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2013 Panthers pre-draft thread
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Zithers


Joined: 15 Aug 2010
Posts: 1966
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 6:46 pm    Post subject: 2013 Panthers pre-draft thread Reply with quote

Let's disagree about who we want!!!

So far I've seen that we've worked out DeAndre Hopkins, Tavon Austin, and Sharrif Floyd.

Unlikely Floyd drops to us. Austin looks like he'll be a good player but I don't really want to take a slot guy/returner at 14th. And don't compare him to Smitty. Hopkins could be the pick if we trade back.

Does anyone have NFL comparisons for these guys (or other potential first rounders)? Read Percy Harvin and Roddy White for the two wideouts. Wondering about other input as I don't watch college ball.

I'd be down with a WR, OL, DT, or S in the first. Would rather grab veterans for the corner position and let Josh Norman, James Dockery, and Josh Thomas show if they're worthy. Also wouldn't oppose a DE since Greg Hardy is going to command a lot of money and having a three man rotation of Charles Johnson, Frank Alexander, and... Bjoern Werner or whoever sounds nice.

Here's our picks btw:

1/14
2/44
3/74... traded for Frank Alexander
4/105
5/141
6/172
7/203... traded for Louis Murphy

We need to find a way to get more picks... later in draft we could take a SAM backer, kicker, or tight end. Would rather not take a WR late... I want a potential #1 or nothing.

So yeah. What do you guys think?
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james.mcmurry13


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hopkins I think is a lot like Roddy White. Not the fastest guy, but he's tough and gets plenty of separation.

Some people liken Tavon Austin to our Steve Smith, I just don't think he's anywhere near as tough. I think his teammate Stedman Bailey is a much better Smith comparison, and I think we might look at him in the 2nd.


There are very few players I like for us at 14. I feel like we'll end up taking someone who I would consider a reach. Lane Johnson and Chance Warmack are the 2 that I think are good value for us. Johnson could easily be gone, and I doubt we'd take Warmack.

Some "reach" picks that I'd like are Johnathan Cyprien (I'm really hoping Vaccaro is gone), DeAndre Hopkins, and Kawaan Short.

I'm pretty averse to the chances of us taking a DT in round one. Star won't be there unless the heart is a real issue, and in that case we should stay away. I don't like Floyd or Richardson's fit for us. Kawaan Short is the realistic guy that I like for us, but I doubt that we'll consider him at 14.

I'm sort of neutral on a corner in the first. Rhodes and Trufant would be the 2 options, and I think of them Rhodes is a much better choice.
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Zithers


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We're working out Ryan Nassib.

This frightens me.

To sort of make up for it, we also worked out Lane Johnson.
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boondock


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 3:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zithers wrote:
We're working out Ryan Nassib.

This frightens me.

To sort of make up for it, we also worked out Lane Johnson.


Nassib would probably be a late round pick for us, like 5th or lower to sit into that backup QB role for a few years. He probably won't slide out of the 3rd though.
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Moody


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 10:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really can't stress how much I don't believe a smaller WR helps Cam. Smith is not only an anomaly for his production but also his insane durability. Being tough is a part of it but you can't tough your way out of injuries.


If a WR doesn't have the potential to become great at the back shoulder fade then I'm not interested. Hopkins currently seems like the best fit for this.
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Zithers


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We are working out Stedman Bailey tmrw w/ Tavon.
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james.mcmurry13


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zithers wrote:
We are working out Stedman Bailey tmrw w/ Tavon.


If we pass on Hopkins/Austin in the first, I think Bailey is a great option in the 2nd.
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johnydtarheel


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 8:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Joe Person ‏@josephperson
Been pushing this for weeks. RT @James_Dator: Gross's replacement on horizon? Lane Johnson to work out for #Panthers http://sbn.to/10PVGTg

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james.mcmurry13


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 8:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

johnydtarheel wrote:
Quote:
Joe Person ‏@josephperson
Been pushing this for weeks. RT @James_Dator: Gross's replacement on horizon? Lane Johnson to work out for #Panthers http://sbn.to/10PVGTg


You could make a 24 hour montage of all the times I've said this, but if Johnson is there at 14, he's a no-brainer pick for us.
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boondock


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

james.mcmurry13 wrote:
johnydtarheel wrote:
Quote:
Joe Person ‏@josephperson
Been pushing this for weeks. RT @James_Dator: Gross's replacement on horizon? Lane Johnson to work out for #Panthers http://sbn.to/10PVGTg


You could make a 24 hour montage of all the times I've said this, but if Johnson is there at 14, he's a no-brainer pick for us.


It's going to be our most effective pick to and essentially fix 2 positions for next season. Slide Gross to RT and have Johnson start at LT, OR vice verse until Johnson gets a hold of the pro game.
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james.mcmurry13


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

boondock wrote:
james.mcmurry13 wrote:
johnydtarheel wrote:
Quote:
Joe Person ‏@josephperson
Been pushing this for weeks. RT @James_Dator: Gross's replacement on horizon? Lane Johnson to work out for #Panthers http://sbn.to/10PVGTg


You could make a 24 hour montage of all the times I've said this, but if Johnson is there at 14, he's a no-brainer pick for us.


It's going to be our most effective pick to and essentially fix 2 positions for next season. Slide Gross to RT and have Johnson start at LT, OR vice verse until Johnson gets a hold of the pro game.


I think it would end up similar to how Dallas went with Tyron Smith. RT for a year, then flip the tackles (although in our case, Gross might be gone after another year).
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fretgod99


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 10:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

james.mcmurry13 wrote:
boondock wrote:
james.mcmurry13 wrote:
johnydtarheel wrote:
Quote:
Joe Person ‏@josephperson
Been pushing this for weeks. RT @James_Dator: Gross's replacement on horizon? Lane Johnson to work out for #Panthers http://sbn.to/10PVGTg
You could make a 24 hour montage of all the times I've said this, but if Johnson is there at 14, he's a no-brainer pick for us.
It's going to be our most effective pick to and essentially fix 2 positions for next season. Slide Gross to RT and have Johnson start at LT, OR vice verse until Johnson gets a hold of the pro game.
I think it would end up similar to how Dallas went with Tyron Smith. RT for a year, then flip the tackles (although in our case, Gross might be gone after another year).
Question: If you legitimately think that Lane Johnson is going to be the solution at LT for the next 6+ years, do you consider trading up to get him? For instance, would you be willing to give up 14 and 74 to move up to 9 or 10?

I'm not a big fan of trading picks to move up, especially since we've still got a few holes to fill. However, it's conceivable that the 3-4 teams ahead of us might rate him as the BPA at that point. And, a few of the teams after us might like him enough to give up a pick to jump us. If that's the case, you've got to consider it, I think. If you legitimately think you're going to land a high-level LT who'll be around for the next 6-10 years (like Gross has been), I think that is absolutely worth a first and a third.

The first question is if you think he's that good. The second question is, even if he's that good, do you think he'd help your team more than whomever else you think would be available at 14 in addition to whomever you could possibly get at 74. I frankly don't know. But, if they made a move like that on draft day, I honestly can't say I'd have a huge problem with it (though I know a number of fans on this board would probably be livid).

EDIT: Bah, spaced we traded the third last year. It'd probably take at least our 4th and 5th (though that might not be enough). Or, our 2nd next year (with maybe some late picks through in either way). I like the idea of trading future picks even less, but the question still remains.
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james.mcmurry13


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 10:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If we had 74, I'd be all for moving up. But Frank Alexander reigns supreme.

Even still, if we could make a deal to jump the Chargers, the only way I'd resist would be if its giving up this year's second or next year's first.

And I do think he's that good. So long as he's allowed to ease into things (RT), he should become a staple at left tackle for whatever team he winds up with.

As for moving up for him v staying put for someone else, I'd move up. He's a better value at...say...9, than Richardson/Vaccaro are at 14. If we stay put at 14 and Johnson is gone, whoever we take will either be a reach or a much lesser need.

EDIT: There have been 2 rumors floating around that help our chances of landing him outright. The first is that teams see this as a weak draft, and moving up might be cheaper than usual. The second, a run on QB's. If the standard projection of one top 10 QB holds true, I doubt we'll be getting anyone at value. But if three were taken before our pick, that greatly increases our chances at anyone. Though, with a division rival before and after us, expect them to do their worst and screw up our plans Sad
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faccda01


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No Sheldon Richardson mentioned so far, am I missing something?

Also, by no means should we trade up. If anything we need to trade back. This draft class is filled with depth, but very weak at the top. We've also seen how much trouble trading up gets us. We've lost two #1s, and the first overall pick of the second round, all for trading up for players that aren't even on the roster anymore (Otah, Brown, soon to be Edwards).

Look at the successful teams, NE, SF, etc. They stock up on picks, so if they need to trade up they have the ammo to do it without mortgaging the future. If they don't trade up, they have ample picks. The odds of a team finding a good player increase with the amount of picks they have.
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fretgod99


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

faccda01 wrote:
No Sheldon Richardson mentioned so far, am I missing something?

Also, by no means should we trade up. If anything we need to trade back. This draft class is filled with depth, but very weak at the top. We've also seen how much trouble trading up gets us. We've lost two #1s, and the first overall pick of the second round, all for trading up for players that aren't even on the roster anymore (Otah, Brown, soon to be Edwards).

Look at the successful teams, NE, SF, etc. They stock up on picks, so if they need to trade up they have the ammo to do it without mortgaging the future. If they don't trade up, they have ample picks. The odds of a team finding a good player increase with the amount of picks they have.
Interestingly, New England traded up last year. Twice.

27 to 21. And back into the first round at 25.

And the Steelers (another "this is what we should be like" franchise) were about to trade up last year to take DeCastro until the Seahawks took Irvin (one of the two players the Jets - the to-be trade partner - wanted).

So, yes, it does happen. The idea of preferring more picks is generally a good one, I think. But an absolute prohibition on trading up is a bad idea. If you have the opportunity to take someone whom you think will be a franchise player, it absolutely can be worth the risk of losing your chance on potentially 2 or 3 players who might be contributors or, in very rare circumstances, stars.

There's also a difference between trading future picks and trading picks within a draft, I think.

However, I think if you have the opportunity to get a guy you think is essentially going to be what Jordan Gross has been (for the most part of his career, a top flight offensive tackle, pro bowl player, and mainstay on your offensive line for a decade), I'd make that trade and not even think twice about it. A perennial quality starter at LT for a mid-first round pick and the equivalent of a mid-third round pick? Hell yes. Sign me up for that.

If you don't think Johnson is likely to turn out to be that player, then obviously you don't make the trade.
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