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Taking a Guard at 10
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Chocolateman78


Joined: 31 Dec 2006
Posts: 5426
PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 8:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TitanMan30 wrote:
TitanSS wrote:
Chocolateman78 wrote:
TitanSS wrote:
Why do you have to draft an OG in the first when you just got the best available one in free agency? Anyone we draft in the first 3 rounds would be a huge upgrade.

We get much better value out of a 3rd round guard than we do a guard at #10. This is the deepest the draft has ever been for the position, why take one in the top ten?


Because there's still a gaping hole at the other guard spot.
Because there's no guarantee that a one of the guys we want will be there in round 3.
Because we have shown very little ability to develop projects on the line lately.
Because you're not paying the #10 pick a ridiculous amount of money.
Because this team will go as far as CJ and Jake Locker carry them and they both need for the line to be at its best for them to reach their potential.
Because I'm tired of people assuming you can just plug anyone in at guard and make magic happen
Because despite the fact that people have watched how terrible our line has been for years (in correlation with us losing alot over that same timeframe) people still take the o-line for granted.
Because this manchild named JJ Watt (ie the next Warren Sapp) is in our division, and he has won defensive player of the year as a 23 year old in his second season. He's gonna be a nuisance to the Titans for a LONG time

should I go on?

Look I get that there will be some good defensive players around at #10. But I want an elite talent. I won't be mad if we go with Star, Ansah, Dee, or Floyd, if they're available, but I'd rather have Chance Warmack to plug in next to big country. Any other year I'd be vehemently against it, but its time. That could be the meanest, nastiest, strongest right side of any o-line in the league. Also I feel Warmack is much better than Decastro was last year.( stronger, played better competition)


Yes, go on.

We had historically one of the worst defenses the franchise has ever fielded last year and this is the deepest the draft will ever be for the OG position.

The paragraph above should be enough to make anyone realize you draft defense in the first.

If CJ needs the best offensive line in football to be worth a damn then why are we paying him? Warmack won't improve Locker's bad accuracy. 3rd and managable will help him out, but none of that is going to matter if our defense is still giving up 38 points.

You can go on and on all you want. There will be tons of talent in the 2nd round and, yes, even in the 3rd round at the position. You can run the ball all day, but if you're giving up scores early and often that one OG doesn't matter.


Brother. You're not thinking outside the box. Most people look at it like. Woah our defense stinks. We need to draft defense. Our offense was pathetic last year and forced our defense to stay on the field until they were ready to puke. Wanna upgrade your defense without even drafting a defender? Draft an offensive line so you can pound the ball and rack up time of possession. So when your defense gets on the field they are fresh bro.



Exactly, it should come as no surprise that the years where we had the best defenses, were years where we were also among the top teams in the league in time of possession.
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-Hope-


Joined: 16 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TitanMan30 wrote:
Brother. You're not thinking outside the box. Most people look at it like. Woah our defense stinks. We need to draft defense. Our offense was pathetic last year and forced our defense to stay on the field until they were ready to puke. Wanna upgrade your defense without even drafting a defender? Draft an offensive line so you can pound the ball and rack up time of possession. So when your defense gets on the field they are fresh bro.

Look at our moves in free agency. We let go of a tight end with bad hands for another one with bad hands. Only our new guy can actually block and play a slew of positions. We also signed a bruising tailback to complement CJ. This front office wants to run a 2 back system and eat up time of possession and use its young gunslinger to slice up defenses with playaction and vertical throws.

New to the boards, eh? Welcome. You appear to be starting your FF career with some mighty fine posting. Wink

I completely agree with everything you just said. Time of possession (or, uh, lack thereof) was a major factor in our defensive struggles last season. Warmack provides an opportunity to definitively put it right.
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Ockham


Joined: 18 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trade pick 10 for Dallas' pick 18 and pick 47

or

Trade pick 10 and pick 40 for St. Louis' pick 16 and pick 22.
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TitanMan30


Joined: 15 Mar 2013
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

-Hope- wrote:
TitanMan30 wrote:
Brother. You're not thinking outside the box. Most people look at it like. Woah our defense stinks. We need to draft defense. Our offense was pathetic last year and forced our defense to stay on the field until they were ready to puke. Wanna upgrade your defense without even drafting a defender? Draft an offensive line so you can pound the ball and rack up time of possession. So when your defense gets on the field they are fresh bro.

Look at our moves in free agency. We let go of a tight end with bad hands for another one with bad hands. Only our new guy can actually block and play a slew of positions. We also signed a bruising tailback to complement CJ. This front office wants to run a 2 back system and eat up time of possession and use its young gunslinger to slice up defenses with playaction and vertical throws.

New to the boards, eh? Welcome. You appear to be starting your FF career with some mighty fine posting. Wink

I completely agree with everything you just said. Time of possession (or, uh, lack thereof) was a major factor in our defensive struggles last season. Warmack provides an opportunity to definitively put it right.


TY Hope. Appreciate Ya.
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MdTitansFan56


Joined: 31 Jul 2011
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With our off season additions would anyone be upset if we went Cordarrelle Patterson. I wouldn't be extremely upset if we did. Not saying he is number 1 on my board but I wouldn't die if we did it. I still think we should go Warmack at 10 if Ansah or Star are off the board. This will be an interesting draft. With all of our moves I don't think we are in dyer need for any one position at 10 now.
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KingTitan


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think our 1st rounder will be one of these guys.

WR
Austin, Tavon
Patterson, Cordarrelle

OG
Cooper, Jonathan

DT/DE
Ansah, Ezekiel
Jordan, Dion
Floyd, Sharrif
Lotulelei, Star

OLB/DE
Mingo, Barkevious


DB
Milliner, Dee
Trufant, Desmond
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Iceman88


Joined: 27 Jan 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KingTitan wrote:
I think our 1st rounder will be one of these guys.

WR
Austin, Tavon
Patterson, Cordarrelle

OG
Cooper, Jonathan

DT/DE
Ansah, Ezekiel
Jordan, Dion
Floyd, Sharrif
Lotulelei, Star

OLB/DE
Mingo, Barkevious


DB
Milliner, Dee
Trufant, Desmond


Lets trim this list

Ansah, Milliner, Lotulelei, trade down
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Dionysus


Joined: 23 May 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KingTitan wrote:
I think our 1st rounder will be one of these guys.

WR
Austin, Tavon
Patterson, Cordarrelle

OG
Cooper, Jonathan

DT/DE
Ansah, Ezekiel
Jordan, Dion
Floyd, Sharrif
Lotulelei, Star

OLB/DE
Mingo, Barkevious


DB
Milliner, Dee
Trufant, Desmond


The bold players would be my preferred choices out of those picks.
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ttitansfan4life


Joined: 30 Dec 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Iceman88 wrote:
KingTitan wrote:
I think our 1st rounder will be one of these guys.

WR
Austin, Tavon
Patterson, Cordarrelle

OG
Cooper, Jonathan

DT/DE
Ansah, Ezekiel
Jordan, Dion
Floyd, Sharrif
Lotulelei, Star

OLB/DE
Mingo, Barkevious


DB
Milliner, Dee
Trufant, Desmond


Lets trim this list

Ansah, Milliner, Lotulelei, trade down


Yea I can't see us taking Austin after taking pretty much the same kind of WR last year in Wright. Also can't see us taking Mingo because he is way undersized to play 4-3 DE(same goes for Jordan) Also would be a huge reach for Trufant at 10, rather have Rhodes. Don't see why just Cooper is up there and not Warmack?
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Flylow


Joined: 01 Feb 2011
Posts: 153
Location: Nashville, TN
PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KingTitan wrote:
I think our 1st rounder will be one of these guys.

WR
Austin, Tavon
Patterson, Cordarrelle

OG
Cooper, Jonathan

DT/DE
Ansah, Ezekiel
Jordan, Dion
Floyd, Sharrif
Lotulelei, Star

OLB/DE
Mingo, Barkevious


DB
Milliner, Dee
Trufant, Desmond



Nice list.

The way Wyatt keeps saying we are looking for "bigger" DEs, I'm starting to think we are going after a Dion Jordan or Bjoern Werner type DE. And since I doubt Dion Jordan makes it out of the top 5. I'm starting to think Werner might be the pick at 10, or even if we were to trade down. Since a team could trade up for a OT (Maybe Dolphins jump SD) or WR (like Rams/Vikings), which would make a Werner pick more valuable for those that like to use that value system for picks.


If Werner is indeed the pick, I could easily see this being the Titans draft for the top 3 rounds.


10. Bjoern Werner
40. Desmond Trufant
70. Ryan Swope
97. Brain Winters


Not sure about Werner at 10, but I just have a feeling that is the pick..
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Iceman88


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flylow wrote:


Nice list.

The way Wyatt keeps saying we are looking for "bigger" DEs, I'm starting to think we are going after a Dion Jordan or Bjoern Werner type DE. And since I doubt Dion Jordan makes it out of the top 5. I'm starting to think Werner might be the pick at 10, or even if we were to trade down. Since a team could trade up for a OT (Maybe Dolphins jump SD) or WR (like Rams/Vikings), which would make a Werner pick more valuable for those that like to use that value system for picks.


If Werner is indeed the pick, I could easily see this being the Titans draft for the top 3 rounds.


10. Bjoern Werner
40. Desmond Trufant
70. Ryan Swope
97. Brain Winters


Not sure about Werner at 10, but I just have a feeling that is the pick..


I wouldnt mind Werner at #10, but fyi Dion Jordan is not the "big" DE we are looking for we are talking about tall and bigger in terms of muscle and weight. They gave Matt Shaughnessy as an example who happens to be 6'5" 285. While Werner is closer to that Jordan is not he is much more of a 3-4 OLB than a big DE. Guys in the draft that would fit as a bigger DE are Datone Jones, Alex Okafor, Tank Carradine and Margus Hunt.
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KingTitan


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ttitansfan4life wrote:
Iceman88 wrote:
KingTitan wrote:
I think our 1st rounder will be one of these guys.

WR
Austin, Tavon
Patterson, Cordarrelle

OG
Cooper, Jonathan

DT/DE
Ansah, Ezekiel
Jordan, Dion
Floyd, Sharrif
Lotulelei, Star

OLB/DE
Mingo, Barkevious


DB
Milliner, Dee
Trufant, Desmond


Lets trim this list

Ansah, Milliner, Lotulelei, trade down


Yea I can't see us taking Austin after taking pretty much the same kind of WR last year in Wright. Also can't see us taking Mingo because he is way undersized to play 4-3 DE(same goes for Jordan) Also would be a huge reach for Trufant at 10, rather have Rhodes. Don't see why just Cooper is up there and not Warmack?


I can see Austin because he just would be a player that isn't available later on in the draft. Only one matches or comes close to his skill and that is Patterson. I think it would take that for us to take a WR in the 1st. Someone with so much playmaking ability oozing from them, making it hard to pass up.

Cause I think if we take an OG, which everyone knows I'd hate. It would be Cooper. He fits in better in my opinion.

With the undersized guys, I don't think they would care as long as they could get to the QB. Just a feeling on that one.
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Iceman88


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KingTitan wrote:
ttitansfan4life wrote:
Iceman88 wrote:
KingTitan wrote:
I think our 1st rounder will be one of these guys.

WR
Austin, Tavon
Patterson, Cordarrelle

OG
Cooper, Jonathan

DT/DE
Ansah, Ezekiel
Jordan, Dion
Floyd, Sharrif
Lotulelei, Star

OLB/DE
Mingo, Barkevious


DB
Milliner, Dee
Trufant, Desmond


Lets trim this list

Ansah, Milliner, Lotulelei, trade down


Yea I can't see us taking Austin after taking pretty much the same kind of WR last year in Wright. Also can't see us taking Mingo because he is way undersized to play 4-3 DE(same goes for Jordan) Also would be a huge reach for Trufant at 10, rather have Rhodes. Don't see why just Cooper is up there and not Warmack?


I can see Austin because he just would be a player that isn't available later on in the draft. Only one matches or comes close to his skill and that is Patterson. I think it would take that for us to take a WR in the 1st. Someone with so much playmaking ability oozing from them, making it hard to pass up.

Cause I think if we take an OG, which everyone knows I'd hate. It would be Cooper. He fits in better in my opinion.

With the undersized guys, I don't think they would care as long as they could get to the QB. Just a feeling on that one.


I wouldnt hate guard at 10 and the only reason that we take Cooper at #10 is if we are not certain that Velasco can cut it because he can play any interior line position. Honestly Warmack is the best player in this draft and if he was a tackle there would be no discussion he would go #1 overall. If we are going G then it should be Warmack.
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KingTitan


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Iceman88 wrote:
I wouldnt hate guard at 10 and the only reason that we take Cooper at #10 is if we are not certain that Velasco can cut it because he can play any interior line position. Honestly Warmack is the best player in this draft and if he was a tackle there would be no discussion he would go #1 overall. If we are going G then it should be Warmack.


Cooper is just as big and as strong, but moves better. It would open up so many more plays in my mind.

Pulling plays to the left or right with Levitre and Cooper. Screens.

Cooper adds value with being able to play Center too. While Warmack is just an OG and maybe only an LG? Where we just signed Levitre.

He is a better version of Velasco. Velsaco can play all 3 interior spots too...I don't think Cooper effects Velasco.

Cooper to me, makes more sense for this team. Not saying he is the better OG, even though its 1A and 1B to me... just Cooper is the better fit for our team and our zone based scheme.
Warmack is more power run based.
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Iceman88


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KingTitan wrote:
Iceman88 wrote:
I wouldnt hate guard at 10 and the only reason that we take Cooper at #10 is if we are not certain that Velasco can cut it because he can play any interior line position. Honestly Warmack is the best player in this draft and if he was a tackle there would be no discussion he would go #1 overall. If we are going G then it should be Warmack.


Cooper is just as big and as strong, but moves better. It would open up so many more plays in my mind.

Pulling plays to the left or right with Levitre and Cooper. Screens.

Cooper adds value with being able to play Center too. While Warmack is just an OG and maybe only an LG? Where we just signed Levitre.

He is a better version of Velasco. Velsaco can play all 3 interior spots too...I don't think Cooper effects Velasco.

Cooper to me, makes more sense for this team. Not saying he is the better OG, even though its 1A and 1B to me... just Cooper is the better fit for our team and our zone based scheme.
Warmack is more power run based.


O I dont disagree that Cooper is more versatile and a better fit for the scheme, to me its just tough to pass on the best player in this draft. I would love to move down a couple spots and get Cooper but I just think that Warmack is the only guard that could be considered a top 10 pick.
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