| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
chuck44
Joined: 17 Dec 2009
Posts: 1189
Location: ohio
|
 Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:58 pm Post subject: What To Do If????????? |
 |
|
|
Every year there are a few players who drop in the draft. Picks 16-18 are valued at 1000,950,900 pts
Our pick at# 23 is 760pts...package that with our 4th from Detroit 100pts..our 3rd in 2014 from Seattle valued somewhere 60-80pts...throw in a 2-7th rd picks which we have 3....total 950-1000pts ...you have enough to move up.
We still keep our picks ..not giving up that much...liquidate some of the bottom end picks...plus you cant sign all of those picks we have and be cap friendly..
So in review we:
Trade pick RD1 #23 our 4th rd(detroit), 2014 3rd(seattlle) 2-7th rd picks
to move to the 16-18 range to pick
either
Alec Ogltree
or
Star Lotulelei
I believe one of these guys could easily fall to the 16-18 range
Do you pull the trigger???? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
vikingsrule
Joined: 15 Nov 2005
Posts: 39758
Location: Land of 10,000 Lakes!
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:01 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
I wouldnt trade up for Star or Ogletree personally.
Ogletree has alarming character issues and he doesnt appear to be maturing with his recent arrest.
Also, if Star falls that far it will be because there are still major concerns over his hearth condition. A 350 pound lineman with heart issues does not sound appealing to me in anyway.
The only players I trade up in that 15-18 range for are Dee Milliner, Xavier Rhodes, Cordarrelle Patterson and Shariff Floyd. No one else intrigues me.
_________________
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
CriminalMind
Joined: 25 Aug 2011
Posts: 2986
Location: Toronto, CA
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:10 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
I would move up for 1-Floyd 2-Milliner 3-Rhodes 4-Richardson
Of course theres varying degrees of what I would be willing to package to move up.
_________________
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
JDBrocks
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Posts: 4813
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:11 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| vikingsrule wrote: | I wouldnt trade up for Star or Ogletree personally.
Ogletree has alarming character issues and he doesnt appear to be maturing with his recent arrest.
Also, if Star falls that far it will be because there are still major concerns over his hearth condition. A 350 pound lineman with heart issues does not sound appealing to me in anyway.
The only players I trade up in that 15-18 range for are Dee Milliner, Xavier Rhodes, Cordarrelle Patterson and Shariff Floyd. No one else intrigues me. |
I wouldn't trade up for Patterson either. Too many questionmarks on the field as well as work ethic issues.
_________________
| Josh Ritter wrote: | | I became a thin blue wire, that held the world above the fire |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vikingsrule
Joined: 15 Nov 2005
Posts: 39758
Location: Land of 10,000 Lakes!
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:14 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| JDBrocks wrote: | | vikingsrule wrote: | I wouldnt trade up for Star or Ogletree personally.
Ogletree has alarming character issues and he doesnt appear to be maturing with his recent arrest.
Also, if Star falls that far it will be because there are still major concerns over his hearth condition. A 350 pound lineman with heart issues does not sound appealing to me in anyway.
The only players I trade up in that 15-18 range for are Dee Milliner, Xavier Rhodes, Cordarrelle Patterson and Shariff Floyd. No one else intrigues me. |
I wouldn't trade up for Patterson either. Too many questionmarks on the field as well as work ethic issues. |
Work ethic isnt a huge deal for me with college athletes, these guys are 20 to 21 years old. Its tough to judge.
On the field, he is raw. Other than that he has shown great ability all over the field. Immediately, he should make an impact in the short and intermediate passing game and be a fantastic YAC receiver and replace Harvin in that regards. Overtime as Patterson develops his craft and learns from Jennings, the route running skills will improve. His hands dont seem to be a question mark, so that is a plus. Jennings and Wright are more your sound route runner types, I think Patterson would be a good fit with that group and I do see him as a potential #1. At 6-2 and nearly 220 pounds with 4.42 speed and great leaping ability, there is a ton to like.
_________________
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
JDBrocks
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Posts: 4813
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:19 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
I'm not saying I wouldn't draft him, just that I wouldn't trade up for him. He doesn't look like a transcendent talent worth sacrificing other picks in a deep draft from picks in the 20-55 range.
_________________
| Josh Ritter wrote: | | I became a thin blue wire, that held the world above the fire |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vikingsrule
Joined: 15 Nov 2005
Posts: 39758
Location: Land of 10,000 Lakes!
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| JDBrocks wrote: | | I'm not saying I wouldn't draft him, just that I wouldn't trade up for him. He doesn't look like a transcendent talent worth sacrificing other picks in a deep draft from picks in the 20-55 range. |
Youre probably not going to find a transcendent talent in that 15-18 range, Randy Moss only happens once every blue moon.
Youre going to get flawed prospects either way. You have to ask why each of these players are falling in the first place.
From a physical standpoint, Rhodes, Floyd, Patterson and Milliner have it all. They are all incredible athletes who have shown excellent football ability. Floyd and Patterson may be a bit more raw and unfinished, but they also have a lot more to build on too, which could lead to a potentially higher ceiling.
With two first rd picks, id take a chance on that type of player.
_________________
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
JDBrocks
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Posts: 4813
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| vikingsrule wrote: | | JDBrocks wrote: | | I'm not saying I wouldn't draft him, just that I wouldn't trade up for him. He doesn't look like a transcendent talent worth sacrificing other picks in a deep draft from picks in the 20-55 range. |
Youre probably not going to find a transcendent talent in that 15-18 range, Randy Moss only happens once every blue moon.
Youre going to get flawed prospects either way. You have to ask why each of these players are falling in the first place.
From a physical standpoint, Rhodes, Floyd, Patterson and Milliner have it all. They are all incredible athletes who have shown excellent football ability. Floyd and Patterson may be a bit more raw and unfinished, but they also have a lot more to build on too, which could lead to a potentially higher ceiling.
With two first rd picks, id take a chance on that type of player. |
Is the difference between Allen and Patterson that big for you? It isn't for me, but everyone evaluates talent differently, so I could understand if it was. That's all that I was saying - it isn't woth losing another potential starter to upgrade from Allen to Patterson.
_________________
| Josh Ritter wrote: | | I became a thin blue wire, that held the world above the fire |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
JMac79
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 2511
Location: St. Anthony, MN
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| JDBrocks wrote: | | I'm not saying I wouldn't draft him, just that I wouldn't trade up for him. He doesn't look like a transcendent talent worth sacrificing other picks in a deep draft from picks in the 20-55 range. |
I really kind of agree with this... maybe "transcendent" isn't the right term for the type of talent to trade up for, but there is just something about Patterson (and a lot of the other guys mentioned) that is just a bit off from top-10 or -15 players in some past drafts. I think Patterson, Rhodes, Miliner, and Floyd are all very talented prospects, but none of them really excite me to the point where I'd want to give up picks in a deep latter third of the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd rounds. With the departure of Winfield (and the relatively unproven nature of Cook and Robinson) I'd maybe consider it for Miliner or Rhodes if the FO is really sold on one of them, but otherwise I think I'd rather keep my picks and go for quantity. I'm just not sure that the dropoff is that significant between the top half of the 1st round and its bottom half.
_________________
| DJC71 wrote: | | That's like asking if I'd still buy my ex-wife flowers on our anniversary after she left me for another dude. Heck no. I hope she gets bedbugs. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Klomp
Joined: 11 Aug 2011
Posts: 3526
Location: The Home of Schwan's Ice Cream
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
I'd trade up for Sheldon Richardson, but that's about it.
And if we do trade up, I see us then trading down from 25 into the 2nd.
_________________
2013 Adopt-a-Viking: FB Jerome Felton - |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Cantwin1
Joined: 10 Jul 2010
Posts: 150
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:40 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| JMac79 wrote: | | JDBrocks wrote: | | I'm not saying I wouldn't draft him, just that I wouldn't trade up for him. He doesn't look like a transcendent talent worth sacrificing other picks in a deep draft from picks in the 20-55 range. |
I really kind of agree with this... maybe "transcendent" isn't the right term for the type of talent to trade up for, but there is just something about Patterson (and a lot of the other guys mentioned) that is just a bit off from top-10 or -15 players in some past drafts. I think Patterson, Rhodes, Miliner, and Floyd are all very talented prospects, but none of them really excite me to the point where I'd want to give up picks in a deep latter third of the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd rounds. With the departure of Winfield (and the relatively unproven nature of Cook and Robinson) I'd maybe consider it for Miliner or Rhodes if the FO is really sold on one of them, but otherwise I think I'd rather keep my picks and go for quantity. I'm just not sure that the dropoff is that significant between the top half of the 1st round and its bottom half. |
Nicely said. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
JDBrocks
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Posts: 4813
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:43 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| JMac79 wrote: | | I really kind of agree with this... maybe "transcendent" isn't the right term |
Yeah, that was a strong term. None of those guys are a significant upgrade from their peers at the position to warrant a trade up.
_________________
| Josh Ritter wrote: | | I became a thin blue wire, that held the world above the fire |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vikingsrule
Joined: 15 Nov 2005
Posts: 39758
Location: Land of 10,000 Lakes!
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 9:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| JDBrocks wrote: | | vikingsrule wrote: | | JDBrocks wrote: | | I'm not saying I wouldn't draft him, just that I wouldn't trade up for him. He doesn't look like a transcendent talent worth sacrificing other picks in a deep draft from picks in the 20-55 range. |
Youre probably not going to find a transcendent talent in that 15-18 range, Randy Moss only happens once every blue moon.
Youre going to get flawed prospects either way. You have to ask why each of these players are falling in the first place.
From a physical standpoint, Rhodes, Floyd, Patterson and Milliner have it all. They are all incredible athletes who have shown excellent football ability. Floyd and Patterson may be a bit more raw and unfinished, but they also have a lot more to build on too, which could lead to a potentially higher ceiling.
With two first rd picks, id take a chance on that type of player. |
Is the difference between Allen and Patterson that big for you? It isn't for me, but everyone evaluates talent differently, so I could understand if it was. That's all that I was saying - it isn't woth losing another potential starter to upgrade from Allen to Patterson. |
Allen and Patterson are hard to compare, they really have different skill sets. I see Allen more of a possession receiver at the next level who really may not offer many explosive big plays. I almost see him a young Michael Jenkins type.
Patterson has game breaking ability, the ability to take a short gain and make a big play out of it. He definitely has the speed and leaping ability to take the top off the defense and be a threat down field.
Allen is more polished, Patterson has more upside. That is what it comes down to for me. If I am trading up in the draft, I want a player with significant upside. Otherwise, MN is better off just staying put with there picks.
_________________
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Purplexing
Joined: 13 Jan 2008
Posts: 3679
Location: Outside Valhalla, looking in.
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 9:32 am Post subject: Re: What To Do If????????? |
|
|
|
| chuck44 wrote: | Every year there are a few players who drop in the draft. Picks 16-18 are valued at 1000,950,900 pts
Our pick at# 23 is 760pts...package that with our 4th from Detroit 100pts..our 3rd in 2014 from Seattle valued somewhere 60-80pts...throw in a 2-7th rd picks which we have 3....total 950-1000pts ...you have enough to move up.
We still keep our picks ..not giving up that much...liquidate some of the bottom end picks...plus you cant sign all of those picks we have and be cap friendly..
So in review we:
Trade pick RD1 #23 our 4th rd(detroit), 2014 3rd(seattlle) 2-7th rd picks
to move to the 16-18 range to pick
either
Alec Ogltree
or
Star Lotulelei
I believe one of these guys could easily fall to the 16-18 range
Do you pull the trigger???? |
If they dropped that far, I'd assume it was because of some issues that reduced their draft day value over their prior perceived value.
So, I'd wait for one or both to drop to 23.
Then I'd pass on one or both.
Then I'd wait to see if they are available at 25.
Then I'd pass on one or both.
The issues that caused them to drop so far remain the same, regardless of their draft position.
Spielman won't risk 1 valuable draft pick, let alone the 4 you chose to exchange for a 'questionable player'. This trade might sound good to a fan of a particular player who fell for agent-hype. But the man making the decision is being paid well to make the best decisions, and could lose a huge salary if he makes the wrong decision(s) on a whim, based on agent-hype.
Assume one plays well after you draft him. But he break a leg, like EJ Henderson, or an ankle, Griffin?, in his 2nd or 3rd year, and is out of the NFL a year later. Then, 4 players you could have drafted are lost due to 1 injury. Too many eggs placed in 1 basket.
What would you do if you were paid as well as Spielman to make the decision on the trade and selection you posited, and your job depended on Ogletree or Lotuleli succeeding?
Yeah, me too.
_________________
When we stop to think about it, most folks behavior isn't perplexing after all. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
rpmwr19
Joined: 23 Dec 2006
Posts: 17119
Location: Stillwater, MN
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 9:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
If Patterson didn't have a severe lack of intelligence I would consider moving up for him.
The old TVC means nothing at this point. We could probably move up for just the first and 4th. 7th round draft picks also barely affect the cap. We may need those.
_________________
Adopt a Viking - Erin Henderson
Stats: |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|
FAQ
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
