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101Raider


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 2447
PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 10:28 am    Post subject: OffSeason Hypothetical Reply with quote

I wasn't sure which thread to put this in since it's a Salary Cap/Free Agent/Draft question. MODS if this would be better suited in one of the other threads I would not be offended at all to have it closed and moved.

So... would the Raiders be better off short/long term if we were to

1. Cut Carson Palmer saving a potential 6 million (assuming that number is accurate)

2. Use the saved cap space to sign a legit Defensive End- Michael Johnson I'm looking at you... or Michael Bennett

3. Draft Geno Smith @ #3



Now I'm just spit balling here, but this is my thought process. I like Carson, I think he played better than most give him credit for. However, the guy is obviously in the twilight of his career. Looking towards the future must be a priority.

For this hypothetical, I'm assuming that a draft day trade does not materialize and I'm most def playing devils advocate here. My number one priority this offseason is to get a pass rusher. With cap money saved we could grab what in my opinion is our most pressing need, pass rusher.

In the draft, I think there's a large gap between Jones, Moore and Werner from the next quality pass rusher. But those three all have questions which make it difficult to draft in the top 5. In a nutshell: Jones obviously medical, Moore his explosion and Werner his motor and quality of competition. Other top choices involve a "franchise" LT when we have one-so basically improving our RT tackle position (so begins the argument of positional worth) and Star who's devalued in my opinion by this being the best DT class in mind EVER.

Let me preface the Geno thing with Geno falls out of my top 5 but in my top 10 in my "big board." However, Geno is interesting. I really don't get all of the hate he's receiving. His completion percentage is incredible and I get all the talk about his offense centered around the screen game, but come on a percentage in the 70s obviously displays good accuracy and intelligence. I've heard he doesn't throw the deep ball, but I'm not sure where that's coming from. The Smith I've seen he's been show great arm strength and accuracy throwing deep. He's athletic (obviously not RGIII or Kaepernick) but it's still there and he seems to have good pocket awareness (though this declined abit as his season progressed). Best of all, he's intelligent with the football. I'd take a 6 int season any day of the week. If he's franchise caliber in McKenzie's mind then I'm good, assuming we have a plan for DE.

SO...


Carson Palmer and Jones/Moore/Werner
or
Geno Smith and Michael Johnson/Bennett


Last edited by 101Raider on Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:23 pm; edited 3 times in total
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oakdb36


Joined: 02 Mar 2006
Posts: 14229
PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 10:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
CBS' Jason La Canfora has been told there's "no way" the Raiders will pay Carson Palmer's $13 million base salary.
La Canfora lumps Palmer into a group of quarterbacks who could be released in the next month. 33-year-old Palmer has gone just 8-16 over the last two seasons as a starter, and he has two years and $28 million left on his contract, no portion of which is guaranteed. He'll almost certainly have to take a pay cut to return to Oakland. Unfortunately for the cap-strapped Raiders, releasing Palmer would give them minimal cap relief and leave them on the hook for a ton of dead money

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McRaider


Joined: 07 Feb 2009
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

for the money i love the idea. after watching alot .... on geno he is light years better than pryor. damn why do we get the high pick this year when next years crop in QB's are way better
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bitty


Joined: 19 Jan 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

McRaider wrote:
for the money i love the idea. after watching alot .... on geno he is light years better than pryor. damn why do we get the high pick this year when next years crop in QB's are way better


If it makes you feel better next year we'll have a high pick as well
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Totty


Joined: 05 Jan 2006
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Location: Moundsville W.V.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Love this idea. Though Geno is not my cup of tea:

Cut Palmer
Sign Bennett/Johnson
Trade back and land Glennon

Reap rewards.
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Silver&Black88


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glennon? *puke*
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Totty


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Silver&Black88 wrote:
Glennon? *puke*


Sweet. Excellent debate.
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Silver&Black88


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Totty wrote:
Silver&Black88 wrote:
Glennon? *puke*


Sweet. Excellent debate.


He's inconsistent.

His deep ball accuracy is shaky (and he has a strong arm so you know he'll be asked to heave it).

He has good speed but doesn't use it enough.

His footwork is trash.

He's inexperienced.

He looks like he's a giant 10 year old.
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Silver&Black88 wrote:
Somewhere, RR strokes his mustache with pride
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raidr4life


Joined: 10 Jan 2010
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 9:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I fully expect Palmer to take a pay cut and be the starter next season. We will see Pryor more involved especially in the redzone. Honestly if we fix the OL the offense isnt that far off we took a step back because of Knapp, most Raider fans knew it too bad the coaches didnt. If offense had stayed the same we probably would have been 8-8 again, this defense needs alot of work but should improve this season.
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Ro4DPoY


Joined: 12 Jul 2010
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 9:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

raidr4life wrote:
I fully expect Palmer to take a pay cut and be the starter next season. We will see Pryor more involved especially in the redzone. Honestly if we fix the OL the offense isnt that far off we took a step back because of Knapp, most Raider fans knew it too bad the coaches didnt. If offense had stayed the same we probably would have been 8-8 again, this defense needs alot of work but should improve this season.


I'd rather cut Palmer now and build an offense with more weapons and a more stout OL with a much cheaper QB. It makes absolutely perfect sense. Even if it isn't Pryor a cheaper younger QB with a better offense with the salary cap shifting throughout the offense just seems like the best direction to go in. Just my opinion.
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NickButera


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ro4DPoY wrote:
raidr4life wrote:
I fully expect Palmer to take a pay cut and be the starter next season. We will see Pryor more involved especially in the redzone. Honestly if we fix the OL the offense isnt that far off we took a step back because of Knapp, most Raider fans knew it too bad the coaches didnt. If offense had stayed the same we probably would have been 8-8 again, this defense needs alot of work but should improve this season.


I'd rather cut Palmer now and build an offense with more weapons and a more stout OL with a much cheaper QB. It makes absolutely perfect sense. Even if it isn't Pryor a cheaper younger QB with a better offense with the salary cap shifting throughout the offense just seems like the best direction to go in. Just my opinion.


That sounds good. But looking at teams like KC worry me. They have weapons, a lot of ProBowl players (I know, Probowl only means so much), and no QB. Talent on their team is debateable for sure, but they have a lot of things we as Raider fans are looking for, an great pass rushing DE, a true #1 WR, they've got a great RB, great CB, etc etc and it doesn't get them very far.

As much as we're all left wanting for talent, having a QB that can throw for 4000 yards and a solid number of TD's is almost an essential in this QB driven league. I'm really torn on the issue. If we get rid of Palmer we have to draft someone who our staff at least thinks can turn into something. Like you said, if we draft a younger cheaper QB it must be for the right reasons, future development wise and not just cap numbers alone. Free agent and mediocre QB's have turned into a coach killer these last several years, and really set teams back it seems to me.
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Totty


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Silver&Black88 wrote:
Totty wrote:
Silver&Black88 wrote:
Glennon? *puke*


Sweet. Excellent debate.


He's inconsistent.

His deep ball accuracy is shaky (and he has a strong arm so you know he'll be asked to heave it).

He has good speed but doesn't use it enough.

His footwork is trash.

He's inexperienced.

He looks like he's a giant 10 year old.


The inconstancy comes from a lack of experience. Russell Wilson lead that team up until last season, and those are some mighty shoes to fill. He did well, though his INT totals are up. The NC State WRs dropped alot o balls on him and he really had little to no help offensively.

The deep ball accuracy is something that can be worked on through mechanics which can be helped with next level coaching. He is not without mechanics, they need worked on no doubt. Also, the foot work issue it a coachable thing. I agree with you on that.

He actually has NO speed. He is primarily a pocket passer. Think Tom Brady speed.

All that said, he does have some upside. And we have seen kids with question marks come out and do some damage. I really think with the proper coaching and tweaking, Gelnnon has some potential.

Cut Palmer
Sign Bennett/Johnson
Trade back to mid 1st, gain a second, or pick next year
Draft Glennon and build.
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RunDmc23


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cut Palmer Start Pryor Draft Bridgewater next year simple as that
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Baggabonez


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 1:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Correct me if I'm wrong. Unless, Palmer doesn't WANT to be in Oakland (ie- he refuses to restructure) he will be in Oakland because the net result would be a loss of salary cap space for a team already up against the cap.

Before I get lectured on the far-fetched reasons why the Raiders would do this despite losing cap space (assuming I'm wrong) I'm perfectly fine dumping Palmer, starting Pryor provided the Raiders remain 43 because Clowney will be on deck.
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G


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 1:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I won't be happy getting rid of Palmer but if it's in the best interest long-term, then I'm cool with it. Geno at 3 is possible and I won't be too upset.
I also like Wilson
I'd take Barkley but not in the first round
Glennon I really don't like. I'd rather go with Bray if I wanted a tree in the pocket. (Bledsoe types) Smith moves well, I just don't know about the program he came from. I could see us drafting a QB this year at some point, but I'd rather take Joeckel and keep Palmer if Star and Jones are off the board.
Jones
Star
Joeckel
My top 3 and if all 3 are there my pick would depend on FA signings and future trade/cuts to be made.
Trade down is my first choice. Picks, picks, picks...I'd trade right out of the first round and build a team. QB would come later if needed...
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