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Jrry32 Another Take Mock Off-Season
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jrry32


Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 45631
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flounch wrote:
We are not drafting 2 WR with our 2 first round pick......forget about it...


Great. But this is what I'd do.
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STLRamsFan99


Joined: 17 Aug 2012
Posts: 1340
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrry32 wrote:
Guaranteed money doesn't always literally mean guaranteed. A roster bonus is considered guaranteed but a player may not receive it.

My issue is that I don't know if the roster bonus was paid all at once or is paid in 4 parts.

The guaranteed money is all accounted for:
4 million signing bonus
2 million guaranteed base salaries
8 million in roster bonuses

That adds up to 14 million.


He may have been paid it and it is now prorated, in 2011 he had a $8 million option bonus. I wonder if he has been paid or is it a roster bonus that can be avoided?

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/st.-louis-rams/quintin-mikell/
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jrry32


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

STLRamsFan99 wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
Guaranteed money doesn't always literally mean guaranteed. A roster bonus is considered guaranteed but a player may not receive it.

My issue is that I don't know if the roster bonus was paid all at once or is paid in 4 parts.

The guaranteed money is all accounted for:
4 million signing bonus
2 million guaranteed base salaries
8 million in roster bonuses

That adds up to 14 million.


He may have been paid it and it is now prorated, in 2011 he had a $8 million option bonus. I wonder if he has been paid or is it a roster bonus that can be avoided?

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/st.-louis-rams/quintin-mikell/


That's my point. From the way it's put in there, it seems that it was already paid and prorated so cutting him only saves 3 million instead of 7 million. But I'm not sure if the info is correct there.
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The LBC wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Don't worry. Sean Payton would pass the ball in a Tornado.

But would he do it in a Sharknado?
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STLRamsFan99


Joined: 17 Aug 2012
Posts: 1340
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2013 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrry32 wrote:
STLRamsFan99 wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
Guaranteed money doesn't always literally mean guaranteed. A roster bonus is considered guaranteed but a player may not receive it.

My issue is that I don't know if the roster bonus was paid all at once or is paid in 4 parts.

The guaranteed money is all accounted for:
4 million signing bonus
2 million guaranteed base salaries
8 million in roster bonuses

That adds up to 14 million.


He may have been paid it and it is now prorated, in 2011 he had a $8 million option bonus. I wonder if he has been paid or is it a roster bonus that can be avoided?

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/st.-louis-rams/quintin-mikell/


That's my point. From the way it's put in there, it seems that it was already paid and prorated so cutting him only saves 3 million instead of 7 million. But I'm not sure if the info is correct there.


That was my conclusion too, I don't know for certain either. If Rams only save 3 million he is a Ram for one more year would be my guess.
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Ramsfan28


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 2:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrry32 wrote:
Ramsfan28 wrote:
Honestly, I've had Phillips going to the Rams for awhile now. I think he will see free agency, and he's a very good fit for the system in St. Louis. Pairing him with a rookie, then having Stewart being depth would be great (unless Stewart steps it up, of course)

My only con...I don't see two WR's in the first. Yes, Sam needs weapons, but I really think he only needs 1. Givens has been a great deep threat, Kendricks is evolving into a threat as a receiving tight end, Pettis has been showing up as an endzone threat, Gibson still has consistency issues but when he is on...he's on. And then of course, there is Danny. Also, there is still Brian Quick, who has shown flashes. My obvious choice for the guy to get the boot is Snail Man. Other than that, I guess it would be between Pettis and Gibson, which will end up fighting it out anyway. I think if the Rams do go receiver, it will be a high pick, then a low pick to battle it out in camp.


Danny and Gibson are both FAs. I let them walk.

Quote:
Personally, I feel there will be lots of safety talent and OLB talent falling in the late first round. Also, I still think the Rams have pretty good odds of catching Warmack at 16. I'd rather see Warmack/Williams, or Williams/Mingo (or Elam). I really wish I knew more about Austin though...the one time I got to see him play was the borefest which was Syracuse vs. West Virginia, where I was considering just playing Yakety Sax as the background music as WV was trying to form an offensive attack.


My issue is that I don't think any of the safeties are worth taking in the late 1st.

As for Austin, he's awesome. Just the only way to really describe him. He truly reminds me of Barry Sanders at times with the moves he can make, you'll see very few guys like him. Plus, he has explosive speed...will be surprised if he doesn't clock a 4.3.

Here are a few vids:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TxzPryPMB74
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Q3UOd9_Tkw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bd8Y-PLYi7M



Hmmmm....so...are you thinking what I'm thinking? Could Austin be a Percey Harvin type player? I totally forgot about the Oklahoma game where he just wrecked them...
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jrry32


Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 45631
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 2:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ramsfan28 wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
Ramsfan28 wrote:
Honestly, I've had Phillips going to the Rams for awhile now. I think he will see free agency, and he's a very good fit for the system in St. Louis. Pairing him with a rookie, then having Stewart being depth would be great (unless Stewart steps it up, of course)

My only con...I don't see two WR's in the first. Yes, Sam needs weapons, but I really think he only needs 1. Givens has been a great deep threat, Kendricks is evolving into a threat as a receiving tight end, Pettis has been showing up as an endzone threat, Gibson still has consistency issues but when he is on...he's on. And then of course, there is Danny. Also, there is still Brian Quick, who has shown flashes. My obvious choice for the guy to get the boot is Snail Man. Other than that, I guess it would be between Pettis and Gibson, which will end up fighting it out anyway. I think if the Rams do go receiver, it will be a high pick, then a low pick to battle it out in camp.


Danny and Gibson are both FAs. I let them walk.

Quote:
Personally, I feel there will be lots of safety talent and OLB talent falling in the late first round. Also, I still think the Rams have pretty good odds of catching Warmack at 16. I'd rather see Warmack/Williams, or Williams/Mingo (or Elam). I really wish I knew more about Austin though...the one time I got to see him play was the borefest which was Syracuse vs. West Virginia, where I was considering just playing Yakety Sax as the background music as WV was trying to form an offensive attack.


My issue is that I don't think any of the safeties are worth taking in the late 1st.

As for Austin, he's awesome. Just the only way to really describe him. He truly reminds me of Barry Sanders at times with the moves he can make, you'll see very few guys like him. Plus, he has explosive speed...will be surprised if he doesn't clock a 4.3.

Here are a few vids:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TxzPryPMB74
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Q3UOd9_Tkw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bd8Y-PLYi7M



Hmmmm....so...are you thinking what I'm thinking? Could Austin be a Percey Harvin type player? I totally forgot about the Oklahoma game where he just wrecked them...


Basically...that and more hopefully.
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The LBC wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Don't worry. Sean Payton would pass the ball in a Tornado.

But would he do it in a Sharknado?
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canucks9314


Joined: 31 Dec 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i think ogletree will be a 1st round pick.
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Flatlyner


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You know, you might have started to sell Williams on me. I just spent quite a while looking over some of his game films and I really like what I saw. Appears to have great hands, speed, size, and fluidity. All things we need. Would love to see him in the Senior bowl.
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jrry32


Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 45631
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flatlyner wrote:
You know, you might have started to sell Williams on me. I just spent quite a while looking over some of his game films and I really like what I saw. Appears to have great hands, speed, size, and fluidity. All things we need. Would love to see him in the Senior bowl.


Haha, not surprised. I think if anyone objectively looks at the game film, they'll come away impressed especially in that Texas game. He made a legit NFL prospect in Quandre Diggs look like a D-II caliber DB.
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The LBC wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Don't worry. Sean Payton would pass the ball in a Tornado.

But would he do it in a Sharknado?
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TDerick94


Joined: 05 Dec 2012
Posts: 61
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 10:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love the Terrance Williams pick,but I would prefer Justin Hunter over Tavon Austin if hes available or Tyler Eifert/Zach Ertz,but no way we draft two receivers and Ogletree will be a 1st Rounder.
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iRaMs


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jrry, got to give you props on this one man. I really like it. The only thing that I would consider a negative and not even a big would be Tavon Austin. His size to me is a concern, but I can overlook that given the potential he has.

Jasper Collins...love that kid. I think he has the potential to be a really good NFL player. Kid is just flat out productive. I really think he is my new man crush. I'll pushing this kid hard from here on out.

Plus you have Gavin Escobar in this madness and Dennis Johnson...nuff said.
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The J.R.S.


Joined: 15 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrry32 wrote:
The J.R.S. wrote:
Not a big fan of the Levitre signing. I'd rather see what Rok can do when healthy.

I think finding a tackle is a priority this off season, and I'm not sure that Long in the 3rd is enough to settle it.

I love Tavon Austin's talent, but the more I look at his tiny frame, the more I begin to see him as a returner that occasionally sees targets in the passing attack (3 or so per game maybe?).

That's not worth a 1st round pick to me. I doubt he'll go that high come April.

All in all, I thought you did a good job of addressing our needs.


What? If he's only seeing 3 or so targets a game then Percy Harvin isn't going to see more. He's the same type of player and fills the same role.

Rok, imo, is a better fit at RG and would compete with Harvey Dahl who is getting up there in age.

As for Long, he has great size and athleticism but is raw, he's pretty much Paul Boudreau's dream prospect. 6'7" 310+ with LT feet and athleticism...plus we know he has the blood-lines. Laughing


They're the same type of player, but Percy has 20 pounds and 2 inches on Austin. He has already shown the ability to handle double digit touches week in and week out. I love Austin's talent, but how is he going to handle being hit in the NFL? That's the only question I have about him.

I like Long as a prospect, and I trust our coaching staff also. It's interesting that you would consider replacing Dahl at RG. Hell, if that is the case why can't Dahl play RT?
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jrry32


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The J.R.S. wrote:
They're the same type of player, but Percy has 20 pounds and 2 inches on Austin. He has already shown the ability to handle double digit touches week in and week out. I love Austin's talent, but how is he going to handle being hit in the NFL? That's the only question I have about him.


Austin has never missed a game in his college career. Harvin struggled with durability issues during it along with his migraines.

Why? The difference between their running styles. Watch Austin play and tell me how many times he takes big hits. Austin is great at getting his yards and getting down or getting out of bounds. He rarely takes hits. Whereas Harvin runs a bit like a power HB which opens him up to big hits.

He'll be fine in terms of being hit. He does the same thing that Isaac and Torry used to do, catch a pass, get the first and then dive down when he's surrounded by tacklers. It's smart and it keeps you healthy.

Quote:
I like Long as a prospect, and I trust our coaching staff also. It's interesting that you would consider replacing Dahl at RG. Hell, if that is the case why can't Dahl play RT?


Dahl is going to be 32 and our OL didn't seem to have issues without him...they gave up 0 sacks over the final 2 games. He's a good player and I love his attitude but with the money he's making at 32 years old, I'd certainly consider replacing him especially with a young guy like Rok.
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The LBC wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Don't worry. Sean Payton would pass the ball in a Tornado.

But would he do it in a Sharknado?
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The J.R.S.


Joined: 15 Feb 2007
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Location: Next to Waldo
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrry32 wrote:
The J.R.S. wrote:
They're the same type of player, but Percy has 20 pounds and 2 inches on Austin. He has already shown the ability to handle double digit touches week in and week out. I love Austin's talent, but how is he going to handle being hit in the NFL? That's the only question I have about him.


Austin has never missed a game in his college career. Harvin struggled with durability issues during it along with his migraines.

Why? The difference between their running styles. Watch Austin play and tell me how many times he takes big hits. Austin is great at getting his yards and getting down or getting out of bounds. He rarely takes hits. Whereas Harvin runs a bit like a power HB which opens him up to big hits.

He'll be fine in terms of being hit. He does the same thing that Isaac and Torry used to do, catch a pass, get the first and then dive down when he's surrounded by tacklers. It's smart and it keeps you healthy.

Quote:
I like Long as a prospect, and I trust our coaching staff also. It's interesting that you would consider replacing Dahl at RG. Hell, if that is the case why can't Dahl play RT?


Dahl is going to be 32 and our OL didn't seem to have issues without him...they gave up 0 sacks over the final 2 games. He's a good player and I love his attitude but with the money he's making at 32 years old, I'd certainly consider replacing him especially with a young guy like Rok.


Austin's greatest attribute is his ability to gain yards after the catch. If he is going to be diving at people's feet when they get near him then I'd say no thanks to drafting him.

I had already considered that his elusiveness makes him hard to square up, but it only takes once, and he does not have eyes in the back of his head. If any one of those Seattle defensive backs caught him clean, it would be lights out. If a player like that ever becomes timid, their career is essentially over.

Bruce and Holt didn't start hitting the ground early until the 3rd year of Mike Martz being the head coach. If you don't believe me, just go look up how we went from leading the league in YAC to being near the bottom. Not coincidentally, that is the year our offense fell off.

I'm not saying that I don't like Austin as a prospect, because I do, but taking him in the first round doesn't make sense to me.

Being that this forum is called "football's future", I'm not surprised that most posters prefer using a 1st round pick on the unproven Tavon Austin as opposed to using a lower 2nd round pick to trade for a guy who has proven to be one of the most dangerous and versatile weapons in the NFL. But when you add it up it defies conventional logic. And please spare me the injury BS.......

You keep bringing up Harvin's migraine history. Why? When was the last time the migraines were a factor? The guy gets put on IR for the first time in his career and suddenly he's injury prone? Give me a break.
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jrry32


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2013 6:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The J.R.S. wrote:


Austin's greatest attribute is his ability to gain yards after the catch. If he is going to be diving at people's feet when they get near him then I'd say no thanks to drafting him.


He already does and he still picks up ridiculous YAC yards. It's all about knowing when you're caught. He makes people miss, picks up yards but when he gets surrounded and has nowhere to go, he either steps out or dives for yards.

Quote:
I had already considered that his elusiveness makes him hard to square up, but it only takes once, and he does not have eyes in the back of his head. If any one of those Seattle defensive backs caught him clean, it would be lights out. If a player like that ever becomes timid, their career is essentially over.


Or he'd get right back up and be fine. This isn't a guy who has had trouble staying on the field. Any WR is at risk of being injured or knocked out with a big hit. Seems ridiculous to not draft someone based on that reasoning...especially when that player never missed a game in his college career.

Quote:
Bruce and Holt didn't start hitting the ground early until the 3rd year of Mike Martz being the head coach. If you don't believe me, just go look up how we went from leading the league in YAC to being near the bottom. Not coincidentally, that is the year our offense fell off.


Again, YAC is no issue at all. It's the ability to recognize when taking unnecessary hits is a bad idea.

Quote:
I'm not saying that I don't like Austin as a prospect, because I do, but taking him in the first round doesn't make sense to me.

Being that this forum is called "football's future", I'm not surprised that most posters prefer using a 1st round pick on the unproven Tavon Austin as opposed to using a lower 2nd round pick to trade for a guy who has proven to be one of the most dangerous and versatile weapons in the NFL. But when you add it up it defies conventional logic. And please spare me the injury BS.......


Why did Santonio Holmes get traded for a 5th? How many 4th rounders are more proven or likely to be better players?

Why didn't Brandon Marshall get traded for a 1st? WRs depreciate in value. Especially when they have injury issues, attitude issues or are looking for a new contact. You're looking at the full trifecta from above for Harvin.

Injury BS? You're sitting here saying Austin isn't worth a 1st because a guy who has never missed a game in college MIGHT get hurt.

Quote:
You keep bringing up Harvin's migraine history. Why? When was the last time the migraines were a factor? The guy gets put on IR for the first time in his career and suddenly he's injury prone? Give me a break.


I brought up his migraine history in regards to college. I've already defended him on the migraines in the NFL, get your facts straight before you come after me.

He's not suddenly injury prone. He's had nagging injuries throughout his NFL career and college career and has a pretty extensive injury history.
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The LBC wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Don't worry. Sean Payton would pass the ball in a Tornado.

But would he do it in a Sharknado?
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