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What's up with all the ILB's in mock drafts?
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NCPackFan


Joined: 12 Jan 2013
Posts: 2428
Location: Kinston, NC
PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 12:49 pm    Post subject: What's up with all the ILB's in mock drafts? Reply with quote

ILB is one of the most STOCKED positions we have on the team. Yet, I consistently see people drafting an ILB or two in their mocks. The last I checked, we have four solid ILB's on this team ALL capable of starting and that's not counting guys that play inside and out like Manning and Jones.

So let me ask this: Is it because we have a lot of Hawk/Smith haters? Or is because some of you completely want to start over here(sparing Bishop of course)? I'm very confident in saying that ILB is the deepest position we have on defense, but I'm still fairly new to this board and am wondering if I missed some sort of discussion that's prompted people to put at least one ILB in their draft.
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GoPackGo


Joined: 12 Oct 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 12:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, the 49ers are STOCKED at the ILB position. We are average.
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nfldraftguru1


Joined: 07 Feb 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's hardly stocked. Bishop is good, Hawk is a below average starter. He's slow and rarely makes plays. The majority of his tackles come 4-6 yards downfield. Smith is a nice 3rd LB, but not a starter.
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Kal-El


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 1:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Common folly of mockers -- drafting what they want to see on the team "right now," not accounting for injuries, depth, and natural player-progression.


In this case, injuries. Bishop will be back from IR. Hawk isn't going anywhere. We could use depth, but that's mid-round value at best.
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NCPackFan


Joined: 12 Jan 2013
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kal-El wrote:
Common folly of mockers -- drafting what they want to see on the team "right now," not accounting for injuries, depth, and natural player-progression.


In this case, injuries. Bishop will be back from IR. Hawk isn't going anywhere. We could use depth, but that's mid-round value at best.


That's what I was thinking too, but I'd kinda be scratching my head if we gave up on Manning, Smith, Jones(who really stepped up last year), and Francois when they're all relatively new players.

I can understand the quality argument, but I think the player progression argument supersedes the former...
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RCobb18


Joined: 04 Dec 2012
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

After seeing our defense get ripped apart in a few games last season a lot of us feel that our defense needs to become more "physical." Bishop is really good and fits the bill of what we missed this last season. Hawk is not going to get any better, he is slow and is terrible in coverage. DJ Smith is just a guy to me and he got exposed in coverage before he got hurt last year. Jones had a good year but he is a free agent and Manning didn't show enough last year as a rookie.

I am not one of those guys that thinks we should get rid of Hawk, it would be expensive to do that. I do however think it would be wise to bring in competition.
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HyponGrey


Joined: 23 Jun 2012
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Losing Jones and possibly Francois. Not sold on Johnson, no confidence in Smith or Manning, and general disenchantment with Hawk by the looks of it. Hey, we can always use more ST guys right? Razz
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2Bigby0


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Having a lot of players is different than being stocked. As a position, I'd grade the Packers as 'average' at best.

AJ Hawk - Below average to average. Makes his tackles aftthoughter 5 yard gains and is relatively 'invisible' during games. He makes no impact either. His lateral movement is also very weak, teams consistently test his sideline to sideline speed. Anything off tackle, Hawk is no where to be found.

Desmond Bishop - Next to CMIII and Raji, Bishop is probably our next best defensive player. He certainly is not a sideline to sideline guy, but he provides some nice 'pop' on the inside. He's effective at the cross dog blitz and if he gets an opportunity, he can really lay some wood. Bishop is a rock solid guy and brings a bit of attitude to the D as well.

DJ Smith - I thought he was an ascending player his rookie year, but before his injury he appeared to have taken a step back. I'm not quite ready to give up on Smith and would like to see him get some more PT moving forward. It's unfortunate that he's 'stuck' in a position similar to what Bishop had a couple seasons ago. He is literally stuck behind Hawk's contract. I think at the very least, Smith can provide the same impact on defense as AJ does and he has some potential. He isn't a star in the making, but could be a solid player.

Terrell Manning - He's the real 'wildcard' in the group if you ask me. He has size and speed. Moved from the outside to the inside this season and it was more of a 'redshirt' season for Manning. Guy looks good on ST and can hit. I like his ability as a sideline to sideline guy. He's one of those players to keep an eye on if you ask me. I'll be interested to see what type of a jump he makes this year. He's a 'darkhorse' at the position.

I think Hawk's impending situation creates a bit of doubt moving forward with our MLB's. Hawk is likely going to be on the roster this year barring anything crazy. But what about after that? This is a position where we really do not have any ascending player. I think it could use a talent injection. The more linebackers we have, the better we are.
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CentralFC


Joined: 03 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Common folly of what we want now?

How about replacing Hawk in a year or two and not being sold on an undersized DJ Smith?

Even more, what was the point of drafting Perry then? Isn't he what we technically wanted now?
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jfinley88


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We are stocked with meh talent outside Bishop...
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justo


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You didn't hear? Bishop is going to get hurt again and we are cutting Hawk, to save a couple million. We need two new ILBs. Toughness. Also our DBs suck at tackling. We need to look at tackle first DBs. Maybe draft four SSs. Toughness. All in the box type guys. Also Raji sucks. Trade him. Pickett is old. We need three new DL too. New defense. Fire Capers. Toughness.
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CentralFC


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 3:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

justo wrote:
You didn't hear? Bishop is going to get hurt again and we are cutting Hawk, to save a couple million. We need two new ILBs. Toughness. Also our DBs suck at tackling. We need to look at tackle first DBs. Maybe draft four SSs. Toughness. All in the box type guys. Also Raji sucks. Trade him. Pickett is old. We need three new DL too. New defense. Fire Capers. Toughness.


Or we want to upgrade Hawk and consider our future with some prudence.
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Ben makes his receivers a lot better then Rodgers does. I think Rodgers gets way more to work with and don't feel he's better then Ben. Rodgers gets better surrounding talent and a better system.
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justo


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CentralFC wrote:
justo wrote:
You didn't hear? Bishop is going to get hurt again and we are cutting Hawk, to save a couple million. We need two new ILBs. Toughness. Also our DBs suck at tackling. We need to look at tackle first DBs. Maybe draft four SSs. Toughness. All in the box type guys. Also Raji sucks. Trade him. Pickett is old. We need three new DL too. New defense. Fire Capers. Toughness.


Or we want to upgrade Hawk and consider our future with some prudence.
The guys most people have mocking at ILB aren't the type of guys going into Hawk's role. They are the ones going into Bishops. I don't think anyone has a shot to replace him till 2015.
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SDN40


Joined: 13 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

justo wrote:
The guys most people have mocking at ILB aren't the type of guys going into Hawk's role. They are the ones going into Bishops. I don't think anyone has a shot to replace him till 2015.


No way is Hawk here in 2015. People were quick to complain about Driver, but Hawk is absolutely stealing money at this point. Driver had 2 TD's last year, Hawks last "play" was, what, 3 years ago ? There should be a player mutiny that Hawk will be 3rd on the payroll. Getting someone with some speed in the middle of the field would have a domino effect.

One small tidbit that has stuck in my mind about Brad Jones. During one of last seasons games, one of the announcers said that Capers really liked Jones. Lots here have him gone, but I wouldn't be so sure.
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incognito_man


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kal-El wrote:
Common folly of mockers -- drafting what they want to see on the team "right now," not accounting for injuries, depth, and natural player-progression.


In this case, injuries. Bishop will be back from IR. Hawk isn't going anywhere. We could use depth, but that's mid-round value at best.


Not really.

Brad Jones is a free agent, that's one spot.
Robert Francois is a RFA, that's another potential spot.

So there ARE spots to fill immediately as well as future spots. ILB is absolutely a position we might draft this year.
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