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skrILL
Joined: 29 Jul 2011
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 Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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| RDawg10 wrote: | | BBIB wrote: | | Heavinsent wrote: |
Please stop. We don't want Vick. |
Well if Vick lands on the Bills you all will be the 4th best team in the AFC East |
That might be the dumbest statement I've ever heard. |
Unfortunately it's probably true.
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RDawg10
Joined: 26 Jan 2011
Posts: 534
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| Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 5:54 pm Post subject: |
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| BBIB wrote: | | jetskid007 wrote: | Our QB situation is so poor that I wouldn't even care about Vick coming in as the starter, I'm just trying to point out that it wouldn't be much of a difference.
Who would Vick have to throw to? Who's running the ball? Who's calling the offense?
That coupled with the fact that we will have little money to offer in free agency leads me to believe that Vick will not be a fit with the New York Jets. The only way the Jets could afford to sign Vick is if they add years and signing bonuses into the contract, which would be even more idiotic then the Sanchez extension was.
Regardless which way you put it, Vick is a 33 year old running quarterback who has battled injuries and has turned the ball over his past 2 seasons in Philadelphia. If he were willing to accept a 1 year, $3.5 million contract I'll take him, otherwise no thanks. |
Vick had to throw the ball 40+ times a game in Philadelphia
The Jets are actually committed to running the football which is why they are #1 in the league in rushing the football since 2009
The Jets actually have a defense. So their offense wouldn't have to be elite just improved, which Vick would do
And Vick didn't have any great targets in Atlanta. Vick's ability to extend plays could improve a guy like Stephen Hill and Jeremy Kerley could be a weapon as well
Not to mention there's a whole off-season to add offensive weapons on the outside |
You talk about how he has had some injury problems recently but not really before. First of all Vick didnt play for 3 years. From 2006-2009. On top of that, the fact that hes recieving injuries recently means that hes not going to get better. This isnt a 25 year old guy, this a 32 year old that doesnt have the ability to recover from injuries like he use too. Also, no offense but Vick will never be a good quarterback again, hes average at best. He cant run like he use to, and he cant really throw the ball all that well. His best season was in 2010 with 21 tds and 6 pics, but lets be serious that was a fluke too. Its same old vick a 15 td 12int passer with 500-750 yards of rushing a year. But that should dwindle now with his age which is why he is no way a viable option for this team.
I keep hearing that Vick is a better option than Sanchez, although some of you are right, i honestly believe that matt moore>Vick>Sanchez. The ideal situation is draft a qb but bring in moore or campbell as well.
Lets face it, and you to BBIB, Vick is not a good quarterback and he never has been. His ability to make people miss and flash when he was young, was what made him michael vick. I would absolutely love the bills to sign Vick, and quite honestly Fitzpatrick>Vick... just saying. Vick in the afc east... he would be terrorized by the dolphins and jets defense, lets not even bring up the patriots... the bills need to draft someone young and get better up front. I doubt the bills are dumb enough to welcome vick.
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RDawg10
Joined: 26 Jan 2011
Posts: 534
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| Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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| skrILL wrote: | | RDawg10 wrote: | | BBIB wrote: | | Heavinsent wrote: |
Please stop. We don't want Vick. |
Well if Vick lands on the Bills you all will be the 4th best team in the AFC East |
That might be the dumbest statement I've ever heard. |
Unfortunately it's probably true. |
Not a chance. The jets team without revis or holmes, you could argue we are currently better.
How could you say that if vick went to the bills, they would be better? Vick is not an upgrade over fitzpatrick.
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BBIB
Joined: 20 Jan 2008
Posts: 7411
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| Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 7:37 pm Post subject: |
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| RDawg10 wrote: |
You talk about how he has had some injury problems recently but not really before. First of all Vick didnt play for 3 years. From 2006-2009. On top of that, the fact that hes recieving injuries recently means that hes not going to get better. This isnt a 25 year old guy, this a 32 year old that doesnt have the ability to recover from injuries like he use too. Also, no offense but Vick will never be a good quarterback again, hes average at best. He cant run like he use to, and he cant really throw the ball all that well. His best season was in 2010 with 21 tds and 6 pics, but lets be serious that was a fluke too. Its same old vick a 15 td 12int passer with 500-750 yards of rushing a year. But that should dwindle now with his age which is why he is no way a viable option for this team.
I keep hearing that Vick is a better option than Sanchez, although some of you are right, i honestly believe that matt moore>Vick>Sanchez. The ideal situation is draft a qb but bring in moore or campbell as well.
Lets face it, and you to BBIB, Vick is not a good quarterback and he never has been. His ability to make people miss and flash when he was young, was what made him michael vick. I would absolutely love the bills to sign Vick, and quite honestly Fitzpatrick>Vick... just saying. Vick in the afc east... he would be terrorized by the dolphins and jets defense, lets not even bring up the patriots... the bills need to draft someone young and get better up front. I doubt the bills are dumb enough to welcome vick. |
Vick missed 3 years because he fought dogs not because of some injury. And if anything not taking those hits may give Vick an extra year or two in the league from a physical standpoint without the extra wear and tear of playing the position.
You may say that Vick's 2010 season was a fluke but his detractors said he would never have another season like that even in the most ideal circumstances
Again the detractors are the ones who can revise history because when I laid out all the facts for why Vick at the age of 30 could be better than he ever was in his 20s, it was laughed out and dismissed and people said that Vick wouldn't even be an effective backup QB for a whole season let alone could he give a team a best chance to win as a starter
Matt Moore over Vick? Really? Matt Moore has about as many losses as wins in his career and about as many turnovers as TDs if I'm not mistaken
And Vick having running ability that diminishes isn't the same as an average dual threat QB diminishing
Vick with 2 lost steps at 34 is still as as fast as a Russell Wilson for instance at 24.
In fact the only QB that would be faster than Vick in his mid 30s would be RGIII
Last edited by BBIB on Sat Dec 29, 2012 7:42 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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BBIB
Joined: 20 Jan 2008
Posts: 7411
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| Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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| RDawg10 wrote: |
Not a chance. The jets team without revis or holmes, you could argue we are currently better.
How could you say that if vick went to the bills, they would be better? Vick is not an upgrade over fitzpatrick. |
Ryan Fitzpatrick has more career turnovers than touchdowns and a losing record as a starter
Vick has given whatever team he's ever played for a better chance to win.
Falcons 3-12 without him during his tenure as a starter Eagles 4-10 without him since he took over as a starter
Vick with an actual Oline and CJ Spiller in the backfield alone would make the Bills offense far more dynamic than Fitzpatrick could ever make it
And Vick on a $5 million dollar contract at that >>>> the big time contract version of Fitzpatrick
It also would be mean another year with Mark Sanchez more than likely at QB for the Jets. Or at best Alex Smith who without that loaded 49ers cast will look awful
So yes Vick on the Bills would be a better team than the Jets |
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RDawg10
Joined: 26 Jan 2011
Posts: 534
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| Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 12:46 am Post subject: |
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| BBIB wrote: | | RDawg10 wrote: |
You talk about how he has had some injury problems recently but not really before. First of all Vick didnt play for 3 years. From 2006-2009. On top of that, the fact that hes recieving injuries recently means that hes not going to get better. This isnt a 25 year old guy, this a 32 year old that doesnt have the ability to recover from injuries like he use too. Also, no offense but Vick will never be a good quarterback again, hes average at best. He cant run like he use to, and he cant really throw the ball all that well. His best season was in 2010 with 21 tds and 6 pics, but lets be serious that was a fluke too. Its same old vick a 15 td 12int passer with 500-750 yards of rushing a year. But that should dwindle now with his age which is why he is no way a viable option for this team.
I keep hearing that Vick is a better option than Sanchez, although some of you are right, i honestly believe that matt moore>Vick>Sanchez. The ideal situation is draft a qb but bring in moore or campbell as well.
Lets face it, and you to BBIB, Vick is not a good quarterback and he never has been. His ability to make people miss and flash when he was young, was what made him michael vick. I would absolutely love the bills to sign Vick, and quite honestly Fitzpatrick>Vick... just saying. Vick in the afc east... he would be terrorized by the dolphins and jets defense, lets not even bring up the patriots... the bills need to draft someone young and get better up front. I doubt the bills are dumb enough to welcome vick. |
Vick missed 3 years because he fought dogs not because of some injury. And if anything not taking those hits may give Vick an extra year or two in the league from a physical standpoint without the extra wear and tear of playing the position.
You may say that Vick's 2010 season was a fluke but his detractors said he would never have another season like that even in the most ideal circumstances
Again the detractors are the ones who can revise history because when I laid out all the facts for why Vick at the age of 30 could be better than he ever was in his 20s, it was laughed out and dismissed and people said that Vick wouldn't even be an effective backup QB for a whole season let alone could he give a team a best chance to win as a starter
Matt Moore over Vick? Really? Matt Moore has about as many losses as wins in his career and about as many turnovers as TDs if I'm not mistaken
And Vick having running ability that diminishes isn't the same as an average dual threat QB diminishing
Vick with 2 lost steps at 34 is still as as fast as a Russell Wilson for instance at 24.
In fact the only QB that would be faster than Vick in his mid 30s would be RGIII |
Oh where do i begin BBIB! First of all im glad you can clarify that vick is faster than russell wilson, because im sure they came over your house the other day and traded 40 times for you. Second vick will be as fast as he was when he was 24 or whatever thats true, but his knees and ability to make people miss is not the same. Third Matt Moore is better than vick. Not only has he been successful surrounded by terrible talent, but hes shown the ability to read defenses. He may not have the arm, but in this league you dont need it. Hes durable and he also brings less of a sideshow. Im sure most Bills fans want nothing to do with Vick, and you go crazy about him making cj spiller better... how? Cj spiller no matter who the quarterback will be successful. He is most successful in open field and im not to sure how much of a difference having vick will change that.
Last i figured i would clarify a few stats for you since you think stats are everything. Btw you seem like Marcus Vick, pleading for vick. Its annoying, your a fan i get it but the bills and jets want nothing to do with him. Hes not going to make us better.
Matt Moore
Career
33 TD's 26 INT PR 80.5
Best year was with the dolphins in 2011 with an OL ranked 21st
Matt Moores best trait has been decision-making. With Carolina he had zero weapons, and didnt have much more besides marshall with miami.
For an interim possible starter Matt Moore>Michael Vick. Plus you will pay probably 3 million less to get moore.... thats a no brainer.
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KBS756
Joined: 01 Oct 2005
Posts: 3148
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| Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 6:00 pm Post subject: |
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Watching the Raiders game and liking what I am seeing out of Pryor so far Good decision making, solid throws, excellent ball placement.
Too bad given a good performance the Raiders Prob don't let him go.
Pryor + McFadden for Greene and Sanchez + 3rd |
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KBS756
Joined: 01 Oct 2005
Posts: 3148
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| Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 6:02 pm Post subject: |
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Double Post Ignore ...
Last edited by KBS756 on Sun Dec 30, 2012 6:12 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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skrILL
Joined: 29 Jul 2011
Posts: 2138
Location: JMG on the sig
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| Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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| RDawg10 wrote: | | skrILL wrote: | | RDawg10 wrote: | | BBIB wrote: | | Heavinsent wrote: |
Please stop. We don't want Vick. |
Well if Vick lands on the Bills you all will be the 4th best team in the AFC East |
That might be the dumbest statement I've ever heard. |
Unfortunately it's probably true. |
Not a chance. The jets team without revis or holmes, you could argue we are currently better.
How could you say that if vick went to the bills, they would be better? Vick is not an upgrade over fitzpatrick. |
Vick is easily an upgrade over Fitz, how can you convince yourself that he isn't? Fitz sucks.
Even with Revis and Holmes, guess what, we are still stuck with Sanchez at QB. Until we fix that, we will continue to have problems.
Step 1: Get a QB guru in the building (see Norv Turner)
Step 2: Cut the dead weight (bye Mark, bye Tim)
Step 3: Sign a veteran stop-gap (Vick, Moore, Campbell, Flynn, etc.)
Step 4: Get some weapons and some blockers
Step 5: Draft someone in the 2nd or 3rd round, and if he isn't the next Russell Wilson, prepare to draft a QB in the 1st in 2014.
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Davey
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 20699
Location: New Jersey
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| Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 2:21 am Post subject: |
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Do it the right way or not at all.
First, hire the right man to run the offense, who isn't going to get up and leave prior to a quarterback's full development. Turner seems ideal, proven record as OC who isn't going to get another HC job again. Being a "head coach of an offense" as he'd be here with Rex Ryan remaining as coach would be the best job he could get.
Bring in a veteran, maybe Alex Smith(has some experience with Turner), to be the starter while a quarterback drafted within the first two rounds is brought up to speed.
Build around the drafted quarterback. |
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KBS756
Joined: 01 Oct 2005
Posts: 3148
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| Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 3:07 am Post subject: |
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| Davey wrote: | Do it the right way or not at all.
First, hire the right man to run the offense, who isn't going to get up and leave prior to a quarterback's full development. Turner seems ideal, proven record as OC who isn't going to get another HC job again. Being a "head coach of an offense" as he'd be here with Rex Ryan remaining as coach would be the best job he could get.
Bring in a veteran, maybe Alex Smith(has some experience with Turner), to be the starter while a quarterback drafted within the first two rounds is brought up to speed.
Build around the drafted quarterback. |
Agree with you completely except the protion of drafting a QB in the first 2 rounds this year. I honestly dont see a QB of the Future there and wouldnt want to reach especially in the first round for one. Praying we land a Star Pass Rusher.
Other than that the plan seems excellent and ... we should be givin Norv the paperwork to sign the second he becomes available, seems to be by far the best option on the market. |
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jamax99
Joined: 29 Dec 2007
Posts: 434
Location: new york
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| Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 3:04 am Post subject: |
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| Trade for rivers, and 2th round pick. For our 1 rounder.. And 3 rd. |
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Rockice_8
Joined: 05 Oct 2010
Posts: 1482
Location: Unknown
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| Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 11:31 am Post subject: |
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I hoping Alex Smith is realeased. He's not a star or anything but he still belongs in the top half of the league in terms of QB play. He's smart, doesn't turn the ball over and can extend plays with his legs. He's what we thought Sanchez was going to be.
He'll be a major upgrade to Sanchez and bring a calming stability to our QB position.
We still need a developmental QB and in the 4th we should be able to land a QB who falls like (Jones, Bray, Dysert).
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BBIB
Joined: 20 Jan 2008
Posts: 7411
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| Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:48 pm Post subject: |
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Matt Moore
35 career touchdowns
34 career turnovers
Alex Smith
85 career touchdowns
82 career turnovers
Vick has a better TD/TO ratio and better win loss record than both of those guys
Again call me a Vick homer but I'm just stating facts here |
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Malik
Joined: 18 Dec 2011
Posts: 2813
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| Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 11:51 pm Post subject: |
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| I'm a Vick guy but I much prefer Matt Moore over Vick as a stop gate. I don't think we're going further than a single playoff victory with Vick and the unnecessary attention isn't worth it. |
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