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Is DE now our top need?
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b_rent87


Joined: 13 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 4:23 pm    Post subject: Is DE now our top need? Reply with quote

I know we have a thread of who we should take at 28 but is DE really our top need? Or can we start someone like Ayers and grab a pass rush specialist in the third or fourth round to rush on passing downs? Or should we look for a 3-down end early in the draft? What do you think?
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b_rent87


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 4:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Personally I would trade up for Werner or Moore if they fell to 20 or later. And I would stay at 28 and take Tank.
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germ-x


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While there is some depth, i'm really not a big fan of the DE's in this class. As far as the 1st round goes, the only 2 i would definitely be down with drafting are Ansah and Carradine. I find Datone Jones to be interesting as well, but i don't know how much of a pass rush he'll generate.

The rest i just don't really like. Bjoern Werner, Alex Okafor, and Sam Montgomery are all very similar to Robert Ayers, IMO, and won't be anything more than solid NFL players. Then there are guys like Damontre Moore, Corey Lemonier, and those undersized guys that at least early in their careers will or should only be pass rush specialists. Though, with how Lemonier seems to have fallen i think he would present good value if he is around in the late 2nd or 3rd rounds. I really like him. He's a bit stiff, but has some explosion/speed and brings it every snap.
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AKRNA


Joined: 28 May 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 4:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think a lot has to do with how our FO views Beal and Jackson along with Ayers. Jackson has shown potential and did make the gameday roster for 14 games. Beal looked impressive in preseason.

Both have a year of NFL experience under their belts which shouldn't be under rated.

Ayers has proven to be fairly solid.

Question being, who in the draft outside of the top 1 or two could come in and displace any of those three, or at leaast two of them. With Hunter being released and Doom allowed to walk, I'd think our FO has some confidence in the roster DE's.
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b_rent87


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AKRNA wrote:
I think a lot has to do with how our FO views Beal and Jackson along with Ayers. Jackson has shown potential and did make the gameday roster for 14 games. Beal looked impressive in preseason.

Both have a year of NFL experience under their belts which shouldn't be under rated.

Ayers has proven to be fairly solid.

Question being, who in the draft outside of the top 1 or two could come in and displace any of those three, or at leaast two of them. With Hunter being released and Doom allowed to walk, I'd think our FO has some confidence in the roster DE's.


I really like Damontre Moore even if it is in a Pass rush specialist role. Start Ayers and Bring in Moore on passing downs. This team can afford to spend its first on Moore if he is there.
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Cruzp23


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 6:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IMO safety is our biggest need then ILB ayers can hold fort at end
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bobdevine


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 6:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A late round possible pick for a pure pass rusher is Cornelius Washington from Georgia. He has the athleticism for a DE, but hasn't shown the production or skills to be drafted higher than, say, the 5-6th round.
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JackedUP


Joined: 23 Oct 2009
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Without a doubt we have a need for a pass rusher..We need more than just Von, if thats all we have we are in trouble. Moore from A&M doesn't look good at all to me, he's weak and has no explosion. To get to the QB you have to be a quick twitch athlete or overwhelm with effort(Jared Allen). Moore has neither in his game. We need a couple rushers, kind of like the Auburn kid can't remember his name Corey Lemoire? Also kid from FSU that was talked up last year Brandon jenkins who got hurt was pretty good from what I remember. Both should be around 3rd round when we pick.
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broncospride95


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I personally love Tank Carradine and I think he would be a great addition to this team. He can do it all. I also like Damontre Moore too, but to a lesser extent. He doesn't have the potential to be an all-around elite DE like Tank could be imo. Moore could be a very good pass rusher at the next level though, so I could definitely see Elway/Fox take a long hard look at Moore if he is there at #28. My preference is Tank though.

-Ansah looks to be going top 10 so he's out of range.

-Lemonier is a interesting prospect in the 2nd like Germ eluded to.

-Werner is a possibility at #28 as he seems to be falling, but imo he's nothing special. Tank was 10x the DE Werner was.

-Datone Jones looks to be a solid overall prospect, but I wouldn't want him in the 1st. If we decide to trade out of the 1st round to the 2nd, I think Jones could be a target for us.

Some other prospects that interest me are Buchanan, Simon, and Kruger. I don't know as much about these three, so if anyone has any insight on these guys it'd be much appreciated.
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Winder23


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 11:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JackedUP wrote:
Without a doubt we have a need for a pass rusher..We need more than just Von, if thats all we have we are in trouble. Moore from A&M doesn't look good at all to me, he's weak and has no explosion. To get to the QB you have to be a quick twitch athlete or overwhelm with effort(Jared Allen). Moore has neither in his game. We need a couple rushers, kind of like the Auburn kid can't remember his name Corey Lemoire? Also kid from FSU that was talked up last year Brandon jenkins who got hurt was pretty good from what I remember. Both should be around 3rd round when we pick.
Damontre Moore is much more than you are giving him credit for. He isn't overly explosive off the snap, but his motor never stops. Moore will be a top 25 pick anyways.

I do also like Lemonier. HE is surprisingly good in the run game. Alot of college DE's aren't, but the kid can shed blocks fairly well. He is a pretty good pass rusher. He sometimes takes way too wide of an angle to the QB and gets too far upfield. If he is avaialable in the second or third like Germ said, it might be a nice pick.
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AnAngryAmerican


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 1:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cruzp23 wrote:
IMO safety is our biggest need then ILB ayers can hold fort at end
Yeah that's right. We need to spend a premium pick on MLB who will be on the field maybe 35% of the time. Screw having a pass rush, Ayers and his 6.5 sacks in 57 career games can hold fort at DE. Rolling Eyes

Of course if we can't resign Dumervil then DE becomes our biggest need, and it's not close. S, RB and WR are secondary needs relative to the hole we would have at DE. Problem is that even if we sign one of the washed-up former has-beens like Freeney, Abraham or Seymour we're still screwed because, as germ-x points out, none of the DEs in this class are anything to get excited about.

I don't think Doom is an elite DE or anything, but, unlike an over-the-hill vet + a rookie, he's respected around the league and teams will game plan for him. Elway isn't stupid; he was willing to pay Doom top-dollar this offseason (even though it was a cut from what Mac paid him) because he understands how important a respected pass rusher who is also a team leader and lockerroom glue is to a team.

Put bluntly, if we lose Doom a lot of the good we've done this offseason will be lost.
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Cruzp23


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 6:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AnAngryAmerican wrote:
Cruzp23 wrote:
IMO safety is our biggest need then ILB ayers can hold fort at end
Yeah that's right. We need to spend a premium pick on MLB who will be on the field maybe 35% of the time. Screw having a pass rush, Ayers and his 6.5 sacks in 57 career games can hold fort at DE. Rolling Eyes

Of course if we can't resign Dumervil then DE becomes our biggest need, and it's not close. S, RB and WR are secondary needs relative to the hole we would have at DE. Problem is that even if we sign one of the washed-up former has-beens like Freeney, Abraham or Seymour we're still screwed because, as germ-x points out, none of the DEs in this class are anything to get excited about.

I don't think Doom is an elite DE or anything, but, unlike an over-the-hill vet + a rookie, he's respected around the league and teams will game plan for him. Elway isn't stupid; he was willing to pay Doom top-dollar this offseason (even though it was a cut from what Mac paid him) because he understands how important a respected pass rusher who is also a team leader and lockerroom glue is to a team.

Put bluntly, if we lose Doom a lot of the good we've done this offseason will be lost.



i think you are over rating the value of pick 28 it is hardly a premium pick
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JerseysFinest27


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 9:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ansah, Mingo, Datone Jones and Carradine are 1st rounders in my opinion. Then Lemonier, Moore and Werner should get consideration from the teams at the bottom of the 1st to mid-2nd.

Outside of them, this class is pretty average. You have guys that had college careers like riding a roller coaster.


If the Dumervil fiasco doesnt work on our side, I can easily seeing us go DE 1st round.
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b_rent87


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bobdevine wrote:
A late round possible pick for a pure pass rusher is Cornelius Washington from Georgia. He has the athleticism for a DE, but hasn't shown the production or skills to be drafted higher than, say, the 5-6th round.
Being a uga fan I have seen a lot of general corn Washington. His lack of production was because of scheme he played contain on the field side he has a lot of potential. I see him going no later than round four however
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Winder23


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JerseysFinest27 wrote:
Ansah, Mingo, Datone Jones and Carradine are 1st rounders in my opinion. Then Lemonier, Moore and Werner should get consideration from the teams at the bottom of the 1st to mid-2nd.

Outside of them, this class is pretty average. You have guys that had college careers like riding a roller coaster.


If the Dumervil fiasco doesnt work on our side, I can easily seeing us go DE 1st round.
Help me with all the love for Carradine around here. He is a nice player, but he hasn't shown anything that is explosive that I can find on tape.
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