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Why don't our coordinators/assistant succeed as Head Coaches
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JDLefebvre


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 2:27 pm    Post subject: Why don't our coordinators/assistant succeed as Head Coaches Reply with quote

All I can think of is Marvin Lewis and even he would've been fired a long time ago by most teams.

But those who failed in the past.

Lebeau
Mularkey
Whiz
Gailey



Know there's more but having trouble thinking of them!!!
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Jakuvious


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mainly because few coaches succeed in general. When you look at the turnover rates for coaches, there's only a handful that last more than 3 or 4 years period, and those are the coaches of teams that consistently make the postseason. So it is really just a matter of probability. Same as why most NE castoffs fail.
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rollins


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I actually think Whiz is a good coach, I mean he got the Arizona Cardinals to a SB! Since then he simply hasn't had a QB that was capable of anything better than a losing season.

I don't know how much say he has with personel decisions, but that has been Arizona's problem not the coaching.

I would say with a team like Detroit Whiz would be a perrennial playoff team.
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jebrick


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

#1 LeBeau failed with the Bengals. Paul Brown failed with the Bengals and he was the owner.

#2 related to #1 - The owner/GM of a team matter for the success of the coach.

#3 It all depends on how good your assistant coaches are Very Happy

None of them did that bad but very few owners have the patience to wait on a change for their players. Tomlin inherited crap on the Oline from Cowher and it has taken 4 years to really change it. Just can't do it over night like most people think.
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rollins


Joined: 19 Dec 2010
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Other than Whiz, the rest were just meant to be coordintors, and one of them happens to be a pretty damn good coordinator! Some guys are meant to coach while some are meant to coordinate. Look at Tomlin, I believe he is the opposite of LeBeau. LeBeau biggest strength is teaching and drawing up plays so he is better as a coordinator than HC. While Tomlin on the other hand has a knack for inspiring and leading men. Theres something about how he speaks that makes people listen, thats why he is better as a HC than a coordinator. To me he wasn't more than average as a coordinator. And I was highly skeptical of his hiring until I heard a few press conferences.
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jcm412


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What about John Fox and Tony Dungey?[/u]
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Bobikus


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Because play drawing and calling is what typically makes a coord great while motivating and personnel management tends to be what makes an HC great. Different skills.
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FourThreeMafia


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 5:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rollins wrote:
I actually think Whiz is a good coach, I mean he got the Arizona Cardinals to a SB! Since then he simply hasn't had a QB that was capable of anything better than a losing season.

I don't know how much say he has with personel decisions, but that has been Arizona's problem not the coaching.

I would say with a team like Detroit Whiz would be a perrennial playoff team.


Why does Whiz get a pass for not having a QB?

I continue to hear people say it wasnt his fault for not having a QB. Whose fault was it?

It would be one thing if he was only there a very short time and had a crap QB, but he was there 6 years...and the main reason he made the SB was because he INHERITED a Kurt Warner, Larry Fitzgerald and Anquan Boldin.

Aside from those 3 players, name one offensive player under Whiz that ever turned out to be more than average?

Now, I know some will say that "Tomlin inherited a good Steelers team" and he did, but while age is catching up with us, parts of this team have improved since has been here.

For an offesnive minded coach, Whiz never really did ANYTHING with that offense. He never did anything with Kevin Kolb, and while I never thought Kolb was good, a truly good offensive coach couldve got more out of him, like Andy Reid was able to do.

The Cards rode Kurt Warner, Fitz and Boldin to the SB.

The only thing Whiz did was install a better offesnive system, which wasnt hard consdiering how bad it was before.

After 6 years, Whiz is leaving that offense in shambles and while the defense is promising, it never showed alot of improvement until Horton got there.

Bottom line...Whiz was an extremely overrated OC here and never that good of a HC. Being better than the likes of Denny Green, Vinny Tobin and Dave McGinnis doesnt make him "good".
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Bobikus


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arizona could have easily taken shots at guys like Flacco, Dalton, Wilson, etc while Whis was there, but chose to overpay for guys like Kolb and keep Leinart around too long despite Whis clearly disliking him from the start.
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SteelProven


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 7:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like Whiz always have, but his drafts never really panned out. If not for L. Fitzgerald staying Whiz would of probably been gone sooner.

The Steelers coordinators never really walked into stable situations. They've all inherited mid level or poor teams. When you take over teams like that you need luck and a lot of it. Something like Bellichick did when getting Brady.

None of the Steelers coordinators ever had a functional QB for the long term. That position has to be stable in some form in fashion.
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lionslicer


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whiz did not have that much control of the team, he was the head coach who played with players the GM gave him....

Rod Graves was responsible for everything, and probably had more responsibilities than 90% of GM's in the NFL. Whiz was hired as a coach and to play that role only. His only decisions were what he made on the field and who to play/bench...

Leinart was there so long because Graves didn't want to admit he drafted a bust.

I like how when a team is good at drafting, people praise the GM, but when they fail, they blame the coach...
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C$!


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 9:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dom Capers and Jim Haslett did pretty good. It's hard though, these guys tend to go to teams with major issues and don't usually get the time to see it through. Look at Romeo Cronell and Charlie Weiss.some guys are just better suited to be coordinators
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at23steelers


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 9:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Arians has a chance to outshine them all, which isn't saying much. And I believe he'd be a better head coach than offensive coordinator which again is not saying much. The less situational play calling he has to make the better! Think he'd be a very average - decent coach, which is better than everyone else, and his job at offensive coordinator.
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JustPlainNasty


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It will always be difficult for me to like Mularkey because the first thought that comes to my mind is him dropping that pass over the middle vs Denver on the last drive of the 1989 divisional playoffs.
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steelcurtain29


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It just shows that only the best of the best are good enough to be Head Coaches in the NFL.

How's that for some crow, Tomlin haters.
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