to see -1yards and a cloud of dust to go with it.


Haha, just kidding.
You see the cloud of dust before his slow [inappropriate/removed] gets stuffed for the loss.



Quoted for truef.
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Polaris


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2013 7:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Packers preferred package on the field is 3 WRs....Cobb, Nelson, Jones.....one TE named Jermichael Finely.....and one RB . They love that grouping and run it quite a bit of the time.

So when you put Kuhn on the field, you're taking one of those guys off the field. And he's making quite a bit of money to be spending most of the game on the bench.

He may not make the team this year, or this may be his last year. Quite a swing from the day when we carried 3 FBs. But it's a reflection of what M3 wants to do with the offense. We are a homerun hitting offense and he wants homerun hitters at every skill position. That's not Kuhn, it's not Leach, it's not any fullback in the league.
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spilltray


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2013 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polaris wrote:
The Packers preferred package on the field is 3 WRs....Cobb, Nelson, Jones.....one TE named Jermichael Finely.....and one RB . They love that grouping and run it quite a bit of the time.

So when you put Kuhn on the field, you're taking one of those guys off the field. And he's making quite a bit of money to be spending most of the game on the bench.

He may not make the team this year, or this may be his last year. Quite a swing from the day when we carried 3 FBs. But it's a reflection of what M3 wants to do with the offense. We are a homerun hitting offense and he wants homerun hitters at every skill position. That's not Kuhn, it's not Leach, it's not any fullback in the league.


It's not really. When the Packers carried 3 FBs they carried 2-3 TEs. Now that they carry 1 FB, they've been having 4-5 TEs on the roster. They use TEs in a TE/H-Back/FB type role and like guys that can flex between the two positions, but the overall number for those 2 position groups has stayed pretty static.
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