| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
turtle28
Joined: 21 Nov 2007
Posts: 53420
Location: MD/DC/VA depends on the hr!
|
 Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:21 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
|
| Slateman wrote: | | turtle28 wrote: | | Slateman wrote: | | MKnight82 wrote: | | Slateman wrote: | | turtle28 wrote: | | Slateman wrote: | And when Orakpo doesn't have a huge year? When 2011 is the best he can put up? Is it a good deal then?
The Chiefs didn't get a good deal on Hali. They signed him to a 5/60. That's basically 12 million a year. The vikings signed Allen to a 6/72. 12 million a year.
So what, please tell me, has Orakpo done to be worthy of being paid as much as Jared Allen? We have two years to get a deal done with Orkapo, if the Skins want to keep him. I see no reason to rush in to it with a guy who has now a history of injury to his left pectoral, especially given this team's history with injuries. |
what has orakpo done to be worthy of being paid by this organization?
since he's stepped on the field as a washington redskin in 09, he's been the teams second best and second most consistent defender behind only London Fletcher. They need to have an injury clause, just like they are going to have with Fred Davis as well! |
And what have been the defensive rankings of these squads?
Efforts need to be made to re-sign Jackson, not sign Orakpo to an extension. We have two more years until we have to worry about him walking. |
We get it. You hate Orakpo. |
Don't hate him, just don't see the rush to sign him to a long term deal with injury and performance issues. |
performance issues?
He's been this teams most consistent pass rusher the past 20 years! My gosh....  |
That's really not saying a whole lot, given this team's pass rushers.
Defense has changed in the last five years. The days of defenses dominating a game are over. What matters most now are defenders who make plays and get turnovers. And that's not Orakpo. He's a good pass rusher. That's fine, but that's also replaceable. Like I said, we have two years of Orakpo. Why rush in to an extension now? |
the days of defense dominating are over... You sure about that? The two teams that played in the Super Bowl were there because of how well their defenses played down the stretch.
Orakpo makes as many plays as anyone on our defense.
We can get him at a bargain price that's why.
_________________
 mike23md
Days until:Training camp 38; Preseason opener @ Titans 52; Monday night vs. Eagles 85 RIP SSF |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Slateman
Joined: 13 Nov 2006
Posts: 4651
|
| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 3:14 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| turtle28 wrote: | | Slateman wrote: | | turtle28 wrote: | | Slateman wrote: | | MKnight82 wrote: | | Slateman wrote: | | turtle28 wrote: | | Slateman wrote: | And when Orakpo doesn't have a huge year? When 2011 is the best he can put up? Is it a good deal then?
The Chiefs didn't get a good deal on Hali. They signed him to a 5/60. That's basically 12 million a year. The vikings signed Allen to a 6/72. 12 million a year.
So what, please tell me, has Orakpo done to be worthy of being paid as much as Jared Allen? We have two years to get a deal done with Orkapo, if the Skins want to keep him. I see no reason to rush in to it with a guy who has now a history of injury to his left pectoral, especially given this team's history with injuries. |
what has orakpo done to be worthy of being paid by this organization?
since he's stepped on the field as a washington redskin in 09, he's been the teams second best and second most consistent defender behind only London Fletcher. They need to have an injury clause, just like they are going to have with Fred Davis as well! |
And what have been the defensive rankings of these squads?
Efforts need to be made to re-sign Jackson, not sign Orakpo to an extension. We have two more years until we have to worry about him walking. |
We get it. You hate Orakpo. |
Don't hate him, just don't see the rush to sign him to a long term deal with injury and performance issues. |
performance issues?
He's been this teams most consistent pass rusher the past 20 years! My gosh.... |
That's really not saying a whole lot, given this team's pass rushers.
Defense has changed in the last five years. The days of defenses dominating a game are over. What matters most now are defenders who make plays and get turnovers. And that's not Orakpo. He's a good pass rusher. That's fine, but that's also replaceable. Like I said, we have two years of Orakpo. Why rush in to an extension now? |
the days of defense dominating are over... You sure about that? The two teams that played in the Super Bowl were there because of how well their defenses played down the stretch.
Orakpo makes as many plays as anyone on our defense.
We can get him at a bargain price that's why. |
Wait ... defenses? What Super Bowl did you watch? Because the one I watched had two teams whose defenses were more bend and but don't break. Baltimore was middle of the road defensively and San Fran couldn't keep anyone under 20 points in the playoffs.
Orakpo does not make as many plays. He's the anti-playmaker. Jackson had more interceptions in one season than Orakpo has in his career. Even returned one for a TD. Jackson has shown he has a nose for the ball, even in limited playing time.
We will not get him at a bargain price, that's incredibly wishful thinking. 5/60 is not bargain, that's market value. THat's also a hefty investment, especially since it will have to be heavily backloaded due to the current cap situation.
He's twice injured the same muscle and had a shoulder injury to go with it the second time around. How about we wait a year and he can show he's healthy and productive? We don't lose anything in the long run. We franchise him and pay him what we'd be paying him anyway. But we get a year to evaluate him.
By y'all's logic, we should have signed Landry to a long term extension in 2010. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dashing
Joined: 10 Jul 2011
Posts: 2813
|
| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 12:27 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| Slateman wrote: | | Dashing wrote: | | Why not just trade orakpo and get Phillips who is a FA from SD and sign him . I know it sounds dumb but its smart he is a 3-4 OLB and Orakpo value pretty good and can snatch us a 2nd round pick and give us flexibility to draft a much needed thing in thew 2nd round. |
Because I'd rather keep a cheap alternative who still has upside. Orakpo could turn in to the guy we all thought he'd be when he was drafted. He could end up being as good a pass rusher as Tambi Hali or DeMarcus Ware have been.
If he ends up finally putting it together, then by all means, sign him long term. I just don't think it's worth it to do it now and hope he can stay healthy and actually become that star player. |
NVM Phillips is 32 i thought he was like 28 .
_________________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXTNES_L3s0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkJ8_uNMM_I&list=LLRM2s0GoIPWV7foTBLfFMRw&feature=mh_lolz
^^^^I like to I like to I like to ^_^ |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dashing
Joined: 10 Jul 2011
Posts: 2813
|
| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 12:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
I think we as fans highly overrated Orakpo and Rob Jackson. Yes I will agree that Orakpo is the better pass rusher how ever Rob is the better playmaker who was 400 less pass rushes than Orakpo.
Honestly and I repeat these guys are 4-3 guys .....we should of thought about getting Kiffin as our 4-3 D and have Raheem back and possibly would of really made our d better. Our pass D sucked but blitzing was our only hope and as evident in the hawks game our DL got dominated and our LB's got mis matched while we couldnt stop the run and why?,,
- our 3-4 DL is not starters and its true
-Our pass rush was not good and our LB's are 4-3 guys .
-We dont have any tacklers other than London who might be gone
-We also Have a sucky D coor.
I mean we finally had blitz alot more LIKE WE SHOULD HAVE the whole time but against a good OL and a mobile QB like wilson it would really caus problems and is why our DL and secondary really needs to improve because face facts our D sucks and might again this year.
_________________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXTNES_L3s0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkJ8_uNMM_I&list=LLRM2s0GoIPWV7foTBLfFMRw&feature=mh_lolz
^^^^I like to I like to I like to ^_^ |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
S. Taylor
Joined: 20 Mar 2005
Posts: 10856
Location: Where my AMBITION takes me...
|
| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
Wait... people really think that Rob Jackson is better than Brian Orakpo?
At anything?
There's a reason that Orakpo was a 1st round selection.
He has played like it, too.
Nobody game plans for Rob Jackson.
Don't take this is a jab at Jackson, either.
I like Rob Jackson.
However, coaches have to prepare to face Brian Orakpo and Ryan Kerrigan. Coaches have to consider how to block both. No one is concerned with Rob Jackson.
Whether the Redskins re-sign Orakpo, now or later, I think it's a priority.
This team isn't even sure that London Fletcher will return for another season.
Trying to replace Fletcher and Orakpo in a span of two season is a bit much. This team isn't far off from being a threat in the playoffs. A healthy Orakpo and an improved secondary would have really helped this team in 2012-2013. I want to see the team improve the secondary via draft/FA and watch them at full strength...
_________________
Don't be afraid to turn the lights on...
I've learned to dream with the lights on...
You can see the truth a whole lot better with the lights on... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
DCRED
Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 2409
Location: USA
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2013 12:59 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| S. Taylor wrote: | Wait... people really think that Rob Jackson is better than Brian Orakpo?
At anything?
There's a reason that Orakpo was a 1st round selection.
He has played like it, too.
Nobody game plans for Rob Jackson.
Don't take this is a jab at Jackson, either.
I like Rob Jackson.
However, coaches have to prepare to face Brian Orakpo and Ryan Kerrigan. Coaches have to consider how to block both. No one is concerned with Rob Jackson.
Whether the Redskins re-sign Orakpo, now or later, I think it's a priority.
This team isn't even sure that London Fletcher will return for another season.
Trying to replace Fletcher and Orakpo in a span of two season is a bit much. This team isn't far off from being a threat in the playoffs. A healthy Orakpo and an improved secondary would have really helped this team in 2012-2013. I want to see the team improve the secondary via draft/FA and watch them at full strength... |
Preach On, Man, Preach On
_________________
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
turtle28
Joined: 21 Nov 2007
Posts: 53420
Location: MD/DC/VA depends on the hr!
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2013 3:36 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| DCRED wrote: | | S. Taylor wrote: | Wait... people really think that Rob Jackson is better than Brian Orakpo?
At anything?
There's a reason that Orakpo was a 1st round selection.
He has played like it, too.
Nobody game plans for Rob Jackson.
Don't take this is a jab at Jackson, either.
I like Rob Jackson.
However, coaches have to prepare to face Brian Orakpo and Ryan Kerrigan. Coaches have to consider how to block both. No one is concerned with Rob Jackson.
Whether the Redskins re-sign Orakpo, now or later, I think it's a priority.
This team isn't even sure that London Fletcher will return for another season.
Trying to replace Fletcher and Orakpo in a span of two season is a bit much. This team isn't far off from being a threat in the playoffs. A healthy Orakpo and an improved secondary would have really helped this team in 2012-2013. I want to see the team improve the secondary via draft/FA and watch them at full strength... |
Preach On, Man, Preach On |
this! I quit replying to Slateman and dashing because I just couldn't take it anymore. It's always great to read S.Taylor's post, he just tells it like it is!
_________________
mike23md
Days until:Training camp 38; Preseason opener @ Titans 52; Monday night vs. Eagles 85 RIP SSF |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
DCRED
Joined: 07 Jun 2010
Posts: 2409
Location: USA
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 21, 2013 8:54 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| turtle28 wrote: | | this! It's always great to read S.Taylor's post, he just tells it like it is! |
I know, right. For some reason the | Quote: | | Nobody gameplans for Rob Jackson |
had me lmao
_________________
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
KERRAKPO9891
Joined: 22 Feb 2013
Posts: 43
Location: Crozet, VA
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
turtle28
Joined: 21 Nov 2007
Posts: 53420
Location: MD/DC/VA depends on the hr!
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 4:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
http://washington.cbslocal.com/2013/02/25/with-injured-players-returning-redskins-run-defense-should-be-strong/
With Carriker and Orakpo returning from injury, the run D should be even stronger next year.
| Quote: | ...the Redskins’ front seven should return intact if they can retain restricted free agent Rob Jackson and if captain London Fletcher eschews retirement. The inside linebacker, who turns 38 in May, finished 2012 strong with 67 tackles, four interceptions and two sacks during the seven-game winning streak which clinched the NFC East title despite being limited in practice by a sprained ankle.
Outside linebacker Ryan Kerrigan, who lines up to Fletcher’s left in coordinator Jim Haslett’s 3-4, was chosen for the Pro Bowl in just his second season. Inside linebacker Perry Riley made 129 tackles (just 10 fewer than Fletcher’s team-leading total) in his first full season as a starter. Like Kerrigan, Riley is just 24 and should be far from his peak.
Up front, left end Adam Carriker, who posted a career-high five and a half sacks in 2011, should also be ready to practice this spring after going down with a torn quadriceps in the same game as Orakpo. Jarvis Jenkins, 24, who replaced Carriker last season will battle him to start in 2013. Right end Stephen Bowen, who’ll be 29 next month, is also back as is nose tackle Barry Cofield, who’s nine days older than Bowen and who was credited with a team-high 35 quarterback pressures while leading the defensive line with 36 tackles. |
_________________
mike23md
Days until:Training camp 38; Preseason opener @ Titans 52; Monday night vs. Eagles 85 RIP SSF |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dashing
Joined: 10 Jul 2011
Posts: 2813
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 6:02 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
OK look we shouldn't re-sign Rob jackson if he is expensive and believe me Slateman and me led the charge on the jackson vs Sackpo debate but I saw enough games to put it like this.
Better pass rusher -Orakpo no debate
Better run stopper- Rob jackson
Better cover LB- Rob Jackson
Better play maker- Rob Jackson
Better game planned - Orakpo
Better potentials- Orakpo
Im sorry Rob jackson has 3 key things you need in the NFL and if I herd right Jackson rushed the passer 400 times but its obvious his pass rushing skills was not all that.
Truthfully IDK how will handle Orakpo but IMO if im the GM you have to pick which one can bring you the important part which is PLAY MAKING abilitys and while both are you its a tough question. Orakpo a hard worker but if we can fetch a 2nd for him and re-sign Jackson who I think will be cheaper than Orakpo than sadly thats what you do , Rob Jackson can work on his pass rushing skills in the off-season and hope it gets better but that 2nd can really help us in getting a CB or safety or another need.
We cant keep both because when Orakpo on the field Robs never on the field EVER ! so pick . Be realistic fellas that 2nd for Sackpo and Rob would be smart considering robs young and possibly can make his pass rushing skills better . But than again im over looking orakpos better run stopping skills .
Its a tough choice but I think we keep Rob Jackson and groom him and get him a personal pass rushing trainer and work on his swift moves and he'll have alot of tools of being a play making OLB . Orakpo is also injury prone and likely more expansive so it comes down to this.
Can Jackson improve if Pass rushing skills? or can Orakpo stay healthy ,get his contract and risk losing a 9-11 sack OLB ?
Its really about turn overs and money IMO .
_________________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXTNES_L3s0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkJ8_uNMM_I&list=LLRM2s0GoIPWV7foTBLfFMRw&feature=mh_lolz
^^^^I like to I like to I like to ^_^ |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dashing
Joined: 10 Jul 2011
Posts: 2813
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 6:06 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| turtle28 wrote: | | DCRED wrote: | | S. Taylor wrote: | Wait... people really think that Rob Jackson is better than Brian Orakpo?
At anything?
There's a reason that Orakpo was a 1st round selection.
He has played like it, too.
Nobody game plans for Rob Jackson.
Don't take this is a jab at Jackson, either.
I like Rob Jackson.
However, coaches have to prepare to face Brian Orakpo and Ryan Kerrigan. Coaches have to consider how to block both. No one is concerned with Rob Jackson.
Whether the Redskins re-sign Orakpo, now or later, I think it's a priority.
This team isn't even sure that London Fletcher will return for another season.
Trying to replace Fletcher and Orakpo in a span of two season is a bit much. This team isn't far off from being a threat in the playoffs. A healthy Orakpo and an improved secondary would have really helped this team in 2012-2013. I want to see the team improve the secondary via draft/FA and watch them at full strength... |
Preach On, Man, Preach On |
this! I quit replying to Slateman and dashing because I just couldn't take it anymore. It's always great to read S.Taylor's post, he just tells it like it is! |
I just starded talking about Orakpo again since months lol and I dont even hate him i would like him back but hes injury prone and probably asking for alot of money .
_________________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXTNES_L3s0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkJ8_uNMM_I&list=LLRM2s0GoIPWV7foTBLfFMRw&feature=mh_lolz
^^^^I like to I like to I like to ^_^ |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
MKnight82
Joined: 04 Mar 2009
Posts: 1433
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 6:19 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| Dashing wrote: | OK look we shouldn't re-sign Rob jackson if he is expensive and believe me Slateman and me led the charge on the jackson vs Sackpo debate but I saw enough games to put it like this.
Better pass rusher -Orakpo no debate
Better run stopper- Rob jackson
Better cover LB- Rob Jackson
Better play maker- Rob Jackson
Better game planned - Orakpo
Better potentials- Orakpo
Im sorry Rob jackson has 3 key things you need in the NFL and if I herd right Jackson rushed the passer 400 times but its obvious his pass rushing skills was not all that.
Truthfully IDK how will handle Orakpo but IMO if im the GM you have to pick which one can bring you the important part which is PLAY MAKING abilitys and while both are you its a tough question. Orakpo a hard worker but if we can fetch a 2nd for him and re-sign Jackson who I think will be cheaper than Orakpo than sadly thats what you do , Rob Jackson can work on his pass rushing skills in the off-season and hope it gets better but that 2nd can really help us in getting a CB or safety or another need.
We cant keep both because when Orakpo on the field Robs never on the field EVER ! so pick . Be realistic fellas that 2nd for Sackpo and Rob would be smart considering robs young and possibly can make his pass rushing skills better . But than again im over looking orakpos better run stopping skills .
Its a tough choice but I think we keep Rob Jackson and groom him and get him a personal pass rushing trainer and work on his swift moves and he'll have alot of tools of being a play making OLB . Orakpo is also injury prone and likely more expansive so it comes down to this.
Can Jackson improve if Pass rushing skills? or can Orakpo stay healthy ,get his contract and risk losing a 9-11 sack OLB ?
Its really about turn overs and money IMO . |
So in the free agent thread you want us to improve our pass rush yet here you want us to trade away our best pass rusher. I don't understand your logic. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lavar703
Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Posts: 4890
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 6:28 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| MKnight82 wrote: | | Dashing wrote: | OK look we shouldn't re-sign Rob jackson if he is expensive and believe me Slateman and me led the charge on the jackson vs Sackpo debate but I saw enough games to put it like this.
Better pass rusher -Orakpo no debate
Better run stopper- Rob jackson
Better cover LB- Rob Jackson
Better play maker- Rob Jackson
Better game planned - Orakpo
Better potentials- Orakpo
Im sorry Rob jackson has 3 key things you need in the NFL and if I herd right Jackson rushed the passer 400 times but its obvious his pass rushing skills was not all that.
Truthfully IDK how will handle Orakpo but IMO if im the GM you have to pick which one can bring you the important part which is PLAY MAKING abilitys and while both are you its a tough question. Orakpo a hard worker but if we can fetch a 2nd for him and re-sign Jackson who I think will be cheaper than Orakpo than sadly thats what you do , Rob Jackson can work on his pass rushing skills in the off-season and hope it gets better but that 2nd can really help us in getting a CB or safety or another need.
We cant keep both because when Orakpo on the field Robs never on the field EVER ! so pick . Be realistic fellas that 2nd for Sackpo and Rob would be smart considering robs young and possibly can make his pass rushing skills better . But than again im over looking orakpos better run stopping skills .
Its a tough choice but I think we keep Rob Jackson and groom him and get him a personal pass rushing trainer and work on his swift moves and he'll have alot of tools of being a play making OLB . Orakpo is also injury prone and likely more expansive so it comes down to this.
Can Jackson improve if Pass rushing skills? or can Orakpo stay healthy ,get his contract and risk losing a 9-11 sack OLB ?
Its really about turn overs and money IMO . |
So in the free agent thread you want us to improve our pass rush yet here you want us to trade away our best pass rusher. I don't understand your logic. |
Ah but you're assuming he is using logic....
_________________
| Deets wrote: | | Absolutely nothing. In two years, Ryan Tannehill will be far better than RGIII. |
RIP Sean Taylor "Forever a Redskin" |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
KERRAKPO9891
Joined: 22 Feb 2013
Posts: 43
Location: Crozet, VA
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 6:29 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| Dashing wrote: | OK look we shouldn't re-sign Rob jackson if he is expensive and believe me Slateman and me led the charge on the jackson vs Sackpo debate but I saw enough games to put it like this.
Better pass rusher -Orakpo no debate
Better run stopper- Rob jackson
Better cover LB- Rob Jackson
Better play maker- Rob Jackson
Better game planned - Orakpo
Better potentials- Orakpo
Im sorry Rob jackson has 3 key things you need in the NFL and if I herd right Jackson rushed the passer 400 times but its obvious his pass rushing skills was not all that.
Truthfully IDK how will handle Orakpo but IMO if im the GM you have to pick which one can bring you the important part which is PLAY MAKING abilitys and while both are you its a tough question. Orakpo a hard worker but if we can fetch a 2nd for him and re-sign Jackson who I think will be cheaper than Orakpo than sadly thats what you do , Rob Jackson can work on his pass rushing skills in the off-season and hope it gets better but that 2nd can really help us in getting a CB or safety or another need.
We cant keep both because when Orakpo on the field Robs never on the field EVER ! so pick . Be realistic fellas that 2nd for Sackpo and Rob would be smart considering robs young and possibly can make his pass rushing skills better . But than again im over looking orakpos better run stopping skills .
Its a tough choice but I think we keep Rob Jackson and groom him and get him a personal pass rushing trainer and work on his swift moves and he'll have alot of tools of being a play making OLB . Orakpo is also injury prone and likely more expansive so it comes down to this.
Can Jackson improve if Pass rushing skills? or can Orakpo stay healthy ,get his contract and risk losing a 9-11 sack OLB ?
Its really about turn overs and money IMO . |
In this post you state that Jackson is a better run stopper, and then turn around and say that Orakpo is?
Regardless, Orakpo is the better player period. He was looking good in pass coverage in limited action last season. He dropped a pick, I forget if it was against the Saints or Rams? But overall he looked good in that department. As far as pass rushing, Orakpo is far and away better, and I believe will solidify himself as one of the leagues best pass rushers over the next few seasons. Orakpo also has potential for being a better play maker than Jackson, considering Orakpo will get to the QB more, he will get more forced fumbles. Although Rak does need to improve his hands to catch the interceptions that are thrown his way. Orakpo also has more potential to be a better run stopper than Jackson, Rak is as strong as an ox and can hold the point of attack well and take on blockers with his strength.
Overall, Orakpo > Jackson
EDIT: Also, you keep saying Jackson is young, but he is actually almost a year older than Rak.
Last edited by KERRAKPO9891 on Mon Feb 25, 2013 6:38 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|
FAQ
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
