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Doctors need more power on NFL sidelines
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 11:00 am    Post subject: Doctors need more power on NFL sidelines Reply with quote

It's become evident to me over the past few seasons as concussions have become more of a focal point in the NFL and injuries have spiked because of the violent hits in the game that doctors need more control on the sidelines.

Dr James Andrews was paid to be on the sidelines by Dan Snyder to be the angel on Snyder's rookie franchise qbs shoulders but Dr James Andrews was not allowed to properly do his job. His job didn't seem to be to be the final say on Rg3 playing but to evaluate whatever Mike Shanahan and Robert Griffin III wanted him to evaluate, NOT what the doctor himself thought he should evaluate.

What I mean by this is if RG3 said he was ok and felt ok and coach Shanahan got caught up in the superman hype that was RG3 for 14 of 17 games of the NFL season then Dr James Andrews had nothing to evaluate. Things such as this have to change with the NFL if they want to get serious about player safety. I know us fans don't want to hear it, players don't want to hear it, coaches don't want to hear it and especially owners don't want to hear it- but it's true!

We have to sit back and put doctors thoughts and doctors evaluations more into the NFL during the game! Not just after the fact, after the game but during the game on the sidelines and especially in decision making on whether the players should go back into the game or not. It has become evident to me the final say on for rg3 to play was never really Dr James Andrews, it was Rg3's pleading to the person who made the decision was the coach and person with final say on player personnel decisions Mike Shanahan. Dr James Andrews was on the sidelines, but overuled by somone. I'm refering to at one point after rg3 tweaked his knee on the second drive the game. The training staff took RG3 into a shed behind the bench which Lavar Arrington refered to as a bathroom and Dr Andrews followed them to the door but the door was shut on him. I don't know who said no to him, but one of the three men that went into that shed did. It was either of the two training staff members or RG3.

How much power does one man need? Not only does Shanahan have control over all the coaching decisions and final player acquisition, evaluation and roster building but apparently Mike Shanahan can play doctor and override their thoughts as well.

This isn't just about Mike Shanahan, this goes for every sideline in the NFL. I've seen millions of times when players have been knocked out in the past two years where they went back in the game. The one I vividly remember was when James Harrison laid out Colt McCoy who needed help to get up and get off the field because he had a concussion but his coach and Colt later decided it was ok to go back in the game.

This isn't right. There needs to be independent doctors out there, doctors not associated with the team, not paid for by the owner that have the final say after a player is injured and the independent doctor should determine if a player should or should not go back in the game. I said this after rg3 got the concussion vs the falcons and was allowed to play the following week vs Minnesota. The NFL needs better protocol on this, players need to do a better job protecting themselves, owners, coaches and fans need to be more worried about players long term health and if they can finish a season rather than how quickly the player can get back into the game.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 12:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://m.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins/nfl-medical-standards-practices-are-different-than-almost-anywhere-else/2013/03/16/b8c170bc-8be8-11e2-9f54-f3fdd70acad2_story.html

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NFL medical standards, practices are different than almost anywhere else

“A lot of doctors would say we’re much more aggressive with the players, getting them back out there with their team, than we would’ve been with the guy who had any other job,” said Kurt Warner, a Super Bowl-winning quarterback who is now an analyst for the NFL Network.

Interviews with more than 50 doctors, players, agents, owners and medical ethicists suggest that what the NFL Physicians Society calls the game’s “unique clinical challenges” can result in inconsistent standards in treating players and cause some doctors to depart from best medical practices and safety norms.

Example: An ordinary citizen would receive a shot of the powerful painkiller Toradol for acute pain only after undergoing surgery, and typically for no more than five days. But in the NFL, doctors administer it weekly despite dangerous side effects that include renal failure, and its ability to mask pain to such a degree that a player injured during a game may not even be aware of the extent of his injury.

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MKnight82


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 2:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's RG3s knee, it's his call, he wanted to play. I don't understand people's stance on this. You're going to ask a doctor if someone should reenter a full contact brutal sport and ask if they'll be ok? Every player that steps on that field risks his health every play of every game, that's the nature of the game. Let it go.
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justo


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 3:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm actually writing a persuasive research paper on this for my 122 final..
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Almm24


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 3:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MKnight82 wrote:
It's RG3s knee, it's his call, he wanted to play. I don't understand people's stance on this. You're going to ask a doctor if someone should reenter a full contact brutal sport and ask if they'll be ok? Every player that steps on that field risks his health every play of every game, that's the nature of the game. Let it go.


Sometimes you have to protect the player from the player himself. Athletes are fierce competitors, of course many of them won't want to come out of the game on their own... they want to play. In RG3's case, he was visibly suffering from his injury. It affected his game, he was not the same after he took a couple of hits. He should have came out earlier when it was obvious he was no longer effective due to it.
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MKnight82


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 3:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Almm24 wrote:
MKnight82 wrote:
It's RG3s knee, it's his call, he wanted to play. I don't understand people's stance on this. You're going to ask a doctor if someone should reenter a full contact brutal sport and ask if they'll be ok? Every player that steps on that field risks his health every play of every game, that's the nature of the game. Let it go.


Sometimes you have to protect the player from the player himself. Athletes are fierce competitors, of course many of them won't want to come out of the game on their own... they want to play. In RG3's case, he was visibly suffering from his injury. It affected his game, he was not the same after he took a couple of hits. He should have came out earlier when it was obvious he was no longer effective due to it.
. You're only saying that because you know he got hurt. But if he stuck it out, won the game all the while limping through it he'd be called a warrior. It's a full contact sport any player can get seriously hurt on any play of the game. Asking a doctor if someone should return to a full contact sport is just silly, from a medical perspective of course they shouldn't, ever.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Almm24 wrote:
MKnight82 wrote:
It's RG3s knee, it's his call, he wanted to play. I don't understand people's stance on this. You're going to ask a doctor if someone should reenter a full contact brutal sport and ask if they'll be ok? Every player that steps on that field risks his health every play of every game, that's the nature of the game. Let it go.


Sometimes you have to protect the player from the player himself. Athletes are fierce competitors, of course many of them won't want to come out of the game on their own... they want to play. In RG3's case, he was visibly suffering from his injury. It affected his game, he was not the same after he took a couple of hits. He should have came out earlier when it was obvious he was no longer effective due to it.
well it's this and the fact that the NFL needs to start making doctors treat NFL players as they would an everyday patient. That's the main premise of the article. If the nfl wants to do best by its players, have doctors treat them like everday regular people, and don't rush them back from injury or cover up their injury by a shot, that should be banned.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MKnight82 wrote:
Almm24 wrote:
MKnight82 wrote:
It's RG3s knee, it's his call, he wanted to play. I don't understand people's stance on this. You're going to ask a doctor if someone should reenter a full contact brutal sport and ask if they'll be ok? Every player that steps on that field risks his health every play of every game, that's the nature of the game. Let it go.


Sometimes you have to protect the player from the player himself. Athletes are fierce competitors, of course many of them won't want to come out of the game on their own... they want to play. In RG3's case, he was visibly suffering from his injury. It affected his game, he was not the same after he took a couple of hits. He should have came out earlier when it was obvious he was no longer effective due to it.
. You're only saying that because you know he got hurt. But if he stuck it out, won the game all the while limping through it he'd be called a warrior. It's a full contact sport any player can get seriously hurt on any play of the game. Asking a doctor if someone should return to a full contact sport is just silly, from a medical perspective of course they shouldn't, ever.
wait? Every single one of us were worried about him after he got tackled on the right sideline, before he threw the second touchdown and if he should finish the game. If there is such doubt, then the player should be sat down. This is why he didnt finish in Baltimore, this is why he didnt play in Cleveland and this is why He shouldn't have played in the second half vs Seattle and we all knew he shouldn't be out there.
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DCRED


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MKnight82 wrote:
Almm24 wrote:
MKnight82 wrote:
It's RG3s knee, it's his call, he wanted to play. I don't understand people's stance on this. You're going to ask a doctor if someone should reenter a full contact brutal sport and ask if they'll be ok? Every player that steps on that field risks his health every play of every game, that's the nature of the game. Let it go.


Sometimes you have to protect the player from the player himself. Athletes are fierce competitors, of course many of them won't want to come out of the game on their own... they want to play. In RG3's case, he was visibly suffering from his injury. It affected his game, he was not the same after he took a couple of hits. He should have came out earlier when it was obvious he was no longer effective due to it.
. You're only saying that because you know he got hurt. But if he stuck it out, won the game all the while limping through it he'd be called a warrior. It's a full contact sport any player can get seriously hurt on any play of the game. Asking a doctor if someone should return to a full contact sport is just silly, from a medical perspective of course they shouldn't, ever.


You make a good point about the Full-Contact sport (with rules about hitting). That is exactly the way MMA is set up. A Fighter may get "hurt" during a match, but he is not removed until a TKO or knockout.

They don't fight with leg braces, however, Laughing But I still think that is a great analogy. And they do have doctors decide whether or not the fight continues.
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Geronimo


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
... and we all knew he shouldn't be out there.


Well, we all but one.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Geronimo wrote:
turtle28 wrote:
... and we all knew he shouldn't be out there.


Well, we all but one.
yeah and he's the one who has too much control IMO
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Chief_Zee


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree that doctors need a bigger say, especially on head injuries. But it gets a little foggy with other injuries.

Like when Nick Sundberg broke his arm last season, but he still stuck it out anyway and played through the injury. If doctors got the final say there is no chance in hell Sundberg gets the OK to play through that broken arm. I don't know who our emergency long-snapper is, but we all saw that Raiders game earlier last season and that was a train wreck.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chief_Zee wrote:
I agree that doctors need a bigger say, especially on head injuries. But it gets a little foggy with other injuries.

Like when Nick Sundberg broke his arm last season, but he still stuck it out anyway and played through the injury. If doctors got the final say there is no chance in hell Sundberg gets the OK to play through that broken arm. I don't know who our emergency long-snapper is, but we all saw that Raiders game earlier last season and that was a train wreck.
well that game it Might have been Montgomery, Kory or Leribeus but Cooley makes the team He's the back up long snapper.
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MKnight82


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 1:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chief_Zee wrote:
I agree that doctors need a bigger say, especially on head injuries. But it gets a little foggy with other injuries.

Like when Nick Sundberg broke his arm last season, but he still stuck it out anyway and played through the injury. If doctors got the final say there is no chance in hell Sundberg gets the OK to play through that broken arm. I don't know who our emergency long-snapper is, but we all saw that Raiders game earlier last season and that was a train wreck.
. This. Unless its a head injury where a persons judgement may be impaired you shouldn't be able to force a player out if the game. A doctor should be there to inform the player of the risk but its the players body and ultimately his decision.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MKnight82 wrote:
Chief_Zee wrote:
I agree that doctors need a bigger say, especially on head injuries. But it gets a little foggy with other injuries.

Like when Nick Sundberg broke his arm last season, but he still stuck it out anyway and played through the injury. If doctors got the final say there is no chance in hell Sundberg gets the OK to play through that broken arm. I don't know who our emergency long-snapper is, but we all saw that Raiders game earlier last season and that was a train wreck.
. This. Unless its a head injury where a persons judgement may be impaired you shouldn't be able to force a player out if the game. A doctor should be there to inform the player of the risk but its the players body and ultimately his decision.
so you're saying if its in the persons best interest to sit out and the organizations doctor shouldn't be allowed to make that determination?

Why not? They're a doctor. We're supposed to listen to what they say. They would never allow most of the people in the real wold to do what the league and teams allow the players to do. If they'd take more precautions and listen to more doctors players like RG3 might have longer careers because they would have avoided major surgery for the second time on the same knee.

So just let me get this straight.

Mike Shanahan who has no medical experience what so ever can keep a player out of the game or play them but doctor Andrews one of the best doctors the NFL uses can't make that determination.

There's something really, really wrong with that. This leagues culture must change.
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