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deuces22wild


Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 8982
PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BBando wrote:
Quote:
Pete Prisco ‏@PriscoCBS

I keep hearing the talk that the Bucs (as in Schiano) don't really like Josh Freeman and visa-versa


If Greg doesn't like Josh I hope they are calling around seeing what we can get for him in a trade!

I wouldn't touch anyone in this draft though.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 11:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

deuces22wild wrote:
BBando wrote:
Quote:
Pete Prisco ‏@PriscoCBS

I keep hearing the talk that the Bucs (as in Schiano) don't really like Josh Freeman and visa-versa


If Greg doesn't like Josh I hope they are calling around seeing what we can get for him in a trade!

I wouldn't touch anyone in this draft though.


Hm, I wonder what Prisco's sources are. I can definately say there is question marks and concern inside the organization but Pete Prisco is a moron. I don't account much of what he says.
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tml_gogo


Joined: 02 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 11:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll never trust news that starts with:

"I keep hearing talks that..."

Or whatever. Usually crap.
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BBando


Joined: 18 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 12:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tml_gogo wrote:
I'll never trust news that starts with:

"I keep hearing talks that..."

Or whatever. Usually crap.
Prisco is a hack anyways. I don't know why I still follow him. He is annoying.
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tml_gogo


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 1:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

^^Excellent post.
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5nick5


Joined: 25 Jan 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 1:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
5nick5 wrote:
If the Cardinals would actually look to make a play for Freeman, I think MD should listen. Yeah we have crap behind Freeman, but does anybody here honestly believe Freeman will ever lead to us to a lombardi trophy? This isn't Baltimore where we have a bunch of savvy vets that can compensate for a mediocre QB. We need a face.

If we trade Freeman we could get so much out of Arizona. If they're going to trade 2 2nd-round picks for a QB who started like 5 games, we could get there 1st (not swap) and maybe a 3rd or 4th. So what, we suck for a year as opposed to being mediocre. I believe you play to win the game, but you play to win it all not to just be the best of the mediocre. If we're picking in the top-5 next year and manage to snag Bridgewater, McCarron, or Manziel, then we'll be ready to join elite company. With Freeman, I doubt we ever see that.

Now obviously this won't happen because Schiano and MD still believe in Freeman (unless they're putting on the ultimate smokescreen). But we need a winner. I know everybody says "our QB situation is better than a lot of other teams" or "you don't need an elite QB to win Super Bowls", and that's true for most teams, but not for this team. On a team with a bunch of young talent, they need a leader that can energize them and energize the fanbase. Freeman hasn't shown he can do that.


I agree with a lot you said. Freeman, unfortunately, 4 years and you see no change, is pretty much what you're going to get. Inconsistency at the qb position that freeman displays usually buys you the eventual role of career back up who can step in time to time and get you a win.

If someone comes at us with an offer, I'd say we must listen to it because quite frankly, I don't think Josh is the answer in Tampa, just from what we've seen.

I don't agree with your statement of Joe Flacco as a medicore qb. Thats a slap in the face to him with that comment, and any one who puts Flacco and Freeman as similar qbs or in the same class are clueless. Flacco is an elite QB. He has been and proved it. Freeman is no where near the player Flacco is. Stats mean nothing. Wins do and making plays in big games are what count, regardless of statistics.

On the 2014 class: Teddy Bridgewater and AJ McCarron are at the top of my list. McArron has the intangibles you look for in a QB. His arm strength is good enough to make the throws on the route tree and his instincts are top notch. The swagger of a winner, accuracy and poise in the pocket.


In regards to Flacco, I may have been pushing by saying he's mediocre, but he's not elite. He, like Freeman, got hot for a stretch. Luckily for him, it was exactly when he needed to get hot. But let's not act like he didn't have an up and down year. He wasn't looking too sharp when the Ravens lost like 4 out of 5.

The difference between Flacco and Freeman is that Flacco has some more experienced guys around him and he knows how to manage a game efficiently. Plus, he doesn't choke under pressure. Freeman has probably the same caliber of weapons but can't manage a game nearly as well as Flacco and is a choke artist. He was great in 2010, but now he's good for maybe 1 or 2 clutch comeback wins a year against slumping teams like Carolina.
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REDandPEWTER


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 6:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

5nick5 wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
5nick5 wrote:
If the Cardinals would actually look to make a play for Freeman, I think MD should listen. Yeah we have crap behind Freeman, but does anybody here honestly believe Freeman will ever lead to us to a lombardi trophy? This isn't Baltimore where we have a bunch of savvy vets that can compensate for a mediocre QB. We need a face.

If we trade Freeman we could get so much out of Arizona. If they're going to trade 2 2nd-round picks for a QB who started like 5 games, we could get there 1st (not swap) and maybe a 3rd or 4th. So what, we suck for a year as opposed to being mediocre. I believe you play to win the game, but you play to win it all not to just be the best of the mediocre. If we're picking in the top-5 next year and manage to snag Bridgewater, McCarron, or Manziel, then we'll be ready to join elite company. With Freeman, I doubt we ever see that.

Now obviously this won't happen because Schiano and MD still believe in Freeman (unless they're putting on the ultimate smokescreen). But we need a winner. I know everybody says "our QB situation is better than a lot of other teams" or "you don't need an elite QB to win Super Bowls", and that's true for most teams, but not for this team. On a team with a bunch of young talent, they need a leader that can energize them and energize the fanbase. Freeman hasn't shown he can do that.


I agree with a lot you said. Freeman, unfortunately, 4 years and you see no change, is pretty much what you're going to get. Inconsistency at the qb position that freeman displays usually buys you the eventual role of career back up who can step in time to time and get you a win.

If someone comes at us with an offer, I'd say we must listen to it because quite frankly, I don't think Josh is the answer in Tampa, just from what we've seen.

I don't agree with your statement of Joe Flacco as a medicore qb. Thats a slap in the face to him with that comment, and any one who puts Flacco and Freeman as similar qbs or in the same class are clueless. Flacco is an elite QB. He has been and proved it. Freeman is no where near the player Flacco is. Stats mean nothing. Wins do and making plays in big games are what count, regardless of statistics.

On the 2014 class: Teddy Bridgewater and AJ McCarron are at the top of my list. McArron has the intangibles you look for in a QB. His arm strength is good enough to make the throws on the route tree and his instincts are top notch. The swagger of a winner, accuracy and poise in the pocket.


In regards to Flacco, I may have been pushing by saying he's mediocre, but he's not elite. He, like Freeman, got hot for a stretch. Luckily for him, it was exactly when he needed to get hot. But let's not act like he didn't have an up and down year. He wasn't looking too sharp when the Ravens lost like 4 out of 5.

The difference between Flacco and Freeman is that Flacco has some more experienced guys around him and he knows how to manage a game efficiently. Plus, he doesn't choke under pressure. Freeman has probably the same caliber of weapons but can't manage a game nearly as well as Flacco and is a choke artist. He was great in 2010, but now he's good for maybe 1 or 2 clutch comeback wins a year against slumping teams like Carolina.


Flacco has been consistent his entire career dude. Look at his record in the playoffs. He wills his team to wins. You talk about him and freeman getting hot during a stretch? Josh did against pour pus defenses. Then slides the final 6 games when needed most. Flacco purely dominated against elite competition. There is no comparison between the two.
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DaRealdeal


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Caaddy24 wrote:
More Josh Freeman debate?

I don't know if we can discuss anything about Freeman that hasn't already been beaten to death. I'll stay out of this one.


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ABucNBradenton


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

How would y'all feel about selecting Tyler Bray with our 3rd or 4th if he is still around. I'm a Freeman supporter but it's somthing to ponder.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ABucNBradenton wrote:
How would y'all feel about selecting Tyler Bray with our 3rd or 4th if he is still around. I'm a Freeman supporter but it's somthing to ponder.


No. To me he's physically gifted. But instincts and intangibles and character aren't their or that of a franchise qb.
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Calibucsfan


Joined: 05 Sep 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 3:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaRealdeal wrote:
Caaddy24 wrote:
More Josh Freeman debate?

I don't know if we can discuss anything about Freeman that hasn't already been beaten to death. I'll stay out of this one.



Ya I can see how pointless it is now..

its always like:
Me:Freeman sucks lets get rid of him
Other fans: But we have no backup plan!
Me:Who cares....he sucks. We can put Shiano out there in a helmet and shoulder pads and he might have a better season than Freeman
Other fans: We totally understand what you are saying, but we have no backup plan
Me:....who cares, ANYONE is better than Freeman. Taking a chance on ANYONE automatically gives us more of a chance to win
Other fans: Not disagreeing with you, but we cant just get rid of Freeman without a plan B.
Me: Confused


Its a pointless circle. Some people around here dont get that Freeman gives us no chance at all to ever go anywhere. So who cares about a backup plan, I will take a gamble on anyone.
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5nick5


Joined: 25 Jan 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 5:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
5nick5 wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
5nick5 wrote:
If the Cardinals would actually look to make a play for Freeman, I think MD should listen. Yeah we have crap behind Freeman, but does anybody here honestly believe Freeman will ever lead to us to a lombardi trophy? This isn't Baltimore where we have a bunch of savvy vets that can compensate for a mediocre QB. We need a face.

If we trade Freeman we could get so much out of Arizona. If they're going to trade 2 2nd-round picks for a QB who started like 5 games, we could get there 1st (not swap) and maybe a 3rd or 4th. So what, we suck for a year as opposed to being mediocre. I believe you play to win the game, but you play to win it all not to just be the best of the mediocre. If we're picking in the top-5 next year and manage to snag Bridgewater, McCarron, or Manziel, then we'll be ready to join elite company. With Freeman, I doubt we ever see that.

Now obviously this won't happen because Schiano and MD still believe in Freeman (unless they're putting on the ultimate smokescreen). But we need a winner. I know everybody says "our QB situation is better than a lot of other teams" or "you don't need an elite QB to win Super Bowls", and that's true for most teams, but not for this team. On a team with a bunch of young talent, they need a leader that can energize them and energize the fanbase. Freeman hasn't shown he can do that.


I agree with a lot you said. Freeman, unfortunately, 4 years and you see no change, is pretty much what you're going to get. Inconsistency at the qb position that freeman displays usually buys you the eventual role of career back up who can step in time to time and get you a win.

If someone comes at us with an offer, I'd say we must listen to it because quite frankly, I don't think Josh is the answer in Tampa, just from what we've seen.

I don't agree with your statement of Joe Flacco as a medicore qb. Thats a slap in the face to him with that comment, and any one who puts Flacco and Freeman as similar qbs or in the same class are clueless. Flacco is an elite QB. He has been and proved it. Freeman is no where near the player Flacco is. Stats mean nothing. Wins do and making plays in big games are what count, regardless of statistics.

On the 2014 class: Teddy Bridgewater and AJ McCarron are at the top of my list. McArron has the intangibles you look for in a QB. His arm strength is good enough to make the throws on the route tree and his instincts are top notch. The swagger of a winner, accuracy and poise in the pocket.


In regards to Flacco, I may have been pushing by saying he's mediocre, but he's not elite. He, like Freeman, got hot for a stretch. Luckily for him, it was exactly when he needed to get hot. But let's not act like he didn't have an up and down year. He wasn't looking too sharp when the Ravens lost like 4 out of 5.

The difference between Flacco and Freeman is that Flacco has some more experienced guys around him and he knows how to manage a game efficiently. Plus, he doesn't choke under pressure. Freeman has probably the same caliber of weapons but can't manage a game nearly as well as Flacco and is a choke artist. He was great in 2010, but now he's good for maybe 1 or 2 clutch comeback wins a year against slumping teams like Carolina.


Flacco has been consistent his entire career dude. Look at his record in the playoffs. He wills his team to wins. You talk about him and freeman getting hot during a stretch? Josh did against pour pus defenses. Then slides the final 6 games when needed most. Flacco purely dominated against elite competition. There is no comparison between the two.


If that were the case, why didn't Baltimore lock him up a year ago? And do you not recall his poor play against Philly, Kansas City, Houston, Pittsburgh, and Denver this year? He is not as consistent as he was in the playoffs this past year. It's a total overreaction, the guy won a Super Bowl, now he's elite. It's like how ever body thought Eli was elite after last year when in reality, he's just a decent QB with some good weapons. Don't get me wrong, Flacco is better than Freeman, but he's not nearly as good as people make him out to be.
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