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big_palooka


Joined: 30 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cellomac1212 wrote:
8 Wins or bust Mother EFFERS!!!!

Seems to be the Davis Motto over, I don't know, the past 30 years... I would be surprised if 4 wins is tolerated. We all know he can clean house, but the real test starts when it comes to acquiring talent. IF Hayden isn't a game changer (or any draft pick from this draft), he might have trouble keeping a job with a less than 8 win showing...


Expecting Hayden or any draft pick to be a game changer in their rookie year is misguided. If that is what Davis expects, then he really has no idea about the game.

This draft class deserves the typical 3 years to develop. And Reggie should get that to see where his draft class stacks up.
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big_palooka


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TiberiusRising wrote:
I think an improved product is what we are hoping for. How much we improve will determine how many wins. Personally I think we will be 7-9 or slightly better which would be a good start.

We already improved depth so injuries shouldnt be as much of a handcuff. o instance WR, RB, LB, CB, TE, OL. I cant count how many injuries put us in bad spots last season with an already crappy roster. (Win Affect 1-2 games minimum)

Are DC and defense should do much better in their second year. While a lot of guys are new they are either seasoned vets or quick learners. I truly believe are defense will be underated and will start to rise ala Seattle a couple years back. You saw glimpses in 09 and 10. Communication was a huge downfall especially with the injuries last year. Having Roach in the middle and Woodson in the secondary is going to do wonders. (Win Affect 1-2 games)

We should be able to run the ball this year regardless of McFadden being healthy or not. Not to mention it is his contract year. He always plays hard but he probably wants to set some milestones this season. Moving back to PBS is good for our RB's and our OL not to mention the QB who wont always be under so much pressure. (Win Affect 1-2 games)

Finally ST should be much better with Ford back and another great possibly better option in Cribbs. We also wont be surprised by a LS injury so wont lose one there. This also goes hand in hand with depth because we have better guys to fill the ST roster. (Win Affect 1-2 games)


Win Affect would be wins in addition to last year imo. However anything can happen and things may not be expected hence my 7 win prediction.

We really need to pull out wins in those first two games to get the confidence going. That SD long snapping debacle was crushing in a game we should have won.


7-9 wins? You're dreaming and will be disappointed. I'd love to see it, but with the schedule and lack of talent, it's just not feasible IMO.

Big question at QB. Lack of pass rush could be an issue. McFadden will have to carry the offense and I'm not buying Jennings or Murray as an answer when he's nicked up. The WRs are still below average with no go to target among them.

To get to 7-9, Flynn will have to be a revelation at QB and someone on defense will really have to really surprise us all.
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dante9876


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

6 wins and a competitive team, not just one who scores garbage points in the 4th would be a huge improvement. I'm sure their will be improvement on all sides of the ball. Improvement ain't just ain't about wins. Especially how bad we was last year.
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TiberiusRising


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Am I missing something or is Huff overvalued just because we paid him alot. I dont think he is as good as mainstream thinks. Not bad but his current salary seems about right especially for his age.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/22351123/nfls-best-deals-quarterbacks-kaepernick-wilson-are-steals-right-now
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Cutler06


Joined: 27 Aug 2006
Posts: 10186
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ch8878 wrote:
GJT1347 wrote:
lol, a subtlely conniving thread made by Cutler06 in the Raiders forum. this should be fun....


Don't you know hes a closet Raiders fan ? Cool

Either that or keep your friends close, keep your enemies closer. Twisted Evil


Maybe a little of both, more than latter than the former though. Besides, my team needs a little competition from a division rival with some swagger....won't get it from the Dolts, Chef's just THINK (and spout) that they're that good, never turns out that way. Always LOVED the Broncos/Raiders games, it's what I waited for every season, they were season-making battles IMO !!


My first FAV trading card was Jim Otto...before I knew any better
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KC's pass rush is fast. Manning's decision making is faster.
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TiberiusRising


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:
TiberiusRising wrote:
I think an improved product is what we are hoping for. How much we improve will determine how many wins. Personally I think we will be 7-9 or slightly better which would be a good start.

We already improved depth so injuries shouldnt be as much of a handcuff. o instance WR, RB, LB, CB, TE, OL. I cant count how many injuries put us in bad spots last season with an already crappy roster. (Win Affect 1-2 games minimum)

Are DC and defense should do much better in their second year. While a lot of guys are new they are either seasoned vets or quick learners. I truly believe are defense will be underated and will start to rise ala Seattle a couple years back. You saw glimpses in 09 and 10. Communication was a huge downfall especially with the injuries last year. Having Roach in the middle and Woodson in the secondary is going to do wonders. (Win Affect 1-2 games)

We should be able to run the ball this year regardless of McFadden being healthy or not. Not to mention it is his contract year. He always plays hard but he probably wants to set some milestones this season. Moving back to PBS is good for our RB's and our OL not to mention the QB who wont always be under so much pressure. (Win Affect 1-2 games)

Finally ST should be much better with Ford back and another great possibly better option in Cribbs. We also wont be surprised by a LS injury so wont lose one there. This also goes hand in hand with depth because we have better guys to fill the ST roster. (Win Affect 1-2 games)


Win Affect would be wins in addition to last year imo. However anything can happen and things may not be expected hence my 7 win prediction.

We really need to pull out wins in those first two games to get the confidence going. That SD long snapping debacle was crushing in a game we should have won.


7-9 wins? You're dreaming and will be disappointed. I'd love to see it, but with the schedule and lack of talent, it's just not feasible IMO.

Big question at QB. Lack of pass rush could be an issue. McFadden will have to carry the offense and I'm not buying Jennings or Murray as an answer when he's nicked up. The WRs are still below average with no go to target among them.

To get to 7-9, Flynn will have to be a revelation at QB and someone on defense will really have to really surprise us all.

I am saying 7 wins. Our schedule is not that bad. Division games are toss up no matter who you are. Although I dont see us beating the Broncos who are toughest team on our schedule. First two games are very winable, Neither team from NY scares me, nor does TEN, DAL, or PHI. We have already beaten PIT and HOU in recent games. Redskins will be tough but who knows RG3 may not even play if he gets hurt again. It is an easier schedule than last season imo. And even last year we should have won the SD and ATL games.
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Ro4DPoY


Joined: 12 Jul 2010
Posts: 553
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:
TiberiusRising wrote:
I think an improved product is what we are hoping for. How much we improve will determine how many wins. Personally I think we will be 7-9 or slightly better which would be a good start.

We already improved depth so injuries shouldnt be as much of a handcuff. o instance WR, RB, LB, CB, TE, OL. I cant count how many injuries put us in bad spots last season with an already crappy roster. (Win Affect 1-2 games minimum)

Are DC and defense should do much better in their second year. While a lot of guys are new they are either seasoned vets or quick learners. I truly believe are defense will be underated and will start to rise ala Seattle a couple years back. You saw glimpses in 09 and 10. Communication was a huge downfall especially with the injuries last year. Having Roach in the middle and Woodson in the secondary is going to do wonders. (Win Affect 1-2 games)

We should be able to run the ball this year regardless of McFadden being healthy or not. Not to mention it is his contract year. He always plays hard but he probably wants to set some milestones this season. Moving back to PBS is good for our RB's and our OL not to mention the QB who wont always be under so much pressure. (Win Affect 1-2 games)

Finally ST should be much better with Ford back and another great possibly better option in Cribbs. We also wont be surprised by a LS injury so wont lose one there. This also goes hand in hand with depth because we have better guys to fill the ST roster. (Win Affect 1-2 games)


Win Affect would be wins in addition to last year imo. However anything can happen and things may not be expected hence my 7 win prediction.

We really need to pull out wins in those first two games to get the confidence going. That SD long snapping debacle was crushing in a game we should have won.


7-9 wins? You're dreaming and will be disappointed. I'd love to see it, but with the schedule and lack of talent, it's just not feasible IMO.

Big question at QB. Lack of pass rush could be an issue. McFadden will have to carry the offense and I'm not buying Jennings or Murray as an answer when he's nicked up. The WRs are still below average with no go to target among them.

To get to 7-9, Flynn will have to be a revelation at QB and someone on defense will really have to really surprise us all.


We have the 4th easiest schedule in the league, just putting that out. As for pass rush we had 25 sacks, it would be hard to do any worse than that. McFadden should do better simply because of going back to a scheme he dominates at so if he were to stay healthy he really could carry the majority of the load on offense.

The WR's will be better with the addition of Cribbs and Ford coming back along with the fact that defenses will have to account more for DMC if he produces at the level that he did 2-3 years ago. Even if Flynn somehow plays worse than Palmer I just don't see that being the difference in the season.

As for someone on defense surprising us we have several new players that should be starting including at least 2 out of 3 LB's we've replaced Kelly and Seymour who didn't produce with younger unknowns. Our DB's are completely revamped taking away the injured CB's we had starting for us last season and we replaced Huff with Woodson.

I just think we're really underrated even by our own fans. I think Roach will turn out better than Phillip Wheeler, Sio Moore will produce at a high level, Burris has a year under his belt. Our CB's are going to be better with the addition of two solid FA's and what should turn out to be a top notch rookie in the mix.

Overall I just disagree with you completely and believe 7 wins is possible, whether or not it will happen in my opinion is based solely on the ability of the coaches to prepare our team week after week. I know were on the right track. I personally just can't wait to see Reggie invest that extra cap room in continuing what I believe will be a bright future.
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big_palooka


Joined: 30 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 12:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TiberiusRising wrote:
big_palooka wrote:
TiberiusRising wrote:
I think an improved product is what we are hoping for. How much we improve will determine how many wins. Personally I think we will be 7-9 or slightly better which would be a good start.

We already improved depth so injuries shouldnt be as much of a handcuff. o instance WR, RB, LB, CB, TE, OL. I cant count how many injuries put us in bad spots last season with an already crappy roster. (Win Affect 1-2 games minimum)

Are DC and defense should do much better in their second year. While a lot of guys are new they are either seasoned vets or quick learners. I truly believe are defense will be underated and will start to rise ala Seattle a couple years back. You saw glimpses in 09 and 10. Communication was a huge downfall especially with the injuries last year. Having Roach in the middle and Woodson in the secondary is going to do wonders. (Win Affect 1-2 games)

We should be able to run the ball this year regardless of McFadden being healthy or not. Not to mention it is his contract year. He always plays hard but he probably wants to set some milestones this season. Moving back to PBS is good for our RB's and our OL not to mention the QB who wont always be under so much pressure. (Win Affect 1-2 games)

Finally ST should be much better with Ford back and another great possibly better option in Cribbs. We also wont be surprised by a LS injury so wont lose one there. This also goes hand in hand with depth because we have better guys to fill the ST roster. (Win Affect 1-2 games)


Win Affect would be wins in addition to last year imo. However anything can happen and things may not be expected hence my 7 win prediction.

We really need to pull out wins in those first two games to get the confidence going. That SD long snapping debacle was crushing in a game we should have won.


7-9 wins? You're dreaming and will be disappointed. I'd love to see it, but with the schedule and lack of talent, it's just not feasible IMO.

Big question at QB. Lack of pass rush could be an issue. McFadden will have to carry the offense and I'm not buying Jennings or Murray as an answer when he's nicked up. The WRs are still below average with no go to target among them.

To get to 7-9, Flynn will have to be a revelation at QB and someone on defense will really have to really surprise us all.

I am saying 7 wins. Our schedule is not that bad. Division games are toss up no matter who you are. Although I dont see us beating the Broncos who are toughest team on our schedule. First two games are very winable, Neither team from NY scares me, nor does TEN, DAL, or PHI. We have already beaten PIT and HOU in recent games. Redskins will be tough but who knows RG3 may not even play if he gets hurt again. It is an easier schedule than last season imo. And even last year we should have won the SD and ATL games.


Denver will likely sweep. They are the class of conference right now w/ Manning. KC should be much improved w/ Reid coaching. SD is a question mark. Best bet 2-3 wins in the division.

Both NY games are on the road.

The Jags, Jets and Titans are the only teams I see on Oakland's level talent wise. Dallas and Philly slightly above.

Other teams trump Oakland in talent and will require some well executed game plans and perhaps a slump from the opponent.
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big_palooka


Joined: 30 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ro4DPoY wrote:

We have the 4th easiest schedule in the league, just putting that out. As for pass rush we had 25 sacks, it would be hard to do any worse than that. McFadden should do better simply because of going back to a scheme he dominates at so if he were to stay healthy he really could carry the majority of the load on offense.


That is irrelevant as we don't know what those teams look like this season. As for sacks, it's not a matter of numbers, it's about getting consistent pressure which Oakland didn't do a season ago. McFadden by all means should bounce back, but how long can he stay healthy?

Ro4DPoY wrote:
The WR's will be better with the addition of Cribbs and Ford coming back along with the fact that defenses will have to account more for DMC if he produces at the level that he did 2-3 years ago. Even if Flynn somehow plays worse than Palmer I just don't see that being the difference in the season.


Cribbs isn't a good WR. Ford, like McFadden is an injury waiting to happen. They don't have a #1 and Flynn is certainly an unknown at this stage. Even average isn't good enough to win 7 games.

Ro4DPoY wrote:
As for someone on defense surprising us we have several new players that should be starting including at least 2 out of 3 LB's we've replaced Kelly and Seymour who didn't produce with younger unknowns. Our DB's are completely revamped taking away the injured CB's we had starting for us last season and we replaced Huff with Woodson.


So yeah..... a bunch of question marks. Should see some improvement, but who's rushing the passer? And how will some of these unknown players perform. Could be better, could be worse.

Ro4DPoY wrote:
I just think we're really underrated even by our own fans. I think Roach will turn out better than Phillip Wheeler, Sio Moore will produce at a high level, Burris has a year under his belt. Our CB's are going to be better with the addition of two solid FA's and what should turn out to be a top notch rookie in the mix.


And then some fans overrate the team. You're banking on 2 rookies to produce at a high level. You're ignoring the fact that Jenkins is actually pretty terrible and Porter is injury prone. They are at this stage similar to Spencer and Bartell. And regardless, with limited pass rush their job is more difficult.

Reality is, there isn't one impact player on defense as it stands. 37 year old Woodson might be the best player on the D which is not the problem you want to have.

Ro4DPoY wrote:
Overall I just disagree with you completely and believe 7 wins is possible, whether or not it will happen in my opinion is based solely on the ability of the coaches to prepare our team week after week. I know were on the right track. I personally just can't wait to see Reggie invest that extra cap room in continuing what I believe will be a bright future.


Possible, yes. If everything goes their way. If McFadden/Ford stay healthy. If Flynn can be slightly above average. If the defense finds a way to pressure the QB with some consistency and create turnovers.

That's putting a lot of faith in emotion. Logic suggests they lack a lot of talent and while they may be headed in the right direction, it's still to early to expect many wins.
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cellomac1212


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:
cellomac1212 wrote:
8 Wins or bust Mother EFFERS!!!!

Seems to be the Davis Motto over, I don't know, the past 30 years... I would be surprised if 4 wins is tolerated. We all know he can clean house, but the real test starts when it comes to acquiring talent. IF Hayden isn't a game changer (or any draft pick from this draft), he might have trouble keeping a job with a less than 8 win showing...


Expecting Hayden or any draft pick to be a game changer in their rookie year is misguided. If that is what Davis expects, then he really has no idea about the game.

This draft class deserves the typical 3 years to develop. And Reggie should get that to see where his draft class stacks up.


Yeah, kind of what I was saying. I meant that if we don't hit the 8 win mark, the only thing that might save him is if he hit gold with one or some of these draft picks. Just an opinion so I can be wrong. But he is going to have to show he can do more than just clean house if he wants to keep job stability at some point this year or the next...
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ch8878


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Allen will be the whipping boy before Reggie count on it.

Reggie traded 2 QB's within 2 weeks that may have never have happened in my 33 years of life, then he was able to get 10 picks in the draft now hes already on the chopping block ...


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ch8878


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:
TiberiusRising wrote:
big_palooka wrote:
TiberiusRising wrote:
I think an improved product is what we are hoping for. How much we improve will determine how many wins. Personally I think we will be 7-9 or slightly better which would be a good start.

We already improved depth so injuries shouldnt be as much of a handcuff. o instance WR, RB, LB, CB, TE, OL. I cant count how many injuries put us in bad spots last season with an already crappy roster. (Win Affect 1-2 games minimum)

Are DC and defense should do much better in their second year. While a lot of guys are new they are either seasoned vets or quick learners. I truly believe are defense will be underated and will start to rise ala Seattle a couple years back. You saw glimpses in 09 and 10. Communication was a huge downfall especially with the injuries last year. Having Roach in the middle and Woodson in the secondary is going to do wonders. (Win Affect 1-2 games)

We should be able to run the ball this year regardless of McFadden being healthy or not. Not to mention it is his contract year. He always plays hard but he probably wants to set some milestones this season. Moving back to PBS is good for our RB's and our OL not to mention the QB who wont always be under so much pressure. (Win Affect 1-2 games)

Finally ST should be much better with Ford back and another great possibly better option in Cribbs. We also wont be surprised by a LS injury so wont lose one there. This also goes hand in hand with depth because we have better guys to fill the ST roster. (Win Affect 1-2 games)


Win Affect would be wins in addition to last year imo. However anything can happen and things may not be expected hence my 7 win prediction.

We really need to pull out wins in those first two games to get the confidence going. That SD long snapping debacle was crushing in a game we should have won.


7-9 wins? You're dreaming and will be disappointed. I'd love to see it, but with the schedule and lack of talent, it's just not feasible IMO.

Big question at QB. Lack of pass rush could be an issue. McFadden will have to carry the offense and I'm not buying Jennings or Murray as an answer when he's nicked up. The WRs are still below average with no go to target among them.

To get to 7-9, Flynn will have to be a revelation at QB and someone on defense will really have to really surprise us all.

I am saying 7 wins. Our schedule is not that bad. Division games are toss up no matter who you are. Although I dont see us beating the Broncos who are toughest team on our schedule. First two games are very winable, Neither team from NY scares me, nor does TEN, DAL, or PHI. We have already beaten PIT and HOU in recent games. Redskins will be tough but who knows RG3 may not even play if he gets hurt again. It is an easier schedule than last season imo. And even last year we should have won the SD and ATL games.


Denver will likely sweep. They are the class of conference right now w/ Manning. KC should be much improved w/ Reid coaching. SD is a question mark. Best bet 2-3 wins in the division.

Both NY games are on the road.

The Jags, Jets and Titans are the only teams I see on Oakland's level talent wise. Dallas and Philly slightly above.

Other teams trump Oakland in talent and will require some well executed game plans and perhaps a slump from the opponent.


So Denver will sweep the division with a 40 year old QB with neck and shoulder issues, and KC is better how ?

Raiders will be much better you can count on it. Wink
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big_palooka


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ch8878 wrote:

So Denver will sweep the division with a 40 year old QB with neck and shoulder issues, and KC is better how ?

Raiders will be much better you can count on it. Wink


After watching Manning last year, you really want make that argument? The guy was electric all season. He's still and elite QB in the NFL. And they had no problem sweeping the Raiders a year ago w/ that same Manning.

KC has talent all over the field. Coaching and QB were their issue. Smith is an upgrade from Cassell and Reid has proven a good HC over the years.
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ch8878


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 2:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:
ch8878 wrote:

So Denver will sweep the division with a 40 year old QB with neck and shoulder issues, and KC is better how ?

Raiders will be much better you can count on it. Wink


After watching Manning last year, you really want make that argument? The guy was electric all season. He's still and elite QB in the NFL. And they had no problem sweeping the Raiders a year ago w/ that same Manning.

KC has talent all over the field. Coaching and QB were their issue. Smith is an upgrade from Cassell and Reid has proven a good HC over the years.


Manning looked average against the Ravens in the 2nd half of the playoff game.

Reid has had some really bad seasons of late, Smith has been up and down in SF.

Rivers is turnover prone.

The Raiders are a completely different team then last year very little is left over so unless you have a crystal ball you or anyone else for that matter does not know what they'll be until the season.
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OakRaiders3828


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 04, 2013 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ch8878 wrote:
big_palooka wrote:
ch8878 wrote:

So Denver will sweep the division with a 40 year old QB with neck and shoulder issues, and KC is better how ?

Raiders will be much better you can count on it. Wink


After watching Manning last year, you really want make that argument? The guy was electric all season. He's still and elite QB in the NFL. And they had no problem sweeping the Raiders a year ago w/ that same Manning.

KC has talent all over the field. Coaching and QB were their issue. Smith is an upgrade from Cassell and Reid has proven a good HC over the years.


Manning looked average against the Ravens in the 2nd half of the playoff game.

Reid has had some really bad seasons of late, Smith has been up and down in SF.

Rivers is turnover prone.

The Raiders are a completely different team then last year very little is left over so unless you have a crystal ball you or anyone else for that matter does not know what they'll be until the season.


We have a ton of new faces, IMO it's going to take a little while to gel and get on the same page.

I think we will be more competitive than last year for sure though. Especially because I feel this team will play with more heart and have way better leadership.

Palooka is right though, Denver is far and away the class of this division.

KC has talent, but if Reid gets pass happy with Smith and doesn't play to his strengths, that might end up badly. Still up in the air with those two, although Reid does seem to have new life now that he's out of that heck hole that is Philadelphia.

San Diego has talent and the second best QB in the division. But they have the worst O line in the division (possibly league) so we may be able to do some things against them.

Right now I see us finishing third. All three teams are pretty weak though, so you never know.

As much as I would love to upset Denver in Mile High on MNF, I actually see us getting swept by them again Crying or Very sad
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