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amazingandre


Joined: 16 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:46 pm    Post subject: Off-season needs Reply with quote

Now the season has ended we need t focus on how to improve the roster. We have a good amount of free agents and we have plenty of holes that need to be filled. Lets hear some of you thoughts on team needs, I will post my in a little while.
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canyon1


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A fellow officer of mine came to me with an idea that i absolutely hated at first, but once I thought about it for awhile it made sense to jump on it. He said to do everything that we could in our power to trade Antonio. He understood that he was old and that someone would probably would give up a max of a fifth for him. Now I think about it i say we should jump all over that. I say this bec if we were to throw that seven million at Greg Jennings who said he doesnt see himself resigning in Green Bay. Pair him with Andre and draft more help on the line and our rookies will be better next year. Our offense would be very dangerous and we have given Shaub every opportunity this way. In the draft we go heavy on defense like we did in 2011 and watch WATT, CUSH, Joseph take over and bring back the true bulls on parade. Just a thought.
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mse326


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RT
NT
WR

Those are my big 3 from what we know (by that I mean positions that I would be willing to spend a 1st rounder on).

ILB could be included in that group depending on the injury status of Cushing. If he is ahead of schedule like was said, we may have a fairly decent idea of what we'll be getting when he comes back. ILB is a need regardless, but to me a midround need if we expect Cushing to be relatively close to what he was. The position is still a 2-down linebacker at heart.

Safety and Nickel corner are also needs that need to be addressed with competent players. Safety is ideally going to be coverage oriented with a nose for the ball since we don't have many playmakers. I do want to stress the nickel aspect of the corner we take. While I don't like the outside corner depth (which is non existent) we were burned bad by slot receivers. We need to be sure that the corner can play the slot, and ability to play outside does not guarantee that. Therefore that is my priority for corner at the moment though depth at the outside is also a need. These too are midround needs. I should also note that this assumes we resign Quin. If we don't Safety goes WAY up.

I haven't looked through FA yet to see if there is anyone out there. I'd prefer the secondary positions to be filled through free agency if possible because there is a pretty steep learning curve in secondary play and we need immediate help.
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texandominance


Joined: 22 Sep 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

canyon1 wrote:
A fellow officer of mine came to me with an idea that i absolutely hated at first, but once I thought about it for awhile it made sense to jump on it. He said to do everything that we could in our power to trade Antonio. He understood that he was old and that someone would probably would give up a max of a fifth for him. Now I think about it i say we should jump all over that. I say this bec if we were to throw that seven million at Greg Jennings who said he doesnt see himself resigning in Green Bay. Pair him with Andre and draft more help on the line and our rookies will be better next year. Our offense would be very dangerous and we have given Shaub every opportunity this way. In the draft we go heavy on defense like we did in 2011 and watch WATT, CUSH, Joseph take over and bring back the true bulls on parade. Just a thought.


I'd have to look at his contract, but I doubt even if we trade Smith, we could afford Jennings.
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amazingandre


Joined: 16 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

texandominance wrote:
canyon1 wrote:
A fellow officer of mine came to me with an idea that i absolutely hated at first, but once I thought about it for awhile it made sense to jump on it. He said to do everything that we could in our power to trade Antonio. He understood that he was old and that someone would probably would give up a max of a fifth for him. Now I think about it i say we should jump all over that. I say this bec if we were to throw that seven million at Greg Jennings who said he doesnt see himself resigning in Green Bay. Pair him with Andre and draft more help on the line and our rookies will be better next year. Our offense would be very dangerous and we have given Shaub every opportunity this way. In the draft we go heavy on defense like we did in 2011 and watch WATT, CUSH, Joseph take over and bring back the true bulls on parade. Just a thought.


I'd have to look at his contract, but I doubt even if we trade Smith, we could afford Jennings.


Not saying I would like this idea, but Smith has a base salary of 5.5 and a cap hit of 9.3
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EliteTexan80


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WR - The NFL is a two WR league. Kevin Walter is NOT a WR that is NFL worthy, let alone worthy for a starting job. If you want to get the best out of Andre Johnson in these latter years, you need to find someone who can play alongside him, and eventually break into AJs spot as the #1 WR of this team. Consistently expecting 1,500 yards from AJ is a quick way to neuter any sort of passing game you'd have. FA WR might be the best "bang for buck" for the team; Mike Wallace, Dwayne Bowe and Greg Jennings are available, but I think you can get a value pickup in Miami WR Brian Hartline. Pair that with a late 1st rounder to work in a platoon with Hartline opposite AJ, move KW to a #3 spot which is platooned with Lestar Jean and Keshawn Martin, and attempt to jump start this passing game. Next season, KW is released and Posey plays the platoon role with Jean/Martin.

RT - People are quick to evoke "Oh, look at how Duane Brown evolved into a great LT after his platoon work," and that's fine...but they fail to realize that in those years where we let Brown work his way into the FT gig, the expectations of the team was anything above 8-8, and hopefully make the playoffs. The bar has been raised, so expectations of how quickly a player evolves needs to as well. Rashad Butler is a FA, and given he's coming off of an injury, he needs to go. Ryan Harris was a stopgap. Wanna run a rotation? Fine. Newton and Ricky Wagner from Wisconsin with our 2nd round pick. Newton has a dirt cheap contract, and the rookie cap means Wagner could very well hit the bench and it won't impact the Texans much, if at all. Doesn't matter who proves to be the better player who turns into the "Brown of the right side", it covers a position of need as well as gives us depth.

ILB - There is no excuse for the decline in play this defense saw once Brian Cushing went down. Cush is a fantastic player, but there has to be a contingency plan in place in case a core guy gets hurt, because football is a very violent sport. Teams in the 3-4 found excellent value when looking for 4-3 SLBs for the spot; NaVarro Bowman was a former 4-3 SLB at Penn State, and has now morphed into the ideal 3-4 ILB; Same can be said about the Steelers and Lawrence Timmons. No real FAs who would represent the right direction, save for one; San Fran ILB Larry Grant is a FA, and you KNOW he is wanting to get out of the shadow of Bowman and Patrick Willis, get starter money and starter minutes. Jasper Brinkley has experience inside and outside for the Vikings, and has a relatively strong year this past year, he could also be tabbed for a role alongside Cushing. I don't know much about this current draft class, but Kiko Alonzo from Oregon seems like the kind of high energy player Wade Phillips finds a role for.

QB - John Lopez said it the best, Matt Schaub can't be sitting on the velvet couch anymore. He's the starting QB of this team, but it is time the organization holds his feet to the fire, make every day in TC and Preseason a "pressure" situation, and see how he responds. No FAs out there (unless Phillip Rivers were to hit the market) and no QB currently on the roster represents that sort of challenge, so draft...here we come. EJ Manuel, Ryan Nassib, Landry Jones and Zac Dysert are all considered part of that 2nd tier of QBs in the draft - it's safe to say that some of these names will rise, some will fall. Do your homework on all names, see which one fits the best. Regardless of where they rise or where they fall, if you feel as if you've IDed a special prospect, grab him with whatever pick you feel necessary to grab him with.

NT - Earl Mitchell is developing well at the NT spot, but Shaun Cody might be best served to test the market. He's a good player, but nothing special and can be upgraded with relative ease. Much like how we got Brandon Brooks (despite a philosophy of staying away from big OL) we need to find a big bodied player to man the trenches once in a while. NEs Ron Brace (remember him?) is a HUGE man at 6' 3" and 330. He has a hard time breaking into that NE front line, with Vince Wilfork and Brandon Daedrick as the 1/2, so Brace could be had on the cheap and get in quickly in the NT rotation. Haven't heard much about NT prospects outside of the big named (Star Lotulelei, John Jenkins, Kawann Short, Jessie Williams) and I doubt these guys will be in the Texans' range.

FS/SS - Given how we like to take CS tweener types and move 'em to S, I think this can be a lower priority on the list. If we're gonna work with three S sets (as indicated by the PT given to Quentin Demps) then we need to upgrade that spot, as Shiloh Keo and Demps are proving to be liabilities. First up is keeping Glover Quin, as he was one of our more consistent players in the back end. San Diego CB Quentin Jammer has ties to Wade Phillips and is closing on the backside of his career; His size makes him a very interesting prospect at the 3rd S spot, but one has to wonder about the money he would ask for, as well as being satisfied with a bench role. Looking over the rest of the FA and draft class, I don't see anyone standing out. A few long shots, guys with question marks at best.
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bunnyracin


Joined: 28 Jul 2011
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 5:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What about making a trade for Percy Harvin? He's still in his rookie contract that expires in 2014 and hes making a little over 2 mil a year. It could be a risk being that his contract is almost up but I'd give up our first pick
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Wolf6151


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 6:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bunnyracin wrote:
What about making a trade for Percy Harvin? He's still in his rookie contract that expires in 2014 and hes making a little over 2 mil a year. It could be a risk being that his contract is almost up but I'd give up our first pick


NO. I can't see giving up a 1st round pick for a 1 yr. player. We're already close to the cap and have some of our own FA that will be getting pay raises, ie: Quin, possibly Barwin, Forsett, Casey, etc.... Harvin will be expensive when he gets to FA and I don't think we'd have the money to offer him a big contract. That would make Harvin a 1 yr. rental for a 1st round pick, NO.
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Wolf6151


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 7:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How I see our needs:

NT - Mitchell has gotten better lately but he's not ready to handle the position by himself, he'll need someone to rotate with. Cody is on the wrong side of 30, not good at all, injured, and is now a FA. Cody walks and is replaced by a 1st round pick, either Kawann Short, Jesse Williams, or possibly Sylvester Williams. Short is quicker and penetrates better while still handling double teams well, but Williams is stronger and handles the double teams better but collapses the pocket on single blockers. ET80's idea of Ron Brace sounds good to me, I remember wanting him in the draft, but haven't seen him play in the pros.

WR - This was already a need before Posey's injury but now it's even more important, and I think Walter is back next year due to the injury to Posey. 1st or 2nd round need that hopefully Kubiak can't ignore any longer or try to fill with an UDFA or mid round picks. I'd like to see this addressed in both FA and the draft. Terrance Williams, Justin Hunter, Cordarelle Patterson, or DeAndre Hopkins in the 1st round and Quinton Patton, Cobi Hamilton, Robert Woods, or Da'Rick Rogers but that's doubtful due to repeated drug issues, in the 2nd or 3rd rounds.

ILB - With Cushings return this is again a 2 down position and thus not a high priority, I think a 3rd - 5th round athletic sideline to sideline player instead of the run stuffing thumper. I like Kiko Alonzo, A.J. Klein, and Kevin Reddick. I'd also bring Ruud and Dobbins back to training camp as depth, but let Bradie James walk.

OT - I think all those who want this position addressed early are in for a disappointment. I think Derek Newton is our starting RT next season but I think we go for some quality OT depth in the 3rd round to push Newton at the position and be a new swing OT. I think we keep Gardner as a utility OT/OG depth as well. I like Ricky Wagner, Xavier Nixon, Kyle Long, Menelik Watson, or jump on Oday Aboushi or Dallas Thomas if one of them falls.

OG - I think we'll look for Wade Smiths replacement in this draft, he'll be a FA in 2014, so I'd like to see us get someone good in the 3rd - 5th to sit for a year with some rotational playing time. I like Gabe Jackson or Alvin Bailey in the 3rd, or Braden Hansen, Blaize Foltz, or Spencer Long in the 4th or 5th rounds.

CB - I think we lose McCain to FA because even mediocre CB's are expensive. We promote Harris to nickle and look for a depth CB like Darius Slay, Johnny Adams, etc... in the 4th or 5th round. I'd like a good FA here but we're already going to have cap issues and just can't afford it.

Other needs of lesser importance are:
FB, a real one for short yardage/goal line work instead of a converted TE.
TE, a big TE that can block and catch, Michael Williams in the 5th.
DT/DE, depth here because we don't know about Jamison's return.
P, younger, better, and cheaper than Jones. I like Quinn Sharp in the 6th or 7th.
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kenney


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mse326 wrote:
RT
NT
WR

Those are my big 3 from what we know (by that I mean positions that I would be willing to spend a 1st rounder on).

ILB could be included in that group depending on the injury status of Cushing. If he is ahead of schedule like was said, we may have a fairly decent idea of what we'll be getting when he comes back. ILB is a need regardless, but to me a midround need if we expect Cushing to be relatively close to what he was. The position is still a 2-down linebacker at heart.

Safety and Nickel corner are also needs that need to be addressed with competent players. Safety is ideally going to be coverage oriented with a nose for the ball since we don't have many playmakers. I do want to stress the nickel aspect of the corner we take. While I don't like the outside corner depth (which is non existent) we were burned bad by slot receivers. We need to be sure that the corner can play the slot, and ability to play outside does not guarantee that. Therefore that is my priority for corner at the moment though depth at the outside is also a need. These too are midround needs. I should also note that this assumes we resign Quin. If we don't Safety goes WAY up.

I haven't looked through FA yet to see if there is anyone out there. I'd prefer the secondary positions to be filled through free agency if possible because there is a pretty steep learning curve in secondary play and we need immediate help.


NO.

JESUS CHRIST.

We had the worst ILBs that I'm pretty sure have ever started in the NFL after Cushing went down. You want to know why our secondary started sucking? Because we started having to commit Quin and Manningn to playing the run because we were running our DIME package as essentially our BASE defense. That's a recipe for disaster. Are Cody and Mitchell good? No, but this defense fell apart because of linebacker play, NOT because of nose play.

Either quit posting NT as a primary need or actually address the numerous reasons I've given you here and elsewhere as to why we don't need a NT in any of the first 4 rounds.
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mse326


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kenney wrote:
mse326 wrote:
RT
NT
WR

Those are my big 3 from what we know (by that I mean positions that I would be willing to spend a 1st rounder on).

ILB could be included in that group depending on the injury status of Cushing. If he is ahead of schedule like was said, we may have a fairly decent idea of what we'll be getting when he comes back. ILB is a need regardless, but to me a midround need if we expect Cushing to be relatively close to what he was. The position is still a 2-down linebacker at heart.

Safety and Nickel corner are also needs that need to be addressed with competent players. Safety is ideally going to be coverage oriented with a nose for the ball since we don't have many playmakers. I do want to stress the nickel aspect of the corner we take. While I don't like the outside corner depth (which is non existent) we were burned bad by slot receivers. We need to be sure that the corner can play the slot, and ability to play outside does not guarantee that. Therefore that is my priority for corner at the moment though depth at the outside is also a need. These too are midround needs. I should also note that this assumes we resign Quin. If we don't Safety goes WAY up.

I haven't looked through FA yet to see if there is anyone out there. I'd prefer the secondary positions to be filled through free agency if possible because there is a pretty steep learning curve in secondary play and we need immediate help.


NO.

JESUS CHRIST.

We had the worst ILBs that I'm pretty sure have ever started in the NFL after Cushing went down. You want to know why our secondary started sucking? Because we started having to commit Quin and Manningn to playing the run because we were running our DIME package as essentially our BASE defense. That's a recipe for disaster. Are Cody and Mitchell good? No, but this defense fell apart because of linebacker play, NOT because of nose play.

Either quit posting NT as a primary need or actually address the numerous reasons I've given you here and elsewhere as to why we don't need a NT in any of the first 4 rounds.


You keep saying ILB ignoring that it is a 2-down position with Cushing in the fold. You'll read my post to see what I said about that.

We defended the run well on the outside because Smith and Watt are good run defenders. Up the middle we get gashed, not just because of ILBs (given it was happening even with Cushing). It was because our NTs couldn't hold up at all. They can't defend the run and get no pressure up the middle. They are completely and utterly useless. And since NT is one of the most important positions in a 3-4 I'd say it is absolutely a 1st round need.

You even said in your post "when Cushing went down..." Well Cushing will presumably be back. So with him in the fold what is more of a need.
-A 2-down ILB
-A 3rd safety
-A NT

I'd suggest the answer to that is pretty obvious. We don't have anyone for any of the positions, but NT is by far the most important position of the 3 in a defense.

You can choose to deny the fact that Cushing will be back, but it's fairly obvious our Coaching staff won't approach it that way unless they get medical reports saying he will never be the same. And frankly there is no reason not to. If we take an early ILB we've wasted the pick on 2-down player or relegate Cushing to a 2-down player. Neither of which are appealling when we'd still have a black hole at NT.
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amazingandre


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think you're both wrong. I think we need a NT and an ILB bad, both starters. Even with Cushing, we constantly get no pressure up the middle unless we blitz him and we have always had trouble stopping the run, the thing that hides it is our ability to control TOP......Get a lead and control the clock and the opposing team has to throw more....I would love to get a high intensity lb who can cover and blitz and roam the field....gives Cushing breaks and help in the middle....plus a bigger NT helps shield blockers from them....not to mention we still need a S, its the heart of this defense we struggle with...
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mse326


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

amazingandre wrote:
I think you're both wrong. I think we need a NT and an ILB bad, both starters. Even with Cushing, we constantly get no pressure up the middle unless we blitz him and we have always had trouble stopping the run, the thing that hides it is our ability to control TOP......Get a lead and control the clock and the opposing team has to throw more....I would love to get a high intensity lb who can cover and blitz and roam the field....gives Cushing breaks and help in the middle....plus a bigger NT helps shield blockers from them....not to mention we still need a S, its the heart of this defense we struggle with...


But do you think an ILB (with Cushing healthy) will be on the field more than say 60% of defensive snaps? The only way that happens is if he has beastly coverage skills, that I just don't think many ILBs possess. We have to be able to stop the run in a nickel package with so many teams going 3 WRs. That means the NT has to be good.

Again I don't dispute ILB is a need, but I don't that I can reason a 1st round pick on a player that barely plays half the snaps. Not when we have other big needs. I fully advocate getting one either in the mid rounds (where we can get good value for the spot) or FA. Just not with a high pick.
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kenney


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mse, we do not, nor have we ever used a NT in our Nickel packages. Not only that, we ran out Nickel significantly less than every other team. You see, Nickel for us is a 4-2-5, as it is for most teams. However, none of our ILBs besides Cushing could do anything -- play the run or cover, which is why, even when we had Cushing, we went straight to Dime and played Quin as primarily a linebacker.

ILB hasn't been more than a 2-down position because all of ours blow. NT is a 2-down position in our scheme, regardless of how good he is.
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mse326


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kenney wrote:
Mse, we do not, nor have we ever used a NT in our Nickel packages. Not only that, we ran out Nickel significantly less than every other team. You see, Nickel for us is a 4-2-5, as it is for most teams. However, none of our ILBs besides Cushing could do anything -- play the run or cover, which is why, even when we had Cushing, we went straight to Dime and played Quin as primarily a linebacker.

ILB hasn't been more than a 2-down position because all of ours blow. NT is a 2-down position in our scheme, regardless of how good he is.


I can similarly say that our Nickel wasn't with a line of

4 (Barwin, Smith, NT, Watt)
2 (Cushing and Reed)

Because or NT was never good enough. That meant Watt would have to kick in and Reed come down.

IIRC Wade's Dallas days had the 2nd ILB was always a 2 down guy with Ratliff remaining on the field.

If we get the ILB I'm sure we'll do it your way. Similarly a NT goes my way. The thing is a line of Barwin, Smith, Watt, and Reed is too small with only 2 LBs behind to stop the run.

We've never had a good enough NT or 2nd ILB to know which way is prefered by Wade.
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