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BigDaddyGtr


Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 170
Location: CORAL SPRINGS, FL
PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:10 am    Post subject: Taking anything but Reply with quote

A position on the "lines" is absolute madness. When the hell are the cowboys going to remember the glory days and realize that your offense only goes where the lines take it and the same as your defense. Draft only offense and def line for the first 4 picks and ill love the draft as long as the picks are solid. Realistic draft

Fluker or Richardson
If fluker then best dline in 2, if Richardson then tackle from ark pine bluff in 2
Barrett jones in 3
Best dline in 4

Then in 5 and 6 get whoever you want but forget about next year and start rebuilding the damn lines now starting with the oline and forget everything else. The cowboys are NOT coming close to the SB next year so stop playing for a possible playoff and build for long term. Personally I'd be happy with a damn 4-12 year like the eagles and with the draft I put up for 2013 and another one in 2014 with high picks then maybe the 2014 team has a shot
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PincheJimmy


Joined: 20 Jan 2008
Posts: 1260
Location: Flower Mound, TX
PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:48 am    Post subject: Re: Taking anything but Reply with quote

BigDaddyGtr wrote:
A position on the "lines" is absolute madness. When the hell are the cowboys going to remember the glory days and realize that your offense only goes where the lines take it and the same as your defense. Draft only offense and def line for the first 4 picks and ill love the draft as long as the picks are solid. Realistic draft

Fluker or Richardson
If fluker then best dline in 2, if Richardson then tackle from ark pine bluff in 2
Barrett jones in 3
Best dline in 4

Then in 5 and 6 get whoever you want but forget about next year and start rebuilding the damn lines now starting with the oline and forget everything else. The cowboys are NOT coming close to the SB next year so stop playing for a possible playoff and build for long term. Personally I'd be happy with a damn 4-12 year like the eagles and with the draft I put up for 2013 and another one in 2014 with high picks then maybe the 2014 team has a shot


So, your OK with the team sucking for the year?? what kind of nonsense is that? In have seen others who have said somthing to this effect, " lets suck this year so we can get a high draft pick" I sure hope our FO or GM/Owner dont think like that, smh
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Texas_OutLaw7


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Joined: 27 Mar 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, count me as I don't agree.
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BigDaddyGtr


Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 170
Location: CORAL SPRINGS, FL
PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:15 am    Post subject: Re: Taking anything but Reply with quote

PincheJimmy wrote:
BigDaddyGtr wrote:
A position on the "lines" is absolute madness. When the hell are the cowboys going to remember the glory days and realize that your offense only goes where the lines take it and the same as your defense. Draft only offense and def line for the first 4 picks and ill love the draft as long as the picks are solid. Realistic draft

Fluker or Richardson
If fluker then best dline in 2, if Richardson then tackle from ark pine bluff in 2
Barrett jones in 3
Best dline in 4

Then in 5 and 6 get whoever you want but forget about next year and start rebuilding the damn lines now starting with the oline and forget everything else. The cowboys are NOT coming close to the SB next year so stop playing for a possible playoff and build for long term. Personally I'd be happy with a damn 4-12 year like the eagles and with the draft I put up for 2013 and another one in 2014 with high picks then maybe the 2014 team has a shot


So, your OK with the team sucking for the year?? what kind of nonsense is that? In have seen others who have said somthing to this effect, " lets suck this year so we can get a high draft pick" I sure hope our FO or GM/Owner dont think like that, smh



No, I didn't say that nor do I ever root to lose, but this team is put together as a team destined to stay 8-8 because, at the positions of dire importance, they are average at best which is why we keep going 8-8. This team is like the Dolphins of the Marino age, so I don't think 1 year of 4-12 is necessarily a bad thing. ONE YEAR, and if we build the Off and Def lines this draft and then next draft pick only best available or specific need, then I think in 2014 the Boys might have a legitimate shot or [inappropriate/removed], just start a trend of being really good every year like the Patriots who, besides having Brady, always have great OLINE play and usually great DLINE play
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Justin Hoover82


Joined: 19 Jan 2013
Posts: 2363
Location: Ft.Worth Texas
PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Terron Armstead is more of a LG imo than a tackle.
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plan9misfit


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:17 am    Post subject: Re: Taking anything but Reply with quote

PincheJimmy wrote:
BigDaddyGtr wrote:
A position on the "lines" is absolute madness. When the hell are the cowboys going to remember the glory days and realize that your offense only goes where the lines take it and the same as your defense. Draft only offense and def line for the first 4 picks and ill love the draft as long as the picks are solid. Realistic draft

Fluker or Richardson
If fluker then best dline in 2, if Richardson then tackle from ark pine bluff in 2
Barrett jones in 3
Best dline in 4

Then in 5 and 6 get whoever you want but forget about next year and start rebuilding the damn lines now starting with the oline and forget everything else. The cowboys are NOT coming close to the SB next year so stop playing for a possible playoff and build for long term. Personally I'd be happy with a damn 4-12 year like the eagles and with the draft I put up for 2013 and another one in 2014 with high picks then maybe the 2014 team has a shot


So, your OK with the team sucking for the year?? what kind of nonsense is that? In have seen others who have said somthing to this effect, " lets suck this year so we can get a high draft pick" I sure hope our FO or GM/Owner dont think like that, smh


There's a lot to be said for people who are willing to take a step back in order to potentially take a few steps forward. I think it's because many people look at the Cowboys and recognize that being average is the worst position to be stuck in because it's purgatory. You're always tortured with the fact that you hope things will be better but know that they won't be. I'm not saying that I agree with the strategy (I don't) because it's easy to dig yourself into a deep hole and suck for a long time, but the expectation is that one bad year will lend itself to enough high draft picks to allow the team to rebound and improve rapidly rather than doing nothing but tread water and sit with records between 7-9 and 9-7 every year and accomplish nothing.
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BigDaddyGtr


Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 170
Location: CORAL SPRINGS, FL
PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:04 am    Post subject: Re: Taking anything but Reply with quote

plan9misfit wrote:
PincheJimmy wrote:
BigDaddyGtr wrote:
A position on the "lines" is absolute madness. When the hell are the cowboys going to remember the glory days and realize that your offense only goes where the lines take it and the same as your defense. Draft only offense and def line for the first 4 picks and ill love the draft as long as the picks are solid. Realistic draft

Fluker or Richardson
If fluker then best dline in 2, if Richardson then tackle from ark pine bluff in 2
Barrett jones in 3
Best dline in 4

Then in 5 and 6 get whoever you want but forget about next year and start rebuilding the damn lines now starting with the oline and forget everything else. The cowboys are NOT coming close to the SB next year so stop playing for a possible playoff and build for long term. Personally I'd be happy with a damn 4-12 year like the eagles and with the draft I put up for 2013 and another one in 2014 with high picks then maybe the 2014 team has a shot


So, your OK with the team sucking for the year?? what kind of nonsense is that? In have seen others who have said somthing to this effect, " lets suck this year so we can get a high draft pick" I sure hope our FO or GM/Owner dont think like that, smh


There's a lot to be said for people who are willing to take a step back in order to potentially take a few steps forward. I think it's because many people look at the Cowboys and recognize that being average is the worst position to be stuck in because it's purgatory. You're always tortured with the fact that you hope things will be better but know that they won't be. I'm not saying that I agree with the strategy (I don't) because it's easy to dig yourself into a deep hole and suck for a long time, but the expectation is that one bad year will lend itself to enough high draft picks to allow the team to rebound and improve rapidly rather than doing nothing but tread water and sit with records between 7-9 and 9-7 every year and accomplish nothing.


thats pretty much it
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sodakcowboy78


Joined: 18 Jan 2012
Posts: 553
Location: sioux falls so dak
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Really not much will change until Dallas hires a true GM for the team and ownership takes a step back...and that wont happen till JJ retires or dies...i read JJ is considering bringing Felix Jones back to backup Murray...how does this happen? I feel bad for guys like Jason Witten and DeMarcus Ware...true football greats and HOF players that will never sniff playoff success unless they hitch a ride with another team somehow...


Peace
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Rtnldave


Joined: 10 Feb 2008
Posts: 2861
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 1:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Taking anything but Reply with quote

BigDaddyGtr wrote:
plan9misfit wrote:
PincheJimmy wrote:
BigDaddyGtr wrote:
A position on the "lines" is absolute madness. When the hell are the cowboys going to remember the glory days and realize that your offense only goes where the lines take it and the same as your defense. Draft only offense and def line for the first 4 picks and ill love the draft as long as the picks are solid. Realistic draft

Fluker or Richardson
If fluker then best dline in 2, if Richardson then tackle from ark pine bluff in 2
Barrett jones in 3
Best dline in 4

Then in 5 and 6 get whoever you want but forget about next year and start rebuilding the damn lines now starting with the oline and forget everything else. The cowboys are NOT coming close to the SB next year so stop playing for a possible playoff and build for long term. Personally I'd be happy with a damn 4-12 year like the eagles and with the draft I put up for 2013 and another one in 2014 with high picks then maybe the 2014 team has a shot


So, your OK with the team sucking for the year?? what kind of nonsense is that? In have seen others who have said somthing to this effect, " lets suck this year so we can get a high draft pick" I sure hope our FO or GM/Owner dont think like that, smh


There's a lot to be said for people who are willing to take a step back in order to potentially take a few steps forward. I think it's because many people look at the Cowboys and recognize that being average is the worst position to be stuck in because it's purgatory. You're always tortured with the fact that you hope things will be better but know that they won't be. I'm not saying that I agree with the strategy (I don't) because it's easy to dig yourself into a deep hole and suck for a long time, but the expectation is that one bad year will lend itself to enough high draft picks to allow the team to rebound and improve rapidly rather than doing nothing but tread water and sit with records between 7-9 and 9-7 every year and accomplish nothing.


thats pretty much it



It really is amazing how history always go by the wayside. This team had to settle for 3-13 and 1-15 back to back years before they could begin to construct a winning team.

The Colts did a very similar thing just 2 years ago and they are already in the playoffs.

I would certainley be willing to go that route. It can't be any worse then what we have. I mean, is there really any difference between an 8-8 team that dosen't make the playoffs and a 4-12 team or 2 -14 team? In fact, the latter has the advantage draft wise.
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Hawksrealm


Joined: 03 Nov 2009
Posts: 260
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 1:44 pm    Post subject: Re: Taking anything but Reply with quote

It really is amazing how history always go by the wayside. This team had to settle for 3-13 and 1-15 back to back years before they could begin to construct a winning team.

The Colts did a very similar thing just 2 years ago and they are already in the playoffs.

I would certainley be willing to go that route. It can't be any worse then what we have. I mean, is there really any difference between an 8-8 team that dosen't make the playoffs and a 4-12 team or 2 -14 team? In fact, the latter has the advantage draft wise.[/quote]

First your history was a time without a cap. 2nd those teams had one of the worst O-lines ever....but in 1992, they had evolved into one of the best in History. Its called continuity, playing together, last years oline was healthy for a few games.

I also don't see any Herschel Walkers that we can use to build with....do you? Every team is just a few players short, as we are, but we have a chance to get the players we need this year. I think the Boys will make a good run at it.
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Rtnldave


Joined: 10 Feb 2008
Posts: 2861
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 2:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Taking anything but Reply with quote

Quote:
Hawksrealm wrote:
It really is amazing how history always go by the wayside. This team had to settle for 3-13 and 1-15 back to back years before they could begin to construct a winning team.

The Colts did a very similar thing just 2 years ago and they are already in the playoffs.

I would certainley be willing to go that route. It can't be any worse then what we have. I mean, is there really any difference between an 8-8 team that dosen't make the playoffs and a 4-12 team or 2 -14 team? In fact, the latter has the advantage draft wise.


First your history was a time without a cap. 2nd those teams had one of the worst O-lines ever....but in 1992, they had evolved into one of the best in History. Its called continuity, playing together, last years oline was healthy for a few games.

I also don't see any Herschel Walkers that we can use to build with....do you? Every team is just a few players short, as we are, but we have a chance to get the players we need this year. I think the Boys will make a good run at it.
[/quote]

The players we need this year? We have all of 6 draft picks, NO comp picks and No money to operate in FA. We need at the very LEAST 2 offensive linemen RT, OG. C is also an area of concern.
We also need 2 S and D line help.

Even if we hit on every draft pick, not likely, it will take approx 2-3 years for the O line to completely gel and defense to learn and get comfortable with a whole new system being introduced this year. You are asking Ware and Spencer to play at the DE positions. I know they played there in college but this is the NFL. They will be seeing 300 lb plus O linemen on almost every play, without a running start from the OLB positions.

Given my assessment of 2-3 years, to what level of effectivness do you see Ware, Witten, Romo, Ratliff, Austin at that stage of their respective careers?

Answer to the H. Walker question, yes I do see a way to garner such picks. Not with one player, but with 2. D. Ware being 1 of them, Romo being the other.

Just hypothetically speaking, what could we get for both of them?

Ware: 1st and 3rd this year, conditional 2nd or 3rd next year?

Romo: 2nd this year 1st next year?

If that happened we would be looking at:

2013 draft:

1st round 2x
2nd round 2x
3rd round 2x
4th round 1x
5th round 1x
6th round 1x

2014 draft:

1st round 2x
2nd round possible 2x
3rd round possible 2x
etc.

If we can agree that our draft picks this year will take at least 2 years to reach their potential, and that at that point our core vets will have little trade value and significant decline in their game, and that our defense will take at least 2 years to grasp the new sysytem well enough to compete for a title, then this scenario seems to be the best option for this team moving forward.

If you ask who will replace them, my answer is this: Does it matter? With this move we are CLEARLY in rebuilding mode. Thus we are not interested in pursuing another title only to finish 8-8 with the same players who, in their primes 2007-2009, could only muster 1 playoff win.

In my opinion our options are these:

Begin to build for the future now OR Field the same team this year that you have for the past 2 or 3 years and hope they stay healthy, hope they grasp the new defense, hope the O line comes together in a hurry and hope the draft picks pan out immedietly. Even with all of that they would still have to catch lightning in a bottle to beat the elite teams in the NFC.
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boog3083


Joined: 01 Oct 2007
Posts: 77
Location: Elkhart, Ks
PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 7:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Hawksrealm wrote:
It really is amazing how history always go by the wayside. This team had to settle for 3-13 and 1-15 back to back years before they could begin to construct a winning team.

The Colts did a very similar thing just 2 years ago and they are already in the playoffs.

I would certainley be willing to go that route. It can't be any worse then what we have. I mean, is there really any difference between an 8-8 team that dosen't make the playoffs and a 4-12 team or 2 -14 team? In fact, the latter has the advantage draft wise.


First your history was a time without a cap. 2nd those teams had one of the worst O-lines ever....but in 1992, they had evolved into one of the best in History. Its called continuity, playing together, last years oline was healthy for a few games.

I also don't see any Herschel Walkers that we can use to build with....do you? Every team is just a few players short, as we are, but we have a chance to get the players we need this year. I think the Boys will make a good run at it.
[/quote]

The players we need this year? We have all of 6 draft picks, NO comp picks and No money to operate in FA. We need at the very LEAST 2 offensive linemen RT, OG. C is also an area of concern.
We also need 2 S and D line help.

Even if we hit on every draft pick, not likely, it will take approx 2-3 years for the O line to completely gel and defense to learn and get comfortable with a whole new system being introduced this year. You are asking Ware and Spencer to play at the DE positions. I know they played there in college but this is the NFL. They will be seeing 300 lb plus O linemen on almost every play, without a running start from the OLB positions.

Given my assessment of 2-3 years, to what level of effectivness do you see Ware, Witten, Romo, Ratliff, Austin at that stage of their respective careers?

Answer to the H. Walker question, yes I do see a way to garner such picks. Not with one player, but with 2. D. Ware being 1 of them, Romo being the other.

Just hypothetically speaking, what could we get for both of them?

Ware: 1st and 3rd this year, conditional 2nd or 3rd next year?

Romo: 2nd this year 1st next year?

If that happened we would be looking at:

2013 draft:

1st round 2x
2nd round 2x
3rd round 2x
4th round 1x
5th round 1x
6th round 1x

2014 draft:

1st round 2x
2nd round possible 2x
3rd round possible 2x
etc.

If we can agree that our draft picks this year will take at least 2 years to reach their potential, and that at that point our core vets will have little trade value and significant decline in their game, and that our defense will take at least 2 years to grasp the new sysytem well enough to compete for a title, then this scenario seems to be the best option for this team moving forward.

If you ask who will replace them, my answer is this: Does it matter? With this move we are CLEARLY in rebuilding mode. Thus we are not interested in pursuing another title only to finish 8-8 with the same players who, in their primes 2007-2009, could only muster 1 playoff win.

In my opinion our options are these:

Begin to build for the future now OR Field the same team this year that you have for the past 2 or 3 years and hope they stay healthy, hope they grasp the new defense, hope the O line comes together in a hurry and hope the draft picks pan out immedietly. Even with all of that they would still have to catch lightning in a bottle to beat the elite teams in the NFC



I agree with all this!!! The trades would be the best thing to happen to the boys!!!
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