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10 Free Agents "You'd" like to see the Steelers go
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Troofax


Joined: 28 Jan 2013
Posts: 252
Location: NW US
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

byerly724 wrote:
Desean Jackson (71 games played)
Rec Yds Avg Lng TD RushAtt Yds Avg Lng TD FUM Lost
274 4,785 17.5 91 23 54 371 6.9 67 3 13 5

Mike Wallace (63 Games played)
235 4,042 17.2 95 32 20 151 7.6 21 0 5 3


where exactly does this 100x skill come in play for him? I know stats are always best measure of skill but come on these are like mirror image of each other. Only Difference is Wallace seems to find the end zone more.

And i'm not even the biggest fan of wallace(was hoping someone traded for him after last season) but lets be realistic
I quit looking at datasheets as evidence about 20 years ago. Eyeballs don't usually let me down. Stats did that too often, I learned from it. It doesn't take much watching for me to compare skill sets. Wallace doesn't stack up to many WR in the league,ever, as far as "skill" goes. Don't know how much more I can emphasis"skill" than I have. You're talking production,Apple meet orange....Production doesn't equal skill or skill set. Wally runs fast,and has good enough hands to make that speed count..but that's where his "skill set" stops,if it can even be called that.

Wally will be effective in a offense that has a great RB and uses the play action game a lot. SF and Houston both make sense.
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Mini-mock
1.Tyler Eiffert TE Notre Dame
2. Eric Reid S LSU
3. Robert Woods WR USC
4. Jonathan Franklin RB UCLA

That's all I got, will fill in the rest later.
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Troofax


Joined: 28 Jan 2013
Posts: 252
Location: NW US
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 5:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

popie70 wrote:
Troofax wrote:
Would be much easier listing the guys that Wallace is more *skilled* than. I don't think that some know what the true meaning of *skilled* is...looking at the list above for about 1.5 seconds, I can't believe what I'm reading...Wallace is not as skilled as any of the players...AB? Debatable? Please...Jackson? and your giving stats as proof? Did you see there Oline and QB situation? Jackson is 100x more skilled than Wallace. Wallace has a unique talent, but that's really it.


If you want to say that Jackson and Wallace can be debated that's fine but to say that Desean Jackson is 100x more skilled than Wallace is ridiculous. I would say they pretty much have the same skill set except Wallace is taller and more durable and while he is a diva isn't in the same stratosphere as Jackson.
Whole heartedly disagree. Wally isn't in Jackson's stratosphere athletically would be more accurate. As for diva status? Wallace does compare favorably in that department. Maybe you're dyslexic?
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Mini-mock
1.Tyler Eiffert TE Notre Dame
2. Eric Reid S LSU
3. Robert Woods WR USC
4. Jonathan Franklin RB UCLA

That's all I got, will fill in the rest later.
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FourThreeMafia


Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 49048
Location: East of Sixburgh
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jebrick wrote:
treat88 wrote:
treat88 wrote:
jebrick wrote:
treat88 wrote:
jebrick wrote:
treat88 wrote:


Lets go with guaranteed money...far better reflection of how teams value a guy.

You take Wallace - a fair number versus Bowe? Whichever side ends up higher claims the bet.

What's a fair number to you?


Fair number? You mean like a range? I think Wallace will get 30M guaranteed.


How much more than Bowe do you think he will get?
I think Bowe will get about 20-25M guaranteed.


So if I take Bowe + 7.5 million versus Wallace on guaranteed money....highest total wins....is that an acceptable wager?


Do we have a wager jebrick?

Gotta keep the offseason interesting, no?


Take it for what it's worth.
Quote:

According to CBS Sports' Jason La Canfora, "many" in the Steelers' organization believe the division-rival Browns will sign free agent Mike Wallace.
New Cleveland owner Jimmy Haslam is a former minority Steelers owner, and the new Browns coaching staff of Rob Chudzinski and Norv Turner believes in a vertical-oriented passing attack. Wallace, of course, is a vertical receiver. Still just 26 years old, Wallace figures to seek a four- to five-year deal worth in excess of $10 million per season. Last offseason, Wallace lobbied the Steelers to pay him Vincent Jackson money (five years, $55.555 million). Source: CBS Sports Feb 11 - 3:07 PM


Think


LaCanfora acts like he has all kinds of insider info on the Steelers when he has none. He has no credibility when speaking of the inner workings of this team.

The Browns may TRY to sign him, but I think he ends up on a team down south. The Dolphins have a ton of money and need a WR.

Besides, why would Wallace want to go to a team that doesnt even have a reliable QB and where he wont be the sure fire number 1 (Josh Gordon is looking good)

They may have the money, but IMO, they dont have the appeal that other teams do, and they can offer him as much as the Browns.
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Troofax


Joined: 28 Jan 2013
Posts: 252
Location: NW US
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Greg Jennings makes sense for Miami. Wally is a luxury piece,not to say he doesn't have value. As long as he keeps that speed he has plenty of value. He might be better off personally as the focus,WR, but for an offense he's much more valuable opposite a stronger, more dependable possession type,and a solid run game. We seen how dependable Wally is when in must pass situations. Is there a less clutch "number 1" in football? That IMO is a true number one. Defense knows you have to pass,who you want to get that pass too,and still have trouble. Wally is no such WR . Better off with a team that has the luxury ,cap room,to afford a great number two weapon. He would shine bright in that role.
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Mini-mock
1.Tyler Eiffert TE Notre Dame
2. Eric Reid S LSU
3. Robert Woods WR USC
4. Jonathan Franklin RB UCLA

That's all I got, will fill in the rest later.
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jebrick


Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 8006
Location: Indianapolis
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FourThreeMafia wrote:
jebrick wrote:

Take it for what it's worth.
Quote:

According to CBS Sports' Jason La Canfora, "many" in the Steelers' organization believe the division-rival Browns will sign free agent Mike Wallace.
New Cleveland owner Jimmy Haslam is a former minority Steelers owner, and the new Browns coaching staff of Rob Chudzinski and Norv Turner believes in a vertical-oriented passing attack. Wallace, of course, is a vertical receiver. Still just 26 years old, Wallace figures to seek a four- to five-year deal worth in excess of $10 million per season. Last offseason, Wallace lobbied the Steelers to pay him Vincent Jackson money (five years, $55.555 million). Source: CBS Sports Feb 11 - 3:07 PM


Think


LaCanfora acts like he has all kinds of insider info on the Steelers when he has none. He has no credibility when speaking of the inner workings of this team.

The Browns may TRY to sign him, but I think he ends up on a team down south. The Dolphins have a ton of money and need a WR.

Besides, why would Wallace want to go to a team that doesnt even have a reliable QB and where he wont be the sure fire number 1 (Josh Gordon is looking good)

They may have the money, but IMO, they dont have the appeal that other teams do, and they can offer him as much as the Browns.


Because they give him 10M per year Very Happy Offer him the most money.

Browns have even more money. About 50M under the cap, and less to spend it on that Miami and need talent. They are also owned by a Steelers fan.
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popie70


Joined: 18 Dec 2010
Posts: 1063
Location: Denver, CO
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Troofax wrote:
popie70 wrote:
Troofax wrote:
Would be much easier listing the guys that Wallace is more *skilled* than. I don't think that some know what the true meaning of *skilled* is...looking at the list above for about 1.5 seconds, I can't believe what I'm reading...Wallace is not as skilled as any of the players...AB? Debatable? Please...Jackson? and your giving stats as proof? Did you see there Oline and QB situation? Jackson is 100x more skilled than Wallace. Wallace has a unique talent, but that's really it.


If you want to say that Jackson and Wallace can be debated that's fine but to say that Desean Jackson is 100x more skilled than Wallace is ridiculous. I would say they pretty much have the same skill set except Wallace is taller and more durable and while he is a diva isn't in the same stratosphere as Jackson.
Whole heartedly disagree. Wally isn't in Jackson's stratosphere athletically would be more accurate. As for diva status? Wallace does compare favorably in that department. Maybe you're dyslexic?


Very clever comeback on your part. So you say that Desean is 100x the athelte. Well are Mike's combine numbers and Desean's pro days numbers:

Mike's Numbers:
40 Yrd Dash: 4.28
20 Yrd Dash: 2.45
10 Yrd Dash: 1.43
225 Lb. Bench Reps: 14
Vertical Jump: 40
Broad Jump: 10'09"
20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.27
3-Cone Drill: 6.90

Desean:
40 Yrd Dash: 4.35
20 Yrd Dash: 2.52
10 Yrd Dash: 1.53
Vertical Jump: 34 1/2
Broad Jump: 10'02" (10' even at the combine)
20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.19
3-Cone Drill: 6.82

So Desean has a better 20yd shuttle and 3 cone drill at this pro day. That looks like someone who is 100x more athletic. Or do you want to ignore these numbers the same way you want to ignore stats?

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=68061&draftyear=2009&genpos=WR

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=57210&draftyear=2008&genpos=WR
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byerly724


Joined: 25 Jul 2009
Posts: 193
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 8:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@popie70 - Sadly those stats too will be to unreliable for Troofax. So from now on we should all ask him how good a player is because as he says he goes by "eyeballs" only.
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Troofax


Joined: 28 Jan 2013
Posts: 252
Location: NW US
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 8:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

popie70 wrote:
Troofax wrote:
popie70 wrote:
Troofax wrote:
Would be much easier listing the guys that Wallace is more *skilled* than. I don't think that some know what the true meaning of *skilled* is...looking at the list above for about 1.5 seconds, I can't believe what I'm reading...Wallace is not as skilled as any of the players...AB? Debatable? Please...Jackson? and your giving stats as proof? Did you see there Oline and QB situation? Jackson is 100x more skilled than Wallace. Wallace has a unique talent, but that's really it.


If you want to say that Jackson and Wallace can be debated that's fine but to say that Desean Jackson is 100x more skilled than Wallace is ridiculous. I would say they pretty much have the same skill set except Wallace is taller and more durable and while he is a diva isn't in the same stratosphere as Jackson.
Whole heartedly disagree. Wally isn't in Jackson's stratosphere athletically would be more accurate. As for diva status? Wallace does compare favorably in that department. Maybe you're dyslexic?


Very clever comeback on your part. So you say that Desean is 100x the athelte. Well are Mike's combine numbers and Desean's pro days numbers:

Mike's Numbers:
40 Yrd Dash: 4.28
20 Yrd Dash: 2.45
10 Yrd Dash: 1.43
225 Lb. Bench Reps: 14
Vertical Jump: 40
Broad Jump: 10'09"
20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.27
3-Cone Drill: 6.90

Desean:
40 Yrd Dash: 4.35
20 Yrd Dash: 2.52
10 Yrd Dash: 1.53
Vertical Jump: 34 1/2
Broad Jump: 10'02" (10' even at the combine)
20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.19
3-Cone Drill: 6.82

So Desean has a better 20yd shuttle and 3 cone drill at this pro day. That looks like someone who is 100x more athletic. Or do you want to ignore these numbers the same way you want to ignore stats?

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=68061&draftyear=2009&genpos=WR

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=57210&draftyear=2008&genpos=WR


Again, appreciate the effort. I was aware of those numbers tho. We obviously have different definitions of "athletic"..

I don't give 2 craps about numbers when talking athletic. It's something I don't have a clear definition for, but I'll describe it the best I can.

To me an "athletic" guy, any athlete in any sport really, but for this debate I'll try and be specific to wideout.

To me truly Athletic WR's look smooth,effortless in everything they do. There is no herky, jerky or clumsiness(sp?), it looks like they are almost bored, it's natural motion. When they go up for a ball, the timing, the eye hand cordination, ability to hang in the air, body control to come down with the ball in bounds, and at the same time make the catch with little effort.

Wallace is none of this. Jackson fits most of this. Wallace is too stiff, everything is awkward about him, including running in a straight line. In your definition, you would consider a James Jett a better athlete than a Lynn Swann. A Ron Brown, better than a Tim Brown...Combine numbers mean very little, give me an "athlete" 24/7/365 & Thrice on Sundays over a gold medalist in the underwear olympics.

"athletic" - usually basketball players to me. I see them as the greatest athletes in the world. Coordination is a big part of that.

BTW- The dyslexic comment was pure sarcasm, tongue in cheek. Hope it didn't offend you.
_________________
Mini-mock
1.Tyler Eiffert TE Notre Dame
2. Eric Reid S LSU
3. Robert Woods WR USC
4. Jonathan Franklin RB UCLA

That's all I got, will fill in the rest later.
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Troofax


Joined: 28 Jan 2013
Posts: 252
Location: NW US
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

byerly724 wrote:
@popie70 - Sadly those stats too will be to unreliable for Troofax. So from now on we should all ask him how good a player is because as he says he goes by "eyeballs" only.


Correct.
_________________
Mini-mock
1.Tyler Eiffert TE Notre Dame
2. Eric Reid S LSU
3. Robert Woods WR USC
4. Jonathan Franklin RB UCLA

That's all I got, will fill in the rest later.
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popie70


Joined: 18 Dec 2010
Posts: 1063
Location: Denver, CO
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 11:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Troofax wrote:
popie70 wrote:
Troofax wrote:
popie70 wrote:
Troofax wrote:
Would be much easier listing the guys that Wallace is more *skilled* than. I don't think that some know what the true meaning of *skilled* is...looking at the list above for about 1.5 seconds, I can't believe what I'm reading...Wallace is not as skilled as any of the players...AB? Debatable? Please...Jackson? and your giving stats as proof? Did you see there Oline and QB situation? Jackson is 100x more skilled than Wallace. Wallace has a unique talent, but that's really it.


If you want to say that Jackson and Wallace can be debated that's fine but to say that Desean Jackson is 100x more skilled than Wallace is ridiculous. I would say they pretty much have the same skill set except Wallace is taller and more durable and while he is a diva isn't in the same stratosphere as Jackson.
Whole heartedly disagree. Wally isn't in Jackson's stratosphere athletically would be more accurate. As for diva status? Wallace does compare favorably in that department. Maybe you're dyslexic?


Very clever comeback on your part. So you say that Desean is 100x the athelte. Well are Mike's combine numbers and Desean's pro days numbers:

Mike's Numbers:
40 Yrd Dash: 4.28
20 Yrd Dash: 2.45
10 Yrd Dash: 1.43
225 Lb. Bench Reps: 14
Vertical Jump: 40
Broad Jump: 10'09"
20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.27
3-Cone Drill: 6.90

Desean:
40 Yrd Dash: 4.35
20 Yrd Dash: 2.52
10 Yrd Dash: 1.53
Vertical Jump: 34 1/2
Broad Jump: 10'02" (10' even at the combine)
20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.19
3-Cone Drill: 6.82

So Desean has a better 20yd shuttle and 3 cone drill at this pro day. That looks like someone who is 100x more athletic. Or do you want to ignore these numbers the same way you want to ignore stats?

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=68061&draftyear=2009&genpos=WR

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=57210&draftyear=2008&genpos=WR


Again, appreciate the effort. I was aware of those numbers tho. We obviously have different definitions of "athletic"..

I don't give 2 craps about numbers when talking athletic. It's something I don't have a clear definition for, but I'll describe it the best I can.

To me an "athletic" guy, any athlete in any sport really, but for this debate I'll try and be specific to wideout.

To me truly Athletic WR's look smooth,effortless in everything they do. There is no herky, jerky or clumsiness(sp?), it looks like they are almost bored, it's natural motion. When they go up for a ball, the timing, the eye hand cordination, ability to hang in the air, body control to come down with the ball in bounds, and at the same time make the catch with little effort.

Wallace is none of this. Jackson fits most of this. Wallace is too stiff, everything is awkward about him, including running in a straight line. In your definition, you would consider a James Jett a better athlete than a Lynn Swann. A Ron Brown, better than a Tim Brown...Combine numbers mean very little, give me an "athlete" 24/7/365 & Thrice on Sundays over a gold medalist in the underwear olympics.

"athletic" - usually basketball players to me. I see them as the greatest athletes in the world. Coordination is a big part of that.

BTW- The dyslexic comment was pure sarcasm, tongue in cheek. Hope it didn't offend you.


Different strokes my man
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whit09


Joined: 15 Dec 2009
Posts: 1308
Location: East of Pittsburgh
PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's mine...

Bruce Gradkowski: Would be a very solid #2 capable of winning games if necessary.

Patrick Chung: A tough STer and would be an upgrade over Mundy, no doubt.

Brian Hartline: A guy that would really shine in Haley's offense, I believe.

Alan Branch: Has been an excellent backup NT/DT for the Cards and Seahawks.

Connor Barwin: Could start in a pinch for Harrison or Woodley if either of them are hurt.

Shonn Greene: I thought he got a raw deal this year.

or

Peyton Hillis: I could see him resurrecting his career here. At worst, he would be a sick FB.

Larry Grant: Solid backup at ILB

And...

Paul Kruger...The Ravens are utterly insane if they let him walk. But they may have to, in order to pay the unibrow.
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AlanFanecaFan


Joined: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 10936
Location: Getting hammered with Jeff Reed
PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 4:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vonta Leach would be nice.
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FourThreeMafia


Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 49048
Location: East of Sixburgh
PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 6:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

whit09 wrote:
Here's mine...

Bruce Gradkowski: Would be a very solid #2 capable of winning games if necessary.

Patrick Chung: A tough STer and would be an upgrade over Mundy, no doubt.

Brian Hartline: A guy that would really shine in Haley's offense, I believe.

Alan Branch: Has been an excellent backup NT/DT for the Cards and Seahawks.

Connor Barwin: Could start in a pinch for Harrison or Woodley if either of them are hurt.

Shonn Greene: I thought he got a raw deal this year.

or

Peyton Hillis: I could see him resurrecting his career here. At worst, he would be a sick FB.

Larry Grant: Solid backup at ILB

And...

Paul Kruger...The Ravens are utterly insane if they let him walk. But they may have to, in order to pay the unibrow.


Hartline is too much like what we already have at WR.

Peyton Hillis has no career to resurrect. His one good year was a fluke. He is not better than Redman. Neither is Shonn Greene.

Larry Grant might be a starter. Depends on whats up with Foote.

Kruger will cost way too much. Like Flacco, he earned a much bigger payday in the postseason. Probably more than he is worth.
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wwhickok


Joined: 27 Nov 2012
Posts: 12201
Location: Montgomery, PA aka Steeler Nation!
PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 9:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So this morning I read an article on the NFL's website that listed 'Potential free agents' for each team. Because I have nothing better to do at my desk job, I took the time to jot down some of the FA's I thought were the 'sexiest' names on the market. I only listed guys I actually think MIGHT end up on the market and MIGHT have some value. The guys I was either, unsure about, unfamiliar with, didn't think were worth it or wouldn't actually be free agents, I didn't list. ex. Joe Flacco & Dannell Ellerbe

Arizona Cardinals: LB Quentin Groves
Atlanta Falcons: LT Sam Baker, S Chris Hope
Baltimore Ravens: LB Paul Kruger , OT Bryant McKinnie
Buffalo Bills: S Jairus Bird, RB Tashard Choice, LB Shawne Merriman, CB Leodis McKelvin
Chicago Bears: QB Jason Campbell, WR Johnny Knox, DT Amobi Okoye, OG Chilo Rachal, Khalil Bell RB
Cincinnati Bengals: K Josh Brown, QB Bruce Gronkowski
Cleveland Browns: WR Joshua Cribbs, RB Brandon Jackson, WR Mohamed Massaquoi, TE Benjamin Watson
Dallas Cowboys: Victor Butler LB, RB Felix Jones, LB Ernie Sims, LB Anthony Spencer
Denver Broncos: RT Ryan Clady, DT Ty Warren
Detroit Lions: OT Gosder Cherilus, LB Justin Durant, WR Stefan Logan, RB Kevin Smith
Green Bay Packers: RB Cedric Benson
Houston Texans: LB Connor Barwin, CB Stanford Routt, Barrett Ruud
Indianapolis Colts: WR Donnie Avery, OT Winston Justice, RB Mewelde Moore
Jacksonville Jaguars: FB Greg Jones
Kansas City Chiefs: P Dustin Colquitt, RB Peyton Hillis, LB Brandon Siler
Miami Dolphins:RB Reggie Bush, K Nate Kaeding, QB Matt Moore
Minnesota Vikings: LB Jasper Brinkley, OT Phil Loadholt, WR Jerome Simpson
New Orleans Saints: OL Jermon Bushrod, DE Turk McBride
NY Giants: RB Ahmad Bradshaw, S Kenny Phillips, LB Keith Rivers
NY Jets: WR Braylon Edwards, RB Shonn Greene, TE Dustin Keller, OL Jason Smith
Oakland Raiders: P Shane Lechler, LB Phillip Wheeler
Philadelphia Eagles: CB Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie
San Diego Chargers: LB Antwan Barnes, RB Jackie Battle, LB Shaun Phillips
San Fransisco 49ers: LB Larry Grant, RB Brandon Jacobs
St. Louis Rams: RB Steven Jackson, WR Steve Smith
Tampa Bay Buccaneers: TE Dallas Clark, OL Jeremy Trueblood
Tennessee Titans: TE Jared Cook, LB Will Witherspoon
Washington Redskins: OL Kory Lichtensteiger

Looking forward to your thoughts.

Reggie Bush is on the list as a 'return guy' as is Stefan Logan. Moore is on the list because he has been here before, perhaps a 'running game jump start'.
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wwhickok


Joined: 27 Nov 2012
Posts: 12201
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FourThreeMafia wrote:
Neither is Shonn Greene.



I gotta disagree with that. Shonn Greene still had a 1,000+ yard season on that crappy NYJ offense.
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