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SnA ExclusiVe


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 12:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

diamondbull424 wrote:
SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
DB: Haha, that's cute, you know how to post pictures and miscalculate PI. I remember when I was in middle school.

Bottom line is that you still don't know what you're talking about in regards to Boldin. He can and does generate separation, even without speed, and somehow that's too hard for most people to comprehend for some reason.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJETviUYRWc&NR=1&feature=endscreen
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUJqM9oZ2P8

How does he do that without speed? The answer is physicality and making good cuts and running good routes. There's more to getting open than just being fast.

Cool story bro... so you still didn't answer the question, where is the separation in the clips you just posted? He's working against a dud of an UDFA in Cassius Vaughn, yet still couldn't get separation against him. Vaughn is in Boldin's hip pocket when Flacco releases the ball for both of those throws. Heck on one he even trips, recovers and still is in position to make a play... just because Boldin abuses a player that is overmatched and has an outlier of a game because of it, doesn't mean he's separating. He did nothing more than make contested grabs over an incompetent defender.

So again, try again buddy... your logic is flawed. I mean, it's quite clear, you're the only one living in this fairytale existence where Boldin has two-three steps on a man whose running right next to him stride for stride (outside of when he trips and still has time to recover and reattach himself into Boldin's hip pocket).


In those particular clips he's not generating the ideal separation that you'd look for, but at his age he generates enough to qualify as open.

But, I digress. View it as you'd like. Boldin gets the job done, and that's all that matters. You throw a pass at him - he's going to catch it more often than not, whether he's open or not. I know for a fact he can get "open" and get "separation", albeit not as much as a guy like Torrey Smith can, but he still gets open enough to make plays, and that's my entire argument.
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Flaccomania


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
diamondbull424 wrote:
SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
DB: Haha, that's cute, you know how to post pictures and miscalculate PI. I remember when I was in middle school.

Bottom line is that you still don't know what you're talking about in regards to Boldin. He can and does generate separation, even without speed, and somehow that's too hard for most people to comprehend for some reason.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJETviUYRWc&NR=1&feature=endscreen
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUJqM9oZ2P8

How does he do that without speed? The answer is physicality and making good cuts and running good routes. There's more to getting open than just being fast.

Cool story bro... so you still didn't answer the question, where is the separation in the clips you just posted? He's working against a dud of an UDFA in Cassius Vaughn, yet still couldn't get separation against him. Vaughn is in Boldin's hip pocket when Flacco releases the ball for both of those throws. Heck on one he even trips, recovers and still is in position to make a play... just because Boldin abuses a player that is overmatched and has an outlier of a game because of it, doesn't mean he's separating. He did nothing more than make contested grabs over an incompetent defender.

So again, try again buddy... your logic is flawed. I mean, it's quite clear, you're the only one living in this fairytale existence where Boldin has two-three steps on a man whose running right next to him stride for stride (outside of when he trips and still has time to recover and reattach himself into Boldin's hip pocket).


In those particular clips he's not generating the ideal separation that you'd look for, but at his age he generates enough to qualify as open.

But, I digress. View it as you'd like. Boldin gets the job done, and that's all that matters. You throw a pass at him - he's going to catch it more often than not, whether he's open or not. I know for a fact he can get "open" and get "separation", albeit not as much as a guy like Torrey Smith can, but he still gets open enough to make plays, and that's my entire argument.


The bolded is pretty much the point. He gets "open enough" because his physicality allows him to fight for the ball and win at a higher rate than others. Likewise, which you've said all year, Boldin has to be used in a certain way in order to be "open enough" to make plays. Like BTerp said, that's basically ceding the point -- that due to his inability to gain separation consistently, he has to be used a specific way in order to be "open enough".
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SnA ExclusiVe


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flaccomania wrote:
SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
diamondbull424 wrote:
SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
DB: Haha, that's cute, you know how to post pictures and miscalculate PI. I remember when I was in middle school.

Bottom line is that you still don't know what you're talking about in regards to Boldin. He can and does generate separation, even without speed, and somehow that's too hard for most people to comprehend for some reason.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJETviUYRWc&NR=1&feature=endscreen
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUJqM9oZ2P8

How does he do that without speed? The answer is physicality and making good cuts and running good routes. There's more to getting open than just being fast.

Cool story bro... so you still didn't answer the question, where is the separation in the clips you just posted? He's working against a dud of an UDFA in Cassius Vaughn, yet still couldn't get separation against him. Vaughn is in Boldin's hip pocket when Flacco releases the ball for both of those throws. Heck on one he even trips, recovers and still is in position to make a play... just because Boldin abuses a player that is overmatched and has an outlier of a game because of it, doesn't mean he's separating. He did nothing more than make contested grabs over an incompetent defender.

So again, try again buddy... your logic is flawed. I mean, it's quite clear, you're the only one living in this fairytale existence where Boldin has two-three steps on a man whose running right next to him stride for stride (outside of when he trips and still has time to recover and reattach himself into Boldin's hip pocket).


In those particular clips he's not generating the ideal separation that you'd look for, but at his age he generates enough to qualify as open.

But, I digress. View it as you'd like. Boldin gets the job done, and that's all that matters. You throw a pass at him - he's going to catch it more often than not, whether he's open or not. I know for a fact he can get "open" and get "separation", albeit not as much as a guy like Torrey Smith can, but he still gets open enough to make plays, and that's my entire argument.


The bolded is pretty much the point. He gets "open enough" because his physicality allows him to fight for the ball and win at a higher rate than others. Likewise, which you've said all year, Boldin has to be used in a certain way in order to be "open enough" to make plays. Like BTerp said, that's basically ceding the point -- that due to his inability to gain separation consistently, he has to be used a specific way in order to be "open enough".


Which isn't bad because that specific way is just putting him in the slot and letting him work the middle of the field.
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I'd say he's [Dennis Pitta] the fourth best TE in the division... Cameron > Miller > Gresham > Eiffert = Pitta
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spiritoftruth


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So you guys (DB and BTerp) are basically saying... Boldin wasn't worth the additional 6 million for this year because he doesn't get separation like a true #1 WR should? And while a combo of Doss/Dickson/Reed... whoever we end up with, probably won't be able to become safety valves or trusted options for Flacco the way Boldin was, at least we won't be overpaying for chemistry?

If that is your argument, then we just disagree right there. That chemistry is worth 6 million, and will be sorely missed on 3rd down next season (and the contract was just until next season). It will make the team worse not having Boldin, and that 6 million saved which will now be used elsewhere, won't help the Ravens as much as Boldin would have this coming year.
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BaltimoreTerp


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 12:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
]Which isn't bad because that specific way is just putting him in the slot and letting him work the middle of the field.


That's the extremely dumbed down, simplistic way of explaining it.

Contrary to popular belief, Cam Cameron actually put Boldin in the slot quite often. And he ran plenty of routes over the middle of the field. Made plenty of plays that way as well. Not a ton. But some. It's not like Boldin ran his first slant route from the slot when Caldwell got into the booth.

What was missing when Cam was calling the plays was a greater overall play design. Things like the post route he used to score against NE and San Fran that I was talking about earlier, when Torrey's route cleared the middle intermediate part of the field by dragging Goldson over to him and the play design ended up isolating Boldin between Bowman (a good linebacker) and Whitner (a bad safety). And it was things like that where Boldin was able to excel. But it still took a lot. And often times, it took manufacturing a play to put Boldin in an open position, and quite frankly, if you have to work that hard to scheme a guy into open space, then it's not going to be an impossible task to put his replacement in those open positions as well. If the point of Boldin's breakout under Caldwell is that scheme trumps personnel, then honestly that makes me less worried about losing him than before.

You can't pay or play a guy based on what he has already done. You have to do the infinitely harder thing and imagine what he will do 6 months from now, a year from now, etc. You can't just pop in the highlight reel from the playoffs and act like it's a foregone conclusion that Boldin, moving forward into the future, will still be a beast.

Boldin's at a stage in his career where his physical skills, relative to where they used to be, are already leaving him, and he's at a stage where he leverages essentially one important physical attribute (his strength) as the only trait that actually makes him an affective receiver. If that strength diminishes further by the time this coming season rolls around, the next season after that comes... then he's quite simply not going to be an affective receiver. Now, it's no sure thing that his body will break down enough by the time the 2013 season starts that he can't do similar things to what he did in the postseason. But it's not farfetched either. The organization made the calculation that he is more likely to regress than maintain that level of physicality and play. I don't know whether they're right or not, nor does anyone else.
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SnA ExclusiVe wrote:

Which isn't bad because that specific way is just putting him in the slot and letting him work the middle of the field.

And even then Boldin has struggled to make plays once he's manned up against a talented corner. He's being paid like an upper echelon #2 receiver, yet he's only effective when he's lined up in the slot working against above average (or below) nickel corners. If he was manned up against a good nickel corner, he wasn't nearly as productive. Which, when teams are bracketing Torrey Smith for an entire game, you sort of need Boldin to win his matchups more often.

It shouldn't take the Ravens scheming Boldin in any particular fashion for him to be effective against the 3rd most talented corner on a roster (or worse). Scheming him should make him dominant, yet he has too many games where he disappears in. He has a valuable skillset as it makes him an attractive safety valve, but if he had more talent, we wouldn't need him as a "safety valve" as often because he'd be getting the kind of separation that makes life easier on a QB.
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BaltimoreTerp


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

spiritoftruth wrote:
So you guys (DB and BTerp) are basically saying... Boldin wasn't worth the additional 6 million for this year because he doesn't get separation like a true #1 WR should? And while a combo of Doss/Dickson/Reed... whoever we end up with, probably won't be able to become safety valves or trusted options for Flacco the way Boldin was, at least we won't be overpaying for chemistry?

If that is your argument, then we just disagree right there. That chemistry is worth 6 million, and will be sorely missed on 3rd down next season (and the contract was just until next season). It will make the team worse not having Boldin, and that 6 million saved which will now be used elsewhere, won't help the Ravens as much as Boldin would have this coming year.


So far as I can tell, in this thread I haven't even made much of an argument as to whether Boldin will be a big loss or not, or whether I think it was a good move. I said that what I worry about most is the lost chemistry and continuity. What I disagreed with was the assertion that, among Boldin's many qualities, he generates separation and generally gets open. I think that regardless of whether you love that Boldin is gone or hate it (and even if you're okay with the move, I certainly don't think anyone 'loves' it), that is just a demonstrably false statement, which is why I jumped in to begin with. Boldin's getting built ups as Jerry Rice reincarnated with some of this talk, being that he apparently gets great separation, has perfect hands, the strength of a grizzly bear, etc... he is who he is, and I think even if you find yourself pining for Boldin, you can't let that obscure what he actually was.

At this stage we don't know what the WR depth chart will look like. I'm not a huge fan of Reed or Doss so if they're expected to play big roles, I would be skeptical about it. I actually like Dickson though and I think he seemed like he got into a better comfort zone and level of trust under Caldwell. He's a guy I expect marginal but meaningful improvement from next year.

If Boldin had been back, I would have worried about whether further physical decline would have further compromised his ability to keep making plays. Boldin makes great catches, but he makes it harder on himself by always being blanketed. So if our slot receiver next year makes significantly less money, but can wiggle himself free over the middle and make some of the tough catches, are we really that much worse off, even if we don't have the X-factor Boldin tough-man catches? I don't think we have to be. I personally have profoundly mixed feelings about trading Boldin. I think there are significant risks to doing so. But put the other way, had we gone into next season significantly relying on a 33 year old receiver whose prime asset is his physicality, I think that would have been a big risk, too.
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 12:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

spiritoftruth wrote:
So you guys (DB and BTerp) are basically saying... Boldin wasn't worth the additional 6 million for this year because he doesn't get separation like a true #1 WR should? And while a combo of Doss/Dickson/Reed... whoever we end up with, probably won't be able to become safety valves or trusted options for Flacco the way Boldin was, at least we won't be overpaying for chemistry?

If that is your argument, then we just disagree right there. That chemistry is worth 6 million, and will be sorely missed on 3rd down next season (and the contract was just until next season). It will make the team worse not having Boldin, and that 6 million saved which will now be used elsewhere, won't help the Ravens as much as Boldin would have this coming year.

1. That's dumbing down my point and making an assumption. We have no way of knowing how Doss/Reed/Streeter/Thompson react to greater opportunity. When Torrey Smith looked bad in training camp as a rookie, was it a foregone conclusion that he would never become anything and Ozzie had just drafted another bust receiver? No. Opportunity knocks, but talent kicks the door in. Torrey got his opportunity to play and made the best of it. Our young guys might not possess the same skillset as Boldin, but each of them (minus Thompson) brings a unique skillset to the #3 spot that we don't currently have from our top two WRs.

And this point also assumes that we can't address the WR position via the draft for an incredibly talented option like DeAndre Hopkins (who looks like a cross between Boldin and a younger Mason).

2. I disagree. His chemistry is worth something, sure, but certainly not $7.5m against the cap. And by shedding his $6m salary, it allows us to increase the depth on our team and probably add two-three value defensive options to make us a better team.

It's not like whoever we replace Boldin with needs to even do that much, he's been an 850-900 yds kind of guy for this team from the onset. If a young guy is able to just get say 600 yds receiving, the increase we get from better defense and depth would be worth cutting Boldin. Because the difference in production from that other guy to Boldin could be made up via more use of our tights ends, Ed Dickson being a guy who now can operate in the intermediate areas of the field more often because Boldin isn't providing that same skill set. Or maybe Rice receives more opportunities in the passing game now that Boldin is gone. Let's not forget that before Pitta and Boldin were used more often as safety valves, Flacco was once accused of being captain checkdown because he would abuse checkdowns to Rice... with Boldin gone, perhaps Rice's number of receptions jumps back up into the 70s to accomodate the extra time needed for Flacco to gell with our less experienced WR core.
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SnA ExclusiVe


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll just finish by saying I agree to disagree.

I still think Boldin can get separation. I don't know what his numbers are compared to other top #2 guys in the league such as James Jones, Decker, etc., but Boldin brings intangibles to the table that we aren't going to find elsewhere, such as his chemistry with Flacco, his physicality and ability to outmuscle defenders for the ball in tight windows, and his blocking ability.

For me personally, his $6M was well worth it because of what he brought to the table not only in terms of just production, but leadership as well as chemistry and reliability. You guys all saw that as soon as Cam left, Boldin practically dominated in every game and when they took Boldin away (Denver), Torrey Smith dominated.

I just don't see that being replaced. You can argue Dennis Pitta or whatever, but I don't see the same production being put up by Pitta that was put up by Boldin, but that's just my opinion, which really is irrelevant because what's done is done and there's no point in looking back and trying to undo the trade. We defintely need to fill a hole at WR right now because Torrey and Jacoby aren't #1 WR's, and we don't have a #1 WR on the roster right now.
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
I'll just finish by saying I agree to disagree.

I still think Boldin can get separation. I don't know what his numbers are compared to other top #2 guys in the league such as James Jones, Decker, etc., but Boldin brings intangibles to the table that we aren't going to find elsewhere, such as his chemistry with Flacco, his physicality and ability to outmuscle defenders for the ball in tight windows, and his blocking ability.

For me personally, his $6M was well worth it because of what he brought to the table not only in terms of just production, but leadership as well as chemistry and reliability. You guys all saw that as soon as Cam left, Boldin practically dominated in every game and when they took Boldin away (Denver), Torrey Smith dominated.

I just don't see that being replaced. You can argue Dennis Pitta or whatever, but I don't see the same production being put up by Pitta that was put up by Boldin, but that's just my opinion, which really is irrelevant because what's done is done and there's no point in looking back and trying to undo the trade. We defintely need to fill a hole at WR right now because Torrey and Jacoby aren't #1 WR's, and we don't have a #1 WR on the roster right now.

And we didn't have one on the roster with Boldin, so what's new? Torrey Smith was our best receiver in his rookie season and that's saying something. Torrey also has the potential to improve into a #1 caliber WR. He's already double coverage or bracketed by defenses on virtually every passing play. He draws the #1 corner... he just needs to take his game to the next level. But that's nothing new either.

We needed a more complete, true #1 WR even when Boldin was on the roster. Unfortunately this draft doesn't really have a TRUE #1 WR, but it does have plenty of great #2 options/#quality #1 options that might be had in the 2nd round.
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SnA ExclusiVe


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 3:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

diamondbull424 wrote:
SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
I'll just finish by saying I agree to disagree.

I still think Boldin can get separation. I don't know what his numbers are compared to other top #2 guys in the league such as James Jones, Decker, etc., but Boldin brings intangibles to the table that we aren't going to find elsewhere, such as his chemistry with Flacco, his physicality and ability to outmuscle defenders for the ball in tight windows, and his blocking ability.

For me personally, his $6M was well worth it because of what he brought to the table not only in terms of just production, but leadership as well as chemistry and reliability. You guys all saw that as soon as Cam left, Boldin practically dominated in every game and when they took Boldin away (Denver), Torrey Smith dominated.

I just don't see that being replaced. You can argue Dennis Pitta or whatever, but I don't see the same production being put up by Pitta that was put up by Boldin, but that's just my opinion, which really is irrelevant because what's done is done and there's no point in looking back and trying to undo the trade. We defintely need to fill a hole at WR right now because Torrey and Jacoby aren't #1 WR's, and we don't have a #1 WR on the roster right now.

And we didn't have one on the roster with Boldin, so what's new? Torrey Smith was our best receiver in his rookie season and that's saying something. Torrey also has the potential to improve into a #1 caliber WR. He's already double coverage or bracketed by defenses on virtually every passing play. He draws the #1 corner... he just needs to take his game to the next level. But that's nothing new either.

We needed a more complete, true #1 WR even when Boldin was on the roster. Unfortunately this draft doesn't really have a TRUE #1 WR, but it does have plenty of great #2 options/#quality #1 options that might be had in the 2nd round.


Boldin wasn't a typical #1 WR, but he was our #1 WR and he definitely commanded the attention of a team's best corner unless a certain matchup favored putting the #1 corner on Torrey instead (situations where they have 1 fast corner and one slower one, they'd put the faster guy on Torrey obviously).

Right now we have no #1 WR no matter how you look at it. At least Boldin was somewhat close to a #1 WR.
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Flaccomania


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
diamondbull424 wrote:
SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
I'll just finish by saying I agree to disagree.

I still think Boldin can get separation. I don't know what his numbers are compared to other top #2 guys in the league such as James Jones, Decker, etc., but Boldin brings intangibles to the table that we aren't going to find elsewhere, such as his chemistry with Flacco, his physicality and ability to outmuscle defenders for the ball in tight windows, and his blocking ability.

For me personally, his $6M was well worth it because of what he brought to the table not only in terms of just production, but leadership as well as chemistry and reliability. You guys all saw that as soon as Cam left, Boldin practically dominated in every game and when they took Boldin away (Denver), Torrey Smith dominated.

I just don't see that being replaced. You can argue Dennis Pitta or whatever, but I don't see the same production being put up by Pitta that was put up by Boldin, but that's just my opinion, which really is irrelevant because what's done is done and there's no point in looking back and trying to undo the trade. We defintely need to fill a hole at WR right now because Torrey and Jacoby aren't #1 WR's, and we don't have a #1 WR on the roster right now.

And we didn't have one on the roster with Boldin, so what's new? Torrey Smith was our best receiver in his rookie season and that's saying something. Torrey also has the potential to improve into a #1 caliber WR. He's already double coverage or bracketed by defenses on virtually every passing play. He draws the #1 corner... he just needs to take his game to the next level. But that's nothing new either.

We needed a more complete, true #1 WR even when Boldin was on the roster. Unfortunately this draft doesn't really have a TRUE #1 WR, but it does have plenty of great #2 options/#quality #1 options that might be had in the 2nd round.


Boldin wasn't a typical #1 WR, but he was our #1 WR and he definitely commanded the attention of a team's best corner unless a certain matchup favored putting the #1 corner on Torrey instead (situations where they have 1 fast corner and one slower one, they'd put the faster guy on Torrey obviously).

Right now we have no #1 WR no matter how you look at it. At least Boldin was somewhat close to a #1 WR.


Torrey was viewed as our #1 WR by most teams -- they most frequently used their best CBs on him. Not quite sure where you got the impression that teams usually put it in Boldin. Teams very quickly found that Torrey was the guy they needed to shut down, not Boldin.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flaccomania wrote:
SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
diamondbull424 wrote:
SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
I'll just finish by saying I agree to disagree.

I still think Boldin can get separation. I don't know what his numbers are compared to other top #2 guys in the league such as James Jones, Decker, etc., but Boldin brings intangibles to the table that we aren't going to find elsewhere, such as his chemistry with Flacco, his physicality and ability to outmuscle defenders for the ball in tight windows, and his blocking ability.

For me personally, his $6M was well worth it because of what he brought to the table not only in terms of just production, but leadership as well as chemistry and reliability. You guys all saw that as soon as Cam left, Boldin practically dominated in every game and when they took Boldin away (Denver), Torrey Smith dominated.

I just don't see that being replaced. You can argue Dennis Pitta or whatever, but I don't see the same production being put up by Pitta that was put up by Boldin, but that's just my opinion, which really is irrelevant because what's done is done and there's no point in looking back and trying to undo the trade. We defintely need to fill a hole at WR right now because Torrey and Jacoby aren't #1 WR's, and we don't have a #1 WR on the roster right now.

And we didn't have one on the roster with Boldin, so what's new? Torrey Smith was our best receiver in his rookie season and that's saying something. Torrey also has the potential to improve into a #1 caliber WR. He's already double coverage or bracketed by defenses on virtually every passing play. He draws the #1 corner... he just needs to take his game to the next level. But that's nothing new either.

We needed a more complete, true #1 WR even when Boldin was on the roster. Unfortunately this draft doesn't really have a TRUE #1 WR, but it does have plenty of great #2 options/#quality #1 options that might be had in the 2nd round.


Boldin wasn't a typical #1 WR, but he was our #1 WR and he definitely commanded the attention of a team's best corner unless a certain matchup favored putting the #1 corner on Torrey instead (situations where they have 1 fast corner and one slower one, they'd put the faster guy on Torrey obviously).

Right now we have no #1 WR no matter how you look at it. At least Boldin was somewhat close to a #1 WR.


Torrey was viewed as our #1 WR by most teams -- they most frequently used their best CBs on him. Not quite sure where you got the impression that teams usually put it in Boldin. Teams very quickly found that Torrey was the guy they needed to shut down, not Boldin.


Well usually it was just matchups. Most teams' best corner is their fastest guy so they put him on Torrey. Plus Boldin usually lines up in the slot for 3 WR formations so they're going to put their best outside corner on Torrey, and that's usually just how the formations aligned anyways.

Take the Steelers for example. Ike Taylor is obviously their fastest corner so they're going to put him on Torrey so he can't just win deep against their other corners, and use combination coverages on Boldin over the middle.
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I'd say he's [Dennis Pitta] the fourth best TE in the division... Cameron > Miller > Gresham > Eiffert = Pitta
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BaltimoreTerp


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SnA ExclusiVe wrote:

Well usually it was just matchups. Most teams' best corner is their fastest guy so they put him on Torrey. Plus Boldin usually lines up in the slot for 3 WR formations so they're going to put their best outside corner on Torrey, and that's usually just how the formations aligned anyways.

Take the Steelers for example. Ike Taylor is obviously their fastest corner so they're going to put him on Torrey so he can't just win deep against their other corners, and use combination coverages on Boldin over the middle.
Ike Taylor isn't really obviously their fastest corner. He's obviously their best corner though. They put him on opposing #1's every week, regardless of matchup. He lined up on Torrey, and Keenan Lewis drew Boldin.

I actually think you're looking at it backwards. Torrey pretty much always drew opposing #1's unless the #1 corner happens to be exceptionally big or physical, like in Aqil Talib's case. But most week's teams were more worried about bracketing coverage on Torrey and trying to prevent big plays over the top by putting the #1 corner on him. It's not like Champ Bailey is close to Denver's fast corner at this stage in his career, but he was their #1, and who did he defend when they played us? Torrey Smith.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2013 3:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BaltimoreTerp wrote:
SnA ExclusiVe wrote:

Well usually it was just matchups. Most teams' best corner is their fastest guy so they put him on Torrey. Plus Boldin usually lines up in the slot for 3 WR formations so they're going to put their best outside corner on Torrey, and that's usually just how the formations aligned anyways.

Take the Steelers for example. Ike Taylor is obviously their fastest corner so they're going to put him on Torrey so he can't just win deep against their other corners, and use combination coverages on Boldin over the middle.
Ike Taylor isn't really obviously their fastest corner. He's obviously their best corner though. They put him on opposing #1's every week, regardless of matchup. He lined up on Torrey, and Keenan Lewis drew Boldin.

I actually think you're looking at it backwards. Torrey pretty much always drew opposing #1's unless the #1 corner happens to be exceptionally big or physical, like in Aqil Talib's case. But most week's teams were more worried about bracketing coverage on Torrey and trying to prevent big plays over the top by putting the #1 corner on him. It's not like Champ Bailey is close to Denver's fast corner at this stage in his career, but he was their #1, and who did he defend when they played us? Torrey Smith.


I think Ike Taylor is faster than anyone on Pittsburgh's roster, and same with Champ Bailey, even at this stage of his career.

But I mean you guys might have a valid point, I just always looked at it in terms of who matches up best with Boldin's physicality and Smith's speed, and that's how teams play them.
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I'd say he's [Dennis Pitta] the fourth best TE in the division... Cameron > Miller > Gresham > Eiffert = Pitta
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