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Is Tannebaum really that bad?
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glenearl18


Joined: 12 Feb 2012
Posts: 362
PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 6:00 pm    Post subject: Is Tannebaum really that bad? Reply with quote

If Coples keeps it up, Mike T's only had 3 bad 1st round selections out of 8, and most of his acquisitions and trades were positive additions to the team. It's not like Gholston was a OMG WTF pick either; most of us loved the pick. Obviously there are better GMs out there, but unless we're sure we have one I don't think blindly firing an above average GM like Tannenbaum is the way to go. It's safe to say that Tebow and probably Favre were Woody Johnson (and possibly Mangini in the case of Favre) driven moves.
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rdelaney89


Joined: 22 Jan 2009
Posts: 1522
PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes he is that bad. You can't look at just his first round selections. He has missed on a lot of other draft picks and it is his fault we have no depth on this team.
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rickyt31


Joined: 29 Dec 2008
Posts: 6620
Location: HEATlanta , GA
PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IMO, it wasn't his talent evaluating skills that hurt him. It was pretty much everything else. Gave out bad contracts, traded a lot of draft picks, and skipped important needs like OLBs & talent on offense.
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green24


Joined: 10 Apr 2010
Posts: 42925
PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

He wasn't awful, but he wasn't good enough. He did some good things, but ultimately we need to go in a different direction.
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barnaby8787


Joined: 01 Jan 2006
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Location: Manhattan, NY
PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

He gave Sanchez a crippling extension
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KBS756


Joined: 01 Oct 2005
Posts: 5345
PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
If Coples keeps it up, Mike T's only had 3 bad 1st round selections out of 8, and most of his acquisitions and trades were positive additions to the team. It's not like Gholston was a OMG WTF pick either; most of us loved the pick. Obviously there are better GMs out there, but unless we're sure we have one I don't think blindly firing an above average GM like Tannenbaum is the way to go. It's safe to say that Tebow and probably Favre were Woody Johnson (and possibly Mangini in the case of Favre) driven moves


I Honestly don't consider any defensive pick ups under Rex to be real Tannenbaum moves in terms of personell evaluation. I'd be shocked if the majority of any personell related decisions were from Tannenbaum. And that is part of the problem because Tannenbaum doesnt seem to know football talent he just knows how to make the dollar signs work. We need a real talent evaluator especially one that knows what he or she is doing evaluating players on the offensive side of the ball.

And givin Mark an extention that didnt allow us an out at the end of this season, and over paying Holmes don't reflect positively on him either especially because both of these are areas where he is supposed to be good as he is more of a $$ not X's and O's football type.


Last edited by KBS756 on Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:53 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Karmaloop


Joined: 01 Mar 2008
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Location: Queens, NY
PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not good at talent evaluation. Had like two good drafts. Good with the cap (mostly).
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green24


Joined: 10 Apr 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Karmaloop wrote:
Not good at talent evaluation. Had like two good drafts. Good with the cap (mostly).

I like the 2006, 2007, 2011, and 2012 drafts. We got one good player (Keller) from 2008-2010.
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Jetsman82


Joined: 20 Jan 2007
Posts: 19684
PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 8:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You can't say Tanny isn't that bad when he's had the Sanchez, Tebow and Holmes blunders. We can't forget the terrible drafts of 2008, 2009 and 2010 also. The Jets are currently in a terrible cap situation, and are devoid of talent at numerous positions on offense and defense. Someone has to pay the price for this failure.

Tanny is supposed to be a cap guru, and he's not even good at that anymore.
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richie jets


Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Posts: 779
Location: yonkers
PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

he started out ok , was aggressive with trades and he picked up some good players , Jenkins ,Holmes ,cro , but once the end of 2010 his drafting and free agency, contracts were brutal. He didn't fill gaping holes in personnel . Edge rusher ??? I think he's bad and getting worse .
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D.Revis24


Joined: 02 Apr 2010
Posts: 3695
PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good for him, he hit on the last 2 first round picks. But that is pretty much it and he left this roster with like no talent or depth. We need so many new starters for next season, he has done a bad job and deserves to be fired.
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jetskid007


Joined: 09 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

He's a very good GM if you have the right structure in place.

Tannenbaum's had good drafts as GM, but dating back to the Mangini days who has had the most say in the selections? The head coach. That's not supposed to happen. A head coach should always give his input and have a loud voice in the discussion, but when you rely on the coach to the point where you can't make your own decisions it is not good.

Tannenbaum revealed his hand a few years ago when word got out that the Gholston pick was a Mangini one. Look at what it's been ever since:

2009 - Mark Sanchez. We know that was Rex's pick. If I wanted to be captain hindsight I can say this was Tannenbaum's worst move because he let the rookie head coach force his hand, but I believe Mark would've been good if the Jets treated his situation better after the 2010 season.

2010 - Kyle Wilson. Hmmmm... cornerback? Rex's fingerprints all over it.

2011 - Muhammad Wilkerson. News has never really came out about this one, but I feel it was Rex's influence that got him here. Rex has sworn by him from day 1 and it's proven to be a great pick.

2012 - Quinton Coples. Much like the Wilkerson pick, Rex has sworn by him and we know that he was the guy pulling for Coples.


Do I have a problem with Rex being deeply involved in the process? No, I actually love it. I love that Rex gets involved and tries to find players that he feels will be stalwarts for his team, but what's gonna happen this year or next? We need someone who can take Rex's input, take the scouts input, but also add his input to the equation. Having Rex pick his players ultimately is a little biased, and if he had it his way we'll be drafting defense for the next decade.

Tannenbaum has always been influenced too much by everyone else (Owner, head coach), but it's about time we find a GM who believes in making his own decisions. Ultimately the general manager is paid to put a winning product on the field, not sell tickets or make headlines. Those things will come if the team is built properly, but Tannenbaum is always trying to find the shortcuts as many businessmen do.


Tannenbaum has had a great stint as general manager of the Jets. Since he's taken over, the Jets became relevant and have added some of the greatest players in Jets history (Revis, Mangold, Ferguson), but he doesn't have enough knowledge or confidence as a talent evaluator to right a ship the way it needs to be fixed. The only way to fix this team is by getting a football guy in place who's more focused on building a winning team and seeing eye-to-eye with Rex Ryan then having 2 businessmen trying to sell tickets and create headlines. I love Tannenbaum as general manager when he was able to sign free agents and restructure contracts at-will, but the new CBA will not allow Tannenbaum's ways to happen again (remember this is the guy who discovered the poison pill).
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Colt45fool


Joined: 28 Jul 2008
Posts: 5672
Location: New Haven, CT
PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 1:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tannenbaum's way of building this team was a little short sighted...when he was batting 1.000, or close to it, he built a team that was AFCCG ready. When he made a couple of misses and guys didn't play up to their contracts, he ultimately took the blame...and rightfully so. Those are contracts he gave out & picks that fall back on him, no matter how clear it is that Rex has a lot of input.

The Rex input is a major issue and I understand wanting to cater to your head coach...but you can't just let the drafts be dictated by defense & allow your offense to slowly deplete of talent. Damien Woody, Braylon Edwards, Alan Faneca, Thomas Jones, Brad Smith, Leon Washington, etc. -- a bunch of guys that were never replaced or were replaced by scrubs. Meanwhile, the defense hasn't missed a beat due to scheming & Rex having his hand prints all over the drafts. The blame falls on Tanenbaum, and the actions are unacceptable.

The most recent blunders -- like the Sanchez extension -- are all the more reason to point fingers at Tannenbaum. Of course, missing on Sanchez hurts a lot too...and it when rains, it really pours on Tannenbaum. Is he that bad? No. But he's seen better days...and we could use a new GM.
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Jetsman82


Joined: 20 Jan 2007
Posts: 19684
PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I could live with some bad draft picks, not every one of your picks will work out, that's just a fact. But his handling of the signings, extensions and trades are what really hurts him the most. He needs to pay the price for his blunders. You have to be held accountable.
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Harris Smith


Joined: 07 Dec 2008
Posts: 1471
Location: Totowa, NJ
PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've always felt that Tannenbaum was not qualified from a football background standpoint to manage the personel on this team. He was elevated to the position of GM upon the arrival of Mangini because he had a preexisting relationship with him, and Mangini wanted a figurehead at the top spot to rubber-stamp his decisions and not interfere. Mangini did the same thing in Cleveland with Kokinos in his brief time there. I also think the owner liked the ability to impose his will on a fellow newbie like Tannenbaum.

But in defense of Tannenbaum, one thing I suspect hurt the Jets from a cap standpoint was the lockout, and the structure of the salary cap afterwards. I think he gambled a little that the cap number for teams would be higher than it is by now, and when he had to readjust his plan to how things worked out, he went into somewhat of a penny pinching mode. I hear people in the media say things like the Jets sat on their hands this past offseason instead of picking up some free agents they needed, but they don't seem to realize that the unused cap space from this year can be carried into next season- which they'll need every bit of just to keep the players from their own roster they want to keep like Revis, Keller, etc.

But at the end of the day, the Rex-Tanny partnership isn't working when it comes to managing the roster. Rex is so focused on defense, he'd probably draft D 5 out of 7 picks every year, and Tannenbaum's really no more qualified than any other fan who's never played, coached, scouted, etc. So really, if the outcome of all this is that the Jets bring in a qualified personel guy to balance out the impulses of Rex Ryan and manage the entire team, the Jets are better off. Personally though, I'd rather they retain Tannenbaum on the staff in a position he's better suited to, because I do think he has talent to offer on the financial end of things.
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