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Geno Smith is worth drafting number one
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nicfre2011 wrote:
bigschmadt00 wrote:
When you factor in the relatively small contract for a #1 overall guy under the new CBA, it makes "taking a shot" on someone much more palatable. I for one am all for it, so long as we don't waste too much time. I'm guessing Geno gets 2 full seasons to show good progress towards being a very good QB (not even elite), and demonstrates on a regular basis he's capable of beating a defense. If not, then we go back to the well, and a well that is shaping up to be very strong in the 2015 draft.

Anyone know how many true and/or redshirt freshman are starting and playing well this year? Of course there's muh boi Manziel, but he's just the tip of the ice berg. You've got a few out west that look promising in UCLA's Brett Hundley, USC's Max Wittek, Oregon's Marcus Mariota, and Stanford's Kevin Hogan. At Notre Dame you've got Everett Golson, and Ohio State's got Braxton Miller. And this isn't even talking about guys who are behind more senior QB's like Philip Rivers little brother at LSU, OU's Kendal Thompson, and lots of others with some real upside, but nothing proven yet.

This is a bad year for QB's, not doubt, at least in comparison to 2012 and 2004. However, we should not prevent us from taking the best of the bunch, which all signs are pointing to us being in position to do. If it works out, great, we've most likely put ourselves into SB contention for the next decade. If not, we've wasted a 1st round pick and roughly $25MM (what Cassel cost over 2 years), but at least we tried, and now we're in position for what looks like one of the best QB classes ever.

Yes I know a lot can change in 2-3 years, and not all of these guys will be good, or come out in the same class, but even spread over 2-3 drafts, there could still be 4 legit franchise QB's each year.

Lets take a shot now, because no other player could possibly improve our team more then a good QB. If we're going to capitalize on JC, DJ, Tamba, Flowers, Bowe, and several other's prime, we need a QB this year. Don't let the failures of past GM's preclude us from taking a need at the top. We can always try again in a few years if it doesn't work, ex. Jacksonville.


Some names I would add that I didn't see in your list (in no particular order) :

Derek Carr, Fresno State (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Teddy Bridgewater, Louisville (will be a junior)
Jeff Driskel, Florida (will be a junior)
Aaron Murray, Georgia (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Zach Mettenberger, LSU (will be a senior)
Tyler Bray, Tennessee (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Logan Thomas, Virginia Tech (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
A.J. McCarron, Alabama (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Tajh Boyd, Clemson (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)

I haven't mentioned Carr up to this point because I think there is a very good chance he returns to Fresno State for his senior year. IF he does declare, he is definitely a decent prospect to keep an eye on. Mettenberger has the prototypical physical skill set you look for but he will need a strong senior year to show some consistency. Obviously the same applies for Logan Thomas, who I really think needs to return to Virgina Tech. I had high hopes for him but I just don't know if he has the mental makeup to be a franchise quarterback at the next level.


I don't like any of those guys. I don't know anything about Carr, so I guess he could be okay, but I want nothing to do with any of the other guys, this year or next. I suppose Bridgewater could be okay, don't know much about him either, but all the other guys...ick
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nicfre2011


Joined: 15 Mar 2011
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rearviewmirror wrote:
nicfre2011 wrote:
bigschmadt00 wrote:
When you factor in the relatively small contract for a #1 overall guy under the new CBA, it makes "taking a shot" on someone much more palatable. I for one am all for it, so long as we don't waste too much time. I'm guessing Geno gets 2 full seasons to show good progress towards being a very good QB (not even elite), and demonstrates on a regular basis he's capable of beating a defense. If not, then we go back to the well, and a well that is shaping up to be very strong in the 2015 draft.

Anyone know how many true and/or redshirt freshman are starting and playing well this year? Of course there's muh boi Manziel, but he's just the tip of the ice berg. You've got a few out west that look promising in UCLA's Brett Hundley, USC's Max Wittek, Oregon's Marcus Mariota, and Stanford's Kevin Hogan. At Notre Dame you've got Everett Golson, and Ohio State's got Braxton Miller. And this isn't even talking about guys who are behind more senior QB's like Philip Rivers little brother at LSU, OU's Kendal Thompson, and lots of others with some real upside, but nothing proven yet.

This is a bad year for QB's, not doubt, at least in comparison to 2012 and 2004. However, we should not prevent us from taking the best of the bunch, which all signs are pointing to us being in position to do. If it works out, great, we've most likely put ourselves into SB contention for the next decade. If not, we've wasted a 1st round pick and roughly $25MM (what Cassel cost over 2 years), but at least we tried, and now we're in position for what looks like one of the best QB classes ever.

Yes I know a lot can change in 2-3 years, and not all of these guys will be good, or come out in the same class, but even spread over 2-3 drafts, there could still be 4 legit franchise QB's each year.

Lets take a shot now, because no other player could possibly improve our team more then a good QB. If we're going to capitalize on JC, DJ, Tamba, Flowers, Bowe, and several other's prime, we need a QB this year. Don't let the failures of past GM's preclude us from taking a need at the top. We can always try again in a few years if it doesn't work, ex. Jacksonville.


Some names I would add that I didn't see in your list (in no particular order) :

Derek Carr, Fresno State (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Teddy Bridgewater, Louisville (will be a junior)
Jeff Driskel, Florida (will be a junior)
Aaron Murray, Georgia (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Zach Mettenberger, LSU (will be a senior)
Tyler Bray, Tennessee (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Logan Thomas, Virginia Tech (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
A.J. McCarron, Alabama (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Tajh Boyd, Clemson (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)

I haven't mentioned Carr up to this point because I think there is a very good chance he returns to Fresno State for his senior year. IF he does declare, he is definitely a decent prospect to keep an eye on. Mettenberger has the prototypical physical skill set you look for but he will need a strong senior year to show some consistency. Obviously the same applies for Logan Thomas, who I really think needs to return to Virgina Tech. I had high hopes for him but I just don't know if he has the mental makeup to be a franchise quarterback at the next level.


I don't like any of those guys. I don't know anything


You could have saved yourself some typing and just posted those two statements.

Rolling Eyes
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Arrowhead86


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I honestly cannot believe some of the posts in this thread.

If anyone wonders how an organization can find itself staring directly at 30 years of time span between their last 1st round QB and (I guess I should add potentially here) their next 1st round QB - they need simply read this thread. Posts in this thread of people talking themselves out of drafting a QB before anything else with things like "weak class", "value" , "separation and drop off".

Sigh.

Then follow that up with basically begging for some ridiculous luck to go our way. People in this draft want the OTHER THIRTY ONE TEAMS to all be wrong about the best QB available in the 1st round so we can steal him in the 2nd round! Seriously?!! No.. really.. SERIOUSLY?!

They want EVERYONE ELSE TO MISS so we can get the stud QB of the draft at #33 OVERALL!

But hey, Tom Brady was a 6th round pick so that proves it's possible right?! Aaron Rodgers was missed on by like 21 teams before GB took him.. so proof it happens right?! Well, yes. It does happen. You just don't plan for it that way. You HOPE that you figure out which guy is the stud and get him immediately. You do not risk him going anywhere else.

Anyone think Rodgers doesn't go #1 overall in a redraft today? How about Brady?!

One of these QB's is going to be the best of the bunch in this class and he's going to have SB potential. We get first crack at picking him. TAKE HIM! Whoever it is - TAKE HIM.

Oh no.. we'd rather hope 31 other teams miss so we can get him - or the next best guy even at 33. Awesome.

I want the best damn QB available. And in 3 years (or less if so obvious) he isn't the guy.. I want to TRY AGAIN!

I'm done with trying to get LUCKY. I'm done watching all the other teams take all the risk in some foolish hope that we will sweep in behind them and get all the reward.

And most importantly - I'm done with that MINDSET from our OWNER, GM, COACHING STAFF, and FANBASE!

Sincerely,

A86
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Rearviewmirror


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nicfre2011 wrote:
Rearviewmirror wrote:
nicfre2011 wrote:
bigschmadt00 wrote:
When you factor in the relatively small contract for a #1 overall guy under the new CBA, it makes "taking a shot" on someone much more palatable. I for one am all for it, so long as we don't waste too much time. I'm guessing Geno gets 2 full seasons to show good progress towards being a very good QB (not even elite), and demonstrates on a regular basis he's capable of beating a defense. If not, then we go back to the well, and a well that is shaping up to be very strong in the 2015 draft.

Anyone know how many true and/or redshirt freshman are starting and playing well this year? Of course there's muh boi Manziel, but he's just the tip of the ice berg. You've got a few out west that look promising in UCLA's Brett Hundley, USC's Max Wittek, Oregon's Marcus Mariota, and Stanford's Kevin Hogan. At Notre Dame you've got Everett Golson, and Ohio State's got Braxton Miller. And this isn't even talking about guys who are behind more senior QB's like Philip Rivers little brother at LSU, OU's Kendal Thompson, and lots of others with some real upside, but nothing proven yet.

This is a bad year for QB's, not doubt, at least in comparison to 2012 and 2004. However, we should not prevent us from taking the best of the bunch, which all signs are pointing to us being in position to do. If it works out, great, we've most likely put ourselves into SB contention for the next decade. If not, we've wasted a 1st round pick and roughly $25MM (what Cassel cost over 2 years), but at least we tried, and now we're in position for what looks like one of the best QB classes ever.

Yes I know a lot can change in 2-3 years, and not all of these guys will be good, or come out in the same class, but even spread over 2-3 drafts, there could still be 4 legit franchise QB's each year.

Lets take a shot now, because no other player could possibly improve our team more then a good QB. If we're going to capitalize on JC, DJ, Tamba, Flowers, Bowe, and several other's prime, we need a QB this year. Don't let the failures of past GM's preclude us from taking a need at the top. We can always try again in a few years if it doesn't work, ex. Jacksonville.


Some names I would add that I didn't see in your list (in no particular order) :

Derek Carr, Fresno State (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Teddy Bridgewater, Louisville (will be a junior)
Jeff Driskel, Florida (will be a junior)
Aaron Murray, Georgia (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Zach Mettenberger, LSU (will be a senior)
Tyler Bray, Tennessee (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Logan Thomas, Virginia Tech (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
A.J. McCarron, Alabama (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Tajh Boyd, Clemson (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)

I haven't mentioned Carr up to this point because I think there is a very good chance he returns to Fresno State for his senior year. IF he does declare, he is definitely a decent prospect to keep an eye on. Mettenberger has the prototypical physical skill set you look for but he will need a strong senior year to show some consistency. Obviously the same applies for Logan Thomas, who I really think needs to return to Virgina Tech. I had high hopes for him but I just don't know if he has the mental makeup to be a franchise quarterback at the next level.


I don't like any of those guys. I don't know anything


You could have saved yourself some typing and just posted those two statements.

Rolling Eyes


you're right, and since I don't know much about 2 of the guys you have there and don't like any of the others even a little, I might as well stop posting. Rolling Eyes
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nicfre2011


Joined: 15 Mar 2011
Posts: 6554
Location: SC
PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rearviewmirror wrote:
nicfre2011 wrote:
Rearviewmirror wrote:
nicfre2011 wrote:
bigschmadt00 wrote:
When you factor in the relatively small contract for a #1 overall guy under the new CBA, it makes "taking a shot" on someone much more palatable. I for one am all for it, so long as we don't waste too much time. I'm guessing Geno gets 2 full seasons to show good progress towards being a very good QB (not even elite), and demonstrates on a regular basis he's capable of beating a defense. If not, then we go back to the well, and a well that is shaping up to be very strong in the 2015 draft.

Anyone know how many true and/or redshirt freshman are starting and playing well this year? Of course there's muh boi Manziel, but he's just the tip of the ice berg. You've got a few out west that look promising in UCLA's Brett Hundley, USC's Max Wittek, Oregon's Marcus Mariota, and Stanford's Kevin Hogan. At Notre Dame you've got Everett Golson, and Ohio State's got Braxton Miller. And this isn't even talking about guys who are behind more senior QB's like Philip Rivers little brother at LSU, OU's Kendal Thompson, and lots of others with some real upside, but nothing proven yet.

This is a bad year for QB's, not doubt, at least in comparison to 2012 and 2004. However, we should not prevent us from taking the best of the bunch, which all signs are pointing to us being in position to do. If it works out, great, we've most likely put ourselves into SB contention for the next decade. If not, we've wasted a 1st round pick and roughly $25MM (what Cassel cost over 2 years), but at least we tried, and now we're in position for what looks like one of the best QB classes ever.

Yes I know a lot can change in 2-3 years, and not all of these guys will be good, or come out in the same class, but even spread over 2-3 drafts, there could still be 4 legit franchise QB's each year.

Lets take a shot now, because no other player could possibly improve our team more then a good QB. If we're going to capitalize on JC, DJ, Tamba, Flowers, Bowe, and several other's prime, we need a QB this year. Don't let the failures of past GM's preclude us from taking a need at the top. We can always try again in a few years if it doesn't work, ex. Jacksonville.


Some names I would add that I didn't see in your list (in no particular order) :

Derek Carr, Fresno State (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Teddy Bridgewater, Louisville (will be a junior)
Jeff Driskel, Florida (will be a junior)
Aaron Murray, Georgia (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Zach Mettenberger, LSU (will be a senior)
Tyler Bray, Tennessee (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Logan Thomas, Virginia Tech (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
A.J. McCarron, Alabama (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)
Tajh Boyd, Clemson (will be a senior if he doesn't declare this year)

I haven't mentioned Carr up to this point because I think there is a very good chance he returns to Fresno State for his senior year. IF he does declare, he is definitely a decent prospect to keep an eye on. Mettenberger has the prototypical physical skill set you look for but he will need a strong senior year to show some consistency. Obviously the same applies for Logan Thomas, who I really think needs to return to Virgina Tech. I had high hopes for him but I just don't know if he has the mental makeup to be a franchise quarterback at the next level.


I don't like any of those guys. I don't know anything


You could have saved yourself some typing and just posted those two statements.

Rolling Eyes


you're right, and since I don't know much about 2 of the guys you have there and don't like any of the others even a little, I might as well stop posting. Rolling Eyes


If I would have known a long time ago that it was really that easy.....



Laughing
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Chiefs_5627


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 1:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AH86 Applause

"He might be a top 10 Qb but we cant take him with 1 or 2" Shocked Shocked
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ArrowheadRage58


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 8:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arrowhead86 wrote:
I honestly cannot believe some of the posts in this thread.

If anyone wonders how an organization can find itself staring directly at 30 years of time span between their last 1st round QB and (I guess I should add potentially here) their next 1st round QB - they need simply read this thread. Posts in this thread of people talking themselves out of drafting a QB before anything else with things like "weak class", "value" , "separation and drop off".

Sigh.

Then follow that up with basically begging for some ridiculous luck to go our way. People in this draft want the OTHER THIRTY ONE TEAMS to all be wrong about the best QB available in the 1st round so we can steal him in the 2nd round! Seriously?!! No.. really.. SERIOUSLY?!

They want EVERYONE ELSE TO MISS so we can get the stud QB of the draft at #33 OVERALL!

But hey, Tom Brady was a 6th round pick so that proves it's possible right?! Aaron Rodgers was missed on by like 21 teams before GB took him.. so proof it happens right?! Well, yes. It does happen. You just don't plan for it that way. You HOPE that you figure out which guy is the stud and get him immediately. You do not risk him going anywhere else.

Anyone think Rodgers doesn't go #1 overall in a redraft today? How about Brady?!

One of these QB's is going to be the best of the bunch in this class and he's going to have SB potential. We get first crack at picking him. TAKE HIM! Whoever it is - TAKE HIM.

Oh no.. we'd rather hope 31 other teams miss so we can get him - or the next best guy even at 33. Awesome.

I want the best damn QB available. And in 3 years (or less if so obvious) he isn't the guy.. I want to TRY AGAIN!

I'm done with trying to get LUCKY. I'm done watching all the other teams take all the risk in some foolish hope that we will sweep in behind them and get all the reward.

And most importantly - I'm done with that MINDSET from our OWNER, GM, COACHING STAFF, and FANBASE!

Sincerely,

A86


Somebody had to say it like that Applause
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lawful yet1


Joined: 22 Feb 2010
Posts: 352
Location: Harrisonville MO.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rearviewmirror wrote:
lawful yet1 wrote:
Jakuvious wrote:
ArrowheadRage58 wrote:
and if you're taking a LT or DL, you better be damn sure they're gonna make more of an impact than a QB.


And you better have a pretty sizable hole at that position (which we most certainly do not at LT.)
if we could retain albert and move him to left guard and pick up a franchise left tackle you bet your ace that would be a better pick then reaching for a qb just look whats going on in philli the oline makes or breaks a offense.



Our OL isn't even close to as bad as Philly's. We would be insane to do anything but take the #1 QB on our board.
really i would say our oline is worse then philli's they get there starters back and there good to go we have our starters there just not good. and please show me one example of a great qb with a bad oline winning a superbowl we all know theres been several great olines with bad qb's winning one
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ryknowssd


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

lawful yet1 wrote:
really i would say our oline is worse then philli's they get there starters back and there good to go we have our starters there just not good. and please show me one example of a great qb with a bad oline winning a superbowl we all know theres been several great olines with bad qb's winning one


The Packers.
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lawful yet1


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chiefs_5627 wrote:
AH86 Applause

"He might be a top 10 Qb but we cant take him with 1 or 2" Shocked Shocked
he was saying he's a top 10 im not i dont think anyone of the qb's in this class are top 20 and they seem to be falling on most big boards
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kcstomp63


Joined: 12 Jan 2010
Posts: 763
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arrowhead86 wrote:
I honestly cannot believe some of the posts in this thread.

If anyone wonders how an organization can find itself staring directly at 30 years of time span between their last 1st round QB and (I guess I should add potentially here) their next 1st round QB - they need simply read this thread. Posts in this thread of people talking themselves out of drafting a QB before anything else with things like "weak class", "value" , "separation and drop off".

Sigh.

Then follow that up with basically begging for some ridiculous luck to go our way. People in this draft want the OTHER THIRTY ONE TEAMS to all be wrong about the best QB available in the 1st round so we can steal him in the 2nd round! Seriously?!! No.. really.. SERIOUSLY?!

They want EVERYONE ELSE TO MISS so we can get the stud QB of the draft at #33 OVERALL!

But hey, Tom Brady was a 6th round pick so that proves it's possible right?! Aaron Rodgers was missed on by like 21 teams before GB took him.. so proof it happens right?! Well, yes. It does happen. You just don't plan for it that way. You HOPE that you figure out which guy is the stud and get him immediately. You do not risk him going anywhere else.

Anyone think Rodgers doesn't go #1 overall in a redraft today? How about Brady?!

One of these QB's is going to be the best of the bunch in this class and he's going to have SB potential. We get first crack at picking him. TAKE HIM! Whoever it is - TAKE HIM.

Oh no.. we'd rather hope 31 other teams miss so we can get him - or the next best guy even at 33. Awesome.

I want the best damn QB available. And in 3 years (or less if so obvious) he isn't the guy.. I want to TRY AGAIN!

I'm done with trying to get LUCKY. I'm done watching all the other teams take all the risk in some foolish hope that we will sweep in behind them and get all the reward.

And most importantly - I'm done with that MINDSET from our OWNER, GM, COACHING STAFF, and FANBASE!

Sincerely,

A86


Bravo!

+1
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ArrowheadRage58


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

lawful yet1 wrote:
Rearviewmirror wrote:
lawful yet1 wrote:
Jakuvious wrote:
ArrowheadRage58 wrote:
and if you're taking a LT or DL, you better be damn sure they're gonna make more of an impact than a QB.


And you better have a pretty sizable hole at that position (which we most certainly do not at LT.)
if we could retain albert and move him to left guard and pick up a franchise left tackle you bet your ace that would be a better pick then reaching for a qb just look whats going on in philli the oline makes or breaks a offense.



Our OL isn't even close to as bad as Philly's. We would be insane to do anything but take the #1 QB on our board.
really i would say our oline is worse then philli's they get there starters back and there good to go we have our starters there just not good. and please show me one example of a great qb with a bad oline winning a superbowl we all know theres been several great olines with bad qb's winning one


We're not missing starters??? This is a good line when healthy, it looks pretty bad at times because of the ineptitude at QB/playcalling and game situations of usually being behind.
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lawful yet1


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ryknowssd wrote:
lawful yet1 wrote:
really i would say our oline is worse then philli's they get there starters back and there good to go we have our starters there just not good. and please show me one example of a great qb with a bad oline winning a superbowl we all know theres been several great olines with bad qb's winning one


The Packers.
packers ok they had 2 probowlers in Timmerman and Winters howmany do we have?
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lawful yet1


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ArrowheadRage58 wrote:
lawful yet1 wrote:
Rearviewmirror wrote:
lawful yet1 wrote:
Jakuvious wrote:
ArrowheadRage58 wrote:
and if you're taking a LT or DL, you better be damn sure they're gonna make more of an impact than a QB.


And you better have a pretty sizable hole at that position (which we most certainly do not at LT.)
if we could retain albert and move him to left guard and pick up a franchise left tackle you bet your ace that would be a better pick then reaching for a qb just look whats going on in philli the oline makes or breaks a offense.



Our OL isn't even close to as bad as Philly's. We would be insane to do anything but take the #1 QB on our board.
really i would say our oline is worse then philli's they get there starters back and there good to go we have our starters there just not good. and please show me one example of a great qb with a bad oline winning a superbowl we all know theres been several great olines with bad qb's winning one


We're not missing starters??? This is a good line when healthy, it looks pretty bad at times because of the ineptitude at QB/playcalling and game situations of usually being behind.
were missing hudson and we still have no clue what we have in him
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ryknowssd wrote:
lawful yet1 wrote:
really i would say our oline is worse then philli's they get there starters back and there good to go we have our starters there just not good. and please show me one example of a great qb with a bad oline winning a superbowl we all know theres been several great olines with bad qb's winning one


The Packers.


QFT. Besides our OL won't be that bad next year. As long as we franchise Albert and Hudson comes back full strength (no reason for that not to happen as he just broke bones, didn't hurt anything else) Allen could possibly improve or we could find a F/A guard we feel is better than Allen or Lilja. That line with a QB who doesn't take sacks at the same rate that Cassel does will be fine.
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