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Who do you draft #4?
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Who do you draft #4?
QB EJ Manuel, Florida State
2%
 2%  [ 1 ]
QB Matt Barkley, USC
2%
 2%  [ 1 ]
WR Cordarrelle Patterson, Tennessee
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
WR Tavon Austin, West Virginia
2%
 2%  [ 1 ]
T Lane Johnson, Oklahoma
8%
 8%  [ 3 ]
G Chance Warmack, Alabama
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
G Jonathan Cooper, North Carolina
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
DT Star Lotulelei, Utah
35%
 35%  [ 12 ]
DT Sharrif Floyd, Florida
8%
 8%  [ 3 ]
DE Ezekiel Ansah, Brigham Young
5%
 5%  [ 2 ]
DE Bjoern Werner, Florida State
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
LB Dion Jordan, Oregon
23%
 23%  [ 8 ]
LB Barkevious Mingo, LSU
2%
 2%  [ 1 ]
LB Jarvis Jones, Georgia
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
CB Dee Milliner, Alabama
5%
 5%  [ 2 ]
S Kenny Vaccaro, Texas
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Other player, post your choice below
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Total Votes : 34

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killdawabbit


Joined: 10 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PowerElite wrote:
Ziggy would be better as a RE in an aggressive 34 rather than a 5 tech. I think that people just like talking about the 5 tech because it sounds more sexy. They treat the RE as if that isn't the position along the defensive line of the 34 that typically calls for more pass rushing ability. If only that position had a sexier name...


Interestingly enough, in a standard 3-4 the RE is called... (drumroll)... a 5 tech! In the "4-3 under" there technically isn't a RE. There is a 3 tech and a pass rushing OLB - at least in the base formation.

I actually think the best spot for Ziggy would happen to be at 5 tech if the coaches valued pass rushing highly at the spot and wanted agression at the position (there happens to be more than one way to play 5 tech based on what the coaches want: see J. Watt and R. Bryant for details).
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Jeezla


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

killdawabbit wrote:
PowerElite wrote:
Ziggy would be better as a RE in an aggressive 34 rather than a 5 tech. I think that people just like talking about the 5 tech because it sounds more sexy. They treat the RE as if that isn't the position along the defensive line of the 34 that typically calls for more pass rushing ability. If only that position had a sexier name...


Interestingly enough, in a standard 3-4 the RE is called... (drumroll)... a 5 tech! In the "4-3 under" there technically isn't a RE. There is a 3 tech and a pass rushing OLB - at least in the base formation.

I actually think the best spot for Ziggy would happen to be at 5 tech if the coaches valued pass rushing highly at the spot and wanted agression at the position (there happens to be more than one way to play 5 tech based on what the coaches want: see J. Watt and R. Bryant for details).


I agree with you. Ziggy is farther ahead as a run defender than a pass rusher anyways. He just needs to gain like 10 pounds which shouldn't be hard for him.
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killdawabbit


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kiltman wrote:
Jeezla wrote:
oland11 wrote:
So yea. Lets draft Star and find a NT later in the draft. Like Brandon Williams or something.


Wouldn't star be the NT? 5.3 40 yard isn't screaming DE to me.

The 5technique DE in the Under is more about run stopping....they have to anchor...not really a speed position. But some penetrating ability is needed, which Star has. He could play both. But with Sop here the best fit is him at DE, and swing him inside at Nose on passing downs.


Actually, it depends. In a more aggressive version, they might want more of a pass rusher. There are different styles of play for that side. Star would play more like what Seattle expects out of Red Bryant. Ziggy would be expected to play more in the way the Texans use Watt, for example.
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Eagles_808


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PowerElite wrote:
"We?" Has it been confirmed by anyone employed by the Eagles organization what position Trent Cole will play?
Most likely Predator/LEO, but not confirmed yet. At the same time, the 3-4/4-3 under hasn't specifically been confirmed yet either, if you look at all of Chip's and Howie's quotes.
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PowerElite


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eagles_808 wrote:
PowerElite wrote:
"We?" Has it been confirmed by anyone employed by the Eagles organization what position Trent Cole will play?
Most likely Predator/LEO, but not confirmed yet. At the same time, the 3-4/4-3 under hasn't specifically been confirmed yet either, if you look at all of Chip's and Howie's quotes.


I think this regime is smart. I don't foresee them asking Trent Cole to drop into pass coverage very much at all at this stage in his career. Trent Cole, Barwin, and B-Rex may all be on the field in the base defense. That would be one hell of a pass rush with those guys and Cox at the 5 tech. Then you have two pretty quick linebackers in the middle of the field and an experienced NT.
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Jeezla


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eagles_808 wrote:
PowerElite wrote:
"We?" Has it been confirmed by anyone employed by the Eagles organization what position Trent Cole will play?
Most likely Predator/LEO, but not confirmed yet. At the same time, the 3-4/4-3 under hasn't specifically been confirmed yet either, if you look at all of Chip's and Howie's quotes.


This is true. We have no idea what our coaches will be asking our DE's and OLB's to do and we probably won't know until training camp.
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Eagles_808


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PowerElite wrote:
I think this regime is smart. I don't foresee them asking Trent Cole to drop into pass coverage very much at all at this stage in his career. Trent Cole, Barwin, and B-Rex may all be on the field in the base defense. That would be one hell of a pass rush with those guys and Cox at the 5 tech. Then you have two pretty quick linebackers in the middle of the field and an experienced NT.
Shocked B-Rex and "good pass rush" in the same post. Shocked

But yeah, I agree. having Cole or Graham drop into coverage makes no sense.




Btw, here's a quote about what I was mentioning:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/02/12/eagles-dont-want-to-label-themselves-3-4-or-4-3/
Quote:
“I’m not caught up with labels,” Kelly said, via Jeff McLane of the Philadelphia Inquirer. “Because I don’t think it’s going to be a ladies-and-gentlemen defense. I think it’s hopefully going to be a defense that creates a lot of turnovers and gets the ball back to our offense.”
Quote:
“I know it’s a vague answer,” Davis said. “Everybody wants to know: Is it 3-4 or is it 4-3? I wouldn’t be a very good coach if I just said it was 3-4. It’s who we have and what we can do with that.”

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PowerElite


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

B Rex is more suited to rushing the passer from the OLB position because it affords him an element of surprise and attack angles that mask having short arms.
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Jeezla


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 5:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eagles_808 wrote:
PowerElite wrote:
I think this regime is smart. I don't foresee them asking Trent Cole to drop into pass coverage very much at all at this stage in his career. Trent Cole, Barwin, and B-Rex may all be on the field in the base defense. That would be one hell of a pass rush with those guys and Cox at the 5 tech. Then you have two pretty quick linebackers in the middle of the field and an experienced NT.
Shocked B-Rex and "good pass rush" in the same post. Shocked

But yeah, I agree. having Cole or Graham drop into coverage makes no sense.




Btw, here's a quote about what I was mentioning:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/02/12/eagles-dont-want-to-label-themselves-3-4-or-4-3/
Quote:
“I’m not caught up with labels,” Kelly said, via Jeff McLane of the Philadelphia Inquirer. “Because I don’t think it’s going to be a ladies-and-gentlemen defense. I think it’s hopefully going to be a defense that creates a lot of turnovers and gets the ball back to our offense.”
Quote:
“I know it’s a vague answer,” Davis said. “Everybody wants to know: Is it 3-4 or is it 4-3? I wouldn’t be a very good coach if I just said it was 3-4. It’s who we have and what we can do with that.”


No Bill. You wouldn't be a very good coach if your unit sucks. Labeling your scheme has no effect on your abilities.
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nlesthought


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 5:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always thought Oregon ran a hybrid look on D. /statement.

We can all agree that the media is pushing this label thing.
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Withmy89vision


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeezla wrote:
Kiltman wrote:
Jeezla wrote:
oland11 wrote:
So yea. Lets draft Star and find a NT later in the draft. Like Brandon Williams or something.


Wouldn't star be the NT? 5.3 40 yard isn't screaming DE to me.

The 5technique DE in the Under is more about run stopping....they have to anchor...not really a speed position. But some penetrating ability is needed, which Star has. He could play both. But with Sop here the best fit is him at DE, and swing him inside at Nose on passing downs.


Yea...I'd way rather have Sheldon Richardson taking on OT's as opposed to Star. I think Star will be easily solo blocked by NFL RT's since you always know what he's going to do: bull straight forward. I like Star a lot as a NT, but not as a DE.


Doesn't matter if Star is predictable if its unstoppable. Freeney's spin is predictable and was still unstoppable in his prime. I don't think Sheldon is that great either. I do like Ansah at 5 more than OLB. He has stiff hips dropping back. I like both Ansah and Star at 5 but they are both different players.
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Jeezla


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Withmy89vision wrote:
Jeezla wrote:
Kiltman wrote:
Jeezla wrote:
oland11 wrote:
So yea. Lets draft Star and find a NT later in the draft. Like Brandon Williams or something.


Wouldn't star be the NT? 5.3 40 yard isn't screaming DE to me.

The 5technique DE in the Under is more about run stopping....they have to anchor...not really a speed position. But some penetrating ability is needed, which Star has. He could play both. But with Sop here the best fit is him at DE, and swing him inside at Nose on passing downs.


Yea...I'd way rather have Sheldon Richardson taking on OT's as opposed to Star. I think Star will be easily solo blocked by NFL RT's since you always know what he's going to do: bull straight forward. I like Star a lot as a NT, but not as a DE.


Doesn't matter if Star is predictable if its unstoppable. Freeney's spin is predictable and was still unstoppable in his prime. I don't think Sheldon is that great either. I do like Ansah at 5 more than OLB. He has stiff hips dropping back. I like both Ansah and Star at 5 but they are both different players.


I don't see Star being unstoppable and Freeny has more than just a spin move.
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PowerElite


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeezla wrote:
Freeny has more than just a spin move.


4.39 speed at the combine and lead all of college football in sacks. Freeney clearly dominated college football. Star is thought to have dominated college football.
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EagleBlueDon


Joined: 19 Feb 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeezla wrote:
Kiltman wrote:
Jeezla wrote:
oland11 wrote:
So yea. Lets draft Star and find a NT later in the draft. Like Brandon Williams or something.


Wouldn't star be the NT? 5.3 40 yard isn't screaming DE to me.

The 5technique DE in the Under is more about run stopping....they have to anchor...not really a speed position. But some penetrating ability is needed, which Star has. He could play both. But with Sop here the best fit is him at DE, and swing him inside at Nose on passing downs.


Yea...I'd way rather have Sheldon Richardson taking on OT's as opposed to Star. I think Star will be easily solo blocked by NFL RT's since you always know what he's going to do: bull straight forward. I like Star a lot as a NT, but not as a DE.
I trust Star's ability to defeat any solo NFL blocker, regardless of position. I like him at 5-tech, more than Ziggy. Cox is our pass rushing presence on the DL, along with our potential million pass rushing specialists. Gimme a little bit of every ability along the front, rather than a guy in Ziggy who is merely known for pass rushing..Soap= multi-block eater, POA.. Cox= pass rush/run stop, Star= multi-block eater, POA, run stop, potential pass rush ability..nice rounded DL right thurr.
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EagleBlueDon


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PowerElite wrote:
Eagles_808 wrote:
PowerElite wrote:
"We?" Has it been confirmed by anyone employed by the Eagles organization what position Trent Cole will play?
Most likely Predator/LEO, but not confirmed yet. At the same time, the 3-4/4-3 under hasn't specifically been confirmed yet either, if you look at all of Chip's and Howie's quotes.


I think this regime is smart. I don't foresee them asking Trent Cole to drop into pass coverage very much at all at this stage in his career. Trent Cole, Barwin, and B-Rex may all be on the field in the base defense. That would be one hell of a pass rush with those guys and Cox at the 5 tech. Then you have two pretty quick linebackers in the middle of the field and an experienced NT.
Much agreed. This regime seems much brighter and rational thus far, and is really hammering home that "personnel driven" theory..which makes me comfortable that the coaches won't put somebody in coverage, who isn't experienced at it or is incompetent at it.
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