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#NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO (Tebow)
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Richter


Joined: 11 Feb 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Troy Brown wrote:
Tzimisce wrote:
I don't see this as being any different than the Albert Haynesworth or Kellen Winslow Jr. experiments. Guy bottoms out and can't find work in the NFL, so BB brings him in to see if maybe he can offer something to this team. Perhaps on a lark. Different circumstances for each, but same mindset.


Do you think you could convince Richter to be this reasonable? Before he pops an eyeball?

Pop an eyeball? I'm not mad. Just disgusted, and mostly with the people claiming how Tebow is some great football player that will be able to do a bunch of things in the offense as a jack-of-all-trades. Considering that right now, I doubt Tebow makes the roster, there's no reason to mourn. There's always a reason to combat idiocy, though, lest it spread.
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Shockey1979


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richter wrote:
Shockey1979 wrote:
He's a backup QB. He will never replace Brady on the field in any regard. Even if some trickery is used it will be with Brady and Tebow on the field. You can't hold a backup QB to a standard of throwing of the starter, or running of a running back, or catching of a TE. The fact that a QB possesses ability to do all of these things in one package is where the value lies. How many QB's in the NFL posses superior running ability then Tebow? How many QB's posses better blocking ability? Depending on the role Bill uses him will determine his value. Not your opinion of him. I'm no Belicheck fan but I know damn sure he wouldn't waste his time with any player he thought was "worthless". So who knows more... you or your hall of fame coach?

Considering that I don't have a blind spot on the matter because I don't have the guy who drafted Tebow working as my OC, or one of my best friends being the guy who coached him in college and has gone to bat for him since, in this case, I do. Of course, I'm not debating Belichick on this, I'm debating you. And since you're claiming Tebow has a bunch of skills that he has not demonstrated in any form or fashion (catch like a tight end? Laughable), I definitely will stick with my assessment.


Either criticize Belicheck and claim he brought a worthless player into your OTA's, or admit that Belicheck must see something valuable in Tebow that is worth bringing him into OTA's for. Can't have it both ways. Can't talk out of one side of your face and say your not debating Bill and then talk out of the other criticizing a move he clearly made.
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24isthelaw


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I don't see this as being any different than the Albert Haynesworth or Kellen Winslow Jr. experiments. Guy bottoms out and can't find work in the NFL, so BB brings him in to see if maybe he can offer something to this team. Perhaps on a lark. Different circumstances for each, but same mindset.


Haynesworth and 85 were all stars, as were Moss, Dillon. That's why you took the risk to acquire them - in case the upside was met. What upside has Tebow shown? Hard to compare tem.
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Richter


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shockey1979 wrote:
Richter wrote:
Shockey1979 wrote:
He's a backup QB. He will never replace Brady on the field in any regard. Even if some trickery is used it will be with Brady and Tebow on the field. You can't hold a backup QB to a standard of throwing of the starter, or running of a running back, or catching of a TE. The fact that a QB possesses ability to do all of these things in one package is where the value lies. How many QB's in the NFL posses superior running ability then Tebow? How many QB's posses better blocking ability? Depending on the role Bill uses him will determine his value. Not your opinion of him. I'm no Belicheck fan but I know damn sure he wouldn't waste his time with any player he thought was "worthless". So who knows more... you or your hall of fame coach?

Considering that I don't have a blind spot on the matter because I don't have the guy who drafted Tebow working as my OC, or one of my best friends being the guy who coached him in college and has gone to bat for him since, in this case, I do. Of course, I'm not debating Belichick on this, I'm debating you. And since you're claiming Tebow has a bunch of skills that he has not demonstrated in any form or fashion (catch like a tight end? Laughable), I definitely will stick with my assessment.


Either criticize Belicheck and claim he brought a worthless player into your OTA's, or admit that Belicheck must see something valuable in Tebow that is worth bringing him into OTA's for. Can't have it both ways. Can't talk out of one side of your face and say your not debating Bill and then talk out of the other criticizing a move he clearly made.

No, I am criticizing Belichick - I don't think his motives in this were based on Tebow's talent. There are any number of theories out there as to why he did this, but improving the Patriots seems less than likely to me. But, my point was, I'm not just objecting to his decision, I'm opposing your claim that he is a good all-around football player that has value. My debate isn't with Belichick, since I don't have unfettered access to him.
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Shockey1979


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richter wrote:

No, I am criticizing Belichick - I don't think his motives in this were based on Tebow's talent. There are any number of theories out there as to why he did this, but improving the Patriots seems less than likely to me. But, my point was, I'm not just objecting to his decision, I'm opposing your claim that he is a good all-around football player that has value. My debate isn't with Belichick, since I don't have unfettered access to him.


Well there you go. Richter knows better then Bill Belicheck by his own admission.

As for "my claims". Yes I believe arguably one of the greatest college football players of all time and Heisman winner who led a failing Denver team to a playoff win has value to bring to an NFL team. If it weren't for the circus that follows him he would have had no problems getting a roster spot. Hence why New England is perfect for him. Whatever theories you want to toss around is fine. What I refuse to believe is Belicheck would ever bring in a player he believes is a no talent worthless hack like you and others are claiming in this thread.
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Billy Spikes


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stephen A. Smith with a lot of truth in what he just said, said what a lot of people are thinking... why talk about Tebow during NBA Finals.
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Richter


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shockey1979 wrote:
Richter wrote:

No, I am criticizing Belichick - I don't think his motives in this were based on Tebow's talent. There are any number of theories out there as to why he did this, but improving the Patriots seems less than likely to me. But, my point was, I'm not just objecting to his decision, I'm opposing your claim that he is a good all-around football player that has value. My debate isn't with Belichick, since I don't have unfettered access to him.


Well there you go. Richter knows better then Bill Belicheck by his own admission.

As for "my claims". Yes I believe arguably one of the greatest college football players of all time and Heisman winner who led a failing Denver team to a playoff win has value to bring to an NFL team. If it weren't for the circus that follows him he would have had no problems getting a roster spot. Hence why New England is perfect for him. Whatever theories you want to toss around is fine. What I refuse to believe is Belicheck would ever bring in a player he believes is a no talent worthless hack like you and others are claiming in this thread.

Yup, I don't believe the head coach is always right. Belichick has a great track record, but in this instance, I think I'm right about the situation. Of course, I don't think this move was about helping the football team in the first place, at least not as far as on-field results go. Do you always go around blindly, unquestioning of authority?
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Shockey1979


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 8:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richter wrote:
Shockey1979 wrote:
Richter wrote:

No, I am criticizing Belichick - I don't think his motives in this were based on Tebow's talent. There are any number of theories out there as to why he did this, but improving the Patriots seems less than likely to me. But, my point was, I'm not just objecting to his decision, I'm opposing your claim that he is a good all-around football player that has value. My debate isn't with Belichick, since I don't have unfettered access to him.


Well there you go. Richter knows better then Bill Belicheck by his own admission.

As for "my claims". Yes I believe arguably one of the greatest college football players of all time and Heisman winner who led a failing Denver team to a playoff win has value to bring to an NFL team. If it weren't for the circus that follows him he would have had no problems getting a roster spot. Hence why New England is perfect for him. Whatever theories you want to toss around is fine. What I refuse to believe is Belicheck would ever bring in a player he believes is a no talent worthless hack like you and others are claiming in this thread.

Yup, I don't believe the head coach is always right. Belichick has a great track record, but in this instance, I think I'm right about the situation. Of course, I don't think this move was about helping the football team in the first place, at least not as far as on-field results go. Do you always go around blindly, unquestioning of authority?


Nope, I have disagreed with quite a bit Reese has done (drafting JPP and the like) and I eat my crow when I am wrong. However I surely wouldn't ever claim that Jerry Reese would bring in any player he thought was "worthless" into a Giants OTA. If Reese believes he's worth the roster spot then he damn well has something to bring to the team. There is a difference between criticizing a draft pick/pickup/cut, and it's a whole other claiming your HOF head coach brought a no talent worthless hack into an OTA.
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Richter


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shockey1979 wrote:
Richter wrote:
Shockey1979 wrote:
Richter wrote:

No, I am criticizing Belichick - I don't think his motives in this were based on Tebow's talent. There are any number of theories out there as to why he did this, but improving the Patriots seems less than likely to me. But, my point was, I'm not just objecting to his decision, I'm opposing your claim that he is a good all-around football player that has value. My debate isn't with Belichick, since I don't have unfettered access to him.


Well there you go. Richter knows better then Bill Belicheck by his own admission.

As for "my claims". Yes I believe arguably one of the greatest college football players of all time and Heisman winner who led a failing Denver team to a playoff win has value to bring to an NFL team. If it weren't for the circus that follows him he would have had no problems getting a roster spot. Hence why New England is perfect for him. Whatever theories you want to toss around is fine. What I refuse to believe is Belicheck would ever bring in a player he believes is a no talent worthless hack like you and others are claiming in this thread.

Yup, I don't believe the head coach is always right. Belichick has a great track record, but in this instance, I think I'm right about the situation. Of course, I don't think this move was about helping the football team in the first place, at least not as far as on-field results go. Do you always go around blindly, unquestioning of authority?


Nope, I have disagreed with quite a bit Reese has done (drafting JPP and the like) and I eat my crow when I am wrong. However I surely wouldn't ever claim that Jerry Reese would bring in any player he thought was "worthless" into a Giants OTA. If Reese believes he's worth the roster spot then he damn well has something to bring to the team. There is a difference between criticizing a draft pick/pickup/cut, and it's a whole other claiming your HOF head coach brought a no talent worthless hack into an OTA.

I don't really see the difference, if the thought process is that there was an ulterior motive, or worse yet, that he didn't make the call directly, but was just fulfilling a request from his offensive coordinator. A lot of McDaniels' guys have been brought in following his return, is it really a stretch to think that another would be?
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mission27


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richter wrote:
I don't really see the difference, if the thought process is that there was an ulterior motive, or worse yet, that he didn't make the call directly, but was just fulfilling a request from his offensive coordinator. A lot of McDaniels' guys have been brought in following his return, is it really a stretch to think that another would be?


Is this such a bad thing, though? Bring Tebow in for a few weeks because your OC who you trust and respect wants to give him a shot. Assuming he really isn't a fit, you let him go. If he works out, great. Doesn't really cost all that much.

There are obviously trade-offs to be made but I don't think there's anything wrong with management making decisions that aren't solely and exclusively geared towards fielding the most talented roster. If Belichick did this to make his OC happy, to improve team chemistry, to sell jerseys... nothing wrong with that. Heck, if he did this to make Urban Meyer happy and keep the information pipeline chugging along? I'm sure that'd be worth every penny.

I'm guessing he made the decision he thought was in the long term best interests of the Patriots. Unless this was just a favor to Tebow. But that seems like a stretch.
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Richter


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 1:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mission27 wrote:
Richter wrote:
I don't really see the difference, if the thought process is that there was an ulterior motive, or worse yet, that he didn't make the call directly, but was just fulfilling a request from his offensive coordinator. A lot of McDaniels' guys have been brought in following his return, is it really a stretch to think that another would be?


Is this such a bad thing, though? Bring Tebow in for a few weeks because your OC who you trust and respect wants to give him a shot. Assuming he really isn't a fit, you let him go. If he works out, great. Doesn't really cost all that much.

There are obviously trade-offs to be made but I don't think there's anything wrong with management making decisions that aren't solely and exclusively geared towards fielding the most talented roster. If Belichick did this to make his OC happy, to improve team chemistry, to sell jerseys... nothing wrong with that. Heck, if he did this to make Urban Meyer happy and keep the information pipeline chugging along? I'm sure that'd be worth every penny.

I'm guessing he made the decision he thought was in the long term best interests of the Patriots. Unless this was just a favor to Tebow. But that seems like a stretch.

Ordinarily I'd say no, but when the OC is a grade-A jackass like McDaniels...

But, I never wanted him back, and I've been calling for his firing for a while. He's not a guy I wanted associated with the franchise, period.
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Shockey1979


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 7:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richter wrote:

A lot of McDaniels' guys have been brought in following his return, is it really a stretch to think that another would be?


Out of curiosity who are these McDaniel guys that have been brought in since his return?
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Grachuus


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shockey1979 wrote:
Richter wrote:

A lot of McDaniels' guys have been brought in following his return, is it really a stretch to think that another would be?


Out of curiosity who are these McDaniel guys that have been brought in since his return?


Hoohooman
amendola
tebow
a number of scrubs we've cut
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patsfan25


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mcdaniels has coordinated a #1 offense every season he's been here. I think we're fine. Get over this waiver wire transaction already.
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Shockey1979


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Grachuus wrote:
Shockey1979 wrote:
Richter wrote:

A lot of McDaniels' guys have been brought in following his return, is it really a stretch to think that another would be?


Out of curiosity who are these McDaniel guys that have been brought in since his return?


Hoohooman
amendola
tebow
a number of scrubs we've cut


Amendola?

He was on the Rams long before McDaniels went there as an OC.

So this "alot" of McDaniels guys is... Tebow, hoohooman (whoever that is) a bunch of scrubs and a far fetched claim of Amendola being a "McDaniels" guy?
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