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Silver&Black88


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Joined: 24 Feb 2009
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Location: Los Angeles, CA
PostPosted: Sun Dec 22, 2013 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RaiderX wrote:
holyghost wrote:
8th rated C.

Does that count in bad shotgun snaps? Do the stat makers who made that up know his protection calls and the ones he may miss?
Because he doesn't pass the eye test on that level. And the run game kinda has sucked, pass protection ranging between decent and horrid. It just isn't showing up "8th" on the field. Don't buy made up stats, they're not counting in the whole picture.


Aside from the Dallas game, the run game has been pretty good since the bye. Been better up the middle too. For some reason he's had issues with McGloin, snapping the ball. Inconsistent play at OG on both sides. Wiz has been just ok IMO


Wiz has been ok imo too. He has weeks where he's an absolute beast blocking. Others he disappears. The bad snaps bug me though and I'm sure everyone else too.
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mtraider1


Joined: 22 Dec 2013
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2013 12:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="manbearpig"]What do you guys think of signing Alex Mack (cal product) and moving lil Wiz back to LG? Twisted Evil[/quote]

I've read this site for many years, but have finally decided to post. I love this idea. In order for the Raiders to get back to greatness, we need to start up front on both sides of the ball. I'd like to see us bring in Alex Mack, slide Wiz over to LG, and bring in Texans guard Wade Smith. I'm not saying that Wiz has been doing a bad job, but bringing in Mack at Center and having two quality guards would do wonders for our team- including the quarterback and running back positions.

LT: Veldeer
LG: Wiz
C: Mack
RG: Smith
RT: Watson (or bring Barnes back if Watson simply isn't ready- not my favorite option, but it's realistic)

On the defensive side of the ball, I would like to see us resign Houston ( I know he might cost a lot of money), Sims and Walker. Then we should bring in Greg Hardy (Carolina). Again, he is going to be expensive, but that's why we have $60+ million to spend in the Free Agency that we actually need to spend. With McGee, who has played ok throughout his rookie season, and maybe an early draft pick up or two to continue to help solidify the defensive front and improve our pass rush our defensive line becomes one of our strengths. So our starting front four would look like:

DE: Houston
DT: Walker
DT: Sims
DE: Hardy

Again, this is just where I would start with free agency. We obviously need to address some skill positions at some point as well, but I would like to see us focus on creating solid fronts on both sides of the ball.
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Chali21


Joined: 07 Feb 2007
Posts: 4267
Location: Cali
PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2013 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mtraider1 wrote:
manbearpig wrote:
What do you guys think of signing Alex Mack (cal product) and moving lil Wiz back to LG? Twisted Evil


I've read this site for many years, but have finally decided to post. I love this idea. In order for the Raiders to get back to greatness, we need to start up front on both sides of the ball. I'd like to see us bring in Alex Mack, slide Wiz over to LG, and bring in Texans guard Wade Smith. I'm not saying that Wiz has been doing a bad job, but bringing in Mack at Center and having two quality guards would do wonders for our team- including the quarterback and running back positions.

LT: Veldeer
LG: Wiz
C: Mack
RG: Smith
RT: Watson (or bring Barnes back if Watson simply isn't ready- not my favorite option, but it's realistic)

On the defensive side of the ball, I would like to see us resign Houston ( I know he might cost a lot of money), Sims and Walker. Then we should bring in Greg Hardy (Carolina). Again, he is going to be expensive, but that's why we have $60+ million to spend in the Free Agency that we actually need to spend. With McGee, who has played ok throughout his rookie season, and maybe an early draft pick up or two to continue to help solidify the defensive front and improve our pass rush our defensive line becomes one of our strengths. So our starting front four would look like:

DE: Houston
DT: Walker
DT: Sims
DE: Hardy

Again, this is just where I would start with free agency. We obviously need to address some skill positions at some point as well, but I would like to see us focus on creating solid fronts on both sides of the ball.


Welcome to the Forum!

I like this idea as well but many others here think that we won't break the bank on free agents. I believe though that Free Agency is where you upgrade players and let others walk.
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Baggabonez


Joined: 29 Apr 2010
Posts: 8060
Location: RaiderNation
PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2013 10:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

holyghost wrote:
8th rated C.

Does that count in bad shotgun snaps? Do the stat makers who made that up know his protection calls and the ones he may miss?
Because he doesn't pass the eye test on that level. And the run game kinda has sucked, pass protection ranging between decent and horrid. It just isn't showing up "8th" on the field. Don't buy made up stats, they're not counting in the whole picture.


The basis of your argument is confirmation bias. You can't accept the statistics that support your position and ignore others that don't. Every OL in the NFL receives a grade in team meeting usually the first practice after a game. period. Yes, sometimes players perform poorly at inopportune times that cost teams games be it a bad long snap or letting a pass get into your body and the ball bounces off your shoulder pads into the hands of a nearby defender. Sure enough that following Monday we have to entertain moving Wiz back to position he wasn't great at or revamping our entire WR corps. It's human nature.

PFF isn't the final word but they are highly respected entity in the industry. 8th is not bad at all considering Wiz' experience. Pouncey is 9th so Wiz is contributing at great value. Wiz won a weekly ROOKIE popularity contest voted on by fans at OG and somehow history gets rewritten that he had real potential at OG.

Lombardi isn't letting the #1 OC get out of Cleveland anyways.
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Nodisrespect wrote:
(on building inside out) teams without highly draft DT's make the playoffs and win the superbowl regularly.

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Teams that win Superbowls and make the playoffs aren't picking in the Top 5, clearly
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raidr4life


Joined: 10 Jan 2010
Posts: 8707
Location: Fresno, California
PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2013 11:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Baggabonez wrote:
holyghost wrote:
8th rated C.

Does that count in bad shotgun snaps? Do the stat makers who made that up know his protection calls and the ones he may miss?
Because he doesn't pass the eye test on that level. And the run game kinda has sucked, pass protection ranging between decent and horrid. It just isn't showing up "8th" on the field. Don't buy made up stats, they're not counting in the whole picture.


The basis of your argument is confirmation bias. You can't accept the statistics that support your position and ignore others that don't. Every OL in the NFL receives a grade in team meeting usually the first practice after a game. period. Yes, sometimes players perform poorly at inopportune times that cost teams games be it a bad long snap or letting a pass get into your body and the ball bounces off your shoulder pads into the hands of a nearby defender. Sure enough that following Monday we have to entertain moving Wiz back to position he wasn't great at or revamping our entire WR corps. It's human nature.

PFF isn't the final word but they are highly respected entity in the industry. 8th is not bad at all considering Wiz' experience. Pouncey is 9th so Wiz is contributing at great value. Wiz won a weekly ROOKIE popularity contest voted on by fans at OG and somehow history gets rewritten that he had real potential at OG.

Lombardi isn't letting the #1 OC get out of Cleveland anyways.
I'm not saying we should move Wiz back but you do keep ignoring the fact that the left side of the line was dominant in run and pass protection when he played next to Veldheer. He did alot more than just win a Rookie poularity contest.

At the beginning of the 2011 season, coach Hue Jackson named Wisniewski the Raiders' starting left guard, the same position occupied by Steve Wisniewski, placed between Samson Satele at center and Jared Veldheer at left tackle. On opening day of the 2011 NFL season, the offensive line cleared the way for 190 rushing yards and a victory over the Denver Broncos.
Wisniewski was named the Pepsi NFL Rookie of the Week for Week 3 of the 2011 NFL season, after the Oakland offensive line cleared the way for 234 rushing yards and allowing only one sack against the New York Jets. His lead block on a pivotal fourth-quarter touchdown run gave Oakland a two-score lead.[5] On January 2012, Wisniewski was named to the Pro Football Weekly All-Rookie team for his outstanding rookie season as starting left guard. Wisniewski helped pave the way for the NFL's 7th ranked rushing attack and anchored an offensive line that only allowed 25 sacks, tied for 3rd best in the NFL.
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NCOUGHMAN


Joined: 25 Mar 2008
Posts: 16670
Location: Stockton via East Palo Alto
PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2013 11:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

raidr4life wrote:
Baggabonez wrote:
holyghost wrote:
8th rated C.

Does that count in bad shotgun snaps? Do the stat makers who made that up know his protection calls and the ones he may miss?
Because he doesn't pass the eye test on that level. And the run game kinda has sucked, pass protection ranging between decent and horrid. It just isn't showing up "8th" on the field. Don't buy made up stats, they're not counting in the whole picture.


The basis of your argument is confirmation bias. You can't accept the statistics that support your position and ignore others that don't. Every OL in the NFL receives a grade in team meeting usually the first practice after a game. period. Yes, sometimes players perform poorly at inopportune times that cost teams games be it a bad long snap or letting a pass get into your body and the ball bounces off your shoulder pads into the hands of a nearby defender. Sure enough that following Monday we have to entertain moving Wiz back to position he wasn't great at or revamping our entire WR corps. It's human nature.

PFF isn't the final word but they are highly respected entity in the industry. 8th is not bad at all considering Wiz' experience. Pouncey is 9th so Wiz is contributing at great value. Wiz won a weekly ROOKIE popularity contest voted on by fans at OG and somehow history gets rewritten that he had real potential at OG.

Lombardi isn't letting the #1 OC get out of Cleveland anyways.
I'm not saying we should move Wiz back but you do keep ignoring the fact that the left side of the line was dominant in run and pass protection when he played next to Veldheer. He did alot more than just win a Rookie poularity contest.

At the beginning of the 2011 season, coach Hue Jackson named Wisniewski the Raiders' starting left guard, the same position occupied by Steve Wisniewski, placed between Samson Satele at center and Jared Veldheer at left tackle. On opening day of the 2011 NFL season, the offensive line cleared the way for 190 rushing yards and a victory over the Denver Broncos.
Wisniewski was named the Pepsi NFL Rookie of the Week for Week 3 of the 2011 NFL season, after the Oakland offensive line cleared the way for 234 rushing yards and allowing only one sack against the New York Jets. His lead block on a pivotal fourth-quarter touchdown run gave Oakland a two-score lead.[5] On January 2012, Wisniewski was named to the Pro Football Weekly All-Rookie team for his outstanding rookie season as starting left guard. Wisniewski helped pave the way for the NFL's 7th ranked rushing attack and anchored an offensive line that only allowed 25 sacks, tied for 3rd best in the NFL.
wiz is a young stud who just gets better
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green24 wrote:
NCOUGHMAN > all of you


Raider X wrote:
This is football, not pussology 101
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raidr4life


Joined: 10 Jan 2010
Posts: 8707
Location: Fresno, California
PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2013 11:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NCOUGHMAN wrote:
raidr4life wrote:
Baggabonez wrote:
holyghost wrote:
8th rated C.

Does that count in bad shotgun snaps? Do the stat makers who made that up know his protection calls and the ones he may miss?
Because he doesn't pass the eye test on that level. And the run game kinda has sucked, pass protection ranging between decent and horrid. It just isn't showing up "8th" on the field. Don't buy made up stats, they're not counting in the whole picture.


The basis of your argument is confirmation bias. You can't accept the statistics that support your position and ignore others that don't. Every OL in the NFL receives a grade in team meeting usually the first practice after a game. period. Yes, sometimes players perform poorly at inopportune times that cost teams games be it a bad long snap or letting a pass get into your body and the ball bounces off your shoulder pads into the hands of a nearby defender. Sure enough that following Monday we have to entertain moving Wiz back to position he wasn't great at or revamping our entire WR corps. It's human nature.

PFF isn't the final word but they are highly respected entity in the industry. 8th is not bad at all considering Wiz' experience. Pouncey is 9th so Wiz is contributing at great value. Wiz won a weekly ROOKIE popularity contest voted on by fans at OG and somehow history gets rewritten that he had real potential at OG.

Lombardi isn't letting the #1 OC get out of Cleveland anyways.
I'm not saying we should move Wiz back but you do keep ignoring the fact that the left side of the line was dominant in run and pass protection when he played next to Veldheer. He did alot more than just win a Rookie poularity contest.

At the beginning of the 2011 season, coach Hue Jackson named Wisniewski the Raiders' starting left guard, the same position occupied by Steve Wisniewski, placed between Samson Satele at center and Jared Veldheer at left tackle. On opening day of the 2011 NFL season, the offensive line cleared the way for 190 rushing yards and a victory over the Denver Broncos.
Wisniewski was named the Pepsi NFL Rookie of the Week for Week 3 of the 2011 NFL season, after the Oakland offensive line cleared the way for 234 rushing yards and allowing only one sack against the New York Jets. His lead block on a pivotal fourth-quarter touchdown run gave Oakland a two-score lead.[5] On January 2012, Wisniewski was named to the Pro Football Weekly All-Rookie team for his outstanding rookie season as starting left guard. Wisniewski helped pave the way for the NFL's 7th ranked rushing attack and anchored an offensive line that only allowed 25 sacks, tied for 3rd best in the NFL.
wiz is a young stud who just gets better
Thing is it wasn't broke shouldn't have tried to fix it. Should have just drafted a C.
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NCOUGHMAN


Joined: 25 Mar 2008
Posts: 16670
Location: Stockton via East Palo Alto
PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 12:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

raidr4life wrote:
NCOUGHMAN wrote:
raidr4life wrote:
Baggabonez wrote:
holyghost wrote:
8th rated C.

Does that count in bad shotgun snaps? Do the stat makers who made that up know his protection calls and the ones he may miss?
Because he doesn't pass the eye test on that level. And the run game kinda has sucked, pass protection ranging between decent and horrid. It just isn't showing up "8th" on the field. Don't buy made up stats, they're not counting in the whole picture.


The basis of your argument is confirmation bias. You can't accept the statistics that support your position and ignore others that don't. Every OL in the NFL receives a grade in team meeting usually the first practice after a game. period. Yes, sometimes players perform poorly at inopportune times that cost teams games be it a bad long snap or letting a pass get into your body and the ball bounces off your shoulder pads into the hands of a nearby defender. Sure enough that following Monday we have to entertain moving Wiz back to position he wasn't great at or revamping our entire WR corps. It's human nature.

PFF isn't the final word but they are highly respected entity in the industry. 8th is not bad at all considering Wiz' experience. Pouncey is 9th so Wiz is contributing at great value. Wiz won a weekly ROOKIE popularity contest voted on by fans at OG and somehow history gets rewritten that he had real potential at OG.

Lombardi isn't letting the #1 OC get out of Cleveland anyways.
I'm not saying we should move Wiz back but you do keep ignoring the fact that the left side of the line was dominant in run and pass protection when he played next to Veldheer. He did alot more than just win a Rookie poularity contest.

At the beginning of the 2011 season, coach Hue Jackson named Wisniewski the Raiders' starting left guard, the same position occupied by Steve Wisniewski, placed between Samson Satele at center and Jared Veldheer at left tackle. On opening day of the 2011 NFL season, the offensive line cleared the way for 190 rushing yards and a victory over the Denver Broncos.
Wisniewski was named the Pepsi NFL Rookie of the Week for Week 3 of the 2011 NFL season, after the Oakland offensive line cleared the way for 234 rushing yards and allowing only one sack against the New York Jets. His lead block on a pivotal fourth-quarter touchdown run gave Oakland a two-score lead.[5] On January 2012, Wisniewski was named to the Pro Football Weekly All-Rookie team for his outstanding rookie season as starting left guard. Wisniewski helped pave the way for the NFL's 7th ranked rushing attack and anchored an offensive line that only allowed 25 sacks, tied for 3rd best in the NFL.
wiz is a young stud who just gets better
Thing is it wasn't broke shouldn't have tried to fix it. Should have just drafted a C.
I like him at oc having 3 diff qbs isn't easy for a oc. He makes calls I trust him mad that he let go of Samson and barksdale for breezell and that willie dude last year
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green24 wrote:
NCOUGHMAN > all of you


Raider X wrote:
This is football, not pussology 101
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Baggabonez


Joined: 29 Apr 2010
Posts: 8060
Location: RaiderNation
PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 1:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

raidr4life wrote:
Baggabonez wrote:
holyghost wrote:
8th rated C.

Does that count in bad shotgun snaps? Do the stat makers who made that up know his protection calls and the ones he may miss?
Because he doesn't pass the eye test on that level. And the run game kinda has sucked, pass protection ranging between decent and horrid. It just isn't showing up "8th" on the field. Don't buy made up stats, they're not counting in the whole picture.


The basis of your argument is confirmation bias. You can't accept the statistics that support your position and ignore others that don't. Every OL in the NFL receives a grade in team meeting usually the first practice after a game. period. Yes, sometimes players perform poorly at inopportune times that cost teams games be it a bad long snap or letting a pass get into your body and the ball bounces off your shoulder pads into the hands of a nearby defender. Sure enough that following Monday we have to entertain moving Wiz back to position he wasn't great at or revamping our entire WR corps. It's human nature.

PFF isn't the final word but they are highly respected entity in the industry. 8th is not bad at all considering Wiz' experience. Pouncey is 9th so Wiz is contributing at great value. Wiz won a weekly ROOKIE popularity contest voted on by fans at OG and somehow history gets rewritten that he had real potential at OG.

Lombardi isn't letting the #1 OC get out of Cleveland anyways.
I'm not saying we should move Wiz back but you do keep ignoring the fact that the left side of the line was dominant in run and pass protection when he played next to Veldheer. He did alot more than just win a Rookie poularity contest.

At the beginning of the 2011 season, coach Hue Jackson named Wisniewski the Raiders' starting left guard, the same position occupied by Steve Wisniewski, placed between Samson Satele at center and Jared Veldheer at left tackle. On opening day of the 2011 NFL season, the offensive line cleared the way for 190 rushing yards and a victory over the Denver Broncos.
Wisniewski was named the Pepsi NFL Rookie of the Week for Week 3 of the 2011 NFL season, after the Oakland offensive line cleared the way for 234 rushing yards and allowing only one sack against the New York Jets. His lead block on a pivotal fourth-quarter touchdown run gave Oakland a two-score lead.[5] On January 2012, Wisniewski was named to the Pro Football Weekly All-Rookie team for his outstanding rookie season as starting left guard. Wisniewski helped pave the way for the NFL's 7th ranked rushing attack and anchored an offensive line that only allowed 25 sacks, tied for 3rd best in the NFL.


In 2011 Wiz won that rookie award from now defunct ProFootball Weekly along with OG Danny Watkins who got cut and is now playing for the veteran minimum. A rookie award assumes a small drawing pool, basically all you have to do is start every game to win. Again, ROOKIE awards are not the best sources for evaluation. Pouncey is on that list as well and Wiz is grading out better than him at OC (Despite a few bad days at the office recently).

If you want to mimic the offensive success of the 2011 season I would look at getting a healthy LT, a viable QB, a healthy DMC and system that accentuates their abilities before I specify an interior OL as the key to the whole thing.
_________________
Nodisrespect wrote:
(on building inside out) teams without highly draft DT's make the playoffs and win the superbowl regularly.

Bonez wrote:
Teams that win Superbowls and make the playoffs aren't picking in the Top 5, clearly
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Silver&Black88


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Joined: 24 Feb 2009
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Location: Los Angeles, CA
PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 1:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

raidr4life wrote:
I'm not saying we should move Wiz back but you do keep ignoring the fact that the left side of the line was dominant in run and pass protection when he played next to Veldheer. He did alot more than just win a Rookie poularity contest.

At the beginning of the 2011 season, coach Hue Jackson named Wisniewski the Raiders' starting left guard, the same position occupied by Steve Wisniewski, placed between Samson Satele at center and Jared Veldheer at left tackle. On opening day of the 2011 NFL season, the offensive line cleared the way for 190 rushing yards and a victory over the Denver Broncos.
Wisniewski was named the Pepsi NFL Rookie of the Week for Week 3 of the 2011 NFL season, after the Oakland offensive line cleared the way for 234 rushing yards and allowing only one sack against the New York Jets. His lead block on a pivotal fourth-quarter touchdown run gave Oakland a two-score lead.[5] On January 2012, Wisniewski was named to the Pro Football Weekly All-Rookie team for his outstanding rookie season as starting left guard. Wisniewski helped pave the way for the NFL's 7th ranked rushing attack and anchored an offensive line that only allowed 25 sacks, tied for 3rd best in the NFL.


Did you really just plagiarize wikipedia? Laughing

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stefen_Wisniewski
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raidr4life


Joined: 10 Jan 2010
Posts: 8707
Location: Fresno, California
PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 2:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Silver&Black88 wrote:
raidr4life wrote:
I'm not saying we should move Wiz back but you do keep ignoring the fact that the left side of the line was dominant in run and pass protection when he played next to Veldheer. He did alot more than just win a Rookie poularity contest.

At the beginning of the 2011 season, coach Hue Jackson named Wisniewski the Raiders' starting left guard, the same position occupied by Steve Wisniewski, placed between Samson Satele at center and Jared Veldheer at left tackle. On opening day of the 2011 NFL season, the offensive line cleared the way for 190 rushing yards and a victory over the Denver Broncos.
Wisniewski was named the Pepsi NFL Rookie of the Week for Week 3 of the 2011 NFL season, after the Oakland offensive line cleared the way for 234 rushing yards and allowing only one sack against the New York Jets. His lead block on a pivotal fourth-quarter touchdown run gave Oakland a two-score lead.[5] On January 2012, Wisniewski was named to the Pro Football Weekly All-Rookie team for his outstanding rookie season as starting left guard. Wisniewski helped pave the way for the NFL's 7th ranked rushing attack and anchored an offensive line that only allowed 25 sacks, tied for 3rd best in the NFL.


Did you really just plagiarize wikipedia? Laughing

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stefen_Wisniewski
Um yes, I was just passing along the info, not claiming it as my own.
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mtraider1


Joined: 22 Dec 2013
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="NCOUGHMAN"][quote="raidr4life"][quote="Baggabonez"][quote="holyghost"]8th rated C.

Does that count in bad shotgun snaps? Do the stat makers who made that up know his protection calls and the ones he may miss?
Because he doesn't pass the eye test on that level. And the run game kinda has sucked, pass protection ranging between decent and horrid. It just isn't showing up "8th" on the field. Don't buy made up stats, they're not counting in the whole picture.[/quote]

The basis of your argument is confirmation bias. You can't accept the statistics that support your position and ignore others that don't. Every OL in the NFL receives a grade in team meeting usually the first practice after a game. period. Yes, sometimes players perform poorly at inopportune times that cost teams games be it a bad long snap or letting a pass get into your body and the ball bounces off your shoulder pads into the hands of a nearby defender. Sure enough that following Monday we have to entertain moving Wiz back to position he wasn't great at or revamping our entire WR corps. It's human nature.

PFF isn't the final word but they are highly respected entity in the industry. 8th is not bad at all considering Wiz' experience. Pouncey is 9th so Wiz is contributing at great value. Wiz won a weekly ROOKIE popularity contest voted on by fans at OG and somehow history gets rewritten that he had real potential at OG.

Lombardi isn't letting the #1 OC get out of Cleveland anyways.[/quote]I'm not saying we should move Wiz back but you do keep ignoring the fact that the left side of the line was dominant in run and pass protection when he played next to Veldheer. He did alot more than just win a Rookie poularity contest.

At the beginning of the 2011 season, coach Hue Jackson named Wisniewski the Raiders' starting left guard, the same position occupied by Steve Wisniewski, placed between Samson Satele at center and Jared Veldheer at left tackle. On opening day of the 2011 NFL season, the offensive line cleared the way for 190 rushing yards and a victory over the Denver Broncos.
Wisniewski was named the Pepsi NFL Rookie of the Week for Week 3 of the 2011 NFL season, after the Oakland offensive line cleared the way for 234 rushing yards and allowing only one sack against the New York Jets. His lead block on a pivotal fourth-quarter touchdown run gave Oakland a two-score lead.[5] On January 2012, Wisniewski was named to the Pro Football Weekly All-Rookie team for his outstanding rookie season as starting left guard. Wisniewski helped pave the way for the NFL's 7th ranked rushing attack and anchored an offensive line that only allowed 25 sacks, tied for 3rd best in the NFL.[/quote] wiz is a young stud who just gets better[/quote]

Wiz is a good player and will continue to get better as time passes. But if you have a chance to bring in a Center who would overall upgrade your line because you're then moving Wiz to LG you have to do it. There are simply too many holes on the Raiders overall roster- if you have a chance to get better at any of the positions you need to take it.
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Silver&Black88


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 1:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

raidr4life wrote:
Silver&Black88 wrote:
raidr4life wrote:
I'm not saying we should move Wiz back but you do keep ignoring the fact that the left side of the line was dominant in run and pass protection when he played next to Veldheer. He did alot more than just win a Rookie poularity contest.

At the beginning of the 2011 season, coach Hue Jackson named Wisniewski the Raiders' starting left guard, the same position occupied by Steve Wisniewski, placed between Samson Satele at center and Jared Veldheer at left tackle. On opening day of the 2011 NFL season, the offensive line cleared the way for 190 rushing yards and a victory over the Denver Broncos.
Wisniewski was named the Pepsi NFL Rookie of the Week for Week 3 of the 2011 NFL season, after the Oakland offensive line cleared the way for 234 rushing yards and allowing only one sack against the New York Jets. His lead block on a pivotal fourth-quarter touchdown run gave Oakland a two-score lead.[5] On January 2012, Wisniewski was named to the Pro Football Weekly All-Rookie team for his outstanding rookie season as starting left guard. Wisniewski helped pave the way for the NFL's 7th ranked rushing attack and anchored an offensive line that only allowed 25 sacks, tied for 3rd best in the NFL.


Did you really just plagiarize wikipedia? Laughing

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stefen_Wisniewski
Um yes, I was just passing along the info, not claiming it as my own.


Haha you're a bum. Wink
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Frankie2Gunz


Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 1383
PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mtraider1 wrote:
manbearpig wrote:
What do you guys think of signing Alex Mack (cal product) and moving lil Wiz back to LG? Twisted Evil


I've read this site for many years, but have finally decided to post. I love this idea. In order for the Raiders to get back to greatness, we need to start up front on both sides of the ball. I'd like to see us bring in Alex Mack, slide Wiz over to LG, and bring in Texans guard Wade Smith. I'm not saying that Wiz has been doing a bad job, but bringing in Mack at Center and having two quality guards would do wonders for our team- including the quarterback and running back positions.

LT: Veldeer
LG: Wiz
C: Mack
RG: Smith
RT: Watson (or bring Barnes back if Watson simply isn't ready- not my favorite option, but it's realistic)

On the defensive side of the ball, I would like to see us resign Houston ( I know he might cost a lot of money), Sims and Walker. Then we should bring in Greg Hardy (Carolina). Again, he is going to be expensive, but that's why we have $60+ million to spend in the Free Agency that we actually need to spend. With McGee, who has played ok throughout his rookie season, and maybe an early draft pick up or two to continue to help solidify the defensive front and improve our pass rush our defensive line becomes one of our strengths. So our starting front four would look like:

DE: Houston
DT: Walker
DT: Sims
DE: Hardy

Again, this is just where I would start with free agency. We obviously need to address some skill positions at some point as well, but I would like to see us focus on creating solid fronts on both sides of the ball.


I love both of these players. This line has been lacking a dominant center for a very long time and Mack is one of the best in the league. Moving Wiz to guard would put be a major upgrade in 2 positions with one move. Smart move.

I also think Hardy is a great DE. Both of these moves would be brilliant and I hope that Mac makes a push for both players. With the money we have we should be able to do it if these players want to hit the open market.
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Baggabonez


Joined: 29 Apr 2010
Posts: 8060
Location: RaiderNation
PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frankie2Gunz wrote:

Moving Wiz to guard would put be a major upgrade in 2 positions with one move. Smart move.


It's not smart though because it doesn't upgrade two positions. You don't pass on a transcendent player in the draft for a developing player but this isn't the case. Wiz is emerging and has the potential to break out next season you don't move him back to a position he was so-so at just because he started there for 16 games and you can upgrade the position marginally. Zero sum game as we talking about the OC position. How much difference is there between two OCs in the Top 10? Wiz is younger and cheaper that money is better spent elsewhere. Wiz is the OCotF. The staff has NEVER waivered on a position change for Wiz. OC is what he was brought here to do and he's beating his classmate, Pouncey at it. Leave him be, please.
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Nodisrespect wrote:
(on building inside out) teams without highly draft DT's make the playoffs and win the superbowl regularly.

Bonez wrote:
Teams that win Superbowls and make the playoffs aren't picking in the Top 5, clearly
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