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Dumervil to Ravens
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CKSteeler


Joined: 17 Mar 2013
Posts: 5387
PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 4:22 pm    Post subject: Dumervil to Ravens Reply with quote

http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_22861665/elvis-dumervil-agrees-contract-baltimore-ravens

Dumervil has 4.5 sacks in 5 games against the Steelers to go with a few forced fumbles I can remember off the top of my head. Combined with Suggs, another guy who has given the Steelers fits over the years, and those concerns people have about a starting duo of Gilbert/Adams in pass pro are magnified. If the right tackle is there in the first two rounds, do the Steelers consider it?

I wonder where they'll play Dumervil. Seems like the better fit on the right being undersized, but Suggs has usually played over there.
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turtle28


Joined: 21 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 4:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sucks but oh well. Maybe it means Harrison returns for cheap

I think the Ravens would switch Suggs to the left side and boy what a mismatch that would be vs all RTs in the NFL! Shocked

I can't see the steelers taking another OL high, the guys they have are very young, they just need to be developed and they'll be fine.
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Last edited by turtle28 on Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:05 pm; edited 1 time in total
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CKSteeler


Joined: 17 Mar 2013
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

5 years, 35 million. I think the Ravens managed a big time upgrade over Kruger at less cost.

I'm curious what they will do schematically. The Canty/Spears signing and talking about a bigger role for Ngata...I could see their pass rush being deadly next year with those two OLB's. Newsome may rebuild his defense in one off-season while Steelers fans are clinging to hope that the team brings back a 35 year old OLB with a bad back/knees...

Not a good off-season.
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popie70


Joined: 18 Dec 2010
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Location: Denver, CO
PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the Ravens are smart they will use him as a situational pass rusher only. I think he is still overrated as a player but he is awful against the run.
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chrisororke


Joined: 14 Jan 2008
Posts: 518
PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
Sucks but oh well. Maybe it means Harrison returns for cheap


This was the guy you could get for cheap. 2.5M cap hit year one via Schefter. Is there any better deal for the player you are getting? I get sick of SteelersDepot going oh we can't sign this guy or that guy and praising Omar Khan all the way for the "Math of Khan". All Khan does is push money down the road. There is no genius in that. A lot of cap strapped teams do that. The difference is weve been doing it for three years and they just started this year because they werent in cap hell until now. Then when a guy like this comes around ohh we can never sign him. You can sign players with exactly like deals like this. That is the true genius. Good news is I'm starting to think we might get two 3rd rd comp picks with how much we lost and we didnt bring in anything, bc Bruce will never see the field.

They were willing to reduce Harrison by 30% salary or 2M and he would've had a cap hit of 8M. Doesn't Harrison look like a fool now with no suitors? He and Urlacher can have a party together bc neither one should get anything more than 1-1.5M.

I wouldn't bring back Harrison under any circumstance. What you people don't understand is the "last resort" of him staying on team was the pay cut and once he refused he was gone forever. If he refused getting 4.5M (in salary 6.57-2M paycut) what makes you think he would take any less to come back to Pittsburgh. He's gone. Get over it


Last edited by chrisororke on Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:05 pm; edited 1 time in total
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wwhickok


Joined: 27 Nov 2012
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Location: Montgomery, PA aka Steeler Nation!
PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not scared, Dumervil's best days are behind him. If they weren't, the Bronco's would have fought harder for him. This is just another case of the Ravens taking on recycled scraps. They lost 8 of their best players and replaced them with 1 declining pass rusher.
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chrisororke


Joined: 14 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wwhickok wrote:
I'm not scared, Dumervil's best days are behind him. If they weren't, the Bronco's would have fought harder for him. This is just another case of the Ravens taking on recycled scraps. They lost 8 of their best players and replaced them with 1 declining pass rusher.


False. They did fight harder and if it wasn't for a FAX then he would still be a Bronco. He was in line for 4M pay cut, which he agreed to but the fax came late so Broncos had to cut him to avoid losing a draft pick for not being cap compliant

And Dumervil is a 10 sack a year guy still, unlike Harrison who is not
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turtle28


Joined: 21 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chrisororke wrote:
turtle28 wrote:
Sucks but oh well. Maybe it means Harrison returns for cheap


This was the guy you could get for cheap. 2.5M cap hit year one via Schefter. Is there any better deal for the player you are getting? I get sick of SteelersDepot going oh we can't sign this guy or that guy and praising Omar Khan all the way for the "Math of Khan". All Khan does is push money down the road. There is no genius in that. A lot of cap strapped teams do that. The difference is weve been doing it for three years and they just started this year because they werent in cap hell until now. Then when a guy like this comes around ohh we can never sign him. You can sign players with exactly like deals like this. That is the true genius. Good news is I'm starting to think we might get two 3rd rd comp picks with how much we lost and we didnt bring in anything, bc Bruce will never see the field.

They were willing to reduce Harrison by 30% salary or 2M and he would've had a cap hit of 8M. Doesn't Harrison look like a fool now with no suitors? He and Urlacher can have a party together bc neither one should get anything more than 1-1.5M.

I wouldn't bring back Harrison under any circumstance. What you people don't understand is the "last resort" of him staying on team was the pay cut and once he refused he was gone forever. If he refused getting 4.5M (in salary 6.57-2M paycut) what makes you think he would take any less to come back to Pittsburgh. He's gone. Get over it
if they need a pass rusher and he's free I'm sure he'll be the first they call. Who's available and better?
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turtle28


Joined: 21 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chrisororke wrote:
wwhickok wrote:
I'm not scared, Dumervil's best days are behind him. If they weren't, the Bronco's would have fought harder for him. This is just another case of the Ravens taking on recycled scraps. They lost 8 of their best players and replaced them with 1 declining pass rusher.


False. They did fight harder and if it wasn't for a FAX then he would still be a Bronco. He was in line for 4M pay cut, which he agreed to but the fax came late so Broncos had to cut him to avoid losing a draft pick for not being cap compliant

And Dumervil is a 10 sack a year guy still, unlike Harrison who is not
if Harrison plays 16 games I guarantee you he gets 10 sacks. He's going to be more healthy this offseason then he's been the previous two.
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wwhickok


Joined: 27 Nov 2012
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chrisororke wrote:
wwhickok wrote:
I'm not scared, Dumervil's best days are behind him. If they weren't, the Bronco's would have fought harder for him. This is just another case of the Ravens taking on recycled scraps. They lost 8 of their best players and replaced them with 1 declining pass rusher.


False. They did fight harder and if it wasn't for a FAX then he would still be a Bronco. He was in line for 4M pay cut, which he agreed to but the fax came late so Broncos had to cut him to avoid losing a draft pick for not being cap compliant

And Dumervil is a 10 sack a year guy still, unlike Harrison who is not


We'll agree to disagree, if the Bronco's wanted him that bad, they had options, including giving him more in way of bonuses.
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CKSteeler


Joined: 17 Mar 2013
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
This is just another case of the Ravens taking on recycled scraps


Another case of recycled scraps? Are we talking about like in 2011 when they signed some old guys for their OL, and proceeded to sweep the Steelers? I remember a lot of fans mocking that signing. I mean, an overweight and old LT? Harrison was going to abuse him...the Ravens just swept the Steelers (and dominated them up front in their first match-up), took the division and went to the AFCCG.

Dumervil is 29 and coming off an 11 sack season. In what world is in decline? And apparently the Steelers also showed interest. Ozzie Newsome knows what he's doing, and it's funny to me how Steelers fans always insist the Ravens are making poor choices when the results on the field clearly dictate otherwise.

I'm not bashing Colbert/Tomlin entirely, but they are far too conservative. This recent trend of just bringing back retreads in FA is fairly alarming. I'll cut them slack since apparently they made a run for Long and Dumervil, but for years now this team has put too much emphasis on guys who know the "system." On both sides of the ball.

How many draft choices did it take the Steelers to retool their OL, only for us still to question whether it's fixed? The Ravens went out and signed some bargain basement vets and they got far superior results. Immediately. The only FA addition the Steelers have made worth a damn in years was Flozell Adams...

Quote:

We'll agree to disagree, if the Bronco's wanted him that bad, they had options, including giving him more in way of bonuses.


The way the deal if structured pays Dumervil 8.5 mil this year. His cap hit is only 2.5, but another 6 has to count in another year (per PFT). The way its structured, the Ravens are probably paying him most of it in the first few years.

If the Broncos matched that, they would have ended up with a cap hit for Dumervil of 12 million a year...or his original salary. The Broncos saw the soft market for pass rushers and pinched him. The contract fiasco blew up in their face.
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Ward4HOF


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm definitely not happy with Dumervil headed to the Ravens...he can still be an effective pass rusher and is an upgrade to anything they had on their roster, that's for sure.

That said, I think the price was a bit steep overall...not sure how much is guaranteed, but $35M is more than I'd've wanted the Steelers to pay. Then again, Dumervil or Worilds??? Gottsa give Dumervil the edge overall, even if Worilds is potentially better defending the run.
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chrisororke


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
chrisororke wrote:
turtle28 wrote:
Sucks but oh well. Maybe it means Harrison returns for cheap


This was the guy you could get for cheap. 2.5M cap hit year one via Schefter. Is there any better deal for the player you are getting? I get sick of SteelersDepot going oh we can't sign this guy or that guy and praising Omar Khan all the way for the "Math of Khan". All Khan does is push money down the road. There is no genius in that. A lot of cap strapped teams do that. The difference is weve been doing it for three years and they just started this year because they werent in cap hell until now. Then when a guy like this comes around ohh we can never sign him. You can sign players with exactly like deals like this. That is the true genius. Good news is I'm starting to think we might get two 3rd rd comp picks with how much we lost and we didnt bring in anything, bc Bruce will never see the field.

They were willing to reduce Harrison by 30% salary or 2M and he would've had a cap hit of 8M. Doesn't Harrison look like a fool now with no suitors? He and Urlacher can have a party together bc neither one should get anything more than 1-1.5M.

I wouldn't bring back Harrison under any circumstance. What you people don't understand is the "last resort" of him staying on team was the pay cut and once he refused he was gone forever. If he refused getting 4.5M (in salary 6.57-2M paycut) what makes you think he would take any less to come back to Pittsburgh. He's gone. Get over it
if they need a pass rusher and he's free I'm sure he'll be the first they call. Who's available and better?


I believe the move the FO was going to make all along was draft one of the many pass rushers in this draft. There is no one better on the FA market. Harrison would be the best name IMO off the top of my head but apparently at the owners meetings in AZ a week ago there was no colder name on the market than Harrison

I think a guy like Tank Carradine FSU would be a "Steeler" like player they could target in round two. Plays the run and rushes the passer. We gotta get younger. Got away with it last year but ole Father Time is coming with a vengeance
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CKSteeler


Joined: 17 Mar 2013
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

According to PFT again, it's a 5 yr deal worth up to 35 with incentives, but really closer to 5 years, 25 million. It pays him 8.5 this year, but the cap hit is 2.5 with another 6 hitting somewhere down the line.

It's much cheaper than Kruger and I think they got a superior player for the next 3 years at least, barring injury. And it was much cheaper, even more than I originally thought.
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chrisororke


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ward4HOF wrote:
I'm definitely not happy with Dumervil headed to the Ravens...he can still be an effective pass rusher and is an upgrade to anything they had on their roster, that's for sure.

That said, I think the price was a bit steep overall...not sure how much is guaranteed, but $35M is more than I'd've wanted the Steelers to pay. Then again, Dumervil or Worilds??? Gottsa give Dumervil the edge overall, even if Worilds is potentially better defending the run.


5 for 35M

7.5M SB
1M base salary yr 1

12M option bonus yr2 ... So if they don't want him after the year they have 6M dead money cap hit, which would be remaining Signing Bonus pro-ration

Yr1 (7.5/5=1.5) salary 1M = 2.5M
Yr2 (7.5/5=1.5) opt bonus (12/4=3) .. Idk salary yr2 but let's say it is 2M 1.5+3+2 =6.5M cap hit yr 2
Yr3 (1.5 SB pro ration) (3M option bonus pro ration) + salary
... And so on
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