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Matts4313


Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 37316
Location: Cowboys Forum ROH Class of 12
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:00 pm    Post subject: Draft prospects? Reply with quote

So, I am just starting to look at potential targets at need positions for the first round. I don't follow a lot of college football, but I enjoy reading a bunch of scouting reports during the offseason. Any Who, I wanted to get some feed back:

I am lumping prospects into three groups:

1 - Need Positions - OG, RT, NT
2 - Upgrade Positions - S, DE, C, OLB*
3 - Depth Positions - RB, CB, QB, OLB*

*OLB is dependent on Spencer*

1. Who will be available at our first round pick in group 1 or 2?

OG - Warmack, Cooper
RT - Fisher
NT - Jenkins, Hankins, Williams

S - Vaccaro, Reid, Elam
DE - Richardson
C - Jones
OLB - Jordan


2. Who are targets for the second and third round?
Phillip Thomas FS Fresno
John Simon 3-4 OLB Ohio State
Shariff Floyd DT Fla
DJ Swearinger S South Carolina
Travis Frederick C Wisconsin
Margus Hunt, DE


3. Preference/Rankings of the above players?

1. Warmack
2. Matthews
3. Richardson
4. Cooper
5. Vaccaro
6. Jordan
7. Hankins
8. Fisher
9. Reid
10. Jones
11. Williams
12. Jenkins


Please help me complete this list, any scouting reports or sleepers we should keep an eye on?


Last edited by Matts4313 on Mon Jan 07, 2013 5:01 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Captain Zapp


Joined: 03 Jan 2012
Posts: 261
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No scouting report yet, but is there a reason you didnt list Barret Jones? I wouldnt be upset at all if the Cowboys moved down a few spots and grabbed the versatile Alabama lineman
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Dboys88-82


Joined: 12 Jan 2011
Posts: 1761
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As far as NT goes im not sure if Hankins will be there yet at 18, but its a possibility and so is Jesse Williams.
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Matts4313


Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 37316
Location: Cowboys Forum ROH Class of 12
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Captain Zapp wrote:
No scouting report yet, but is there a reason you didnt list Barret Jones? I wouldnt be upset at all if the Cowboys moved down a few spots and grabbed the versatile Alabama lineman


No good reason. This list is very raw, as mentioned due to my ignorance of college football.


I simply went through a 1st round mock I found online and pulled names to start the list. Now I am asking you all to help me fill in the list and rank them.


I will add Jones to the C spot. Anyone else?
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Matts4313


Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 37316
Location: Cowboys Forum ROH Class of 12
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dboys88-82 wrote:
As far as NT goes im not sure if Hankins will be there yet at 18, but its a possibility and so is Jesse Williams.


I will get them added.

Heres what we can do - lets add a bunch of the names for now. We can then later "cut the fat" and come up with a list of names that we as fans would be happy with if the Cowboys drafted in each round.
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DKDALfan


Joined: 18 Mar 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dboys88-82 wrote:
As far as NT goes im not sure if Hankins will be there yet at 18, but its a possibility and so is Jesse Williams.


I really do think that Jesse Williams is a underrated player on this forum.

As for sleepers, Travis Frederick is right now by most ranked as a 3rd rounder. IMO he would've been a 1st rounder if Wisconsin had kept him at guard and and if he hadn't had that big changes in the talent around him. I think that he is a 1st round talent, but he shouldnt go there since there is some safer guys. But I think that if we could get him with our mid 2nd round pick, we should be more then happy.
- I believe, that Frederick could end up being the best guard from this draft class. I'm really high on him.

I think that Ansah deserves a mention as well for DE for the 1st round. Very relentless player, He don't just tackle, he hits. He is raw, but in terms of talent a 1st rounder. have displayed a fast learning curve as well. Could provide the passrush we need from the D line.


Last edited by DKDALfan on Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:23 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Dboys88-82


Joined: 12 Jan 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Matts4313 wrote:
Dboys88-82 wrote:
As far as NT goes im not sure if Hankins will be there yet at 18, but its a possibility and so is Jesse Williams.


I will get them added.

Heres what we can do - lets add a bunch of the names for now. We can then later "cut the fat" and come up with a list of names that we as fans would be happy with if the Cowboys drafted in each round.


Sounds good to me. Jesse Williams at this point might be more of a second rounder, but a lot can change. If you are looking for some prospect rankings a good place to start is here: http://walterfootball.com/draft2008P.php
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Football Mensa


Joined: 13 Dec 2012
Posts: 621
Location: Texas via Louisiana and I love being Cajun...
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Larry Warford G Kentucky....2nd round

Phillip Thomas FS Fresno St..2-3 round (if he played in the sec he would be a household name)

John Simon 3-4 OLB Ohio State 3rd round...has a Clay Matthews type motor

Shariff Floyd DT Fla.....would draft him in a blink and switch to a 4-3

Jenkins is better than Jesse Williams. I would prefer a disruptive d lineman over a true nt. Nt's are'nt pass rushers primarily and that is the reason I would prefer a return to the 4-3.

RB Sleeper.....Spencer Ware...think Marion Barber with talent..

DJ Swearinger S South Carolina......3rd round

Travis Frederick C Wisconsin...2nd round

If he comes out another safety that will be a late round pick, Craig Loston...This is a player who will come up and tattoo whoever has the ball.

Another center who is a sleeper is Patrick Lewis from Texas A&M.

I got more but I want to see what the other posters come up with.
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JWingate


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Draft prospects? Reply with quote

Matts4313 wrote:
So, I am just starting to look at potential targets at need positions for the first round. I don't follow a lot of college football, but I enjoy reading a bunch of scouting reports during the offseason. Any Who, I wanted to get some feed back:

I am lumping prospects into three groups:

1 - Need Positions - OG, RT, NT
2 - Upgrade Positions - S, DE, C, OLB*
3 - Depth Positions - RB, CB, QB, OLB*

*OLB is dependent on Spencer*

1. Who will be available at our first round pick in group 1 or 2?

OG: Cooper (Available)
OG: Warmack (Possible)
RT: Matthews (I don't think he declared, but wont be available if he did)
RT: Fisher (Available)
NT: Jenkins (Available)
NT: Hankins (Possible)
NT: Williams (Available)

S: Vaccaro (Possible)
S: Reid (Possible)
DE: Richardson (Not Available)
C: Jones (Available)
OLB: Jordan (Not Available)


2. Who will be available at pick 2 and 3 out of any the above?

Shot in the dark, but Barrett Jones, Jesse Williams, Eric Fisher (Possible). None available in the 3rd pick.

3. Preference/Rankings of the above players?

1. Warmack
2. Matthews
3. Richardson
4. Cooper
5. Vaccaro
6. Jordan
7. Hankins
8. Fisher
9. Reid
10. Jones
11. Williams
12. Jenkins

Please help me complete this list, any scouting reports or sleepers we should keep an eye on?
Of that list keep an eye on Hankins, Vaccaro, Richardson, and Fisher. All of those I believe could be our 1st rounder. While I would love to see Cooper or Warmack be our selection I just don't see it.

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MaddHatter


Joined: 29 Nov 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Elam at S
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DKDALfan


Joined: 18 Mar 2011
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Location: Denmark
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Football Mensa wrote:
Jenkins is better than Jesse Williams. I would prefer a disruptive d lineman over a true nt. Nt's are'nt pass rushers primarily and that is the reason I would prefer a return to the 4-3.


first of all, I do agree with you on Jenkins being the better one right now.

as for prefering a disruptive D lineman over a true NT, do you with that mean that Jenkins is more of a disruptive 4-3 DT then a true NT, and that Williams is more of the true NT type then disruptive DT in the NFL?

- because I would argue that Williams is the one who has more potential and upside to be a disruptive passrushing threat at DT (or a 2 gap NT who can do it all), where as I believe Jenkins potential is limited to be a NT who can offer very little passrush but who is a big 2 gap runstopper and who can push the pocket.
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Football Mensa


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DKDALfan wrote:
Football Mensa wrote:
Jenkins is better than Jesse Williams. I would prefer a disruptive d lineman over a true nt. Nt's are'nt pass rushers primarily and that is the reason I would prefer a return to the 4-3.


first of all, I do agree with you on Jenkins being the better one right now.

as for prefering a disruptive D lineman over a true NT, do you with that mean that Jenkins is more of a disruptive 4-3 DT then a true NT, and that Williams is more of the true NT type then disruptive DT in the NFL?

- because I would argue that Williams is the one who has more potential and upside to be a disruptive passrushing threat at DT (or a 2 gap NT who can do it all), where as I believe Jenkins potential is limited to be a NT who can offer very little passrush but who is a big 2 gap runstopper and who can push the pocket.


I think Jenkins is a true nt. Run stopper only who won't be in the opponents backfield. If we stay in a 3-4 He would be a good pick. However I want a disruptive lineman who can get pressure on the opponents qb.

Jesse imo would be better in a 4-3 than he is in a 3-4. He has more agility than Jenkins. Georgia wore him out with their quick pace offense. That is a little worrisome to me.
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buckwild


Joined: 25 Jan 2011
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Location: Ft Worth, Tx
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Draft prospects? Reply with quote

Matts4313 wrote:
So, I am just starting to look at potential targets at need positions for the first round. I don't follow a lot of college football, but I enjoy reading a bunch of scouting reports during the offseason. Any Who, I wanted to get some feed back:

I am lumping prospects into three groups:

1 - Need Positions - OG, RT, NT
2 - Upgrade Positions - S, DE, C, OLB*
3 - Depth Positions - RB, CB, QB, OLB*

*OLB is dependent on Spencer*

1. Who will be available at our first round pick in group 1 or 2?

OG - Warmack, Cooper
RT - Matthews, Fisher
NT - Jenkins, Hankins, Williams

S - Vaccaro, Reid
DE - Richardson
C - Jones
OLB - Jordan


2. Who will be available at pick 2 and 3 out of any the above?


3. Preference/Rankings of the above players?


Please help me complete this list, any scouting reports or sleepers we should keep an eye on?


1) Doubt Warmack will be there at #18
2) Matthews is not coming out according to all my Aggie friends as he will be a Top 5 pick next year. He is moving to LT after this season.
3).Don't see all the love for Vaccaro considering he played for an average defense, and UT players track record in the NFL. Give me Reid in the 2nd or Elam in the 1st.
4). I would like to see the Cowboys look at Porter from Texas A&m at OLB. A more well rounded OLB
5) I would love if the Cowboys could get Richardson.

This should be an interesting off season for the Cowboys.
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CowboysTilIDie


Joined: 09 Jan 2012
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Draft prospects? Reply with quote

buckwild wrote:
Matts4313 wrote:
So, I am just starting to look at potential targets at need positions for the first round. I don't follow a lot of college football, but I enjoy reading a bunch of scouting reports during the offseason. Any Who, I wanted to get some feed back:

I am lumping prospects into three groups:

1 - Need Positions - OG, RT, NT
2 - Upgrade Positions - S, DE, C, OLB*
3 - Depth Positions - RB, CB, QB, OLB*

*OLB is dependent on Spencer*

1. Who will be available at our first round pick in group 1 or 2?

OG - Warmack, Cooper
RT - Matthews, Fisher
NT - Jenkins, Hankins, Williams

S - Vaccaro, Reid
DE - Richardson
C - Jones
OLB - Jordan


2. Who will be available at pick 2 and 3 out of any the above?


3. Preference/Rankings of the above players?


Please help me complete this list, any scouting reports or sleepers we should keep an eye on?


1) Doubt Warmack will be there at #18
2) Matthews is not coming out according to all my Aggie friends as he will be a Top 5 pick next year. He is moving to LT after this season.
3).Don't see all the love for Vaccaro considering he played for an average defense, and UT players track record in the NFL. Give me Reid in the 2nd or Elam in the 1st.
4). I would like to see the Cowboys look at Porter from Texas A&m at OLB. A more well rounded OLB
5) I would love if the Cowboys could get Richardson.

This should be an interesting off season for the Cowboys.


1.) Guards slide. Everyone thought Decastro would go top 20, too.
2.) Smart decision on his part.
3.) Agreed. Elam is the only 1st round caliber safety IMO.
4.) Don't like Porter. Too soft. Average pass rusher. Good coverage ability though.
5.) Ditto. And I think he could be there at our pick or close to it.
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DKDALfan


Joined: 18 Mar 2011
Posts: 2410
Location: Denmark
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Football Mensa wrote:
DKDALfan wrote:
Football Mensa wrote:
Jenkins is better than Jesse Williams. I would prefer a disruptive d lineman over a true nt. Nt's are'nt pass rushers primarily and that is the reason I would prefer a return to the 4-3.


first of all, I do agree with you on Jenkins being the better one right now.

as for prefering a disruptive D lineman over a true NT, do you with that mean that Jenkins is more of a disruptive 4-3 DT then a true NT, and that Williams is more of the true NT type then disruptive DT in the NFL?

- because I would argue that Williams is the one who has more potential and upside to be a disruptive passrushing threat at DT (or a 2 gap NT who can do it all), where as I believe Jenkins potential is limited to be a NT who can offer very little passrush but who is a big 2 gap runstopper and who can push the pocket.


I think Jenkins is a true nt. Run stopper only who won't be in the opponents backfield. If we stay in a 3-4 He would be a good pick. However I want a disruptive lineman who can get pressure on the opponents qb.

Jesse imo would be better in a 4-3 than he is in a 3-4. He has more agility than Jenkins. Georgia wore him out with their quick pace offense. That is a little worrisome to me.


ahh, good, now I understand your post better.

I'm not that worried about Williams being worn out actually. You have to remember, most of his strength is in the upper body and that is what he is using to put his will on the opposing offence. A upper body gets worn out faster then if you have a strong lower body to help it throughout the game. I think with some added strength to the lower body and some coaching more focused on him using the strength from his lower body together with his upper body, will make him last longer and also being a much more dominant force.

I do see Williams as the better player long term, for the same reason that you wrote. I think he will be the better player both in the 3-4 and 4-3 system but I still like him best in a 3-4. But right now, Jenkins is the better one and the safer pick as we both have stated before.
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