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Charles Woodson - Released!
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What should we do with Woodson?
Cut Him
33%
 33%  [ 17 ]
Renegotiate @ ~$5million/yr
17%
 17%  [ 9 ]
Renegotiate @ less than $5million/yr
43%
 43%  [ 22 ]
Keep Him at Current Contract
5%
 5%  [ 3 ]
Total Votes : 51

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rbens06


Joined: 07 Jan 2008
Posts: 742
PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Packerraymond wrote:
CWood21 wrote:
blankman0021 wrote:
Does that include any of the cap we rolled over? (Did we roll over much with all those injuries?)


No, but I'm hesitant to add that to the salary since I'm sure Ted will want to roll some over to next year.


You can't roll it to next year without rolling it to this year first. Even if we don't spend it this year, thats like what 7 million I read??


Correct, we need to roll the money over into this year and then can do the same for next year (if we did not use it). The amount is about $7 million, operating under the current cap is more ideal and stable for the future.
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rbens06


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 7:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CWood21 wrote:
2Bigby0 wrote:
I think 5-6 Mil likely takes care of our own free agents. Shields and EDS ins particular are going to see a pay raise.

Extend Raji and CMIII... I'm not sure how much that will cost, but I imagine with them having a contract in place, they can structure the contracts to be beneficial for both sides.

Going to need another 5-6 Mil for our own draft class as well.


Pencil in 5 million for draft picks, Shields/EDS (assuming 1st/2nd round tenders) will be an additional 4.5 million and then a Matthews extension adds another 6 million. That pretty much covers all the cap space we have for this offseason. Could open up more by restructuring Aaron Rodgers.


I think that based on last year's tenders numbers, assuming Shields is a 1st, EDS is a 2nd, and Crabtree is a right to match, they would account for a hair under $6 million. Personally, I think that Matthews will take more then $6 million. I believe right now he is about $2.6 million. I think he gets a contract that pays him annually around $12 million. To me our cap space is pretty much covered between the RFA and Matthews. Logistically it may make more sense to extend Raji first then Matthews (and at the worse case tag him next offseason).
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incognito_man


Joined: 11 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 8:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rbens06 wrote:
incognito_man wrote:
Shields is the wild card through all this. I think he's going to get more than many on here think. He will take a bigger chunk of change to retain than many are planning for.

His own coach compared his 2012 season to Tramon's 2010 after which Tramon got about $7mil/yr.

I think we'll be lucky to retain Shields for less than $5million/yr on a long term contract, although we do have the advantage of the tender.


I think much like the rationale used on not extending Rodgers until next offseason is the same with Shields. It does not make much sense to even try and negotiate a long term deal with Shields. Any long term deal will undoubtedly pay him more then the tender and the tender locks him up for next year on a good price. A long term deal might be beneficial because we can lock him up for multiple years and maybe get a discount. However, Shields has had ups and down throughout his career, and although I think he is a good player to move forward with, it makes sense to make him prove the long term deal and allow us to reap the benefit of the RFA.


Locking him up now makes sense though because the tender 'threat' will drive his price down. Especially if he continues to progress, he will get VERY expensive and do we want him to be a free agent again the same year Raji and Matthews are?

They very well might be our 3 best defensive players.

I'm all for locking up Shields now while he's a bargain. I know his coach thinks very highly of him and his price is only gonna get higher.
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HokieHigh


Joined: 18 Aug 2009
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Location: Blacksburg
PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

incognito_man wrote:
rbens06 wrote:
incognito_man wrote:
Shields is the wild card through all this. I think he's going to get more than many on here think. He will take a bigger chunk of change to retain than many are planning for.

His own coach compared his 2012 season to Tramon's 2010 after which Tramon got about $7mil/yr.

I think we'll be lucky to retain Shields for less than $5million/yr on a long term contract, although we do have the advantage of the tender.


I think much like the rationale used on not extending Rodgers until next offseason is the same with Shields. It does not make much sense to even try and negotiate a long term deal with Shields. Any long term deal will undoubtedly pay him more then the tender and the tender locks him up for next year on a good price. A long term deal might be beneficial because we can lock him up for multiple years and maybe get a discount. However, Shields has had ups and down throughout his career, and although I think he is a good player to move forward with, it makes sense to make him prove the long term deal and allow us to reap the benefit of the RFA.


Locking him up now makes sense though because the tender 'threat' will drive his price down. Especially if he continues to progress, he will get VERY expensive and do we want him to be a free agent again the same year Raji and Matthews are?

They very well might be our 3 best defensive players.

I'm all for locking up Shields now while he's a bargain. I know his coach thinks very highly of him and his price is only gonna get higher.


I don't know why you would wait on any of these guys. They all belong here, are all part of the core. Sam Shields has a Packers ring tatted on his neck, lock that kid up for life. CM3 and Raji both belong here.

CM3 will cost ~+11 million from where he is now.
Raji will cost ~+4 million from where he is now.
Shields will cost ~+6 million.

I wonder if A-Rod will agree to hold his deal off until the salary cap officially increases? Is that TV deal cap increase officially supposed to happen?
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incognito_man


Joined: 11 Jan 2007
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Location: Madison
PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 9:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HokieHigh wrote:


I don't know why you would wait on any of these guys. They all belong here, are all part of the core. Sam Shields has a Packers ring tatted on his neck, lock that kid up for life. CM3 and Raji both belong here.

CM3 will cost ~+11 million from where he is now.
Raji will cost ~+4 million from where he is now.
Shields will cost ~+6 million.

I wonder if A-Rod will agree to hold his deal off until the salary cap officially increases? Is that TV deal cap increase officially supposed to happen?


I think your numbers are quite far off.

You're suggesting that Matthews will make $16million/yr
Raji will make $9.5million/year and Shields will make $6.5million/yr

Realistically, Matthews is looking at $12million/yr (increase of $7million). Comparable to Woodley and Hali.

Raji is looking at $8million/yr (increase of $2million). Comparable to Wilfork and less than Ngata (who makes about $9).

Shields is wildcard however, he might be around 4.5 or might be around 7. Tough to tell.
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nfldraftguru1


Joined: 07 Feb 2009
Posts: 9761
Location: Whitewater, WI
PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

incognito_man wrote:
HokieHigh wrote:


I don't know why you would wait on any of these guys. They all belong here, are all part of the core. Sam Shields has a Packers ring tatted on his neck, lock that kid up for life. CM3 and Raji both belong here.

CM3 will cost ~+11 million from where he is now.
Raji will cost ~+4 million from where he is now.
Shields will cost ~+6 million.

I wonder if A-Rod will agree to hold his deal off until the salary cap officially increases? Is that TV deal cap increase officially supposed to happen?


I think your numbers are quite far off.

You're suggesting that Matthews will make $16million/yr
Raji will make $9.5million/year and Shields will make $6.5million/yr

Realistically, Matthews is looking at $12million/yr (increase of $7million). Comparable to Woodley and Hali.

Raji is looking at $8million/yr (increase of $2million). Comparable to Wilfork and less than Ngata (who makes about $9).

Shields is wildcard however, he might be around 4.5 or might be around 7. Tough to tell.

I wouldn't give Raji Wilfork $. He's not an elite NT, just very good. A notch below that.
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incognito_man


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nfldraftguru1 wrote:

I wouldn't give Raji Wilfork $. He's not an elite NT, just very good. A notch below that.


have to factor in inflation to contracts.

Raji signing, today, for the same money means he's worth a little less.

I think the $7.5million/yr is ballpark for Raji.
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nfldraftguru1


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 9:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

incognito_man wrote:
nfldraftguru1 wrote:

I wouldn't give Raji Wilfork $. He's not an elite NT, just very good. A notch below that.


have to factor in inflation to contracts.

Raji signing, today, for the same money means he's worth a little less.

I think the $7.5million/yr is ballpark for Raji.

I could agree with that # ballpark. I forget that the cap is going to move over the next couple years.
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spilltray


Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 10145
Location: Green Bay, WI
PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nfldraftguru1 wrote:
incognito_man wrote:
nfldraftguru1 wrote:

I wouldn't give Raji Wilfork $. He's not an elite NT, just very good. A notch below that.


have to factor in inflation to contracts.

Raji signing, today, for the same money means he's worth a little less.

I think the $7.5million/yr is ballpark for Raji.

I could agree with that # ballpark. I forget that the cap is going to move over the next couple years.


Not much. The rumor of a cap spike for the new TV deals was wrong. It's going to stay fairly static. The NFLPA screwed up big time in this last CBA.
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rbens06


Joined: 07 Jan 2008
Posts: 742
PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 12:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

incognito_man wrote:
HokieHigh wrote:


I don't know why you would wait on any of these guys. They all belong here, are all part of the core. Sam Shields has a Packers ring tatted on his neck, lock that kid up for life. CM3 and Raji both belong here.

CM3 will cost ~+11 million from where he is now.
Raji will cost ~+4 million from where he is now.
Shields will cost ~+6 million.

I wonder if A-Rod will agree to hold his deal off until the salary cap officially increases? Is that TV deal cap increase officially supposed to happen?


I think your numbers are quite far off.

You're suggesting that Matthews will make $16million/yr
Raji will make $9.5million/year and Shields will make $6.5million/yr

Realistically, Matthews is looking at $12million/yr (increase of $7million). Comparable to Woodley and Hali.

Raji is looking at $8million/yr (increase of $2million). Comparable to Wilfork and less than Ngata (who makes about $9).

Shields is wildcard however, he might be around 4.5 or might be around 7. Tough to tell.


I think Matthews is a little lower then that, he is still on his rookie deal and I think he is below $3 million making his increase more like $9-10 million. Either way I think those numbers are pretty accurate to what we can expect for those guys.
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rbens06


Joined: 07 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 12:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

incognito_man wrote:
rbens06 wrote:
incognito_man wrote:
Shields is the wild card through all this. I think he's going to get more than many on here think. He will take a bigger chunk of change to retain than many are planning for.

His own coach compared his 2012 season to Tramon's 2010 after which Tramon got about $7mil/yr.

I think we'll be lucky to retain Shields for less than $5million/yr on a long term contract, although we do have the advantage of the tender.


I think much like the rationale used on not extending Rodgers until next offseason is the same with Shields. It does not make much sense to even try and negotiate a long term deal with Shields. Any long term deal will undoubtedly pay him more then the tender and the tender locks him up for next year on a good price. A long term deal might be beneficial because we can lock him up for multiple years and maybe get a discount. However, Shields has had ups and down throughout his career, and although I think he is a good player to move forward with, it makes sense to make him prove the long term deal and allow us to reap the benefit of the RFA.


Locking him up now makes sense though because the tender 'threat' will drive his price down. Especially if he continues to progress, he will get VERY expensive and do we want him to be a free agent again the same year Raji and Matthews are?

They very well might be our 3 best defensive players.

I'm all for locking up Shields now while he's a bargain. I know his coach thinks very highly of him and his price is only gonna get higher.


If we can get him on a bargain I would be all for it, but I think Matthews and Raji should take precedent, which I think will inevitably push Shields into next offseason.
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rbens06


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 12:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

HokieHigh wrote:
incognito_man wrote:
rbens06 wrote:
incognito_man wrote:
Shields is the wild card through all this. I think he's going to get more than many on here think. He will take a bigger chunk of change to retain than many are planning for.

His own coach compared his 2012 season to Tramon's 2010 after which Tramon got about $7mil/yr.

I think we'll be lucky to retain Shields for less than $5million/yr on a long term contract, although we do have the advantage of the tender.


I think much like the rationale used on not extending Rodgers until next offseason is the same with Shields. It does not make much sense to even try and negotiate a long term deal with Shields. Any long term deal will undoubtedly pay him more then the tender and the tender locks him up for next year on a good price. A long term deal might be beneficial because we can lock him up for multiple years and maybe get a discount. However, Shields has had ups and down throughout his career, and although I think he is a good player to move forward with, it makes sense to make him prove the long term deal and allow us to reap the benefit of the RFA.


Locking him up now makes sense though because the tender 'threat' will drive his price down. Especially if he continues to progress, he will get VERY expensive and do we want him to be a free agent again the same year Raji and Matthews are?

They very well might be our 3 best defensive players.

I'm all for locking up Shields now while he's a bargain. I know his coach thinks very highly of him and his price is only gonna get higher.


I don't know why you would wait on any of these guys. They all belong here, are all part of the core. Sam Shields has a Packers ring tatted on his neck, lock that kid up for life. CM3 and Raji both belong here.


It is not really a matter about the guy belonging here or not, it is a numbers game. You cannot just resign Matthews, Shields, and Raji all at once because their cap numbers will jump up so much you would not be able to fit them all in under the cap. It is much like Rodgers, he deserves to be paid in the $20 million range, but why would you do that this year when he is on a very team friendly $9-10 million deal. The amount we "save" by waiting to extend Rodgers can be allocated elsewhere and lock other guys up. Same logic goes for Shields, we can pay him the tender rate and allocate more cap dollars to other guys, Matthews and Raji, while still keeping all those guys.
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ugLymayNe


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 4:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Woodson's leadership will be missed for sure. His play on the other hand won't. In my honest opinion we kept him a year too long just as we did with Driver.
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persiandud


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm gonna miss Woodchuck, he's one of my favorite Packers ever. Good decision by TT, 10 million is a lot of money.
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Pugger


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 10:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

palmy50 wrote:
It's a tough thing to say, but I broke down every Packers game last year and it sure looks like Woodson lost his legs. It's a hard thing to watch to tell the truth. Mind is still there, but the body can't get to the spot!

I'm all about having Woody back, but a cut in pay is a NEED at this point. That money just can't be justified at this point. I respect what the Packers did for Driver last season. But at large that's terrible business.

Truth be told, there is a part of me that hopes Woodson would just hand in the pads. I like to remember Jordan playing with the Bulls. Know what I mean?


I do know what you mean. Sad I wonder if they asked him to restructure and he declined? Here is what TT said:

"We are grateful for all that Charles has given to the Green Bay Packers over the past seven years,” Thompson said. “He has been an integral part of the Packers’ success and our Super Bowl title in 2010 would not have been possible without his contributions. A once-in-a-generation talent as a player, he is also a great leader and ambassador for the organization off the field. Charles will always be a member of the Packers family and we look forward to his eventual induction into the Pro Football Hall of Fame. We wish him and his family all the best."

As a Packer shareholder I hope he joins the BOD after he retires and joins Bryce Paup, Johnny Gray, Mark Murphy and Al Toon.
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