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Trading Down from #25 More Likely?
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What to do with #25?
Select BPA regardless of position
31%
 31%  [ 11 ]
Select Top WR
5%
 5%  [ 2 ]
Select Top CB
2%
 2%  [ 1 ]
Select Top DT
2%
 2%  [ 1 ]
Trade Up to get guy we want
2%
 2%  [ 1 ]
Trade Down and get more ammo
54%
 54%  [ 19 ]
Total Votes : 35

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meixdaddy_10


Joined: 06 Jan 2007
Posts: 588
Location: Mankato, MN
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:59 pm    Post subject: Trading Down from #25 More Likely? Reply with quote

I know it has been beaten like a dead horse, but I really think we
will trade down with #25 to pick up some more ammo.

With some of the rules thrown in the last CBA, teams get an extra
year of control on players in RD1. If they are going to grab a QB
at the top of RD2 they might as well trade up to the end of RD1
and have that extra year.

What better team to trade up with than MN who has 2 later 1st RD picks?

I really think we go LB at #23 (Brown or Te'o)

And it pains me to say it but I think we try to trade down to early
2nd to grab WR Woods. I think it'll be easier to trade down to grab
him than to try and trade up to get him, because you just dont
know where he's going to go.

If that fails and he's gone I think we go DT with either Sly or Short.
Its a win-win either way.

AZ trades up for Barkley, BUFF trades up for Nassib, Philly for EJ Manuel?

What kind of compensation would we get out of a trade back?
Obviously the other teams 2nd Rd pick, 3rd or 4th RD too? and an extra 2014 5th or 6th RD pick?

Thoughts?

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl--nfl-contract-rules-could-help-matt-barkley--other-qbs-get-drafted-in-first-round-150546269.html
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wcblack34


Joined: 21 Jan 2005
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Location: Anywhere but Wisconsin.
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With 11 draft picks, the only compensation that makes sense is a 1st Round pick in the 2014 Draft. Anything less than that plus a late first or a second round pick this year, and we're better off staying put and taking the top guy on our board.
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vike daddy


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Joined: 12 Mar 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wcblack34 wrote:
With 11 draft picks, the only compensation that makes sense is a 1st Round pick in the 2014 Draft. Anything less than that plus a late first or a second round pick this year, and we're better off staying put and taking the top guy on our board.

yep.

and trading down ten spots (as an example) from #25 to #35 is only "worth" about a mid 3rd.
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vikingsrule


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

vike daddy wrote:
wcblack34 wrote:
With 11 draft picks, the only compensation that makes sense is a 1st Round pick in the 2014 Draft. Anything less than that plus a late first or a second round pick this year, and we're better off staying put and taking the top guy on our board.

yep.

and trading down ten spots (as an example) from #25 to #35 is only "worth" about a mid 3rd.


To get a future first round pick, the Vikings would essentially have to give up the pick and may only receive a 4th or 5th round pick from the 2013 draft.

To me, its not worth it. You shouldnt prepare your draft in hopes of stockpiling picks in 2014 to replace Ponder. I think its most prudent to use picks to put the pieces around Ponder in 2013. Moving from pick 25 to the 120 range, to get a first in 2014 just doesnt seem worth it to me.

To go from 25 to 35, to acquire a future 2nd rd pick, would probably only yield a 4th rd pick in 2013.

These future trades probably wont happen until later in the draft.
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biggsohnasty


Joined: 25 Dec 2008
Posts: 368
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If a team like Philly, Buffalo, Arizona or whoever is moving up in hopes to secure a QB...u throw out all trade value charts because teams are irrational with that position.

With that said, I would be willing to deal pick 23 or 25 to move down into the 34-40 range as long as we get a minimum of a 2nd round pick in 2014 in return. But I could see a team forking over a 2014 first if necessary.

And it would be silly not to try accumulating more future picks. Planning for a Ponder flameout isnt the way to build, but look at it this way: you put yourself in a position where IF Ponder struggles again, you have ammo to move up to get a new QB (Bridewater, etc.), but if Ponder plays well, you have more picks in what should be a better draft in terms of top tier talent.
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arKnaD7


Joined: 16 Mar 2006
Posts: 2027
PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 1:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is a relevant trade from 2011

New Orleans Saints: Acquire No. 28 pick (Mark Ingram) in 2011

New England Patriots: Acquire No. 56 pick in 2011 and a first-round pick in 2012.
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thestonedkoala


Joined: 28 Jan 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 4:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

arKnaD7 wrote:
Here is a relevant trade from 2011

New Orleans Saints: Acquire No. 28 pick (Mark Ingram) in 2011

New England Patriots: Acquire No. 56 pick in 2011 and a first-round pick in 2012.


New Orleans wasn't building at the time. Philly, Buffalo or Arizona are, so they won't give up a high first.
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PrplChilPill


Joined: 26 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gotta get a second this year, otherwise you are punting on this draft for the future, a future that may not include Allen or Williams. At some point, play for now.

If they do deal, I would be good with the second this year and second next year.
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vike daddy


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PrplChilPill wrote:
If they do deal, I would be good with the second this year and second next year.

yes, that would be a nice price.
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vikingsrule


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 11:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PrplChilPill wrote:
Gotta get a second this year, otherwise you are punting on this draft for the future, a future that may not include Allen or Williams. At some point, play for now.

If they do deal, I would be good with the second this year and second next year.


I agree, a 2nd this year and next year would be ideal. Going for a first next year means you arent going to be likely to get anything more than a 4th in exchange this year.

Why short the talent on the roster in 2013 to reserve valuable picks for the future? A future that may not even include Ponder/Frazier for all we know. A 2nd and a 2nd would be fantastic, but finding a team desperate enough like the Saints in 2011 may be hard. I dont think there will be significant demand for future trades for the teams who are rebuilding (most likely to be looking for a QB).

Actually, it was Sean Payton's son who pushed for Mark Ingram. His son really wanted Ingram on the Saints, but the Saints took Cam Heyward instead. But New Orleans still went out of there way to do what they could to get Ingram. I feel like emotion drove this deal for Payton than actually thinking it through in a logical manner. They overpaid for a RB and for trade compensation, and when you consider that the Saints already had Pierre Thomas and Darren Sproles, combined with finding guys like Ivory out of knowwhere and being a pass heavy team, it made no sense what so ever for Payton to sign off on this trade. But again, his son wanted Ingram and Payton was probably doing what he could to save the disappointment.
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Minnesnowta vk


Joined: 03 Feb 2013
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 11:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

With the depth of the DT and wr class I don't see how staying put at 25 makes any sense I want to move down to the early second and pick up a second next year this puts in position to have the ammo to move up for a QB if ponder craps the bed this year. I don't see us pulling of a New England type trade and moving to the mid to bottom of the second for a first next year when theres are bound to be great talent that's dropped to the early second in this WR and DT heavy draft

T'eo or brown with the 23
Woods hunter watford or sly with the early second bpa
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xDarealx


Joined: 29 Dec 2012
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

vikings should trade down. By far they should add more picks for this season. this draft is 2 deep to worry about next yr.
my dream scenario, trade that 25th pick for both of the bengals 2nd rnd picks. Or jus keep trading down from 25 to get multiple picks.
there is way to much depth in this draft. We can get starters in the 4th at safety and og
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xDarealx


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Minnesnowta vk wrote:
With the depth of the DT and wr class I don't see how staying put at 25 makes any sense I want to move down to the early second and pick up a second next year this puts in position to have the ammo to move up for a QB if ponder craps the bed this year. I don't see us pulling of a New England type trade and moving to the mid to bottom of the second for a first next year when theres are bound to be great talent that's dropped to the early second in this WR and DT heavy draft

T'eo or brown with the 23
Woods hunter watford or sly with the early second bpa

Plz someone tell me what's the fascination with Arthur Brown?
I think it's a waste of a first rnd pick. He played olb in college, he wasn't the signal caller on def. Why don't we jus wait to the second for lb's like kiko Alonso or Jon Bostic. Teo and brown remind me of 3-4 inside backers.
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Purplexing


Joined: 13 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wcblack34 wrote:
With 11 draft picks, the only compensation that makes sense is a 1st Round pick in the 2014 Draft. Anything less than that plus a late first or a second round pick this year, and we're better off staying put and taking the top guy on our board.


This makes the most sense for a reason not explicitly stated by the author, wcblack34....

I assume that 11 picks in 2013 will be sufficient to address all of the roster spots in need of a new starter or an upgrade in talent... e.g. WR, DT, MLB, CB, G.

(DE doesn't need to be addressed now, but could be, as a pre-emptive move.)

So, the 5 areas that need to be addressed can possibly be resolved with picks in rounds 1-4.

Those who think more picks are needed fail to realize that Spielman did NOT 'purge' more than half of the free agents and under-performers that were projected by MANY mock off seasons. Continuity is important when your W-L record is 10-6. It doesn't count for much when it is 3-13.

Simpson was brought back, Carlson wasn't cut, Gerhart wasn't cut, Kluwe wasn't cut, Kropog was brought back, Olsen replaced Schwartz, Jennings 'replaces' Harvin, Sandejo, Mitchell returned, etc.

So, [rhetorical question] which roster spots are filled but require upgrading, necessitating 'more ammo' than 11 picks to fill? [/rhetorical question].

Staying put in the current spots, and picking higher caliber talented players to improve the chance of finding a long term starter or quality rotational player, makes more sense for a young team with a winning record. Just my $.02.
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Purplexing


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

xDarealx wrote:
Minnesnowta vk wrote:
With the depth of the DT and wr class I don't see how staying put at 25 makes any sense I want to move down to the early second and pick up a second next year this puts in position to have the ammo to move up for a QB if ponder craps the bed this year. I don't see us pulling of a New England type trade and moving to the mid to bottom of the second for a first next year when theres are bound to be great talent that's dropped to the early second in this WR and DT heavy draft

T'eo or brown with the 23
Woods hunter watford or sly with the early second bpa

Plz someone tell me what's the fascination with Arthur Brown?
I think it's a waste of a first rnd pick. He played olb in college, he wasn't the signal caller on def. Why don't we jus wait to the second for lb's like kiko Alonso or Jon Bostic. Teo and brown remind me of 3-4 inside backers.


He has good tools to be a great NFL player.

Now, your turn; what's your fascination with more picks?

5 Key Needs: DT, MLB, WR, CB, G. Can you name any others that require more picks than the 6 others (11 total - 5 greatest needs to be addressed in rounds 1-4) the Vikings have in 2013?
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