Discuss football with over 60,000 fans. Free Membership. Join now!

 FAQFAQ  RegisterRegister   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

FootballsFuture.com Forum Index
FootballsFuture.com Home

Who do you draft #11?
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> San Diego Chargers
View previous topic :: View next topic  

Who do you draft #11?
QB EJ Manuel, Florida State
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
QB Matt Barkley, Southern California
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
WR Tavon Austin, West Virginia
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
WR Keenan Allen, California
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
TE Tyler Eifert, Notre Dame
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
T Lane Johnson, Oklahoma
53%
 53%  [ 8 ]
DT Sharrif Floyd, Florida
13%
 13%  [ 2 ]
DT Sheldon Richardson, Missourri
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
DE Bjoern Werner, Florida State
6%
 6%  [ 1 ]
DE Datone Jones, UCLA
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
LB Jarvis Jones, Georgia
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
LB Barkevious Mingo, LSU
26%
 26%  [ 4 ]
LB Alec Ogletree, Georgia
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
CB Xavier Rhodes, Florida State
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
S Kenny Vacarro, Texas
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Other player, post your choice below
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Total Votes : 15

Author Message
Wilkieray


Joined: 16 Mar 2012
Posts: 141
Location: Bossier city, LA
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 12:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think you have to go Lane Johnson. True there are good OT's in the 2-4th round but I do not think you have a day 1 starter that I'd be comfortable with. Not to mention that Johnson ceiling is way higher than the later round prospects. Just my opinion. The LSU thing is so true. Not just Dorsey. You have J. Russell, Buster Davis and a few other underachievers (not necessarily busts). I'd be very careful when drafting players from schools like LSU, USC, Bama. Not that I wouldn't, I'd just be very careful.
_________________
New Regime = New Team... Now start building it and make it your own.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Neutral


Joined: 08 Mar 2013
Posts: 663
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 12:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To be fair, there's a least one pick on there that appears to be strictly BPA rather than need, and that's the Raiders taking Fisher. Considering that Veldheer is one of their few young bright spots, that pick would effectively net a quality right tackle. You could make a case about the guards as well. The position is chronically devalued in the draft. This scenario has one team taking the top guard over the second pass rusher, and another taking the second guard over the third pass rusher. I'd be surprised if those teams' front offices felt the same way. An argument could be made that this year boasts a very top-shallow draft class. But, it's working against the new rookie wage scale that prevents signing a player to an inflated first contract just because they play a premium position. It seems like both picks were made because they were the better/higher-rated player regardless of position.

With that said, even if Warmack and Cooper were on the board, it would be a surprise if Telesco took one this early. And, as Duffman pointed out, the staff might not be all that high on an OT should one fall to #11. Pass rush is a possibility and certainly a major need. But looking at that list, there's potential for Telesco to throw us a curveball. A few possibilities...

Vaccaro: we're assuming that Brandon Taylor is the starter as soon as he's fully recovered from his ACL tear. The team just spent a 3rd [and 6th] round pick on him last year and Pagano presumably had input at some point leading up to that selection. But, the team also had a major need at SS, and what if Taylor was simply the best option at the time? It's possible that Vaccaro is the kind of player that Pagano was hoping he could get at the time, and envisions him as an ideal pair to Weddle.

Ogletree: another case where a highly-drafted youngster is currently penciled into a starting spot, the team spent a late 2nd round pick on Mouton in 2011. Pagano was the LB coach - what input did he have in that selection? Little is known about Mouton, and we haven't heard anything about him standing out in training camp or impressing as a spot starter (unlike say, Shareece Wright). Even if Pagano intends for him to have a role in the defense, is it a starting role? Primary backup Demorrio Williams saw the field quite often last year with Butler and Spikes entrenched as the starters. It's possible that Mouton slides into Demorrio's role and Telesco drafts a stud ILB in the first. Ogletree is a possibility, but in that scenario, I was envisioning Arthur Brown.

Austin: we know that we don't need a WR on day one or two. But what if the new offensive staff looks at Austin as too valuable a weapon to pass on? It's presumed that Royal will be the slot receiver. That position was underutilized used by Norv who ran 2-WR sets more frequently than most (all? I don't know exactly) other coaches. That should change with Whisenhunt as the OC. But do they give Royal a chance? Reportedly the cap savings for cutting Royal is only $1.5M. That's enough to cover signing the #11 pick, effectively adding money elsewhere, such as adding veteran depth or extending players. Austin is presumably an upgrade, even if Royal has a rebound year. With Alexander and Floyd having injury concerns and Gates coming off his worst season, could the staff make the pick here to ensure that Rivers has weapons to work with?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PackMan22


Joined: 04 May 2007
Posts: 905
Location: Idaho
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 4:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The LBC wrote:
PackMan22 wrote:
JammerHammer21 wrote:
PackMan22 wrote:
I voted Floyd. I vote BPA regardless of scheme or team positional needs.


He has zero fit here.

Right. And I voted regardless of that.

Then your logic is flawed. There's fitting scheme to highly talented players, but you do so when it doesn't require scheming to the detriment of high-talent, productive players already on your roster. The value in "best player available" is notably affected by how well the particular player fits to the scheme a team implements; ad when teams draft on "BPA" it's very rarely a strict Best Player Available in a holistic sense, rather a Best Player Available FOR THEIR TEAM.

Floyd's not a great fit for 5-tech, particularly in the scheme we run, and even if he was investing yet another 1st round selection in the 5-tech position would likely necessitate kicking Corey Liuget inside to the 0-Tech/NT position, which is a suspect move at best.

Other question: If you were dead set on doing what YOU wanted to do no matter what, what exactly was your motivation for soliciting opinions from the fan base in this sub-forum? Stroking your own ego?


The reason i run the poll is to see who the fanbase likes with the options available. But there are always surprises, and often picks surprise the fanbase. I can't claim to know the positional needs of every team.
When there are several guys available who are similar in grade, I will try to vote for the player who best fits a need. When there is a player who is CLEARLY a tier above everyone else on the board, I vote that player regardless of positional need or scheme. And of the board fell this way, I'm sure someone in the room is screaming for Floyd. My lone vote represents that guy in the room.

Also, rarely does my single vote sway the outcome of the poll. So if you don't like my vote, you get to vote for whomever you prefer.
_________________
Adopt-a-Packer Frank Zombo

Can we please cease and desist with the term 'professional athletes representing their country'? That term should be reserved for one man and one man only: Pat Tillman.-Mike Bianchi, Orlando Sentinel
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JammerHammer21


Joined: 27 Dec 2009
Posts: 24317
Location: Anywhere
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Screaming for a player at arguably our strongest position when we have tons of needs? Floyd is getting so overrated, I don't see this surefire top 5 pick at all...
_________________

Bohlmann20 (On The 95 Cleveland Browns Staff) wrote:
Lombardi - Isn't that the guy the trophy is named after? If so, top 3 coach of all time.

#JDI
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Boltstrikes


Moderator
Joined: 15 Feb 2006
Posts: 5996
Location: LA MIRADA, CA
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 1:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wilkieray wrote:
I think you have to go Lane Johnson. True there are good OT's in the 2-4th round but I do not think you have a day 1 starter that I'd be comfortable with. Not to mention that Johnson ceiling is way higher than the later round prospects. Just my opinion. The LSU thing is so true. Not just Dorsey. You have J. Russell, Buster Davis and a few other underachievers (not necessarily busts). I'd be very careful when drafting players from schools like LSU, USC, Bama. Not that I wouldn't, I'd just be very careful.


Jacob Hester was the one that left the foulest taste in my mouth. We essentially spent two second round picks for a glorified special teams player.

Somehow we need two starting Tackles before the start of the season and another starting guard. Yes, I've jumped on the soapbox that we need a pass rusher year after year and AJ grabbed players like English... We will always have CB and pass rusher as a need. Every team in the NFL needs this guys constantly but I can't repeat it enough times, if we allow Rivers to get hit as often as we did the past two years, we will lose our franchise quarterback and then we are back in the Ryan Leaf era.
_________________


EverythingSF wrote:
But I do feel Alex is better than Rivers and we may as well not even argue over it here because I am pretty sure neither will change the others mind.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
winitall


Joined: 19 Apr 2008
Posts: 2152
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The first round is where need should be matched with the best player available. The first part is deciding who the best players available are. In my opinion the top 7 players available are:

1. Sharrif Floyd
2. Jarvis Jones
3. Lane Johnson
4. Kenny Vaccaro
5. Xavier Rhodes
6. Tavon Austin
7. Shelden Richardson

When need is factored into the equation numbers 1,6, and 7 are eliminated. That leaves Jones, Johnson, Vaccaro, and Rhodes on the list. All of these players are around the same value and all play at positions that could be upgraded. However I believe that the depth at both cornerback and safety in this draft is extremely deep. Players like Baccari Rambo, Duke Williams, Robert Alford, etc can be added round three or later. This leaves only Jarvis Jones and Lane Johnson as the two prospects still in consideration. I consider building inside out and that games are won in the trenches. That is why Lane Johnson would be the correct choice if the draft fell this way.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The LBC


Global Moderator
Joined: 12 Jan 2008
Posts: 22816
Location: Where We Can't Have Nice Things
PostPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

winitall wrote:
The first round is where need should be matched with the best player available. The first part is deciding who the best players available are. In my opinion the top 7 players available are:

1. Sharrif Floyd
2. Jarvis Jones
3. Lane Johnson
4. Kenny Vaccaro
5. Xavier Rhodes
6. Tavon Austin
7. Shelden Richardson

When need is factored into the equation numbers 1,6, and 7 are eliminated. That leaves Jones, Johnson, Vaccaro, and Rhodes on the list. All of these players are around the same value and all play at positions that could be upgraded. However I believe that the depth at both cornerback and safety in this draft is extremely deep. Players like Baccari Rambo, Duke Williams, Robert Alford, etc can be added round three or later. This leaves only Jarvis Jones and Lane Johnson as the two prospects still in consideration. I consider building inside out and that games are won in the trenches. That is why Lane Johnson would be the correct choice if the draft fell this way.

I agree with where you're going, I just would tweak the players you have listed slightly. I don't view Jarvis Jones as remotely a Top 15 caliber player - somehow Bjoern Werner's production is being sunk because he just "doesn't stand out on tape" and yet Jones is getting a pass despite having similar shortcomings to Werner. I would swap Jon Cooper in over Jones because of positional versatility and yes, that's why I actually rate Cooper higher on my big board than Chance Warmack. If an interior lineman is drafted in the Top 15 it's almost always a center - Cooper can play that position, Warmack hasn't shown to be able to do it (if he can then obviously that ought to boost his stock, but I've seen no indication that's in Chance's repertoire). In this respect, Cooper represents the same kind of value that made both of the Pouncey's Top 15 caliber players, because they projected as long-term options at the 2nd-most premium OL position (center) but could immediately plug in at a guard spot (it's actually pretty commonly done with interior linemen on both sides of the trench, 3-4 NT's as well as centers - Alex Mack and Eric Wood both played guard as rookies).
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Neutral


Joined: 08 Mar 2013
Posts: 663
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 12:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boltstrikes wrote:
Jacob Hester was the one that left the foulest taste in my mouth. We essentially spent two second round picks for a glorified special teams player.


It has to be Buster Davis for me, for the domino effect it had if nothing else. Can you imagine how differently things would have played out if they did the sane thing and just taken Weddle at #30?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
MrDrew


Global Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2008
Posts: 17312
Location: Sector ZZ9 Plural Z Alpha
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 12:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Neutral wrote:
Boltstrikes wrote:
Jacob Hester was the one that left the foulest taste in my mouth. We essentially spent two second round picks for a glorified special teams player.


It has to be Buster Davis for me, for the domino effect it had if nothing else. Can you imagine how differently things would have played out if they did the sane thing and just taken Weddle at #30?


Both would have been drafted, it just wouldn't have cost the extra pick to get Weddle. Busted would have still been there in the 2nd, or AJ would have traded up to get him too.
_________________


"I am a leaf on the wind... Watch how I soar"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Boltstrikes


Moderator
Joined: 15 Feb 2006
Posts: 5996
Location: LA MIRADA, CA
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glanced over the official roster today and Shaun Philips is still listed on it. I haven't heard a whisper about him being back or being courted by other teams. I wonder if something is in the works to keep him here now.
_________________


EverythingSF wrote:
But I do feel Alex is better than Rivers and we may as well not even argue over it here because I am pretty sure neither will change the others mind.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
MrDrew


Global Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2008
Posts: 17312
Location: Sector ZZ9 Plural Z Alpha
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boltstrikes wrote:
Glanced over the official roster today and Shaun Philips is still listed on it. I haven't heard a whisper about him being back or being courted by other teams. I wonder if something is in the works to keep him here now.


The last rumor is that Denver Team was interested.
_________________


"I am a leaf on the wind... Watch how I soar"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
winitall


Joined: 19 Apr 2008
Posts: 2152
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The LBC wrote:
winitall wrote:
The first round is where need should be matched with the best player available. The first part is deciding who the best players available are. In my opinion the top 7 players available are:

1. Sharrif Floyd
2. Jarvis Jones
3. Lane Johnson
4. Kenny Vaccaro
5. Xavier Rhodes
6. Tavon Austin
7. Shelden Richardson

When need is factored into the equation numbers 1,6, and 7 are eliminated. That leaves Jones, Johnson, Vaccaro, and Rhodes on the list. All of these players are around the same value and all play at positions that could be upgraded. However I believe that the depth at both cornerback and safety in this draft is extremely deep. Players like Baccari Rambo, Duke Williams, Robert Alford, etc can be added round three or later. This leaves only Jarvis Jones and Lane Johnson as the two prospects still in consideration. I consider building inside out and that games are won in the trenches. That is why Lane Johnson would be the correct choice if the draft fell this way.

I agree with where you're going, I just would tweak the players you have listed slightly. I don't view Jarvis Jones as remotely a Top 15 caliber player - somehow Bjoern Werner's production is being sunk because he just "doesn't stand out on tape" and yet Jones is getting a pass despite having similar shortcomings to Werner. I would swap Jon Cooper in over Jones because of positional versatility and yes, that's why I actually rate Cooper higher on my big board than Chance Warmack. If an interior lineman is drafted in the Top 15 it's almost always a center - Cooper can play that position, Warmack hasn't shown to be able to do it (if he can then obviously that ought to boost his stock, but I've seen no indication that's in Chance's repertoire). In this respect, Cooper represents the same kind of value that made both of the Pouncey's Top 15 caliber players, because they projected as long-term options at the 2nd-most premium OL position (center) but could immediately plug in at a guard spot (it's actually pretty commonly done with interior linemen on both sides of the trench, 3-4 NT's as well as centers - Alex Mack and Eric Wood both played guard as rookies).


Jarvis Jones is one of those guys where there are two completely different views. You either love him or you hate him. I'm one of the people that think he can be one of the better players out of this class if he can stay healthy. Werner is a guy that I love for a 4-3 but I am unsure of how he will fair in a 3-4 coming of the edge. In regards to Cooper I just haven't seen enough of him to give a fair evaluation of him. I am intrigued by his ability to play multiple positions though.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Boltstrikes


Moderator
Joined: 15 Feb 2006
Posts: 5996
Location: LA MIRADA, CA
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was a huge Werner fan and thought he'd be a perfect 3-4 olb but the combine changed my mind. He doesn't have the hips for a lb.
_________________


EverythingSF wrote:
But I do feel Alex is better than Rivers and we may as well not even argue over it here because I am pretty sure neither will change the others mind.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
wwhickok


Joined: 27 Nov 2012
Posts: 12056
Location: Montgomery, PA aka Steeler Nation!
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If I may chime in here, I beleive this is going to be a selection of need more so than BPA.

After the speculative report that this could be Philip Rivers' last season with the Chargers, I think if they stay at 11, they will take a WR IF Lane Johnson is already gone.

I actually believe however, that the Chargers are a strong candidate to move up in the draft to select a LT. I'm not sure if they have the fire power for the #1 overall spot to select Joekel or Fisher, but I could see it if they feel they do. I believe Rivers is still a quality QB who has very little on offense to support him, the receivers are average at best and that Oline is terrible. They have a solid Running Back in Matthews, the problem is, the offensive line isn't truly capable of opening holes for them. With a few right selections in this draft, they could fix all of that.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JammerHammer21


Joined: 27 Dec 2009
Posts: 24317
Location: Anywhere
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 1:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wwhickok wrote:
If I may chime in here, I beleive this is going to be a selection of need more so than BPA.

After the speculative report that this could be Philip Rivers' last season with the Chargers, I think if they stay at 11, they will take a WR IF Lane Johnson is already gone.

I actually believe however, that the Chargers are a strong candidate to move up in the draft to select a LT. I'm not sure if they have the fire power for the #1 overall spot to select Joekel or Fisher, but I could see it if they feel they do. I believe Rivers is still a quality QB who has very little on offense to support him, the receivers are average at best and that Oline is terrible. They have a solid Running Back in Matthews, the problem is, the offensive line isn't truly capable of opening holes for them. With a few right selections in this draft, they could fix all of that.


Nah, WR isn't a need and Patterson is a gigantic character risk IMO. Can't run route either.
_________________

Bohlmann20 (On The 95 Cleveland Browns Staff) wrote:
Lombardi - Isn't that the guy the trophy is named after? If so, top 3 coach of all time.

#JDI
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   

Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> San Diego Chargers All times are GMT - 4 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Page 2 of 3

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum




Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group