Discuss football with over 60,000 fans. Free Membership. Join now!

 FAQFAQ  RegisterRegister   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

FootballsFuture.com Forum Index
FootballsFuture.com Home

They're worst than Limas....Lets nip it in da butt.
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> Pittsburgh Steelers
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
FourThreeMafia


Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 50400
Location: East of Sixburgh
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DudeWhat?? wrote:
Sanders is not high profile unless he is a fourth WR. He is a good third. Brown is a great second and a decent 1st WR. i say no 1 WR is a need..tops ours ILB or NT need. or Safety need..


Wrong again.

For one, we dont need a high profile WR. Is it nice? Sure, but not a need.

Sanders is a great 3rd and will be a good 2. Brown a capable of being a qualtiy number 1. Maybe not elite, but most teams dont have that anyway.

And WR tops our need at NT and safety? Very very happy you have no pull in the front office.
_________________

Madden 25 Steelers Franchise
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SteelersFan2333


Joined: 21 Dec 2009
Posts: 931
Location: Ft Lauderdale
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 6:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When did Matt Millen become a Steelers fan?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The Curtain


Joined: 24 Sep 2012
Posts: 568
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 8:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FourThreeMafia wrote:
DudeWhat?? wrote:
Sanders is not high profile unless he is a fourth WR. He is a good third. Brown is a great second and a decent 1st WR. i say no 1 WR is a need..tops ours ILB or NT need. or Safety need..


Wrong again.

For one, we dont need a high profile WR. Is it nice? Sure, but not a need.

Sanders is a great 3rd and will be a good 2. Brown a capable of being a qualtiy number 1. Maybe not elite, but most teams dont have that anyway.

And WR tops our need at NT and safety? Very very happy you have no pull in the front office.


Agreed. Brown is good, Sanders is good for a 2/3 guy. Wallace can be anywhere on the chart should be come back. And you still have Heath Miller, who's been outstanding in the new offense.

Would it be nice to have a Fitzy type number one? Sure. Don't need it, though. Especially when you have a QB that can get it done with just about any supporting cast.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Dcash4


Joined: 21 Apr 2008
Posts: 1189
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 8:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just a hypothetical with this receiver thing.

First off, we do not NEED a big time number 1 receiver with the guys we have now. If we lose Wallace (pretty sure thats happening), then I do believe that a capable guy - FA or draft - must be brought in, but we would still be fine either way.

Our defense has been playing great - but we all know that there are definitely some question marks on that side of the ball as far as our future is concerned. More youth in key positions is needed. But here is my what if.

If a big time WR talent is available in the first round - why not take him? We have needs, but if there is a player that can take your offense to the next level it has to be considered. Ben is a big time player and i think adding another big piece for him could push the offense to an "elite" status.

I know that it gets said every year that our defense is aging, and everyone is waiting for the downslide. But if the defense does start to go down, then I want the offense to take off in the opposite direction. In a passing league, i would have no problem with our first or second round pick being a big WR talent, or a pass receiving tight end over some of the more obvious needs.

(Edit: I should add in here as long as its a BPA, not just taking a WR to take a WR over other positions)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
steelcurtain29


Moderator
Joined: 04 Oct 2007
Posts: 35083
Location: Monongahela, PA
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DudeWhat?? wrote:
Sanders is not high profile unless he is a fourth WR. He is a good third. Brown is a great second and a decent 1st WR. i say no 1 WR is a need..tops ours ILB or NT need. or Safety need..


Dude, What?? Did you not see Sanders take over in the Browns game? Their secondary is no pushover, either. Sanders has been caught in the shadow of Brown / Wallace for a while now. He's definitely a good receiver and a long-term starting WR in the NFL; and a productive one at that.

How could you possible find WR as a top need? If Wallace walks, we still have Sanders, Brown and Cotchery.

If Troy decided to retire tomorrow, or Foote did, who is their replacements? In fact, I think Foote needs a replacement now; someone who can split time in certain packages. Meanwhile, we're stuck with Ryan Mundy starting with Polamalu injured; and you think WR is a better issue than Safety??

Again.... Dude, what?? Think
_________________
3DS Friend Code
4038-6129-7897
Pokemon X
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JustPlainNasty


Joined: 11 Feb 2008
Posts: 7099
Location: Las Vegas
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dcash4 wrote:
Just a hypothetical with this receiver thing.

First off, we do not NEED a big time number 1 receiver with the guys we have now. If we lose Wallace (pretty sure thats happening), then I do believe that a capable guy - FA or draft - must be brought in, but we would still be fine either way.

Our defense has been playing great - but we all know that there are definitely some question marks on that side of the ball as far as our future is concerned. More youth in key positions is needed. But here is my what if.

If a big time WR talent is available in the first round - why not take him? We have needs, but if there is a player that can take your offense to the next level it has to be considered. Ben is a big time player and i think adding another big piece for him could push the offense to an "elite" status.

I know that it gets said every year that our defense is aging, and everyone is waiting for the downslide. But if the defense does start to go down, then I want the offense to take off in the opposite direction. In a passing league, i would have no problem with our first or second round pick being a big WR talent, or a pass receiving tight end over some of the more obvious needs.

(Edit: I should add in here as long as its a BPA, not just taking a WR to take a WR over other positions)


I agree with the premise, while theoretically selecting the position of WR is against our best interests in the 1st round, getting a player of Keenan Allen's, DeAndre Hopkins, Terrance Williams ability will not hurt us, although it would be a slight luxury.

Sometimes the term PMMD (Player Makes the Most Difference)is even more appropriate vs BPA. If that wasn't the case there are a couple guards and a tight end in this draft who may be the Best Players in it.
_________________
Dcash4 wrote:


...you have a forum resume?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JustPlainNasty


Joined: 11 Feb 2008
Posts: 7099
Location: Las Vegas
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh yeh and it's

Nip it in the bud....

Like a flower before it blooms.
_________________
Dcash4 wrote:


...you have a forum resume?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The Curtain


Joined: 24 Sep 2012
Posts: 568
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dcash4 wrote:
Just a hypothetical with this receiver thing.

First off, we do not NEED a big time number 1 receiver with the guys we have now. If we lose Wallace (pretty sure thats happening), then I do believe that a capable guy - FA or draft - must be brought in, but we would still be fine either way.

Our defense has been playing great - but we all know that there are definitely some question marks on that side of the ball as far as our future is concerned. More youth in key positions is needed. But here is my what if.

If a big time WR talent is available in the first round - why not take him? We have needs, but if there is a player that can take your offense to the next level it has to be considered. Ben is a big time player and i think adding another big piece for him could push the offense to an "elite" status.

I know that it gets said every year that our defense is aging, and everyone is waiting for the downslide. But if the defense does start to go down, then I want the offense to take off in the opposite direction. In a passing league, i would have no problem with our first or second round pick being a big WR talent, or a pass receiving tight end over some of the more obvious needs.

(Edit: I should add in here as long as its a BPA, not just taking a WR to take a WR over other positions)


We sort of tried this idea a few years ago, when the line was a complete mess, we drafted Mendenhall in the first and then Sweed in the second, seemed like the idea was to give Ben new weapons to compensate for the line. Only problem is that Mendenhall breaks his leg. Then Limas Sweed ends up being Limas Sweed. So our line still sucks

The only way I'd say we should get a true playmaker WR is if one is available through trade. Like the complete fantasy situation where Larry Fitzgerald wants out of Arizona and coming back to Pittsburgh would be his ideal destination. I'd give up our first rounder for that in a heartbeat, who else you going to draft that is better than him?

We draft a WR in the first round, that's a major gamble on a position we're not hurting at. I'd rather that gamble be at a position we need. People can talk that "it's a passing league" talk all they want, defense still wins championships and our philosophy is defense-first. The results speak for themselves.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
treat88


Joined: 03 Mar 2006
Posts: 6428
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think a WR makes the most sense for this team, but it all depends on draft order and who is available.

I wouldn't gripe with Hunter at 32....or even late 1st.

The most impactful WR in this class, IMO, is Tavon Austin tho. He's not the big RZ target we all want and would give us a smurf like corp, but I wouldn't be unhappy to pick him up at 64ish ala Randall Cobb.
_________________



"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself."
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
FourThreeMafia


Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 50400
Location: East of Sixburgh
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

treat88 wrote:
I don't think a WR makes the most sense for this team, but it all depends on draft order and who is available.

I wouldn't gripe with Hunter at 32....or even late 1st.

The most impactful WR in this class, IMO, is Tavon Austin tho. He's not the big RZ target we all want and would give us a smurf like corp, but I wouldn't be unhappy to pick him up at 64ish ala Randall Cobb.


I think this team is at a point where it cant really afford to go pure BPA. I think if we got to a place where WR was the pure BPA and we didnt like the value at other positions, that we would need to trade down. In years past, this team could afford to do something like that. At this point, IMO, there would be absolutely no way to justify taking a WR that early, unless the value was just insane. Hunter is as overrated as they get and IMO, a bust waiting to happen, but even beyond that, I just dont see any WR who would be too tempting not to take in the first.

Defense IMO needs to be the pick. I see SEVEN current defensive starters on our roster retiring or leaving in the next 2 to 4 years (Hampton, Keisel, Harrison, Foote, Clark, Ike and Troy). The retooling needs to begin immediately.
_________________

Madden 25 Steelers Franchise
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
treat88


Joined: 03 Mar 2006
Posts: 6428
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FourThreeMafia wrote:
treat88 wrote:
I don't think a WR makes the most sense for this team, but it all depends on draft order and who is available.

I wouldn't gripe with Hunter at 32....or even late 1st.

The most impactful WR in this class, IMO, is Tavon Austin tho. He's not the big RZ target we all want and would give us a smurf like corp, but I wouldn't be unhappy to pick him up at 64ish ala Randall Cobb.


I think this team is at a point where it cant really afford to go pure BPA. I think if we got to a place where WR was the pure BPA and we didnt like the value at other positions, that we would need to trade down. In years past, this team could afford to do something like that. At this point, IMO, there would be absolutely no way to justify taking a WR that early, unless the value was just insane. Hunter is as overrated as they get and IMO, a bust waiting to happen, but even beyond that, I just dont see any WR who would be too tempting not to take in the first.

Defense IMO needs to be the pick. I see SEVEN current defensive starters on our roster retiring or leaving in the next 2 to 4 years (Hampton, Keisel, Harrison, Foote, Clark, Ike and Troy). The retooling needs to begin immediately.


Not arguing the fact that the defense needs a youth infusion.

In fact, I basically agree on all your points, although I like Hunter a little more than you do.

However, if someone out there loves a WR/TE/RB and we do end up drafting near or at the bottom of the round, I'm not going to take'em to task for going a different route than I would, at least not yet.

There's just too much we don't know, most specifically draft order and which underclassmen declare, to start debating who should go where and which way we should go IMO. I get not liking Hunter specifically, I just can't rule out the entire WR position without knowing more than I do now.
_________________



"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself."
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Dcash4


Joined: 21 Apr 2008
Posts: 1189
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 12:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FourThreeMafia wrote:
Defense IMO needs to be the pick. I see SEVEN current defensive starters on our roster retiring or leaving in the next 2 to 4 years (Hampton, Keisel, Harrison, Foote, Clark, Ike and Troy). The retooling needs to begin immediately.


I completely agree that the defense definitely needs to restock and soon.

I just also think that you are naming a lot of guys on the defensive side of the ball that will be gone here shortly. Our offense is stocked now and I feel ready to take off, but still think its missing a few pieces.

Main thought is that a defensive down slide MAY be coming (not a prediction, just as you said, there will be a lot of turnover soon). Why not try to make your offense a definite force.

We need youth on defense but that's more than just a first round necessity. If it comes down to getting a game changer/impact player on the defensive side then that's exactly what we need. But i feel if it came down to a guy who would just be another piece to the defensive puzzle over an offensive guy who could take us to the next level, I would have to think hard about it.

In no way saying i want a WR or bust 1st round, and I am not a prospect guy like some of you guys, and usually dont care about college kids until closer to the draft so I have zero knowledge of receivers that may be coming out. Just something to think about.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
FourThreeMafia


Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 50400
Location: East of Sixburgh
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dcash4 wrote:
FourThreeMafia wrote:
Defense IMO needs to be the pick. I see SEVEN current defensive starters on our roster retiring or leaving in the next 2 to 4 years (Hampton, Keisel, Harrison, Foote, Clark, Ike and Troy). The retooling needs to begin immediately.


I completely agree that the defense definitely needs to restock and soon.

I just also think that you are naming a lot of guys on the defensive side of the ball that will be gone here shortly. Our offense is stocked now and I feel ready to take off, but still think its missing a few pieces.

Main thought is that a defensive down slide MAY be coming (not a prediction, just as you said, there will be a lot of turnover soon). Why not try to make your offense a definite force.

We need youth on defense but that's more than just a first round necessity. If it comes down to getting a game changer/impact player on the defensive side then that's exactly what we need. But i feel if it came down to a guy who would just be another piece to the defensive puzzle over an offensive guy who could take us to the next level, I would have to think hard about it.

In no way saying i want a WR or bust 1st round, and I am not a prospect guy like some of you guys, and usually dont care about college kids until closer to the draft so I have zero knowledge of receivers that may be coming out. Just something to think about.


I named those players leaving soon to supplement my main point. Even as a stand alone point, I think it carries alot of merit as well, because 7 defensive starters is more than half our defense.

Now, I do think Cortez Allen and Keenan Lewis are the future (pending we can retain Lewis), and Cam Heyward has a bright future, but IMO, OLB, NT and safety are huge areas of concern going forward.

As far as making offense are primary force, I dont have a problem with that, but I do want the defense to become an afterthought either. Right now, IMO, we have plenty of talent on offense. Its always nice to add more, but I think when you look at our defense, it looks really grim going forward because we have aging starters and limited depth at certain positions.

I am usually all for BPA....even if its over a bigger need. But regardless of what our biggest need is, I honestly cant see us taking an offensive player with the facts I stated. If the value is crazy, okay....but IMO, with Huinter, I dont think that is the case. I think we can get a player like him in the mid rounds.
_________________

Madden 25 Steelers Franchise
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The Curtain


Joined: 24 Sep 2012
Posts: 568
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, and it isn't like we have young studs lying in wait. Our young blood in the front seven was/is Hood and Heyward. While the play of Allen/Lewis is promising for our CB's of the future, our front seven of the future looks far less than terrifying. We don't have one dominant player at any position there right NOW, let alone two years from now.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mason Storm


Joined: 06 Aug 2009
Posts: 476
Location: Hmm fire Tomlin of course y didnt i think of that oh yea because thats stupid.
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FourThreeMafia wrote:
No.


Thank you, did you witness the wretched play of our SS all year? Or perhaps that we basically have a bag of cookies at LDE, and our LB cannot consistently pressure the QB. WR in the first round worst first round pick in a long time. Also dont forget we have no clear cut #1 running back.
_________________

^ TommyC376 sig n avy^
"You know your a parent when you pay $120 for your kid to watch something live thats on tv for free"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   

Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> Pittsburgh Steelers All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Page 2 of 3

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum




Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group