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wackywabbit 
Joined: 20 Dec 2009 Posts: 3838
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Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:21 pm Post subject: |
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| jpeter15 wrote: | | StRawz11 wrote: | | PFT said they are getting the sense that the Ravens don't even want Ed Reed back. Color me confused as [inappropriate/removed] as to what Ozzie is thinking |
PFT also said Pollard was an instigator with the whole "mutiny" against Harbaugh last year. That makes a lot of sense as to why we would dump him. Harbaugh has history of dumping guys that are in his doghouse. |
What history?
The only guy I knew of in his doghouse was Ellerbe and we wanted him back at the right price. Ozzie has all but guaranteed we'd make an effort to retain Reed. If he walks it's only because another team offered him more. _________________
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diamondbull424 
 Joined: 02 Dec 2007 Posts: 10016 Location: Baltimore, MD
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Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:23 pm Post subject: |
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So not only was he instigating things with the media, but he was instigating things in the locker room as well... gone. He really wasn't as good of a player as he, himself, believed he was. Sure his pairing with Reed produced a nice safety duo, but he had too many flaws to be calling anyone out. Maybe him being cut will teach him to carry himself with more class.
I think an underrated reason as to why we might be making these moves is that with Ray gone, we can't have the "leaders" on the team simply being the loudest voices. We need guys that are going to be able to pick the team up with their play and understand how to carry themselves to keep morale high.
And Reed was always another guy to "speak his mind"- like with calling out Flacco a couple years back. Would I like to have him back for his coverage and leadership in the secondary, sure, but it's really not that big of a deal. Between not knowing if he wants to retire/not retire, complaining about his contract, calling out teammates, and now- apparently instigating a mutiny... along with his declining play... he's just not worth fretting too much over. I want him to retire with us and be a lifetime Raven, but we got a chance to have Reed go out on top- as a Raven and win a ring... he's a HOF player, but at this point, we're not obligated to him any longer. He's not Ray Lewis. He's a great on-field leader, but off-the-field, he's not as responsible as you'd want your Alpha leader to be. Not saying we SHOULDN'T make every attempt to bring him back, but if he's not back, I won't be as depressed as I was when I heard Ray Lewis was retiring. Reed never had the same impact on me as Lewis. But he's still a top 10 safety in this game IMO. _________________
Blind arrogance sows the field of it's own destruction. - Commander Greil, Fire Emblem
Last edited by diamondbull424 on Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:26 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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BaltimoreTerp 

Joined: 13 Feb 2005 Posts: 24816 Location: Brooklyn, New York
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Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:25 pm Post subject: |
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I think connecting this to the so-called 'mutiny' is just tabloid fodder. Florio has nothing to connect it to this release except an article that has already been out there for several months, not an actual source saying that it played a part. It's just baseless speculation until proven otherwise. _________________ "The really important kind of freedom involves attention, and awareness, and discipline, and effort, and being able truly to care about other people and to sacrifice for them, over and over, in myriad petty little unsexy ways, every day.” |
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diamondbull424 
 Joined: 02 Dec 2007 Posts: 10016 Location: Baltimore, MD
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Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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| wackywabbit wrote: | | jpeter15 wrote: | | StRawz11 wrote: | | PFT said they are getting the sense that the Ravens don't even want Ed Reed back. Color me confused as [inappropriate/removed] as to what Ozzie is thinking |
PFT also said Pollard was an instigator with the whole "mutiny" against Harbaugh last year. That makes a lot of sense as to why we would dump him. Harbaugh has history of dumping guys that are in his doghouse. |
What history?
The only guy I knew of in his doghouse was Ellerbe and we wanted him back at the right price. Ozzie has all but guaranteed we'd make an effort to retain Reed. If he walks it's only because another team offered him more. |
I know Jared Gaither was another name that was in the Harbaugh doghouse... and McKinnie was in the doghouse this season as well... so basically players who had Allen Iverson syndrome. Didn't like to practice/prepare as hard, but were 'naturals' and played well in the games.
It may not seem like much, but practicing well raises the level of the whole team. So playing well, but practicing half arsed is only benefiting the individual, not the team. And in the long run hurts the individual too. So I have no gripe with Harbaugh seeking to discipline guys who think they're above the team by, essentially, putting them in time out. _________________
Blind arrogance sows the field of it's own destruction. - Commander Greil, Fire Emblem |
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wackywabbit 
Joined: 20 Dec 2009 Posts: 3838
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Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:36 pm Post subject: |
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^^Agreed. And how is Reed not a good off the field leader? No one takes preparation for the game more seriously. _________________
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diamondbull424 
 Joined: 02 Dec 2007 Posts: 10016 Location: Baltimore, MD
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Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:41 pm Post subject: |
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| coordinator0 wrote: | | I'm big on Cyprien too. It's hard to say where his value is at but at this point I wouldn't be upset if he was Baltimore's pick at 32. |
Neither would I. Safety is now a big need... and I love football players with top shelf instincts... and he has them in spades. He also has the athleticism and COD skills that I think a top safety should have. If he played for Alabama, he'd probably be a top 15 pick. We might be able to trade down a little into the 2nd and still get him though... and with Elam likely in that area of the draft as well... and the potential for Vacarro to slide some... I think it could make sense to trade down and just take the best safety to fall.
As long as we skip out on Eric Reid, I'm good. He consistently takes some bad angles to the ball, has only above average instincts, and isn't as strong a tackler as I'd like to have. _________________
Blind arrogance sows the field of it's own destruction. - Commander Greil, Fire Emblem |
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drd23 
 Joined: 26 Oct 2010 Posts: 5000 Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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I do not understand this move.
Pollard wasn't old, so it can't be about "getting younger". It can't be about letting the youth get playing time considering that the only young safeties on the roster were either injured or started the year on the PS so they can't have shown all that much to justify releasing one of the better performing players on the D last year.
He must either have been incredibly destructive in the lockerroom (but they why haven't we heard anything sooner?) or the coaching staff need to take a spoonful of concrete and harden the **** up if they've seriously released him because of his personality.
Also, PFT (or whoever else for that matter) can blame the "mutiny' all they want, but the fact is that whatever happened happened for the good of the team. The team played a hell of a lot better after that from what I recall. _________________
db424 on the sig! |
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wwhickok 
Joined: 27 Nov 2012 Posts: 2235 Location: Williamsport, PA
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Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 5:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Ed Reed is headed to Houston tomorrow to meet with them. Early speculation is that there is a very good chance that he signs with them. |
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diamondbull424 
 Joined: 02 Dec 2007 Posts: 10016 Location: Baltimore, MD
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Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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| wackywabbit wrote: | | ^^Agreed. And how is Reed not a good off the field leader? No one takes preparation for the game more seriously. |
And this is how the media stays in business.
Where did I say Reed wasn't a 'good' off-the-field leader? Find it and I'll pay you a penny. Even before I made my edit (which was a nano-edit to further clarify my position), I didn't ever mention anything about him not being a good leader in that respect.
What I said was this, "he's not as responsible as you'd want your Alpha leader to be."
With Ray gone there is no one higher on the locker room chain to corall the guys after Reed goes off on one of his tangents to the media about- whatever his next tangent could be about... and they all seem to come at the worst times, the times when the Alpha leader should be trying to reign the guys in. Reed is a great leader in the secondary, he's a great 'beta' type leader. A 2nd in command. He can be the 'voice' of a locker room, the cool guy, while the Alpha dog cracks the whip.
But with Reed being the elderstatesman, he'll most likely assume the Alpha role of leader of the defense... meaning, he can't be as reckless as he's been for much of his career in terms of his dealings with the media. He needs to be more responsible and think of team morale before speaking. Because if he doesn't, his words can have a very strong impact on a locker room without a true alpha around to galvinize a weaknened locker room. _________________
Blind arrogance sows the field of it's own destruction. - Commander Greil, Fire Emblem |
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RavensTillIDie 
 Joined: 14 Jan 2007 Posts: 10837 Location: ----------------- Props to Jamison. on the dope signature!!!!!!!!!!
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Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 6:31 pm Post subject: |
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Well, on the bright side we're one step closer to Clowney in 2014.
#InOzzieWeTrust!!
 _________________
 | EliteTexan80 wrote: | | If this site represents "average" then yes. There are times where I forgo saying things because I'm afraid some of you will make me dumber. |
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sp6488 
Joined: 14 Mar 2005 Posts: 6230 Location: MD
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Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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| RavensTillIDie wrote: | Well, on the bright side we're one step closer to Clowney in 2014.
#InOzzieWeTrust!!
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Your tongue better be so far in your cheek... _________________
| Tzimisce wrote: | I'm sorry you're drowning in a sea of delusion.
I won't be sorry when the Ravens finish 8-8. |
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RavensTillIDie 
 Joined: 14 Jan 2007 Posts: 10837 Location: ----------------- Props to Jamison. on the dope signature!!!!!!!!!!
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Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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| sp6488 wrote: | | RavensTillIDie wrote: | Well, on the bright side we're one step closer to Clowney in 2014.
#InOzzieWeTrust!!
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Your tongue better be so far in your cheek... |
But, but, but...Clowney!!
Fine, guess I'll take another super bowl. *sigh* _________________
 | EliteTexan80 wrote: | | If this site represents "average" then yes. There are times where I forgo saying things because I'm afraid some of you will make me dumber. |
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nevermore 
Joined: 30 Sep 2008 Posts: 5610 Location: Austria
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Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:45 am Post subject: |
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This one I genuinely don't get. _________________
| SnA ExclusiVe wrote: | | DOES ANYONE ON THIS SITE EVEN KNOW WHO PLAYS ON THE RAVENS DEFENSE?! |
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Sassan11
Joined: 05 Aug 2010 Posts: 1131 Location: DMV
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Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:26 am Post subject: |
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In the past we had Ray Lewis who Harbaugh probably felt could keep these "mutiny" players in check. Now that we have lost our leader you can't be having the players run the show.
Its also a lot easier to keep troubled/headcase players when you have a chance at a superbowl. Maybe we know we won't be contenders this year and are rebuilding and don't want our young guys to have bad vets to learn from. |
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diamondbull424 
 Joined: 02 Dec 2007 Posts: 10016 Location: Baltimore, MD
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Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:06 am Post subject: |
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I forget who made the comment, but I think the most logical explanation for these moves that I've seen was the idea that we needed to clear immediate cap room.
Now you may say two things:
1. Well, it's only $1m why create a need for just $1m...
I think the most logical assertion here is that we're trying to address a need with the money we've freed up. The only need to player fit that I think makes sense is Ed Reed. He's visiting teams and he's shopping himself. Most likely, he'll eventually return to Ozzie with the highest price he was offered and we'll have a chance to match- similar to Welker with the Patriots. Because Boldin is away on a trip to Africa, as c0 mentioned in the FA thread, we haven't ACTUALLY been able to take his $6m off the books to give us room to work. So instead, we needed to clear some room to bring back Reed.
2. Well, why didn't we just trade Pollard then...
Well first off, we have no idea if they tried to trade him or not, perhaps he just didn't fetch back much if any value... or perhaps teams we were willing to deal with were willing to take him on. But even if we didn't try and trade him, it's likely because we needed the money cleared for Reed now. We couldn't afford to have Reed come back with an offer for us to match and be unable to match because we don't have enough cap or because Pollard trade talks haven't heated up. Cutting Pollard should put us at around the $4m mark that we would need to be at to resign Reed. And if its a choice between the two, we can more easily find players to fulfill Pollard's heavy hitting- lack of coverage skillset, than Reed's ability as a no tackling nuclear deterrent. Reed is also a lifetime Raven type player and the lieutenant leader along the defense.
------
I think the fact that Pollard was involved in the mutiny and his comments to the media throughout the season might have helped move him along, but I think bigger than that reason is the fact that when Pollard went down for three games we got a good look at what Jame Ihedigbo could do for our defense in his stead... and while he wasn't as good, we didn't miss much of a beat... was also a little better in covarage than Pollard... just not as hard a hitter (though he could still lay the wood).
Ihedigbo made Pollard expendable to a point. That and the upcoming crop of loaded safeties in this draft class with significantly better coverage range, skills, and speed to upgrade our safety play opposite Reed.
Also, the question might be asked:
3. Why not Vonta Leach?
Well Leach is the best player at his position in the league, so it'd be difficult to let him go from that vantage point. And we might be trying a more long term method with him such as an extension of some sort. _________________
Blind arrogance sows the field of it's own destruction. - Commander Greil, Fire Emblem |
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