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#NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO (Tebow)
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24isthelaw


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

patsfan25 wrote:
Mcdaniels has coordinated a #1 offense every season he's been here. I think we're fine. Get over this waiver wire transaction already.


The success of the offense is 100% due to Tom Brady and Dante Scarneccia. McDaniels is just along for the ride. There's no reason he should have this much input in personnel decisions. Bill O'Brien didn't get to bring his every project in for kicks.
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ChazStandard


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

24isthelaw wrote:
patsfan25 wrote:
Mcdaniels has coordinated a #1 offense every season he's been here. I think we're fine. Get over this waiver wire transaction already.


The success of the offense is 100% due to Tom Brady and Dante Scarneccia. McDaniels is just along for the ride. There's no reason he should have this much input in personnel decisions. Bill O'Brien didn't get to bring his every project in for kicks.


I don't think that's fair - he's definitely shown he can coach offensive players. He got the best out of Orton, Cassel, Brandon Lloyd. He must have had something to do with picking up Welker and making him what he is. He has shown he's a good offensive coach, and a sometimes-brilliant sometimes-average play caller.

He failed in Denver as a GM rather than a coach.
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jofos


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If anyone believes that Mcdaniels is solely responsible or that Belichick made the move based on some blind request from an assistant coach is crazy. Belichick must think that Tebow can bring something to the Patriots. Weather that something is as something other than QB now or at QB in the future he must think there is something to help the team. Belichick could be wrong and Tebow gets cut in training camp, he could be right and Tebow develops into the QB of the future.
Either way the only down side I see to signing a 3rd string project QB that is still fairly young is the media that comes with it. Chad was kind of a big mouth distraction guy before he came to the Patriots. His mouth wasn't the issue that fail as a Patriot. Expect Tebow to be the same way. Once the new wares off every Patriot report won't be about Tebow.
If the Patriots had the team to make the super bowl before they signed Tim then this isn't going to hurt them. The 53rd spot on the roster isn't filled by a make or break guy.
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Cypher


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the bright side, they seem to be getting along famously.


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patsfan25


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

24isthelaw wrote:
patsfan25 wrote:
Mcdaniels has coordinated a #1 offense every season he's been here. I think we're fine. Get over this waiver wire transaction already.


The success of the offense is 100% due to Tom Brady and Dante Scarneccia. McDaniels is just along for the ride. There's no reason he should have this much input in personnel decisions. Bill O'Brien didn't get to bring his every project in for kicks.


Please. Show me the proof in which invalidates McDaniel's productivity on this team.
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patsfan25


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richter wrote:
mission27 wrote:
Richter wrote:
I don't really see the difference, if the thought process is that there was an ulterior motive, or worse yet, that he didn't make the call directly, but was just fulfilling a request from his offensive coordinator. A lot of McDaniels' guys have been brought in following his return, is it really a stretch to think that another would be?


Is this such a bad thing, though? Bring Tebow in for a few weeks because your OC who you trust and respect wants to give him a shot. Assuming he really isn't a fit, you let him go. If he works out, great. Doesn't really cost all that much.

There are obviously trade-offs to be made but I don't think there's anything wrong with management making decisions that aren't solely and exclusively geared towards fielding the most talented roster. If Belichick did this to make his OC happy, to improve team chemistry, to sell jerseys... nothing wrong with that. Heck, if he did this to make Urban Meyer happy and keep the information pipeline chugging along? I'm sure that'd be worth every penny.

I'm guessing he made the decision he thought was in the long term best interests of the Patriots. Unless this was just a favor to Tebow. But that seems like a stretch.

Ordinarily I'd say no, but when the OC is a grade-A jackass like McDaniels...

But, I never wanted him back, and I've been calling for his firing for a while. He's not a guy I wanted associated with the franchise, period.


This is absolutely one of the most absurd things I've heard in this forum. It's your opinion, but the reasons don't resonate.
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Donut


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChazStandard wrote:
24isthelaw wrote:
patsfan25 wrote:
Mcdaniels has coordinated a #1 offense every season he's been here. I think we're fine. Get over this waiver wire transaction already.


The success of the offense is 100% due to Tom Brady and Dante Scarneccia. McDaniels is just along for the ride. There's no reason he should have this much input in personnel decisions. Bill O'Brien didn't get to bring his every project in for kicks.


I don't think that's fair - he's definitely shown he can coach offensive players. He got the best out of Orton, Cassel, Brandon Lloyd. He must have had something to do with picking up Welker and making him what he is. He has shown he's a good offensive coach, and a sometimes-brilliant sometimes-average play caller.

He failed in Denver as a GM rather than a coach.

The first draft was bad(though i liked Ayers and McKinley a lot). The 2nd draft wasnt bad. Walton is a solid C, Beadles is versatile OL that is good enough to start but better as a backup. Decker developing. His drops and weird plays he falls need to stop though. Demaryius Thomas is a beast.
Denver just became a cluster f and fans hated him for trading Cutler. Though i like Mcdaniels. I think hecwill be a good coach. His plsy design is very good. He needs to improve in game adjustments.
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Richter


Joined: 11 Feb 2010
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

patsfan25 wrote:
Richter wrote:
mission27 wrote:
Richter wrote:
I don't really see the difference, if the thought process is that there was an ulterior motive, or worse yet, that he didn't make the call directly, but was just fulfilling a request from his offensive coordinator. A lot of McDaniels' guys have been brought in following his return, is it really a stretch to think that another would be?


Is this such a bad thing, though? Bring Tebow in for a few weeks because your OC who you trust and respect wants to give him a shot. Assuming he really isn't a fit, you let him go. If he works out, great. Doesn't really cost all that much.

There are obviously trade-offs to be made but I don't think there's anything wrong with management making decisions that aren't solely and exclusively geared towards fielding the most talented roster. If Belichick did this to make his OC happy, to improve team chemistry, to sell jerseys... nothing wrong with that. Heck, if he did this to make Urban Meyer happy and keep the information pipeline chugging along? I'm sure that'd be worth every penny.

I'm guessing he made the decision he thought was in the long term best interests of the Patriots. Unless this was just a favor to Tebow. But that seems like a stretch.

Ordinarily I'd say no, but when the OC is a grade-A jackass like McDaniels...

But, I never wanted him back, and I've been calling for his firing for a while. He's not a guy I wanted associated with the franchise, period.


This is absolutely one of the most absurd things I've heard in this forum. It's your opinion, but the reasons don't resonate.

I consider any defense of McDaniels absurd, so I guess we're even. I like how the Patriots didn't miss a beat on offense when he left. Really must have been all his doing.
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patsfan25


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richter wrote:
patsfan25 wrote:
Richter wrote:
mission27 wrote:
Richter wrote:
I don't really see the difference, if the thought process is that there was an ulterior motive, or worse yet, that he didn't make the call directly, but was just fulfilling a request from his offensive coordinator. A lot of McDaniels' guys have been brought in following his return, is it really a stretch to think that another would be?


Is this such a bad thing, though? Bring Tebow in for a few weeks because your OC who you trust and respect wants to give him a shot. Assuming he really isn't a fit, you let him go. If he works out, great. Doesn't really cost all that much.

There are obviously trade-offs to be made but I don't think there's anything wrong with management making decisions that aren't solely and exclusively geared towards fielding the most talented roster. If Belichick did this to make his OC happy, to improve team chemistry, to sell jerseys... nothing wrong with that. Heck, if he did this to make Urban Meyer happy and keep the information pipeline chugging along? I'm sure that'd be worth every penny.

I'm guessing he made the decision he thought was in the long term best interests of the Patriots. Unless this was just a favor to Tebow. But that seems like a stretch.

Ordinarily I'd say no, but when the OC is a grade-A jackass like McDaniels...

But, I never wanted him back, and I've been calling for his firing for a while. He's not a guy I wanted associated with the franchise, period.


This is absolutely one of the most absurd things I've heard in this forum. It's your opinion, but the reasons don't resonate.

I consider any defense of McDaniels absurd, so I guess we're even. I like how the Patriots didn't miss a beat on offense when he left. Really must have been all his doing.


That's a moot point, as he is currently under title, and we're still one of the best offenses in the NFL. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.
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Shockey1979


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 1:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richter wrote:

I consider any defense of McDaniels absurd, so I guess we're even. I like how the Patriots didn't miss a beat on offense when he left. Really must have been all his doing.


By that logic... the Pats were 8th in scoring and 5th in total yards the season they didn't have Brady. Does that cheapen his value to the team too?
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Richter


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shockey1979 wrote:
Richter wrote:

I consider any defense of McDaniels absurd, so I guess we're even. I like how the Patriots didn't miss a beat on offense when he left. Really must have been all his doing.


By that logic... the Pats were 8th in scoring and 5th in total yards the season they didn't have Brady. Does that cheapen his value to the team too?

Not really, considering the drop-off that represents. Not to mention, they played what I think was the second easiest defensive schedule in the league. A one season sample size that represents a small but substantial drop-off, versus multiple seasons of data post-McDaniels that correlate with my assertion? Not much of a contest. Not to mention, as terrible as Matt Cassel has been at times, he put up a 27-7 TD/Int season in KC after leaving the Patriots - he has some talent. With a superior surrounding cast and culture, it's not really surprising he could hold things together for a decent stretch when facing a weak schedule.
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Shockey1979


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Or perhaps the Pats offense is bigger then any one guy be it the HOF QB or journeyman OC. As long as Belichick is there it seems to function even with any one individual cog missing.
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Richter


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shockey1979 wrote:
Or perhaps the Pats offense is bigger then any one guy be it the HOF QB or journeyman OC. As long as Belichick is there it seems to function even with any one individual cog missing.

The offense is always bigger than one guy. I'm not sure what point you're making with that statement. It's been my contention for some time that as good as the Patriots' offense is, McDaniels' play calling has held them back in key situations. He's the weak link, more so than anything else.So why would I want him catered to?
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24isthelaw


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richter wrote:
Shockey1979 wrote:
Or perhaps the Pats offense is bigger then any one guy be it the HOF QB or journeyman OC. As long as Belichick is there it seems to function even with any one individual cog missing.

The offense is always bigger than one guy. I'm not sure what point you're making with that statement. It's been my contention for some time that as good as the Patriots' offense is, McDaniels' play calling has held them back in key situations. He's the weak link, more so than anything else.So why would I want him catered to?


And Richter is not the only person who feels this way. McDaniels' general lack of touch with reality is evident in most of the things he does. Between his situational playcalling, 3rd quarter playcalling and most everything he did as a HC, he demonstrates a constant disconnect with what is sensible, and always wants to do things HIS way. His lack of success in St. Louis and Denver, and the improvements those teams made on offense immediately after letting him go, speak to the danger/futility of his stubbornness when it is not tempered with a Hall of Fame quarterback, well chosen personnel, and the best offensive line coach in the NFL.
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patsfan25


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

24isthelaw wrote:
Richter wrote:
Shockey1979 wrote:
Or perhaps the Pats offense is bigger then any one guy be it the HOF QB or journeyman OC. As long as Belichick is there it seems to function even with any one individual cog missing.

The offense is always bigger than one guy. I'm not sure what point you're making with that statement. It's been my contention for some time that as good as the Patriots' offense is, McDaniels' play calling has held them back in key situations. He's the weak link, more so than anything else.So why would I want him catered to?


And Richter is not the only person who feels this way. McDaniels' general lack of touch with reality is evident in most of the things he does. Between his situational playcalling, 3rd quarter playcalling and most everything he did as a HC, he demonstrates a constant disconnect with what is sensible, and always wants to do things HIS way. His lack of success in St. Louis and Denver, and the improvements those teams made on offense immediately after letting him go, speak to the danger/futility of his stubbornness when it is not tempered with a Hall of Fame quarterback, well chosen personnel, and the best offensive line coach in the NFL.


So you want to nitpick every part of McDaniels you can dissect now, while ignoring the fact that McD is an offensive genius, with one of the most creative minds in the NFL. Not to mention his playcalling has always actually been timely under many situations. He's having his way right now, because he commands one of the best offenses in the league (which is definitely impacted by more than one person). Regardless of any personnel or decisions he's been handed to make over his time here, I can care less (and so should you) because he's been able to produce at what he does. And that's all that matters. So by the power that is invested in McDaniels by Belichick, I'll take his sentiments over anyone else'. The logic in here has really disintegrated.....
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