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Why the Redskins should not draft a secondary player
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taylormade


Joined: 26 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 12:07 am    Post subject: Why the Redskins should not draft a secondary player Reply with quote

Why the Redskins should not draft a secondary player with their 2nd and 3rd round draft picks: Mike Shanahan has NEVER drafted a great secondary player (History Inside)


Mike missed way more on secondary players than he did with any other position. It is pretty noticeable. I mean Delta O'Neal was his best selection with a first rounder. Look on how many he missed on.

2012
Round: 7 Pick: 6 Selection: 213 Richard Crawford DB Southern Methodist - Too early to tell, seems to have potential as a return man.
Round: 7 Pick: 10 Selection: 217 Jordan Bernstine DB Iowa - Is he on the practice squad?

2011
Round 5 Pick: 15 Selection: 146 Dejon Gomes DB Nebraska - Can't beat out Madieu Williams at Safety.
Roune 7 Pick: 10 Selection: 213 Brandyn Thompson DB Boise State - Out of the league?


2008
Round 4 Pick: 20 Overall 119 Jack Williams DB Kent State - Never panned out
Round 7 Pick: 13 Overall 220 Joshua Barrett DB Arizona State - Looked like Tarzan, played like Jane.

2005
Round 2 Pick:24 Overall: 56 Darrent Williams DB Oklahoma State - Better return man than cornerback, Who knows how good he could of been, but he was never better than a serviceable no. 2
Round 3 Pick: 12 Overall: 76 Karl Paymah DB Washington State - Very Meh.
Round 3 Pick: 33 Overall: 97 Domonique Foxworth DB Maryland - Was successful for a couple years on the Ravens, but lots of players are successful on the Ravens defense.

2004
Round 3 Pick: 22 Overall: 85 Jeremy LeSueur DB Michigan - Bust
Round 5 Pick: 20 Overall: 152 Jeff Shoate DB San Diego State - Bust

2003


2002
Round 4 Pick: 33 Overall: 131 Sam Brandon DB UNLV - Never heard of him.
Round 7 Pick: 17 Overall: 228 Chris Young DB Georgia Tech - Him, either.

2001
Round 1 Pick: 24 Overall 24 Willie Middlebrooks DB Minnesota - Shanny's biggest bust

2000
Round 1 Pick: 15 Overall 15 Deltha O'Neal DB California - Probably the best Cornerback Shanny drafted.
Round 2 Pick:14 Overall 45 Kenoy Kennedy DB Arkansas - Probably the best Safety Shanny ever drafted.

1999
Round 3 Pick 6 Overall 67 Chris Watson DB Eastern Illinois - Bust
Round 5 Pick 34 Overall 167 Darwin Brown DB Texas Tech - Bust

1998
Round 2 Pick:31 Overall: 61 Eric Brown DB Mississippi State - Big Bust

1997

Round 4 Pick 28 Overall: 124 Cory Gilliard DB Ball State - Unmemorable.


1996
2 14 44 Tory James DB Louisiana State - Had most his success with the Bengals.
Round 4: Pick: 27 Overall: 122 Darius Johnson DB Oklahoma - Who?
6 14 181 Tony Veland DB Nebraska - Never Heard of him.




After Looking at this list... do you feel confident in Shanahan still grabbing a secondary player? I feel he is more successful with other positions, especially offense.
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turtle28


Joined: 21 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 12:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That doesn't mean you quit trying. That's like saying you don't draft Cutler because Griese didn't work out or you don't draft Rg3 because JC didn't work out.

If you need a postion and a player is there thats one of the best available and worthy of the selection, you take the player.

Do you know how many other first round busts Shanahan drafted?

Marcus Nash, Ashley Lelie, Jarvis Moss all 3 first round picks. All busts
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Last edited by turtle28 on Sun Mar 17, 2013 12:17 am; edited 1 time in total
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taylormade


Joined: 26 Jan 2008
Posts: 598
PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 12:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
That doesn't mean you quit trying. That's like saying you don't draft Cutler because Griese didn't work out or you don't draft Rg3 because JC didn't work out.


But history says that he has a very low percentage grabbing secondary players. So by doing this you are gambling big time. Comparing quarterbacks to cornerbackers is like comparing apples and oranges.

Quote:

If you need a postion and a player is there thats one of the best available and worthy of the selection, you take the player.


But this data shows that Shanahan clearly can't scout secondary players. Again, its a gamble whereas other positions Shanahan is quite adept at drafting.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 12:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

taylormade wrote:
turtle28 wrote:
That doesn't mean you quit trying. That's like saying you don't draft Cutler because Griese didn't work out or you don't draft Rg3 because JC didn't work out.


But history says that he has a very low percentage grabbing secondary players. So by doing this you are gambling big time. Comparing quarterbacks to cornerbackers is like comparing apples and oranges.

Quote:

If you need a postion and a player is there thats one of the best available and worthy of the selection, you take the player.


But this data shows that Shanahan clearly can't scout secondary players. Again, its a gamble whereas other positions Shanahan is quite adept at drafting.
he had other failed draft picks and our scouting department is way different than the one he had in Denver. I really don't believe that he or Kyle do much defensive back scouting. They leave that up to the scouts and defensive coaches.

That's how we get a guy like Kerrigan. I believe Hasslett and Spanos saw a lot of Kevin Green and Mike Vrable in him. That's how we get a Jenkins and a Perry Riley.

The one defensive pick you can point to in the Shanahan "Redskins" era who hasn't worked out to be great is a 5th round DB. DeJon Gome, he's only 23 and he's still young and developing. He's only going into his third year, yeah, so he couldn't beat out a 10 year vet in his second year, that doesn't mean in 2 more years of development he won't be a starter.

Richard Crawford looked pretty good for a 7th round pick last year when he was picking off Romo. Wink
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 12:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
That doesn't mean you quit trying. That's like saying you don't draft Cutler because Griese didn't work out or you don't draft Rg3 because JC didn't work out.


taylormade wrote:
But history says that he has a very low percentage grabbing secondary players. So by doing this you are gambling big time. Comparing quarterbacks to cornerbackers is like comparing apples and oranges.
you missed the point. I was saying it doesn't mean you don't drsft a position you need. If you need a good player in a position, you better draft the best prospect available in that position.


If you need a postion and a player is there thats one of the best available and worthy of the selection, you take the player.

taylormade wrote:
But this data shows that Shanahan clearly can't scout secondary players. Again, its a gamble whereas other positions Shanahan is quite adept at drafting.
Shanahan had other failed draft picks and our scouting department is way different than the one he had in Denver. I really don't believe that he or Kyle do much defensive back scouting. They leave that up to the scouts and defensive coaches.

That's how we get a guy like Kerrigan. I believe Hasslett and Spanos saw a lot of Kevin Green and Mike Vrable in him. That's how we get a Jenkins and a Perry Riley.

The one defensive pick you can point to in the Shanahan "Redskins" era who hasn't worked out to be great is a 5th round DB. DeJon Gome, he's only 23 and he's still young and developing. He's only going into his third year, yeah, so he couldn't beat out a 10 year vet in his second year, that doesn't mean in 2 more years of development he won't be a starter.

Richard Crawford looked pretty good for a 7th round pick last year when he was picking off Romo. Wink
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S. Taylor


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 1:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The best thing Mike likely helped do was trade Portis for Bailey.

I guess the Skins need to trade Alfred Morris for Revis...
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Dashing


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 1:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
That doesn't mean you quit trying. That's like saying you don't draft Cutler because Griese didn't work out or you don't draft Rg3 because JC didn't work out.

If you need a postion and a player is there thats one of the best available and worthy of the selection, you take the player.

Do you know how many other first round busts Shanahan drafted?

Marcus Nash, Ashley Lelie, Jarvis Moss all 3 first round picks. All busts


Life you never give up at a certain point but yes Shanny needs to give up.


Taylor I saw your post on ES and I wish I had an account to help back you up because you are correct.

Shanny can draft a QB and ill think hes the guy which is evident in his resume and potentially got us 2 starting QB's. But on defense he sucks..........the CB market down to we have a chance to sign a vet CB and WInfield and Grimes are my top 2.. Much rather have Allen draft but all he is ,is a YES MAN.
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Dashing


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 1:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

S. Taylor wrote:
The best thing Mike likely helped do was trade Portis for Bailey.

I guess the Skins need to trade Alfred Morris for Revis...


ha
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Dashing


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 2:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
taylormade wrote:
turtle28 wrote:
That doesn't mean you quit trying. That's like saying you don't draft Cutler because Griese didn't work out or you don't draft Rg3 because JC didn't work out.


But history says that he has a very low percentage grabbing secondary players. So by doing this you are gambling big time. Comparing quarterbacks to cornerbackers is like comparing apples and oranges.

Quote:

If you need a postion and a player is there thats one of the best available and worthy of the selection, you take the player.


But this data shows that Shanahan clearly can't scout secondary players. Again, its a gamble whereas other positions Shanahan is quite adept at drafting.
he had other failed draft picks and our scouting department is way different than the one he had in Denver. I really don't believe that he or Kyle do much defensive back scouting. They leave that up to the scouts and defensive coaches.

That's how we get a guy like Kerrigan. I believe Hasslett and Spanos saw a lot of Kevin Green and Mike Vrable in him. That's how we get a Jenkins and a Perry Riley.

The one defensive pick you can point to in the Shanahan "Redskins" era who hasn't worked out to be great is a 5th round DB. DeJon Gome, he's only 23 and he's still young and developing. He's only going into his third year, yeah, so he couldn't beat out a 10 year vet in his second year, that doesn't mean in 2 more years of development he won't be a starter.

Richard Crawford looked pretty good for a 7th round pick last year when he was picking off Romo. Wink




Yea a 30th ranked D is good. Shanny track record on D is Awful! people just dont wanna admit he sucks on the defensive side of things .
I don't mind a 2nd round CB but this track records bad .

Crawford had 1 pick and one big KR too . Its ok we will suck this season and people will see the reality . Smile
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Almm24


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 3:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

We haven't made any moves to address our secondary and we are strapped on cap space. Draft picks are the best way to do this since they are young and cheap. Shanahan may not have had success drafting defensive backs, but its a risk we must take in order to fix our secondary.
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MKnight82


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe we shouldn't draft anyone then since they might bust.
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DCRED


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 5:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MKnight82 wrote:
Maybe we shouldn't draft anyone then since they might bust.


I agree with you guys
Maybe we should just draft 5 RB's, possibly a QB and late-round Olinemen. If we just run the ball 45-50 times a game with Fresh powerbacks and Olinemen we won't need a great Defense anyway Laughing
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mike23md


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 8:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So do you think that every coach should just ignore their team needs and draft their strengths only?

In case you have not realized, we have 2 CB's on our starting depth chart, Josh Wilson and Richard Crawford. Korey Lindsay, Jerome Murphy, and Chase Minnifield are listed on the depth chart cause they are still on the roster. But none of them are starters, and Minnifield is probably going to be on the PUP list at start of the season.

Do you really want to go into the season with that kind of secondary? Didn't think so. Because we have no money for outside free agents, and we still have to sign Fred Davis plus our rookies, we have to draft secondary to improve. Otherwise we are going into the season WORSE than how we prepared for it.

But to say that we should just ignore the biggest hole in our defense entirely, is LUDICROUS.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Almm24 wrote:
We haven't made any moves to address our secondary and we are strapped on cap space. Draft picks are the best way to do this since they are young and cheap. Shanahan may not have had success drafting defensive backs, but its a risk we must take in order to fix our secondary.
exactly! Like I said we have to try. I've said for the longest time I didn't want to draft a wr high again because we had so many busts dating back to Desmond Howard but if we need one more than other positions I think we should take one high, because you have to try, you can't just give up on addressing your teams greatest needs
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 9:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MKnight82 wrote:
Maybe we shouldn't draft anyone then since they might bust.
this! Short and sweet, great post mknight
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