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Winfield in the Wind
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rpmwr19


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://giggigoofer.blogspot.com/2011/09/do-not-feed-drama-llama.html


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Purplexing


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

vike daddy wrote:
Billy Spikes wrote:
***Update***
Quote:
Antoine Winfield's deal with #Seahawks is for 1 year, $3M with $1M guaranteed. He turned down a similar, fully guaranteed deal with #Vikings

i guess i don't understand how the two deals can be "similar" if one had $1M in guarantees and one had $3M. a third of a contract guaranteed versus 100% of one guaranteed? that's not similar.


Similar is not the same as same.

A not-guaranteed deal selected over a guaranteed deal of the same total money is similar to saying 'I like the lesser guarantee deal for another reason'. But it is not the same thing.
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vike daddy


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 12:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Purplexing wrote:
vike daddy wrote:
Billy Spikes wrote:
***Update***
Quote:
Antoine Winfield's deal with #Seahawks is for 1 year, $3M with $1M guaranteed. He turned down a similar, fully guaranteed deal with #Vikings

i guess i don't understand how the two deals can be "similar" if one had $1M in guarantees and one had $3M. a third of a contract guaranteed versus 100% of one guaranteed? that's not similar.

Similar is not the same as same.

i understand that. that's just basic vocabulary definitions. i never thought of them as being equal, identical, or the same.

but to me, they aren't similar either, if one is fully guaranteed. and one is not. they're only similar in that they are for one year (which is what Winfield wanted from either club) and the potential dollar payoff.

but given Winfield's recent penchant for breaking a bone here and there, you would think the guaranteed one is going to produce more bucks.
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twslhs20


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Purplexing wrote:
I don't know it. Link?

We don't know if Winfield forced the issue or if Spielman cut him as you claim, with the venom you claim Spielman had in doing so.

Another perfectly plausible theory is that Winfield knew he was declining and projected 1 more year of quality play in reduced PT to try to get a ring.

Seattle looks like an 'All-in' situation.

Winfield saw the Viking exodus and knows Rice, Harvin, etc. He may not believe in Ponder, et al.

So, anyone could also speculate that Winfield stood fast on his $7.2M salary when asked to renegotiate, in order to force Spielman to drop him and negotiate from a better leveraged position.


http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/blogs/197800971.html

Quote:
What made Winfield’s release all the more confusing for the cornerback and his agent is the lack of discussions that preceded it. At no point, during the league’s 87-hour negotiating window from Saturday through Tuesday where teams and agents could be in contact, was there any hint that Winfield could soon be on the street. No one from the Vikings front office even proposed a pay cut or contract restructuring.

Winfield and his agent knew, in this league, that’s always a possibility. But they didn’t expect, after nine seasons of service, that in the snap of two fingers, a loyal locker room leader would have a trap door opened beneath him.


http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/13/antoine-winfield-surprised-by-release-by-vikings/

Quote:
“After nine years in the organization, the cornerback believed he deserved better, that he was owed more. On top of that, the source said, contrary to other published reports, the Vikings never had formally proposed a possible restructuring of Winfield’s contract as a means of keeping him.”


He did diverse better. The reduced role was a ploy to gain leverage over him to restructure. You do that to a guy who has been a leader off and on the field for 9 years here? You do that to a guy who has been the lone consistent bright spot in a secondary that has never done anything but suck?

vike daddy wrote:
twslhs20 wrote:
Oh my fault. I guess I'm only allowed to come in here when they do something positive.

i don't know why you or anyone else says this.

no one said anything as to what you are allowed to have as an opinion, either pro or con. no one said you can't have the opinion you voiced. but if you voice such a bitter and rude one, you can expect to get a reaction, and other opinions reviewing it. that's what we do here, review each other's opinions.

that too, is allowed.


You're damn right I'm bitter. I'm mad as hell with the way this was handled. If you want the man to restructure, and he won't then cut him. It is a business. I understand that. The FO spit in his face.

Look at the contract he signed for

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000159618/article/antoine-winfield-chose-seahawks-over-vikings-money

Quote:
Winfield accepted a one-year contract worth $3 million with $1 million guaranteed from the Seattle Seahawks on Friday, a source involved in the process told NFL.com's Ian Rapoport. The Vikings offered him a similar contract with more guaranteed money, but Winfield decided to take his talents to the Pacific Northwest.

Rapoport learned there were some emotions involved for Winfield after he cut by the Vikings. Winfield wanted to retire a Viking and make Minnesota his permanent home, but he and his family will now live in Houston. He even contemplated retiring when he released. A chance at winning a possible Super Bowl title with the Seahawks ended up playing a factor in Winfield joining the team.


Clearly he is still bitter, and I don't blame him. Clearly money is of no concern to him. He might have restructure if he was asked, or it was even discussed.
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twslhs20


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rpmwr19 wrote:
http://giggigoofer.blogspot.com/2011/09/do-not-feed-drama-llama.html

[img]stuff[/img]



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Purplexing


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IMO, the need for a CB increases, but not to the extent that it exceeds that for a DT and MLB.

Perhaps it draws even with WR. Maybe just a notch below WR.

It will depend on the Vikings board, the players selected by other teams, etc.
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PrplChilPill


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The corners on this roster are either hurt, traded for a low round pick, or just plain bed. cB is a huge need, IMO.
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Purplexing


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/blogs/197800971.html

Winfield is 36 and the other players retained, such as Loadholt, Felton, etc. have many more years of service available to the Vikings, at lower costs. That makes Spielman's move a wise business decision.

Employment is at will of both parties. The Vikings do not owe Winfield any loyalty because he could find employment elsewhere if he were cut. He signed the contract, as did the Vikings. CBA rules allow the Vikings to void the contract.

If Spielman wasn't as courteous in his last meeting with Winfield as people believe he should have been, perhaps there is a good reason it didn't happen that way? That may need further research.... but I couldn't care less about it now. It's a done deal by Seattle.

Re: vike daddys' suggestion that an injury prone player should accept guaranteed money: disability insurance costs something, but can replace lost income due to a disabling injury. Winfield could buy $2M of disability insurance coverage from Lloyds or other providers.
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Purplexing


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PrplChilPill wrote:
The corners on this roster are either hurt, traded for a low round pick, or just plain bed. cB is a huge need, IMO.


bedridden? Laughing Wink
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vike daddy


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

twslhs20 wrote:
You're damn right I'm bitter. I'm mad as hell with the way this was handled.

i think it was a botched handling too, and i'm none too pleased he's no longer on the Vikings. it will take me quite a while to process it without some ire also.

the difference between us is that i'm not expressing the Vikings hopefully will crash and burn and that Winfield will win a ring and "rub their noses in it." that's just petty.

to each their own, and your view is "allowed" here to be expressed, contrary to your previous complaint and assertion it was not. there's no need to invent things that aren't true, or criticize our community when it is unfounded.
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rpmwr19


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

twslhs20 wrote:
Oh lets give that fat worthless RT top 5 RT money. Makes sense.

Vikings be damned. I hope 26 wins a ring and rubs their noses in it.

He won't because he is nothing but class, but I will still hold out hope.


Quote:


Appropriate.
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Freakout


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not even mad with the way it was handled. Winfield was my favorite Viking defender but it came down to having Winfield for 1 more year or having Loadholt for 5 more years.

Spielman did not exactly have time to re-negotiate a new contract with Winfield. He would have run the risk of losing Loadholt in the process. Then we are assuming that Winfield would have even agreed to take a big paycut.
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PrplChilPill


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Or, the much less important KWill could have been cut......
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vikingsrule


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PrplChilPill wrote:
Or, the much less important KWill could have been cut......


To the Vikings, Williams was obviously viewed as the more important player.
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PrplChilPill


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vikingsrule wrote:
PrplChilPill wrote:
Or, the much less important KWill could have been cut......


To the Vikings, Williams was obviously viewed as the more important player.


Even though DT is deep, and easier to play right away than corner. I disagree that cutting Winfield was the only way to sign a good, but not great, RT to huge money. I guess we will all see how we'll they cover three pass first teams this year.....
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