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Darkness


Joined: 24 Jun 2012
Posts: 7739
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JTagg7754 wrote:
oakdb36 wrote:

The rest of the stuff is the things you were claiming Pryor was incapable of doing a week before that game. He was supposedly too dumb to run the offense, to have it lined up correctly and in time. Well, in his first ever start, it wasn't an issue. McKenzie is commenting on it because it's the kind of things that happen frequently to a QB in his first start in the NFL and Pryor handled it very well. That was definitely a positive to take from this game. It's definitely not enough. He needs to show a lot more as a passer.


Yep, based on a report. Obviously I have no first hand knowledge. Good for him for learning a three step drop. Don't you find it bad that we even have to talk about this for a NFL QB?

It's a positive to take from a game.... if you're in high school. A player in this league shouldn't even need to learn these things. I would hope it was second nature by now. Doesn't it seem like we're babying a player too much?


It seems like you and holyghost were dismissing his ability to do the simple things all together before the game without any evidence aside from bias. Then he does those things, and it's "isn't it bad we even have to talk about that?!". No one would talk about him being able to take snaps, lining up the offense and making drops if you didn't bring it up to begin with
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NCOUGHMAN


Joined: 25 Mar 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darkness wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
oakdb36 wrote:

The rest of the stuff is the things you were claiming Pryor was incapable of doing a week before that game. He was supposedly too dumb to run the offense, to have it lined up correctly and in time. Well, in his first ever start, it wasn't an issue. McKenzie is commenting on it because it's the kind of things that happen frequently to a QB in his first start in the NFL and Pryor handled it very well. That was definitely a positive to take from this game. It's definitely not enough. He needs to show a lot more as a passer.


Yep, based on a report. Obviously I have no first hand knowledge. Good for him for learning a three step drop. Don't you find it bad that we even have to talk about this for a NFL QB?

It's a positive to take from a game.... if you're in high school. A player in this league shouldn't even need to learn these things. I would hope it was second nature by now. Doesn't it seem like we're babying a player too much?


It seems like you and holyghost were dismissing his ability to do the simple things all together before the game without any evidence aside from bias. Then he does those things, and it's "isn't it bad we even have to talk about that?!". No one would talk about him being able to take snaps, lining up the offense and making drops if you didn't bring it up to begin with


this.
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holyghost


Joined: 18 Jan 2007
Posts: 5772
PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darkness wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
oakdb36 wrote:

The rest of the stuff is the things you were claiming Pryor was incapable of doing a week before that game. He was supposedly too dumb to run the offense, to have it lined up correctly and in time. Well, in his first ever start, it wasn't an issue. McKenzie is commenting on it because it's the kind of things that happen frequently to a QB in his first start in the NFL and Pryor handled it very well. That was definitely a positive to take from this game. It's definitely not enough. He needs to show a lot more as a passer.


Yep, based on a report. Obviously I have no first hand knowledge. Good for him for learning a three step drop. Don't you find it bad that we even have to talk about this for a NFL QB?

It's a positive to take from a game.... if you're in high school. A player in this league shouldn't even need to learn these things. I would hope it was second nature by now. Doesn't it seem like we're babying a player too much?


It seems like you and holyghost were dismissing his ability to do the simple things all together before the game without any evidence aside from bias. Then he does those things, and it's "isn't it bad we even have to talk about that?!". No one would talk about him being able to take snaps, lining up the offense and making drops if you didn't bring it up to begin with


I was, I admit. I was a lukewarm Pryor fan before that but skeptical considering his inability to get any playing time. And up until that I didn't want to judge because I also saw signs of Knapp and Allen being reallllly inflexible in other ways. So I couldn't tell at the time whether it was Pryor or them at fault for not getting him on the field.

But when the report came out about the 3 step drop I definitely took it to heart, and basically turned on Pryor on a dime. If there was truth to it, you have no idea how bad that is when it comes to a prospect. To not know such a simple thing, such a foundational skill of his job?

It turns out it was overblown. Even if his drops aren't perfect, and his passing needs tons of work and work that may never even be able to improve it, there's one thing from Pryor he did that I actually never expected. His arm, his base skills and footwork - they're terrible. But as a passer that one thing he did is a big deal - he found the open guy. That means alot, it really does. And more than that, he found the open guy on scoring plays too. It's the singular best skill a passer can have, and it's one of the hardest to teach. There are endless amounts of timing spots on routes for different guys catching passes. It's why every quarterback plays the same game a totally different way. Pryor found the right guys at the right times often enough to produce 2 passing scores and likely another one ruined by PI. That's much more than I expected in that department from him.

I wouldn't say that I was dismissing him due to "bias" as you state. I have and had no previous bias against Pryor. I just thought if there was truth to the thing about the 3 step drop, then as a prospect he had 0% chance to emerge as a legitimate QB of this team. Like I said, turns out it was overblown and I overreacted to it.
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JTagg7754


Joined: 09 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darkness wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
oakdb36 wrote:

The rest of the stuff is the things you were claiming Pryor was incapable of doing a week before that game. He was supposedly too dumb to run the offense, to have it lined up correctly and in time. Well, in his first ever start, it wasn't an issue. McKenzie is commenting on it because it's the kind of things that happen frequently to a QB in his first start in the NFL and Pryor handled it very well. That was definitely a positive to take from this game. It's definitely not enough. He needs to show a lot more as a passer.


Yep, based on a report. Obviously I have no first hand knowledge. Good for him for learning a three step drop. Don't you find it bad that we even have to talk about this for a NFL QB?

It's a positive to take from a game.... if you're in high school. A player in this league shouldn't even need to learn these things. I would hope it was second nature by now. Doesn't it seem like we're babying a player too much?


It seems like you and holyghost were dismissing his ability to do the simple things all together before the game without any evidence aside from bias. Then he does those things, and it's "isn't it bad we even have to talk about that?!". No one would talk about him being able to take snaps, lining up the offense and making drops if you didn't bring it up to begin with


Actually we had conventional thinking and a report to base those thoughts on. Hardly bias. And you're taking out of context. It's the fact that Reggie was proud he could do that to where I said that. Good for him for learning a 3 step drop though LOL.

Again, I never brought it up, Papa did.
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Nodisrespect


Joined: 28 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

holyghost wrote:
Darkness wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
oakdb36 wrote:

The rest of the stuff is the things you were claiming Pryor was incapable of doing a week before that game. He was supposedly too dumb to run the offense, to have it lined up correctly and in time. Well, in his first ever start, it wasn't an issue. McKenzie is commenting on it because it's the kind of things that happen frequently to a QB in his first start in the NFL and Pryor handled it very well. That was definitely a positive to take from this game. It's definitely not enough. He needs to show a lot more as a passer.


Yep, based on a report. Obviously I have no first hand knowledge. Good for him for learning a three step drop. Don't you find it bad that we even have to talk about this for a NFL QB?

It's a positive to take from a game.... if you're in high school. A player in this league shouldn't even need to learn these things. I would hope it was second nature by now. Doesn't it seem like we're babying a player too much?


It seems like you and holyghost were dismissing his ability to do the simple things all together before the game without any evidence aside from bias. Then he does those things, and it's "isn't it bad we even have to talk about that?!". No one would talk about him being able to take snaps, lining up the offense and making drops if you didn't bring it up to begin with


I was, I admit. I was a lukewarm Pryor fan before that but skeptical considering his inability to get any playing time. And up until that I didn't want to judge because I also saw signs of Knapp and Allen being reallllly inflexible in other ways. So I couldn't tell at the time whether it was Pryor or them at fault for not getting him on the field.

But when the report came out about the 3 step drop I definitely took it to heart, and basically turned on Pryor on a dime. If there was truth to it, you have no idea how bad that is when it comes to a prospect. To not know such a simple thing, such a foundational skill of his job?

It turns out it was overblown. Even if his drops aren't perfect, and his passing needs tons of work and work that may never even be able to improve it, there's one thing from Pryor he did that I actually never expected. His arm, his base skills and footwork - they're terrible. But as a passer that one thing he did is a big deal - he found the open guy. That means alot, it really does. And more than that, he found the open guy on scoring plays too. It's the singular best skill a passer can have, and it's one of the hardest to teach. There are endless amounts of timing spots on routes for different guys catching passes. It's why every quarterback plays the same game a totally different way. Pryor found the right guys at the right times often enough to produce 2 passing scores and likely another one ruined by PI. That's much more than I expected in that department from him.

I wouldn't say that I was dismissing him due to "bias" as you state. I have and had no previous bias against Pryor. I just thought if there was truth to the thing about the 3 step drop, then as a prospect he had 0% chance to emerge as a legitimate QB of this team. Like I said, turns out it was overblown and I overreacted to it.
Thanks for owning up to it, i know we clashed about it, but i had forgot all about it. I would have taken a similar position as your self, but his work ethic has never been questioned, and even if he couldn't throw well, i had a strong feeling he would excel at the things he could control. We didn't have to burn any TO to get plays in.(like we did sometimes with Carson, and ALL the time with Campbell) And that is huge.

And let's not forget Carson wrote all his notes for the game, i think that played a large part in him "finding open guys". Which should also give hope that he can learn and improve and is willing to put in the work.
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NCOUGHMAN


Joined: 25 Mar 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cp for oc? Cool
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NCOUGHMAN > all of you


Raider X wrote:
This is football, not pussology 101
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Silver&Black88


Joined: 24 Feb 2009
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NCOUGHMAN wrote:
cp for oc? Cool


CPeezy + TPeezy = TDeezy's fo sheezy.


I just wanted to say that.
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OakRaiders3828


Joined: 18 Aug 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pistol with a two QB system? make everyone happy
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bigm19792002


Joined: 11 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

we need a good back up RB we should have kept Bush that really bothered me when then did not resign him
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Silver&Black88


Joined: 24 Feb 2009
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bigm19792002 wrote:
we need a good back up RB we should have kept Bush that really bothered me when then did not resign him


Why? Bush has no burst and our main backup got injured. And even then, our running game was at its best when that was the case.
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JTagg7754


Joined: 09 Nov 2010
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Location: Somewhere in Ohio
PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bigm19792002 wrote:
we need a good back up RB we should have kept Bush that really bothered me when then did not resign him


I think Goodson will suffice as a backup. Stewart wasn't terrible either. I'd worry about our starting positions first and foremost and then we can focus on those that are back-ups. That's just the way I would do it.
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ZoomWaffle


Joined: 25 Apr 2010
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JTagg7754 wrote:
bigm19792002 wrote:
we need a good back up RB we should have kept Bush that really bothered me when then did not resign him


I think Goodson will suffice as a backup. Stewart wasn't terrible either. I'd worry about our starting positions first and foremost and then we can focus on those that are back-ups. That's just the way I would do it.


Agreed. We dont necessarily need a legit #2 back, either. Think about it, Goodson and Reece are both capable RBs who offer different things to our offense. We really should be limiting McFadden's carries (maybe split him out wide more often?) and let Reece and Goodson get some carries. We have 3 Rbs who can do all sorts of different things and they could form a very dangerous combination.
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La_Vader wrote:
I wouldn't trade Pryor for any prospect in this years draft. Quote me on that
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NCOUGHMAN


Joined: 25 Mar 2008
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Location: Stockton via East Palo Alto
PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ZoomWaffle wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
bigm19792002 wrote:
we need a good back up RB we should have kept Bush that really bothered me when then did not resign him


I think Goodson will suffice as a backup. Stewart wasn't terrible either. I'd worry about our starting positions first and foremost and then we can focus on those that are back-ups. That's just the way I would do it.


Agreed. We dont necessarily need a legit #2 back, either. Think about it, Goodson and Reece are both capable RBs who offer different things to our offense. We really should be limiting McFadden's carries (maybe split him out wide more often?) and let Reece and Goodson get some carries. We have 3 Rbs who can do all sorts of different things and they could form a very dangerous combination.


if we limit dmacs carries he better limit his salary

8mill for a rb thats gonna split a lot of carries is insane
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NCOUGHMAN > all of you


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ZoomWaffle


Joined: 25 Apr 2010
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 9:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NCOUGHMAN wrote:
ZoomWaffle wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
bigm19792002 wrote:
we need a good back up RB we should have kept Bush that really bothered me when then did not resign him


I think Goodson will suffice as a backup. Stewart wasn't terrible either. I'd worry about our starting positions first and foremost and then we can focus on those that are back-ups. That's just the way I would do it.


Agreed. We dont necessarily need a legit #2 back, either. Think about it, Goodson and Reece are both capable RBs who offer different things to our offense. We really should be limiting McFadden's carries (maybe split him out wide more often?) and let Reece and Goodson get some carries. We have 3 Rbs who can do all sorts of different things and they could form a very dangerous combination.


if we limit dmacs carries he better limit his salary

8mill for a rb thats gonna split a lot of carries is insane


Well its either give him 200 carries over 16 games or 200 carries over 8 games. At least with limited carries we have a better chance of having him all year. Besides, I want him to get reduced carries but increased time in the slot. With our weak WR corps, he can make his money in more ways than just running the ball.
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I wouldn't trade Pryor for any prospect in this years draft. Quote me on that
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raidr4life


Joined: 10 Jan 2010
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JTagg7754 wrote:
Darkness wrote:
JTagg7754 wrote:
oakdb36 wrote:

The rest of the stuff is the things you were claiming Pryor was incapable of doing a week before that game. He was supposedly too dumb to run the offense, to have it lined up correctly and in time. Well, in his first ever start, it wasn't an issue. McKenzie is commenting on it because it's the kind of things that happen frequently to a QB in his first start in the NFL and Pryor handled it very well. That was definitely a positive to take from this game. It's definitely not enough. He needs to show a lot more as a passer.


Yep, based on a report. Obviously I have no first hand knowledge. Good for him for learning a three step drop. Don't you find it bad that we even have to talk about this for a NFL QB?

It's a positive to take from a game.... if you're in high school. A player in this league shouldn't even need to learn these things. I would hope it was second nature by now. Doesn't it seem like we're babying a player too much?


It seems like you and holyghost were dismissing his ability to do the simple things all together before the game without any evidence aside from bias. Then he does those things, and it's "isn't it bad we even have to talk about that?!". No one would talk about him being able to take snaps, lining up the offense and making drops if you didn't bring it up to begin with


Actually we had conventional thinking and a report to base those thoughts on. Hardly bias. And you're taking out of context. It's the fact that Reggie was proud he could do that to where I said that. Good for him for learning a 3 step drop though LOL.

Again, I never brought it up, Papa did.
Another explanation from the JTagg anti Pryor dictionary. LOL. Your only running mate just left your campaign. Smile
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