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BSH/DRD/SG Official 2013 OFF-Season THREAD
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tml_gogo


Joined: 02 Feb 2007
Posts: 13696
Location: Montréal
PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 12:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
Interesting stat line: qb Ej Manuel completed 73% of his passes on the intermediate throws between 7-20 yards.

If we go qb I'm starting to really like him as the choice. I see nothing that conparisons him and josh freeman other than physical stature and arm strength.


From earlier in the thread:

tml_gogo wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
tml_gogo wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
If we're looking at QB, EJ Manuel is growing on me. I like the poise and confidence he has in the pocket. Like his athleticism. He's an accurate thrower whos been nothing but a winner at Florida State. Good feel for the pocket. Mechanics are sound. Listening to him speak and his command, seems like the intangibles are there.

I think we should give him a hard look.


Not overly accurate though..reminds me of just another Freeman.


Please elaborate how he reminds you of freeman? Besides skin color and physical frame , I see two completely different qbs.


Woah, nobody was going there buddy. No need to turn this into THAT kinda debate.

Both of them:

- Very big guys
- Very strong arm
- Athletically gifted
- Issues with accuracy
- Issues with consistency

Pretty similar guys.

EDIT: Here is WalterFootball's scouting report on EJ Manuel.

Quote:
Strengths:
Dual-Threat Quarterback
Powerful arm
Excellent mobility
Size and strength
Escapability
Experienced
Quick release


Weaknesses:
Not a natural passer
Decision-making
Field vision
Struggles to work through progressions
Runs to quickly
Spotty accuracy
Can panic at times
Didn't play as well against good defenses


Please, tell me how that doesn't sound exactly like Freeman.

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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Going back watching tape and doing research completing 65% of your passes on average isn't spotty. When things break down Manuel keeps his eyes down field. Makes good decisions and reads.
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tml_gogo


Joined: 02 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
Going back watching tape and doing research completing 65% of your passes on average isn't spotty. When things break down Manuel keeps his eyes down field. Makes good decisions and reads.


Highlight videos aren't tape. Every single scouting service says the same things about him.. intriguing physical tools, questionable mental abilities.
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RedCoat


Joined: 25 Nov 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Saying that E.J is similar to Free, is IMO, a slap in the face of Free... Wink

I've never understood the hype around E.J, he has all the tools except where it matter's....the top 6 inch's.
I know a lot of mocks have him rising, and if he puts up some numbers in Indy, no doubt he'll rise higher still, but IMO, I'll be surprised if he goes any higher, than the bottom of the 2nd if he's lucky, and if he does, he'll be riding pine for quite a time.
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Soul Glo


Joined: 22 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dude's better than Free Laughing haha

You got like EJ for what he is, a potential QB... why are you using stats? It does not say much about a prospects. EJ is mentally way behind Free when he came out, his pocket abiltiy wasn't as good, does not have good downfield accuracy, more of a throwe than passer, tries to rocket everything, erratic.


He's huge, athletic, good kid, with arm talent but he's got work to do. He can get overwhelmed at times, needs to learn how to read defenses, carry an offense, and learn touch. He's a project for now, but don't know if I'd consider him till the 3rd unless I am comfortable with him on the bench for a little.
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Soul Glo


Joined: 22 Nov 2009
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Location: FL
PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaRealdeal wrote:
deuces22wild wrote:
Damn SG you are putting some seious overtime in lately Very Happy

Nice work, nice read.

If we stay at 13 we should have no problem getting a player that will help us right away.

A few guys I like at that spot are Richardson, Ansah, Rhodes, Vaccaro, Floyd and Milliner.

Just finished reading it. Awesome presentation, SG.

Greene over Ogletree is interesting. I kind of like it, especially after Ogletree's latest arrest (as if he didn't have enough character concerns already).


aprreciate the feedback guys.

yeah, honestly Ogletree potential is crazy... freak athlete. But who knows if he'll put it together, I don't think Greene has much of a chance at being a bust.
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Soul Glo


Joined: 22 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://walterfootball.com/draft2013meetingsteams.php

^ good thing to look at, two guys not on your list DRD are Vance McDonald (TE Rice) & Christine Michael (RB Texas A&M)

http://www.pewterreport.com/index.php?option=com_k2&view=item&id=8754:&Itemid=15

also forgot to post this: said we interview Michael Buchanon (DE Illinois) & CB Marc Anthony (California)

other things:
-seems like we think we could improve our DT position
-haven't interviewed Quinton Patton
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DaRealdeal


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Soul Glo wrote:
http://walterfootball.com/draft2013meetingsteams.php

^ good thing to look at, two guys not on your list DRD are Vance McDonald (TE Rice) & Christine Michael (RB Texas A&M)

http://www.pewterreport.com/index.php?option=com_k2&view=item&id=8754:&Itemid=15

also forgot to post this: said we interview Michael Buchanon (DE Illinois) & CB Marc Anthony (California)

other things:
-seems like we think we could improve our DT position
-haven't interviewed Quinton Patton

Thanks, bud. I have been meaning to update the interview tracker. Work has been crushing me recently. I'll have that all updated tonight.

Marc Anthony is a guy that I REALLY like for us. Over the next few weeks I'm going to be writing up previews for small name guys that look like ideal schematic fits. Anthony will be one of those guys.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1539523-a-full-scouting-guide-to-the-top-quarterbacks-in-the-2013-nfl-draft

EJ Manuel IMO, is the best prospect. Regardless of what I keep hearing and what i've seen from watching his games over the past couple years, the guy is accurate, poise, and decisive. Smart and confident. I think he's got the intangibles. While he's a very fluid athlete with some wheels, he's not a run first QB.

I'm not saying we definately will draft him, but if he's there, you have to consider the possibilities. Manuel has tremendous upside and the intangibles to be a starting QB in this league, I think a pretty good one.
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BBando


Joined: 18 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 5:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I will cry if we take E.J. Dude is so bad.
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REDandPEWTER


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 5:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BBando wrote:
I will cry if we take E.J. Dude is so bad.


Please explain why?
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REDandPEWTER


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Soul Glo wrote:
Dude's better than Free Laughing haha

You got like EJ for what he is, a potential QB... why are you using stats? It does not say much about a prospects. EJ is mentally way behind Free when he came out, his pocket abiltiy wasn't as good, does not have good downfield accuracy, more of a throwe than passer, tries to rocket everything, erratic.


He's huge, athletic, good kid, with arm talent but he's got work to do. He can get overwhelmed at times, needs to learn how to read defenses, carry an offense, and learn touch. He's a project for now, but don't know if I'd consider him till the 3rd unless I am comfortable with him on the bench for a little.


I'm not sure you can say EJ is mentally far behind Freeman when he was coming out.

Freeman always had accuracy issues, mechanics, footwork, were inconsistent. Couldn't really win big games either (same issue in the pros). But physically, he had tremendous upside with a rocket arm.

I honestly, think EJ is more polished of a prospect than Josh Freeman when looking at the two as prospects coming out. EJ is more accurate, keeps his eyes down field, and is more decisive and is able to go through reads and look off defenders.
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ravishingone


Joined: 07 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
Soul Glo wrote:
Dude's better than Free Laughing haha

You got like EJ for what he is, a potential QB... why are you using stats? It does not say much about a prospects. EJ is mentally way behind Free when he came out, his pocket abiltiy wasn't as good, does not have good downfield accuracy, more of a throwe than passer, tries to rocket everything, erratic.


He's huge, athletic, good kid, with arm talent but he's got work to do. He can get overwhelmed at times, needs to learn how to read defenses, carry an offense, and learn touch. He's a project for now, but don't know if I'd consider him till the 3rd unless I am comfortable with him on the bench for a little.


I'm not sure you can say EJ is mentally far behind Freeman when he was coming out.

Freeman always had accuracy issues, mechanics, footwork, were inconsistent. Couldn't really win big games either (same issue in the pros). But physically, he had tremendous upside with a rocket arm.

I honestly, think EJ is more polished of a prospect than Josh Freeman when looking at the two as prospects coming out. EJ is more accurate, keeps his eyes down field, and is more decisive and is able to go through reads and look off defenders.


I fully expect the Bucs to just get a better back-up in free agency then Orlovsky. As mentioned before, Dom's job is probably on the line if they don't make the playoffs or finish with ten wins. It certainly is possible the brain trust would feel strongly about a QB, but I would think they would have to trade Freeman at the draft. Over the last decade, pretty much when a QB was drafted in the first two rounds, the incumbent inevitably gets ousted. Dom better feel pretty confident that if he drafts a Qb so early in the draft, he better perform to a playoff level or the GM will probably be relocating next January.
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scottonatable


Joined: 24 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 6:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

if EJ was there in the 3rd round i would be glad to pick him up... i personally think he could out play freeman.. ya he had his bad games this season against Florida and the 2nd half on NC STATE but does anyone remember the Clemson game?!! FSU was down early and looked in trouble and EJ had a career game against him. Hes been with Jimbo Fisher for 5 years, now is he with a 1st round pick, no. could he start right away probably not. but i think he could be a star in the NFL
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tml_gogo


Joined: 02 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
BBando wrote:
I will cry if we take E.J. Dude is so bad.


Please explain why?


We've already explained why..everytime we provide the various reasons why, you just say you disagree. It's obviously fine that you disagree with us, but don't dismiss what we and every professional scout says.

Not accurate
Rockets passes unnecessarily
Hasn't won big games
...etc, it's all up there
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