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muttz1983


Joined: 24 Oct 2006
Posts: 77
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 2:34 am    Post subject: Trade down scenarios Reply with quote

Trade down scenarios - Let me know what compensation you think we would get, player you would want otherwise, if you think a different team would go in a different direction.

Option 1) 1. KC – Luke Joeckel

Option 2) 1. Jax – Geno Smith
2. KC – Luke Joeckel
1st (3000) to 2nd (2600) - 400 pt. difference
2013 Trade-able picks: 1.2, 2.1 (580), 3.2 (260), 4.1 (112), 5.2 (42), 6.1 (27), 7.2 (13.8 )

Option 3) 1. Oak – Geno Smith
2. Jax - Dion Jordan
3. KC – Luke Joeckel
1st (3000) to 3rd (2200) - 800 pt. difference
2013 Trade-able picks: 1.3, 3.4 (250), 4.3 (104), 6.4 (25.8 ), 7.3 (13.4), 7.13 (9.4)

Option 4) 1. Phi - Geno Smith
2. Jax – Dion Jordan
3. Oak – Luke Joeckeli
4. KC – Star Lotulelei
1st (3000) to 4th (1800) - 1200 pt. difference
2013 Trade-able picks: 1.4, 2.3 (550), 3.5 (245), 4.4 (100), 5.3 (41), 6.28 (16.2), 7.4 (13), 7.6 (12.2), 7.24 (5)

Option 5) 1. Det - Luke Joeckel
2. Jax –Geno Smith
3. Oak – Star Lotulelei
4. Phi – Dion Jordan
5. KC – Eric Fisher
1st (3000) to 5th (1700) - 1300 pt. difference
2013 Trade-able picks: 1.5, 2.4 (540), 3.3 (255), 5.4 (96), 6.3 (26.2), 7.5 (12.6)

Option 6) 1. Cle -Geno Smith
2. Jax – Dion Jordan
3. Oak – Luke Joeckel
4. Phi – Star Lotulelei
5. Det – Eric Fisher
6. KC – Ziggy Ansah
1st (3000) to 6th (1600) - 1400 pt. difference
2013 Trade-able picks: 1.6, 3.6 (240), 4.7 (88 ), 5.6 (39), 6.5 (25.4), 6.7 (24.6)

Option 7) 1. Ari - Geno Smith
2. Jax – Dion Jordan
3. Oak – Luke Joeckel
4. Phi – Star Lotulelei
5. Det – Eric Fisher
6. Cle – Dee Miliner
7. KC – Ziggy Ansah
1st (3000) to 7th (1500) - 1500 pt. difference
2013 Trade-able picks: 1.7, 2.6 (520), 3.7 (235), 4.6 (92), 5.7 (38.5), 6.6 (25), 6.8 (24.2)

Option 8 ) 1. Buf – Geno Smith
2. Jax – Dion Jordan
3. Oak – Luke Joeckel
4. Phi – Star Lotulelei
5. Det –Eric Fisher
6. Cle – Dee Miliner
7. Ari – Barkevious Mingo
8. KC – Ziggy Ansah
1st (3000) to 8th (1400) - 1600 pt. difference
2013 Trade-able picks: 1.8, 2.9 (490), 3.9 (225), 4.8 (86), 5.10 (37), 6.9 (23.8 )

Option 9) 1. NYJ – Dion Jordan
2. Jax – Geno Smith
3. Oak – Luke Joeckel
4. Phi – Star Lotulelei
5. Det – Eric Fisher
6. Cle – Dee Miliner
7. Ari – Barkevious Mingo
8. Buf – Chance Warmack
9. KC – Ziggy Ansah
1st (3000) to 9th (1350) - 1650 pt. difference
2013 Trade-able picks: 1.9, 2.7 (510), 3.10 (220), 4.9 (84), 5.8 (38 ), 6.10 (23.4), 7.9 (11)

Option 10) 1. Ten – Dion Jordan
2. Jax – Geno Smith
3. Oak – Luke Joeckel
4. Phi – Star Lotulelei
5. Det – Eric Fisher
6. Cle – Dee Miliner
7. Ari – Barkevious Mingo
8. Buf – Chance Warmack
9. NYJ – Ziggy Ansah
10. KC – Sharrif Floyd
1st (3000) to 10th (1300) - 1700 pt. difference
2013 Trade-able picks: 1.10, 2.8 (500), 3.8 (230), 4.10 (82), 5.9 (37.5), 7.10 (10.6)
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Mongo


Joined: 17 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't see OAK taking Joeckel. Veldheer is ok. They need pass rush help.
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Jakuvious


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I think OAK takes Miliner before Joeckel. They genuinely have no starting corners right now.
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marnz


Joined: 16 Mar 2013
Posts: 222
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

oak will take a defense for sure if geno is off the board

even then i think they go defense
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Taylor916


Joined: 26 Oct 2008
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Location: Nebraska
PostPosted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

my favorite scenario by far would be to trade our 1.1 to philadelphia for thier 1.4 and 2.4 along with getting Nick Foles and in Return we could send Daniels to Philly if they want him. If they take Geno then they may not want Daniels but they should take Daniels and release Vick. If they Do not take Daniels then we may have to accept Foles and thier 3.4. In a perfect world we could trade Alberts and our 1.1 for Nick Foles and thier 1.4 2.4 and 3.4. Then we may have to look at trading Daniels to someone for a 3rd or 4th or hold onto him for a year and be QB heavy this year. Next year Daniels would need to be traded or released unless he really impressed. I think we are putting too much cap space into Daniels. I doubt he is that talented. I remember him getting pretty roughed up by the mediokre Huskers. Atleast they were mediokre that year.
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ryknowssd


Joined: 13 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 7:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Taylor916 wrote:
my favorite scenario by far would be to trade our 1.1 to philadelphia for thier 1.4 and 2.4 along with getting Nick Foles and in Return we could send Daniels to Philly if they want him. If they take Geno then they may not want Daniels but they should take Daniels and release Vick. If they Do not take Daniels then we may have to accept Foles and thier 3.4. In a perfect world we could trade Alberts and our 1.1 for Nick Foles and thier 1.4 2.4 and 3.4. Then we may have to look at trading Daniels to someone for a 3rd or 4th or hold onto him for a year and be QB heavy this year. Next year Daniels would need to be traded or released unless he really impressed. I think we are putting too much cap space into Daniels. I doubt he is that talented. I remember him getting pretty roughed up by the mediokre Huskers. Atleast they were mediokre that year.


Who is this Daniels guy you speak of? Travis? I thought we cut him...
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FrostyCow


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 9:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Taylor916 wrote:
my favorite scenario by far would be to trade our 1.1 to philadelphia for thier 1.4 and 2.4 along with getting Nick Foles and in Return we could send Daniels to Philly if they want him. If they take Geno then they may not want Daniels but they should take Daniels and release Vick. If they Do not take Daniels then we may have to accept Foles and thier 3.4. In a perfect world we could trade Alberts and our 1.1 for Nick Foles and thier 1.4 2.4 and 3.4. Then we may have to look at trading Daniels to someone for a 3rd or 4th or hold onto him for a year and be QB heavy this year. Next year Daniels would need to be traded or released unless he really impressed. I think we are putting too much cap space into Daniels. I doubt he is that talented. I remember him getting pretty roughed up by the mediokre Huskers. Atleast they were mediokre that year.


First of all, there's no way this happens. We sign Daniel then immediately trade him? Presumably, you're having Philly trade up to get Geno Smith. With Vick and Dixon on their roster already, taking Daniel as their #3 with a 3 year contract and cutting Vick doesn't make any sense. If Philly trades up, they will most likely keep Vick and Dixon and then cut Foles or trade him for late future picks.

Second, Daniel is better than Foles, I'm convinced of that. Foles is much over rated, and Reid went out and targeted Daniel in free agency. I trust Reid's QB evaluation.

Personally, I would trade our 1 for Philly's 1 and 2 and be done with it. Not great value, but you're still getting Fischer or Joekel in the first plus an extra second, why not take that trade?
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muttz1983


Joined: 24 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My personal favorite would be the trade with the Lions. We trade 1 for 5, their 2nd this year, and 2nd next year. Lions draft Luke Joeckel. Then at 5 we draft Eric Fisher. We then trade Branden Albert to the Dolphins for their 2 second round picks this year. We then start Fisher and Stephenson at the T spots.

We then still have the Lions 2nd and 2 Miami seconds this year. This gives us an opportunity to grab a ILB and depth at S and DE in the second.

We will then have a 2nd back in next years draft.
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DT58_lives_on


Joined: 04 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Then at 5 we draft Eric Fisher. We then trade Branden Albert to the Dolphins for their 2 second round picks this year.


I don't think there is a chance in heck we get BOTH second's from Miami for Albert. Especially AFTER we've already drafted Fisher. At that point I think we'd be fortunate to get one.
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nicfre2011


Joined: 15 Mar 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FrostyCow wrote:
Taylor916 wrote:
my favorite scenario by far would be to trade our 1.1 to philadelphia for thier 1.4 and 2.4 along with getting Nick Foles and in Return we could send Daniels to Philly if they want him. If they take Geno then they may not want Daniels but they should take Daniels and release Vick. If they Do not take Daniels then we may have to accept Foles and thier 3.4. In a perfect world we could trade Alberts and our 1.1 for Nick Foles and thier 1.4 2.4 and 3.4. Then we may have to look at trading Daniels to someone for a 3rd or 4th or hold onto him for a year and be QB heavy this year. Next year Daniels would need to be traded or released unless he really impressed. I think we are putting too much cap space into Daniels. I doubt he is that talented. I remember him getting pretty roughed up by the mediokre Huskers. Atleast they were mediokre that year.


First of all, there's no way this happens. We sign Daniel then immediately trade him? Presumably, you're having Philly trade up to get Geno Smith. With Vick and Dixon on their roster already, taking Daniel as their #3 with a 3 year contract and cutting Vick doesn't make any sense. If Philly trades up, they will most likely keep Vick and Dixon and then cut Foles or trade him for late future picks.

Second, Daniel is better than Foles, I'm convinced of that. Foles is much over rated, and Reid went out and targeted Daniel in free agency. I trust Reid's QB evaluation.

Personally, I would trade our 1 for Philly's 1 and 2 and be done with it. Not great value, but you're still getting Fischer or Joekel in the first plus an extra second, why not take that trade?


The one thing I agree with you on is your comment about there being no way that Daniel is traded. I will tell you IMO it would be more because other teams aren't going to trade for a quarterback that has 9 career passing attempts and is scheduled to make $1,800,000 in 2013, $3,400,000 in 2014, and $4,800,000 in 2015.

What makes you think Daniel is such a good quarterback? Is it because he stood next to Drew Brees and was sprinkled with Drew Brees magic pixie dust? Is he the next Drew Brees simply through osmosis? Is it because we signed him to a 3 year deal and that must mean he is a good quarterback? Which one of his 7 career completions in 3 years jumps out at you?

I get the whole "he's our boy now so we will support him to the death!", aka "Brady Quinn hasn't gotten a fair shake" concept but I don't get how anyone can seriously say right now at this point in time, considering where Daniel and Foles have come from and what they have done so far in the league, that Daniel is even in the same league as Foles - and that is not exactly saying Foles is an All-Pro to say the least.

Yes Daniel had statistical success as a college quarterback at Missouri. But there is a reason he went undrafted. Can he develop into the next Drew Brees or Tom Brady, sure. Is that likely? I highly doubt it. And even if he does, his contract with us will be voided if he meets certain performance criteria. Basically, if Smith goes down for any extended period of time and Daniel throws for 2,000 or more yards and passes for 12 or more touchdowns the rest of his contract will be voided.
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ArrowheadRage58


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While Daniel is mostly an unknown, he's not Brady Quinn. I recall little excitement or optimism for Quinn other than "he's not Cassel". There may have been people, even me, "excited" for Quinn to play for no other reason than he doesn't wear #7. I was never big on Quinn and hated the signing because even fans knew he wasn't going to be a significant upgrade and certainly not enough for our FO to consider him as a threat to Cassel's job before the season.

Now Daniel may never be a star or even a starter, but I think there is legit belief that he can play a little and I also prefer him to Foles. Don't confuse that optimism with anyone believing he's the next Drew Brees or even as good as Alex.
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nicfre2011


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ArrowheadRage58 wrote:
While Daniel is mostly an unknown, he's not Brady Quinn. I recall little excitement or optimism for Quinn other than "he's not Cassel". There may have been people, even me, "excited" for Quinn to play for no other reason than he doesn't wear #7. I was never big on Quinn and hated the signing because even fans knew he wasn't going to be a significant upgrade and certainly not enough for our FO to consider him as a threat to Cassel's job before the season.

Now Daniel may never be a star or even a starter, but I think there is legit belief that he can play a little and I also prefer him to Foles. Don't confuse that optimism with anyone believing he's the next Drew Brees or even as good as Alex.


What are you basing your preference for Daniel over Foles on?
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bigschmadt00


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nicfre2011 wrote:
ArrowheadRage58 wrote:
While Daniel is mostly an unknown, he's not Brady Quinn. I recall little excitement or optimism for Quinn other than "he's not Cassel". There may have been people, even me, "excited" for Quinn to play for no other reason than he doesn't wear #7. I was never big on Quinn and hated the signing because even fans knew he wasn't going to be a significant upgrade and certainly not enough for our FO to consider him as a threat to Cassel's job before the season.

Now Daniel may never be a star or even a starter, but I think there is legit belief that he can play a little and I also prefer him to Foles. Don't confuse that optimism with anyone believing he's the next Drew Brees or even as good as Alex.


What are you basing your preference for Daniel over Foles on?


I think this might have something to do with it:

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nicfre2011


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bigschmadt00 wrote:
nicfre2011 wrote:
ArrowheadRage58 wrote:
While Daniel is mostly an unknown, he's not Brady Quinn. I recall little excitement or optimism for Quinn other than "he's not Cassel". There may have been people, even me, "excited" for Quinn to play for no other reason than he doesn't wear #7. I was never big on Quinn and hated the signing because even fans knew he wasn't going to be a significant upgrade and certainly not enough for our FO to consider him as a threat to Cassel's job before the season.

Now Daniel may never be a star or even a starter, but I think there is legit belief that he can play a little and I also prefer him to Foles. Don't confuse that optimism with anyone believing he's the next Drew Brees or even as good as Alex.


What are you basing your preference for Daniel over Foles on?


I think this might have something to do with it:


Exactly. Hmmm, he is standing pretty close to Brees. Maybe some of that All-Pro rubbed off on Daniel!

Laughing
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muttz1983


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DT58_lives_on wrote:
Quote:
Then at 5 we draft Eric Fisher. We then trade Branden Albert to the Dolphins for their 2 second round picks this year.


I don't think there is a chance in heck we get BOTH second's from Miami for Albert. Especially AFTER we've already drafted Fisher. At that point I think we'd be fortunate to get one.


I disagree. I think that a lot would weigh in to how much they value Lane Johnson. If they think that he is equal to Albert they could trade up to get him or hope he falls to them at 12. If he isn't there they would have missed out on the top LT free agents and top LT prospects. What would still have open to them would be draft a CB at 12, Xavier Rhodes, and try to get value in the 2nd. What we have on our team would not diminish the value? It is what they don't have on their team that the value is higher. I could see 2 seconds for Albert when the other options may not be as good.
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