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The future of the Ravens
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SnA ExclusiVe


Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 22712
Location: Spokane, WA
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DontTazeMeBro wrote:
Eh. Not that reliable of a stat. Anything a WR gets his hands on counts as a drop. So if a WR has to jump through the roof to touch it but doesn't come down with it it is a drop despite being a bad throw. Then there are throws that are intentionally like 10 feet above a WRs head out of bounds or at a WRs feet under imense pressure that don't count as throwaways even though that was the intention. I think it's better to leave the numbers unadjusted.


Either way I think Flacco is a tremendously inaccurate QB.
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DontTazeMeBro


Joined: 20 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
DontTazeMeBro wrote:
Eh. Not that reliable of a stat. Anything a WR gets his hands on counts as a drop. So if a WR has to jump through the roof to touch it but doesn't come down with it it is a drop despite being a bad throw. Then there are throws that are intentionally like 10 feet above a WRs head out of bounds or at a WRs feet under imense pressure that don't count as throwaways even though that was the intention. I think it's better to leave the numbers unadjusted.


Either way I think Flacco is a tremendously inaccurate QB.


He isn't above average accuracy. But he has has his hot zones. He can hit that deep comeback all day. A lot of overthrown deep balls but I think some of that is because Torrey Smith is a small target. The smaller the WR the more accurate the QB has to be. And while he isn't the most accurate QB ever seen I don't see balls constantly sailing over a WRs head right into the hands of a safety like I do with a lot of other QBs. I'd give him a B- for accuracy. He has a lot of room for improvement but it isn't a killer.
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diamondbull424


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Joined: 02 Dec 2007
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Location: Baltimore, MD
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DontTazeMeBro wrote:
SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
DontTazeMeBro wrote:
Eh. Not that reliable of a stat. Anything a WR gets his hands on counts as a drop. So if a WR has to jump through the roof to touch it but doesn't come down with it it is a drop despite being a bad throw. Then there are throws that are intentionally like 10 feet above a WRs head out of bounds or at a WRs feet under imense pressure that don't count as throwaways even though that was the intention. I think it's better to leave the numbers unadjusted.


Either way I think Flacco is a tremendously inaccurate QB.


He isn't above average accuracy. But he has has his hot zones. He can hit that deep comeback all day. A lot of overthrown deep balls but I think some of that is because Torrey Smith is a small target. The smaller the WR the more accurate the QB has to be. And while he isn't the most accurate QB ever seen I don't see balls constantly sailing over a WRs head right into the hands of a safety like I do with a lot of other QBs. I'd give him a B- for accuracy. He has a lot of room for improvement but it isn't a killer.

To piggy back, Torrey's speed is also something Flacco hasn't pinned down yet. When we've seen Jones and Boldin get space deep, Flacco's accuracy has been on point with them. So Torrey's speed is simply hard to get used to and get his timing down with. It's not a deep ball accuracy thing as much as a Torrey Smith deep thing.

That and the fact that our offense goes deep more than most offenses and you'll have Flacco obviously not being very high on the adjusted accuracy metric.
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RavensfanRD


Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Posts: 1661
Location: Baltimore, MD (Land of the Greatness)
PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gooselovechild wrote:
SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
gooselovechild wrote:
RavensfanRD wrote:
Flacco is fine. Coaching staff needs to go.


We're the only team that's won a playoff game in each of the past 4 seasons, and been to 2 AFCCGs in that time....never gonna happen.


And when you look at the talent that's been on this team, are you honestly surprised?

If that's the only thing keeping this coaching staff employed, then that's pretty sad...Rex Ryan and the Jets went to 2 AFC Championships and look where they are. Things can head downhill in a hurry if your coaching staff is a bunch of idiots.


Knee jerk and emotional decision making kills franchises even faster.

It's not like this supreme collection of talent was winning consistently prior to Harbaugh being hired.


The fact that this year's team has 9 wins so far with the amount of long term injuries sustained--particularly by the defense--is actually proof that Harbaugh is a good coach, especially since most of those calling for his removal also feel that Flacco should be replaced too.


It's not like we had this supreme level of talent prior to the Harbaugh era, either. Since the Harbaugh era we've fielded the most balanced Ravens teams ever. We've always been defense dominated. And had an OK offense during the beginning of the Vinny years.
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santiagomn8


Joined: 27 Dec 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

diamondbull424 wrote:
I just want to take the time out and say that this thread is absolute golden.

I think this thread is much more intriguing when looked at as a joke than as real discussion points.

I mean apparently, Alex Smith/Mike Vick are better options than Flacco. Smith deserves $10m a season, yet we can't afford to give Flacco $14m?

And then the arguments... "let's just wait until there's a REALLY good QB in the draft"... who? You mean like Matthew Stafford, the #1 pick? Heard he was really good... wait, you're talking about the guy who Flacco is outplaying...? Right... Or wait, maybe we could take a look at that JaMar-... not even going to finish that one. Hmm... what about Blaine Gabbert... no wait, you mean that scrub? Cam Newton is a bigger threat than Flacco, but not a better "QB".

So honestly, outside of Luck/RG3- and RG3 already has durability concerns- who are these "solutions" that people are offering? So many people here continue to act like baffoons and simply act as if a draft pick, any draft pick... can get you a franchise QB. I just named a host of #1 to top 10 QBs above... and outside of two of them, Flacco has been better to much better than all of them. Yet apparently it's so easy to get a "better" QB. And heck the scenarios where we could have our pick of the most prestigious QB the draft has to offer- would only occur with us having to give up a heft draft pick in order for it to happen.

But no... As opposed to actually understanding that we already HAVE a "franchise QB"... as in a player that we can put in that position and can be a durable rock in place that as long as we can provide him with some assistance, he can be a viable winning option. A franchise QB is not the same as an elite QB. Flacco is simply put, good enough and clutch enough to get this team where it needs to go. He's a top 10-13 QB.

And when he has a clean pocket and isn't rushing his technique, his physical traits are elite for QBing the football. His footwork has worsened in recent weeks, likely in relation to less comfortability with an OL that in recent weeks has begun to suck much harder. It just seems fishy that in the beginning of the season against Cincy/Philly/NE... Flacco was making some incredibly accurate passes with consistency. Yet recently, his passing has regressed to what it's looked like in past years. You have to imagine enough of that has to do with a) coaching b) poor technique and c) OL play.

Flacco's biggest weakness is pocket presence. No one said Flacco ever needed an elite rushing attack. He definitely has the arm to work in an offense where it can be centered around him making plays as long as those plays have short yardage options. An elite LT is truly the best possible option for Flacco moving forward.



First of all no one said its easy to find an elite QB like I've said before I would keep Flacco for now until someone comes out in the draft that we believe is a home run and go all out to get him...ur quick to name busts but how bout the mannings rivers hell Bradford yea it's a risky strategy but sometimes u gotta make those risks...stafford btw yea he has Calvin Johnson which don't get me wrong is a beast but what else does he have no O line no receiver besides Johnson no run game if u gave him what we had u dont think he would do good? Anyway back to my main point I'm not saying let Flacco go and just get anyone I'm saying keep trying wit him for now but if there is a guy comes out who is just too good to pass on then go get him regardless the cost or for whatever reason someone like a rivers mate get released go and get him.
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coordinator0


Joined: 18 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How are the Ravens going to move into a position to get one of those elite QB prospects? They're almost always the number one or two overall picks (also depends on how many there are in a draft class) and if the Ravens are still competitive and making the playoffs it's going to be extremely hard and expensive to move up that high.

Phillip Rivers is not any more of a franchise QB than Flacco is. I can't see why San Diego would release him anyways.
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santiagomn8


Joined: 27 Dec 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

coordinator0 wrote:
How are the Ravens going to move into a position to get one of those elite QB prospects? They're almost always the number one or two overall picks (also depends on how many there are in a draft class) and if the Ravens are still competitive and making the playoffs it's going to be extremely hard and expensive to move up that high.

Phillip Rivers is not any more of a franchise QB than Flacco is. I can't see why San Diego would release him anyways.



First off I think rivers is a better quarter back than Flacco and I Also said if that happens not that it would happen

Second let say in the next 2 or 3 years some really great QB prospect comes out we coul trade Flacco our first that year and maybe a first the next year I don't consider that something crazy to give up and I think that would be a realistic trade
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NJ Raven


Joined: 14 Sep 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So what kind of deal do you think he's played his into so far this season? I wouldn't hate a Kolb/Fitz-like deal at this point.
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santiagomn8


Joined: 27 Dec 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would say somewhere in the 8mil a year if he steps it up the next couple games into the playoffs then 10mil if he somehow wins a superbowl u know he is going to want 12 to 14 which they would give him
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coordinator0


Joined: 18 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

santiagomn8 wrote:
coordinator0 wrote:
How are the Ravens going to move into a position to get one of those elite QB prospects? They're almost always the number one or two overall picks (also depends on how many there are in a draft class) and if the Ravens are still competitive and making the playoffs it's going to be extremely hard and expensive to move up that high.

Phillip Rivers is not any more of a franchise QB than Flacco is. I can't see why San Diego would release him anyways.



First off I think rivers is a better quarter back than Flacco and I Also said if that happens not that it would happen

Second let say in the next 2 or 3 years some really great QB prospect comes out we coul trade Flacco our first that year and maybe a first the next year I don't consider that something crazy to give up and I think that would be a realistic trade


Either way why would they cut him?

I don't think a trade of two first round picks and Flacco would propel the Ravens from the late 20's to 1 or 2 overall. Just look at what the Redskins gave to the Rams for RGIII. Three first round picks and a 2nd round pick for only moving up 4 spots. It would be pretty much the same type of situation because Baltimore would be trying to trade up for X elite QB prospect. Is it worth it? Eh, I don't know about that.
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drd23


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Somebody please justify to me why Flacco is worth $15m/yr other than "thats what the market is" and "thats what you pay a franchise QB".

Please justify why is should be paid the 7th highest average salary for a QB because I just don't see it, and yet so many of you think its laughable not to.

Oh, and tell me how such a salary fits into the salary cap without cutting/letting go some significant players, because I struggle to see that too.

IDK, maybe I'm just blind.
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coordinator0


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Who knows what kind of deal Flacco will end up getting? At this point it's all speculation and even that is a few months old. I'm not going to try and guess right now because there's just too many variables and the situation is rather unique. If there's one thing about the front office that I have faith in it's not making bad or unreasonable decisions when it comes to handing out contracts. I don't think they've made a bad move in that regard for years. Some point to Foxworth but he was a good cover corner for Baltimore before he hurt his knee in training camp.
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Mr. X


Joined: 03 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My internship is over so I'm here to troll again...of wait...I'm just here to have everything I said in the beginning of the season and got blasted for come to fruition and now have everybody else say the same thing...
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sp6488


Joined: 14 Mar 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr. X wrote:
My internship is over so I'm here to troll again...of wait...I'm just here to have everything I said in the beginning of the season and got blasted for come to fruition and now have everybody else say the same thing...


For some reason I can only see your most recent post under post history, so please do tell what it was that you were saying. For some reason I bet it wasn't quite what has "come to fruition."
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sp6488


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Watching this MNF game has really solidified my opinion that there is no way that you just cut ties with Flacco. I know you're not suggesting we get rid of him this season, but even grabbing "our" guy once available in the draft may very well fall flat on its face. The Jets thought they had that with Sanchez (Top 5) and the Titans thought they had with Locker (Top 10). Making a move to a rookie QB would more likely put this team farther behind then closer to a SB. Flacco is a quality QB that actually still has some upside due to his ridiculous arm strength and size.
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