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nagahide13


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LionsFan630 wrote:
stylish313 wrote:
LionsFan630 wrote:
Yeah Milliner definitely put himself back in to the conversation running that 40 time.

At this point I feel pretty confident in narrowing down the Lions pick to 5 guys:

- Joeckel
- Fisher
- Milliner
- Ansah
- Warmack
FIFY


Just can't see a OG going that high. DeCastro was hyped as the next Hutchinson and he fell past 20. I think Warmack is probably looking at the 8-15 range when all is said and done.


Well, he was hyped there by some. But he certainly isn't the next Hutch. I find it extremely likely that he was just never as good of a prospect as us arm chair GMs thought. He must of had some serious flaws, or he'd be a better player right now.

If Warmack is as good as we think he is, he's worth it. If not, he isn't. That's about it.
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stylish313


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nagahide13 wrote:
LionsFan630 wrote:
stylish313 wrote:
LionsFan630 wrote:
Yeah Milliner definitely put himself back in to the conversation running that 40 time.

At this point I feel pretty confident in narrowing down the Lions pick to 5 guys:

- Joeckel
- Fisher
- Milliner
- Ansah
- Warmack
FIFY


Just can't see a OG going that high. DeCastro was hyped as the next Hutchinson and he fell past 20. I think Warmack is probably looking at the 8-15 range when all is said and done.
DeCastro had exceptional skill, but lacked the physical tools that land guys like Ansah into the top #10. Warmack has both, and is ready to physically dominate even if his techniques will need some refining.

Well, he was hyped there by some. But he certainly isn't the next Hutch. I find it extremely likely that he was just never as good of a prospect as us arm chair GMs thought. He must of had some serious flaws, or he'd be a better player right now.

If Warmack is as good as we think he is, he's worth it. If not, he isn't. That's about it.

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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rockcity wrote:
TheROARisBACK wrote:
Lionsden5555 wrote:
After watching Millner and Rhodes run it just confirms what all the tape shows. They are both fast enough, physical, and have prototypical size for the position. Would I be OK with taking Millner at #5, yeah but at the same time if you aren't comfortable taking Rhodes at 5, then why Millner?


Scheme versatility.

That's my biggest reason, there are concerns Rhodes would be limited to, but be a very good, boundary corner at the next level.
idk how you can say that. Rhodes has manned up on alot of good wrs..from fast shifty guys from Broyles to bigger guys Floyd. whats Dee"s done?? Hes had nothing but perfect timing as far as competition goes.. imo Dee didnt fair well when ask to guard the small shifty guys with speed. i cant see either why has been talked top 5, the tape dont fit the spot.


Rhodes may have manned up against Broyles and Stills but how do you think he did?
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IDOG_det


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

diehardlionfan wrote:
Rockcity wrote:
TheROARisBACK wrote:
Lionsden5555 wrote:
After watching Millner and Rhodes run it just confirms what all the tape shows. They are both fast enough, physical, and have prototypical size for the position. Would I be OK with taking Millner at #5, yeah but at the same time if you aren't comfortable taking Rhodes at 5, then why Millner?


Scheme versatility.

That's my biggest reason, there are concerns Rhodes would be limited to, but be a very good, boundary corner at the next level.
idk how you can say that. Rhodes has manned up on alot of good wrs..from fast shifty guys from Broyles to bigger guys Floyd. whats Dee"s done?? Hes had nothing but perfect timing as far as competition goes.. imo Dee didnt fair well when ask to guard the small shifty guys with speed. i cant see either why has been talked top 5, the tape dont fit the spot.


Rhodes may have manned up against Broyles and Stills but how do you think he did?
In 2010 against Broyles he did great except for 1 play where Broyles made him look foolish with an amazing double move. Rhodes has learned since then though.
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TheROARisBACK


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rockcity wrote:
TheROARisBACK wrote:
Rockcity wrote:
TheROARisBACK wrote:
Rockcity wrote:
TheROARisBACK wrote:
Lionsden5555 wrote:
After watching Millner and Rhodes run it just confirms what all the tape shows. They are both fast enough, physical, and have prototypical size for the position. Would I be OK with taking Millner at #5, yeah but at the same time if you aren't comfortable taking Rhodes at 5, then why Millner?


Scheme versatility.

That's my biggest reason, there are concerns Rhodes would be limited to, but be a very good, boundary corner at the next level.
idk how you can say that. Rhodes has manned up on alot of good wrs..from fast shifty guys from Broyles to bigger guys Floyd. whats Dee"s done?? Hes had nothing but perfect timing as far as competition goes.. imo Dee didnt fair well when ask to guard the small shifty guys with speed. i cant see either why has been talked top 5, the tape dont fit the spot.


Watch him he primarily plays the boundary. All three years he rarely played inside and when he did he didn't look too good. That's where he gave up the most. Not terrible, just not a good spot. Matching up with one or two good prospects with specific skill sets doesn't tell you how he played them in coverage. Also who are these speedsters Dee struggled with? You seem to mention that a lot.
not sure i follow. you want Rhodes to be able to play the slot? if so why would you want your 1st rd pick in the slot? And its not just one or two prospect either he had a career not one season like Dee with no potentials of being 1st rd picks..watch the LSU game if he didnt win in the begining he wasnt keeping up. not that he allowed receptions but this is the nfl were teams will take advantage of things like that. Rhodes resume is far greater than Dee no debate imo


The original question asked was talking about being comfortable with taking Rhodes high, around 5, compared to Milliner. I feel when taking a corner that high they should be versatile and able to move around to play the opposing teams best W/O who might play outside and can kick it inside and run multiple routes as well. That's a big question with Rhodes IMO. Your not wasting a pick on the slot, you want your guy to be able to match-up wherever the opposing teams best receiver lines up so having range in that area and being able to cover it would be nice considering how high the pick is.

I wasn't necessarily saying Rhodes faced no one but those two names, just using those names to tell how just because he faced receivers with varying skill-sets (Floyd, being big and considered physical where-as Broyles is a precise route-runner with great ability to find holes in zone schemes and work out the slot) doesn't tell how he covered them.

Also, prior to tearing his ACL Justin Hunter was talked about highly, even now after it. As well as Cordarrelle Patterson, and Da'Rick Rodgers prior to the suspension. He effectively covered "speedster" Joe Adams from Arkansas. He also had a big game against receiving TE Tyler Eifert, showcasing his ability to play these bigger, receiving TE's that are thought to be the new wave in the league. All are highly touted prospects sans Adams. He's also played other good receivers. I never understood why you brought his competition up.

You always bring up the LSU game, meh, it wasn't great - mostly his tackling from what I recall. That's one game though. I definately can spot those problems in all the prospects this year and in years past.

And I disagree about his resume being far greater...How did you come to that conclusion? Dee contributed more in different facets, being on ST (3 years) as a gunner and having a small stint returning. Also recorded a blocked kick. Only thing that really favors Rhodes as far as resume is more starts, even with his overall career stats aren't better than Milliners.
resume was about more who they have matched up against. it also goes beyond the LSU game i just thought that would give you an idea what i was getting at. Can Milliner be good sure. Can Rhodes sure. There isnt much difference there imo. Its crazy to call one a top 5 and not the other imo. With all the factors i just see Rhodes being the better pro. I also have another rated higher than Dee. i cant wrap my head around the top 5 talk..top 5 cbs dont happen all that often i dont see what makes him so special. Why i wish they would bring pros to the combines to see how these guys would fare.. He doesnt have enough to tell me hes some shut down cb...


Fair enough. I disagree though.
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IDOG_det wrote:
diehardlionfan wrote:
Rockcity wrote:
TheROARisBACK wrote:
Lionsden5555 wrote:
After watching Millner and Rhodes run it just confirms what all the tape shows. They are both fast enough, physical, and have prototypical size for the position. Would I be OK with taking Millner at #5, yeah but at the same time if you aren't comfortable taking Rhodes at 5, then why Millner?


Scheme versatility.

That's my biggest reason, there are concerns Rhodes would be limited to, but be a very good, boundary corner at the next level.
idk how you can say that. Rhodes has manned up on alot of good wrs..from fast shifty guys from Broyles to bigger guys Floyd. whats Dee"s done?? Hes had nothing but perfect timing as far as competition goes.. imo Dee didnt fair well when ask to guard the small shifty guys with speed. i cant see either why has been talked top 5, the tape dont fit the spot.


Rhodes may have manned up against Broyles and Stills but how do you think he did?
In 2010 against Broyles he did great except for 1 play where Broyles made him look foolish with an amazing double move. Rhodes has learned since then though.


Jones was 32/42 and passed for close to 400 yards 4 TD and a 9.5 YPA that game. Broyles and Kenny both had great games with Broyles snagging 12 balls for 124 yards and one score. Rhodes had seven tackles and I don't think he was even credited for one pass defence.

The Sooners basically shredded the secondary.

I'm not certain how you could consider his performance great.
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bigc421


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nagahide13 wrote:
LionsFan630 wrote:
stylish313 wrote:
LionsFan630 wrote:
Yeah Milliner definitely put himself back in to the conversation running that 40 time.

At this point I feel pretty confident in narrowing down the Lions pick to 5 guys:

- Joeckel
- Fisher
- Milliner
- Ansah
- Warmack
FIFY


Just can't see a OG going that high. DeCastro was hyped as the next Hutchinson and he fell past 20. I think Warmack is probably looking at the 8-15 range when all is said and done.


Well, he was hyped there by some. But he certainly isn't the next Hutch. I find it extremely likely that he was just never as good of a prospect as us arm chair GMs thought. He must of had some serious flaws, or he'd be a better player right now.

If Warmack is as good as we think he is, he's worth it. If not, he isn't. That's about it.


A+ for logic
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IDOG_det


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

diehardlionfan wrote:
IDOG_det wrote:
diehardlionfan wrote:
Rockcity wrote:
TheROARisBACK wrote:
Lionsden5555 wrote:
After watching Millner and Rhodes run it just confirms what all the tape shows. They are both fast enough, physical, and have prototypical size for the position. Would I be OK with taking Millner at #5, yeah but at the same time if you aren't comfortable taking Rhodes at 5, then why Millner?


Scheme versatility.

That's my biggest reason, there are concerns Rhodes would be limited to, but be a very good, boundary corner at the next level.
idk how you can say that. Rhodes has manned up on alot of good wrs..from fast shifty guys from Broyles to bigger guys Floyd. whats Dee"s done?? Hes had nothing but perfect timing as far as competition goes.. imo Dee didnt fair well when ask to guard the small shifty guys with speed. i cant see either why has been talked top 5, the tape dont fit the spot.


Rhodes may have manned up against Broyles and Stills but how do you think he did?
In 2010 against Broyles he did great except for 1 play where Broyles made him look foolish with an amazing double move. Rhodes has learned since then though.


Jones was 32/42 and passed for close to 400 yards 4 TD and a 9.5 YPA that game. Broyles and Kenny both had great games with Broyles snagging 12 balls for 124 yards and one score. Rhodes had seven tackles and I don't think he was even credited for one pass defence.

The Sooners basically shredded the secondary.

I'm not certain how you could consider his performance great.
You gotta remember how young he was then and how little playing time he had.
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IDOG_det wrote:
diehardlionfan wrote:
IDOG_det wrote:
diehardlionfan wrote:
Rockcity wrote:
TheROARisBACK wrote:
Lionsden5555 wrote:
After watching Millner and Rhodes run it just confirms what all the tape shows. They are both fast enough, physical, and have prototypical size for the position. Would I be OK with taking Millner at #5, yeah but at the same time if you aren't comfortable taking Rhodes at 5, then why Millner?


Scheme versatility.

That's my biggest reason, there are concerns Rhodes would be limited to, but be a very good, boundary corner at the next level.
idk how you can say that. Rhodes has manned up on alot of good wrs..from fast shifty guys from Broyles to bigger guys Floyd. whats Dee"s done?? Hes had nothing but perfect timing as far as competition goes.. imo Dee didnt fair well when ask to guard the small shifty guys with speed. i cant see either why has been talked top 5, the tape dont fit the spot.


Rhodes may have manned up against Broyles and Stills but how do you think he did?
In 2010 against Broyles he did great except for 1 play where Broyles made him look foolish with an amazing double move. Rhodes has learned since then though.


Jones was 32/42 and passed for close to 400 yards 4 TD and a 9.5 YPA that game. Broyles and Kenny both had great games with Broyles snagging 12 balls for 124 yards and one score. Rhodes had seven tackles and I don't think he was even credited for one pass defence.

The Sooners basically shredded the secondary.

I'm not certain how you could consider his performance great.
You gotta remember how young he was then and how little playing time he had.


I do remember. I asked Rockcity how he thought Rhodes did. When you suggested he did great I was merely pointing out that regardless of experience his performance couldn't be considered good let alone great.

I think Rhodes is a good prospect but Milliners stats are far better playing a superior level of competition.
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Rockcity


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

diehardlionfan wrote:
IDOG_det wrote:
diehardlionfan wrote:
IDOG_det wrote:
diehardlionfan wrote:
Rockcity wrote:
TheROARisBACK wrote:
Lionsden5555 wrote:
After watching Millner and Rhodes run it just confirms what all the tape shows. They are both fast enough, physical, and have prototypical size for the position. Would I be OK with taking Millner at #5, yeah but at the same time if you aren't comfortable taking Rhodes at 5, then why Millner?


Scheme versatility.

That's my biggest reason, there are concerns Rhodes would be limited to, but be a very good, boundary corner at the next level.
idk how you can say that. Rhodes has manned up on alot of good wrs..from fast shifty guys from Broyles to bigger guys Floyd. whats Dee"s done?? Hes had nothing but perfect timing as far as competition goes.. imo Dee didnt fair well when ask to guard the small shifty guys with speed. i cant see either why has been talked top 5, the tape dont fit the spot.


Rhodes may have manned up against Broyles and Stills but how do you think he did?
In 2010 against Broyles he did great except for 1 play where Broyles made him look foolish with an amazing double move. Rhodes has learned since then though.


Jones was 32/42 and passed for close to 400 yards 4 TD and a 9.5 YPA that game. Broyles and Kenny both had great games with Broyles snagging 12 balls for 124 yards and one score. Rhodes had seven tackles and I don't think he was even credited for one pass defence.

The Sooners basically shredded the secondary.

I'm not certain how you could consider his performance great.
You gotta remember how young he was then and how little playing time he had.


I do remember. I asked Rockcity how he thought Rhodes did. When you suggested he did great I was merely pointing out that regardless of experience his performance couldn't be considered good let alone great.

I think Rhodes is a good prospect but Milliners stats are far better playing a superior level of competition.
I do think he did good.. lets remember oklahomas offence and how it was fit to broyles skills. wr screens and swing passes.. broyles wasnt the down field threat so much. they chose to play rhodes ten yards off of him which was a mistake but they had to try and take away the run. he also didnt man him all game long.. theres a reason broyles was ncaa leader in receptions.. screens/swings.

Dee didnt man up on anyone worth a dam imo. i mean lets look at the michigan game...they were going right at him..he got away with alot.. any good wr wouldnt be dropping them slants like the michigan guys were but they were beating him. again another stat looker..not watching with the thought of nfl talent.. we saw what rhodes has done against nfl talent. and we are also talking about a #5 pick in the draft. nothing that Dee has done does not warrent that pick for me. he played in the sec so what, the wr in his full season sucked and theres no other way to put it. best wrs in that division play on alabama..almost feel dee knew what he was doing entering a weak draft...i dont think he would have been able to hold up to the next years hype. while rhodes has atleast shown he can get better. like i said Dee wont be the best cb out of this class thats my opinion. ive seen nothing and no one has been able to change that and believe you me i want the Lions to get a great cb so theres no need for me to dog any cb to put anyone ahead of that. i just dont think Dees the guy. lol i dont in rhodes either but i see a better pro in rhodes.
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TheROARisBACK


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

^And now you're reaching...Badly.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheROARisBACK wrote:
^And now you're reaching...Badly.
reaching about what?
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rockcity wrote:
Dee didnt man up on anyone worth a dam imo. i mean lets look at the michigan game...they were going right at him..he got away with alot.. any good wr wouldnt be dropping them slants like the michigan guys were but they were beating him. again another stat looker..not watching with the thought of nfl talent.. we saw what rhodes has done against nfl talent. and we are also talking about a #5 pick in the draft. nothing that Dee has done does not warrent that pick for me. he played in the sec so what, the wr in his full season sucked and theres no other way to put it. best wrs in that division play on alabama..almost feel dee knew what he was doing entering a weak draft...i dont think he would have been able to hold up to the next years hype. while rhodes has atleast shown he can get better. like i said Dee wont be the best cb out of this class thats my opinion. ive seen nothing and no one has been able to change that and believe you me i want the Lions to get a great cb so theres no need for me to dog any cb to put anyone ahead of that. i just dont think Dees the guy. lol i dont in rhodes either but i see a better pro in rhodes.


Went ahead and highlighted it for you.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheROARisBACK wrote:
Rockcity wrote:
Dee didnt man up on anyone worth a dam imo. i mean lets look at the michigan game...they were going right at him..he got away with alot.. any good wr wouldnt be dropping them slants like the michigan guys were but they were beating him. again another stat looker..not watching with the thought of nfl talent.. we saw what rhodes has done against nfl talent. and we are also talking about a #5 pick in the draft. nothing that Dee has done does not warrent that pick for me. he played in the sec so what, the wr in his full season sucked and theres no other way to put it. best wrs in that division play on alabama..almost feel dee knew what he was doing entering a weak draft...i dont think he would have been able to hold up to the next years hype. while rhodes has atleast shown he can get better. like i said Dee wont be the best cb out of this class thats my opinion. ive seen nothing and no one has been able to change that and believe you me i want the Lions to get a great cb so theres no need for me to dog any cb to put anyone ahead of that. i just dont think Dees the guy. lol i dont in rhodes either but i see a better pro in rhodes.


Went ahead and highlighted it for you.
... so tell me who are these wr in the sec that are good? idk even know what you want me to say about the michigan game because i said it.. why dont you tell me whats wrong with it..Michigan had a good game plan the players just didnt get it done as far as catching the ball.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rockcity wrote:
TheROARisBACK wrote:
Rockcity wrote:
Dee didnt man up on anyone worth a dam imo. i mean lets look at the michigan game...they were going right at him..he got away with alot.. any good wr wouldnt be dropping them slants like the michigan guys were but they were beating him. again another stat looker..not watching with the thought of nfl talent.. we saw what rhodes has done against nfl talent. and we are also talking about a #5 pick in the draft. nothing that Dee has done does not warrent that pick for me. he played in the sec so what, the wr in his full season sucked and theres no other way to put it. best wrs in that division play on alabama..almost feel dee knew what he was doing entering a weak draft...i dont think he would have been able to hold up to the next years hype. while rhodes has atleast shown he can get better. like i said Dee wont be the best cb out of this class thats my opinion. ive seen nothing and no one has been able to change that and believe you me i want the Lions to get a great cb so theres no need for me to dog any cb to put anyone ahead of that. i just dont think Dees the guy. lol i dont in rhodes either but i see a better pro in rhodes.


Went ahead and highlighted it for you.
... so tell me who are these wr in the sec that are good? idk even know what you want me to say about the michigan game because i said it.. why dont you tell me whats wrong with it..Michigan had a good game plan the players just didnt get it done as far as catching the ball.


Justin Hunter, Da'Rick Rodgers (formerly of UT; dismissed because of character issues), Cordarelle Patterson, Donte Moncrief, Malcom Mitchell, Tavarres King Confused

Along with others through-out his career.

I honestly don't know what to tell you if you believe what you posted about the UM game. About the only accurate statement was that they targeted him a lot... And he responded, 5 pass breakups where he shutdown everyone he faced. His lone bad play was slipping which let a UM receiver (Gardner?) get wide open for a score.... But according to you the receivers dropped everything, right. He didn't get away with anything more than any other corner would, that's a cop-out.
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