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BSH almost done with the year Bucs Mock Draft
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bucstopshere


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 2:02 am    Post subject: BSH almost done with the year Bucs Mock Draft Reply with quote

This is strictly draft only. With too many unknowns with our cap situation I don't know exactly how much we'll have. I figure we will go after a CB or DE in the FA. Grimes makes a ton of sense. If they wanted to go pass rush, then Michael Johnson (who Mark Dominik talked about picking in the first round of 2010) makes a ton of sense. Either way here is what I got for our draft with no idea on free agency. Either way enjoy, comment, discuss all that good stuffffffff


sorry if the pics aren't the greatest, can't tell sizing on the work computer LOL

1st Round


Johnthan Banks || CB || Mississippi State
It's no secret, we desperately need CB help. Like most years we are going to be telegraphing our pick a bit, but with Schiano hopefully he can keep it better hidden than it was under Raheem. If he can, we might be able to trade down and get some extra picks. Not sure which guy they will like the most, but I have to go with Banks here. He will likely be the guy that will be around when we still pick and is a good one. With the elite size and speed combo he'll be helpful going against the likes of Julio and Colston. He's a willing and able tackler as well. He's the first step in rebuilding a pass defense that has been down right terrible this year.


2nd Round


Logan Ryan || CB || Rutgers
I fought long and hard with this pick. I wanted to put a DE here, but not sure there is a guy that will be left that can make an immediate impact that we need. I know a lot of us would dream that a guy like Dion Jordan would fall here, but I can't see it. We are really low on corners, and if we were to just sign a guy like Michael Johnson this would be the best way to go. I know like you guys I would prefer a veteran added to this group, but the team has shown they aren't scared to go young. Trading away Talib when we knew there was a possible suspension for Wright looming showed us all that. I think by simply adding the talent and tandem of Banks and Ryan we will improve, and it will be a trial by fire. We have been known to double up on positions of need before and think we do it again this year. Ryan is a Schiano guy that he recruited and a heck of a player. Like I said, I think getting some actual talent and EJ Biggers and Leonard Johnson down the depth chart will help this entire secondary come together.



3rd Round


Phillip Thomas || S || Fresno State
Yup, you guessed it again another DB. When your the worst passing defense in the league you have to add difference makers in the secondary. We all would like to think that Ronde can play forever, and even if he does come back we need to think of a replacement. We have shown that we like to use a lot of three safety sets getting Black on the field. While I think he could be a solid starter I don't just want to give him the job with no competition. We did draft Tandy last year but I'm begging to think that he wont stick around. Neither he nor Goode have seen the field despite injuries in front of them in the depth chart. This might be a stretch for Thomas to last this long, but he only has one solid year of production and a bit of an injury history. I think adding some better players in coverage will buy that extra time that we need for our dline to get home. With high picks invested in Bowers and Clayborn I don't think they are ready to give up on them just quite yet.

4th Round (TRADE UP using this years 5th & 7th and next years 6th )


Brandon Jenkins || DE || Florida State
Last year we flipped a couple 4th rounders into Martin and David. This year we trade up from the 5th to get three 4th rounders that all could be impact players for the Bucs. The Bucs move up to get Jenkins who falls for numerous reasons. First is his size, second is the injury, third is the history of these smallish DE's out of FSU, the production that both Werner and Caradine had this year and finally is that he never got to prove his deficiencies that he had and the reason he came back. So scouts only have one real year of tape on him and I think it helps him slip a bit. The Bucs need help badly with rushing the passer and Jenkins could be the situational type guy they need. Adding him gives the Bucs a good rotation at the end spot and something it's missing as a pure speed rusher.



4th Round


Jordan Reed || TE || Florida
After focusing on the defense, specially the secondary with the first 3 rounds, it's time we add to the most explosive offense that Tampa has ever seen. Reed makes perfect sense here. People may say this is too far for him to fall but Hernandez fell to around this same spot with more production out of Florida. They are very similar players and with the unknown of Clark coming back Reed can work in as a passing TE only. With Byham being a force in the run game it allows Reed to focus on learning the routes and timing with Freeman. His speed will really force in the middle for Freeman. Reed could be the piece that makes this offense take it to the next level.



4th Round (From New England)


Marquess Wilson || WR || Washington State
Back to back picks on the receiving corps for us here. Wilson is an all world talent but left the Cougars in the middle of the season. While it's probably nothing major there still are some concerns. Last time we took a reciever in the 4th round that quit his team we struck gold. We might have to trade up a little for him but I would be ok with that. At 6'3 he has great size but is going to need to pack on some weight to be able to handle the NFL. Learning behind Jackson could be the best thing for him and give us someone to fill in for him as he gets older. Wilson isnt exactly a return specialist but has deceptive speed and someone that could get involved in the rotation.


6th Round


D.J. Harper || RB || Boise State
We finish off the draft with another offensive pick. The last RB we got out of Boise wasn't too shabby so we go after the guy that was slated to start in front of Martin before a knee injury all but derailed his career. When he injured his knee after Ian Johnson left for the NFL, Martin took advantage and put together two great seasons for the Broncos. Harper as a sixth year senior has shown some of the promise that he had coming into Boise as a top recruit out of Texas. He is well coached, has good size and speed and decent at catching the football. It's obvious that Blount's days are numbered in Tampa, so Harper is the guy to spell Martin when he needs it.



discuss!
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theindianstud12


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Logan Ryan is right on Milliner's tail right now
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bucstopshere


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

theindianstud12 wrote:
Logan Ryan is right on Milliner's tail right now


He is playing great ball and might have to be the first round pick if we want him. The point is two straight CBs. The draft is corner deep and they could be getting two first round talent guys 1 & 2
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REDandPEWTER


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 9:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Love the Ryan and Thomas pick but the banks pick isn't good. He's too soft and really don't know if 3 DBS will help our pass rush issues or lack there of. Don't like Jenkins either. I think he's similar player to Everett Brown. Wilson won't be a buccaneer. He quit on his team and was different than mike Williams situation.

Like the Jordan reed pick in the 4th round as he's not being over drafted but idk if he'd declare early being that low of a pick unless he has his degree.
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BBando


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 11:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote


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ravishingone


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
Love the Ryan and Thomas pick but the banks pick isn't good. He's too soft and really don't know if 3 DBS will help our pass rush issues or lack there of. Don't like Jenkins either. I think he's similar player to Everett Brown. Wilson won't be a buccaneer. He quit on his team and was different than mike Williams situation.

Like the Jordan reed pick in the 4th round as he's not being over drafted but idk if he'd declare early being that low of a pick unless he has his degree.


Totally agree on Wilson because of his issues in college. I really don't see them doubling down on CBs that early in the draft. With Wright for all intents and purposes being cut without cap penalty, you have to figure the organization is going to sign one premium CB in free agency. I wouldn't be shocked if they add some mid-level free agent at CB also.

I don't have statistical data to prove this, but I think it is easier to find good CB talent in later rounds, then pass rushers. My reasoning with a lot of spread being used in college, most CBs just play zone and not a lot of man. I think a pass rusher is easier to evaluate in college.

Of course, I'm sure my theory could easily be proven wrong. Very Happy I know this is not going to make other fans happy, but I see Biggers getting resigned (he won't cost that much) and being at the very least the 4th CB next year.
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eggybucsfan31


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ravishingone wrote:
Of course, I'm sure my theory could easily be proven wrong. Very Happy I know this is not going to make other fans happy, but I see Biggers getting resigned (he won't cost that much) and being at the very least the 4th CB next year.



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bucstopshere


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
Love the Ryan and Thomas pick but the banks pick isn't good. He's too soft and really don't know if 3 DBS will help our pass rush issues or lack there of. Don't like Jenkins either. I think he's similar player to Everett Brown. Wilson won't be a buccaneer. He quit on his team and was different than mike Williams situation.

Like the Jordan reed pick in the 4th round as he's not being over drafted but idk if he'd declare early being that low of a pick unless he has his degree.


Ok so how is a pass rusher going to magically appear for us to take, we are picking at 19 and easily see 5 pass rushers before us. I'm not trying to fix our pass rush with this draft. I'm trying to fix our coverage. Corners have a lot better success translating to the pros than DEs do

And LOL at you thinking you know Wilson's situation at WSU. Leach was FIRED from Texas Tech for locking a player in a closet. So you think Williams who was suspended for the team for being late on curfew is better? LOLOL

Sorry that's just wrong. I'm sure Dominik will look into it

I agree that Jenkins is a lot like Brown. The problem with Brown was they wanted him to be an everydown player. It ruined him
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manilathrilla1


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting draft, like you said though things may change after FA, not only in regards to Cap situation but the teams direction in the draft.

I do see us picking up a Vet @ the CB and drafting at least one like you have. And Dominik has proven he'll take the best player on his board as he has doubled down twice in the 1st 2 rounds previously.

I have always felt that O-Line has more to do with continuity than overall talent, so lets just keep our O-Lineman the same for a while.

The connection between pass rush and coverage is undeniable, and we can hope for Clayborn and Bowers to progress while drafting secondary.
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bucstopshere


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

manilathrilla1 wrote:
Interesting draft, like you said though things may change after FA, not only in regards to Cap situation but the teams direction in the draft.

I do see us picking up a Vet @ the CB and drafting at least one like you have. And Dominik has proven he'll take the best player on his board as he has doubled down twice in the 1st 2 rounds previously.

I have always felt that O-Line has more to do with continuity than overall talent, so lets just keep our O-Lineman the same for a while.

The connection between pass rush and coverage is undeniable, and we can hope for Clayborn and Bowers to progress while drafting secondary.


Wow me and Manila on the same page?! Never would have thought that 3 years ago! Lol...good to see you back on the board.

Agreed on the oline. Actually when Joesph and Nicks return I love our depth with Larsen and Meredith. We do need a swing tackle but think we can sign a cheap one in FA.

Clayborn and Bowers should be better next year. It usually takes dlinemen 3 years to get it. ACs injury happened early so he should be close to full strength and Bowers should get better throughout the year
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DaRealdeal


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can dig it.

Wilson and Jenkins are the only picks that I would disagree with. Wilson because of this incident with Leach (from what I am reading, Wilson lied and has now recanted) and I never really saw it with Jenkins. He's soft.
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bucstopshere


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaRealdeal wrote:
I can dig it.

Wilson and Jenkins are the only picks that I would disagree with. Wilson because of this incident with Leach (from what I am reading, Wilson lied and has now recanted) and I never really saw it with Jenkins. He's soft.


Think I'm going to edit it a bit and post it as a slideshow....I got two other guys in mind. And the more film I watch on Banks the more I agree he's not physical enough
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REDandPEWTER


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bucstopshere wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
Love the Ryan and Thomas pick but the banks pick isn't good. He's too soft and really don't know if 3 DBS will help our pass rush issues or lack there of. Don't like Jenkins either. I think he's similar player to Everett Brown. Wilson won't be a buccaneer. He quit on his team and was different than mike Williams situation.

Like the Jordan reed pick in the 4th round as he's not being over drafted but idk if he'd declare early being that low of a pick unless he has his degree.


Ok so how is a pass rusher going to magically appear for us to take, we are picking at 19 and easily see 5 pass rushers before us. I'm not trying to fix our pass rush with this draft. I'm trying to fix our coverage. Corners have a lot better success translating to the pros than DEs do




This draft is lloaded with pass rushers. Dion Jordan, Mingo, Montgomery, Moore, Okefore, Ansuh, Werner, Jones.

I can gurantee you that we will be in position to draft a pass rusher, plus, ammo to go up and get one. I mean, if it took Jacksonville only a 4th round pick to move up into the 5th spot with us, even though it was 2 picks they jumped, is a highly valued pick.

Also, I disagree with you. You can fix you're coverage all you want. Get pro-bowl CBs to be starters. But if you don't have a pass rush that can disrupt the QB, good QBs, and there are a lot of them in the NFC, will tear up a good secondary. As Joe Theissman and many other analysts I've heard say, you're secondary is only as good as your front. If they can't get to the QB, QB will find time to get an open WR.

Quote:

And LOL at you thinking you know Wilson's situation at WSU. Leach was FIRED from Texas Tech for locking a player in a closet. So you think Williams who was suspended for the team for being late on curfew is better? LOLOL

Sorry that's just wrong. I'm sure Dominik will look into it


Man, This guy walks out on his team, after a confrontation with Leach. That is not a guy Greg Schiano will want on his team.

Also, DRD said the exact same thing I did regarding Wilson and I don't see you ripping back at him. Not sure what you're point is.
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bucstopshere


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Of all those guys you listed Clayborn and Bowers had more college production. I know you are drafting based off potential, but the point is, we don't know what we are getting with those guys. Id rather sign Michael Johnson and draft corners.

I don't know what to think of the whole Wilson situation, Leach is a proven liar, Wilson is back tracking his story. I do agree with you though, he wouldn't be able to handle Schaino if he is crying about his feelings. Going to change that pick
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ravishingone


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was curious about the players drafted at 19 and till the end of the first round the last five drafts between pass rushers and CB. I will define pass rusher in general, not just those chosen to play in 4-3 defenses.

2012

Pass Rushers
-Shea McClellin
-Chandler Jones
-Whitney Mercelius

CB
-None in the first round, only Harrison Smith a safety by the Vikings.

[/b]2011

Pass Rushers
-Adrian Clayborn
-Cameron Jordan
-Cameron Hayward (more of a 3-4 5 technique)

CB
-Prince Amukamara
-Jimmy Smith

2010

Pass Rushers
-Jared Odrick
-Jerry Hughes

CB
-Kareem Jackson
-Devin McCourty
-Kyle Wilson
-Patrick Robinson

2009

Pass Rushers
-Robert Ayers
-Clay Matthews

CB
-Vontae Davis

2008

Pass Rusher
-Lawrence Jackson
-Kentwan Balmer

CB
-Aqib Talib
-Mike Jenkins
-Antoine Cason

What does it all mean? I believe you can find value at either position later in the first round. Simply saying no good CBs or pass rushers available at 19 or later, just isn't true.

I hope they address CB in free agency, my preference is Brent Grimes (if deemed healthy and an older saavy less expensive CB. I'm just not sure you can ever pencil Bowers to be able to play 16 games a year, which is ashame because I think he is the best pure pass rusher out of anyone on the roster (including Clayborn).





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