Discuss football with over 60,000 fans. Free Membership. Join now!

 FAQFAQ  RegisterRegister   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

FootballsFuture.com Forum Index
FootballsFuture.com Home

The Sam Bradford Thread
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 10, 11, 12  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> St. Louis Rams
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
iRaMs


Joined: 05 May 2010
Posts: 4054
Location: Teletran 1
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrry32 wrote:
STLRamsFan99 wrote:
Jonezy wrote:
I'd rather Bowe then Wallace myself


I agree with you. Bowe is a complete receiver, Wallace is used as a deep threat mainly.


http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap2000000090196/Wallace-51-yd-TD

Here are their 2011 numbers in a few categories:
Wallace:
64% catch rate
35% short routes
38% intermediate routes
8% deep routes
19% bomb routes
6.5 YAC(#7 in the NFL)

Bowe:
57% catch rate
26% short routes
46% intermediate routes
21% deep routes
7% bomb routes
4.4 YAC(#44 in the NFL)

The belief that Wallace is just some deep threat is outdated.


yep, I wanted Wallace before. Now I want him even more in a Rams uni.
_________________
Jared Cook: MIA

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DerekBrink


Joined: 16 Nov 2012
Posts: 378
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

if we could get Wallace I'd be stoked.

1. Wallace
2. Givens
3. Amendola
4. Quick/Pettis
5. Pettis/Quick

I'd be very happy with that receiving corps.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DerekBrink


Joined: 16 Nov 2012
Posts: 378
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrry32 wrote:


If Sam earns a 4th year, he's either going to prove himself the guy or prove himself not the guy. Patience is already starting to run very thin.

.


earns a fourth year? How could you possibly think he won't be our QB next year?. Really what other option would we have? There isn't a QB in the draft who has the upside Sam has or would be as good as Sam right now.

Sure patience may be running thin with some fans but I haven't heard anything to suggest Fisher of the personnel people feel that way.

Yes he's had some poor games this year but two of those games our line and receivers played absolutely terrible. The Jets game our receiving corps just looked awful.

If Bradford was playing poorly or his play getting worse I might be less optimistic but he's actually played a lot better the last 6 games than he did the first 5. In the last 6 games he's only had one poor game(that awful game against the Jets).

His numbers the last 6 games

Completion % 62 TD 8 Int 4 Y/A 7.1 RAT 88.0 13 Sacks against(15 first 5 games)

They aren't great numbers but they'd put him in the top 13 QB's and most of this was compiled with Amendola injured or Givens in the doghouse. In fact Givens and Amendola have only played 3 full games together. Hopefully Sam can continue to improve and play well down the stretch. We play much weaker defenses down the stretch so it's certainly possible. Especially when you consider the two best defenses we play are the 49ers who Bradford played exceptional against and the Seahawks, who may be without their top 2 corners.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The J.R.S.


Joined: 15 Feb 2007
Posts: 3817
Location: Next to Waldo
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrry32 wrote:
STLRamsFan99 wrote:
Jonezy wrote:
I'd rather Bowe then Wallace myself


I agree with you. Bowe is a complete receiver, Wallace is used as a deep threat mainly.


http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap2000000090196/Wallace-51-yd-TD

Here are their 2011 numbers in a few categories:
Wallace:
64% catch rate
35% short routes
38% intermediate routes
8% deep routes
19% bomb routes
6.5 YAC(#7 in the NFL)

Bowe:
57% catch rate
26% short routes
46% intermediate routes
21% deep routes
7% bomb routes
4.4 YAC(#44 in the NFL)

The belief that Wallace is just some deep threat is outdated.


True, he is now also in the doghouse with his team and drops passes often. But he is also a very talented player.

I'd rather have Bowe, and comparing the stats you did is completely unfair and should not be considered indicative of their quality as WRs.

Wallace had Two time pro bowler Big Ben throwing to him, while Bowe had Matt Cassel for half of the year and Kyle Orton/ Tyler Palko for the other half.

Bowe is great outside of the numbers and in the end zone, Wallace is more suited for the middle of the field and stretching the field deep.
_________________


Real sports fans do not condone ESPN.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jrry32


Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 46692
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 2:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The J.R.S. wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
STLRamsFan99 wrote:
Jonezy wrote:
I'd rather Bowe then Wallace myself


I agree with you. Bowe is a complete receiver, Wallace is used as a deep threat mainly.


http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap2000000090196/Wallace-51-yd-TD

Here are their 2011 numbers in a few categories:
Wallace:
64% catch rate
35% short routes
38% intermediate routes
8% deep routes
19% bomb routes
6.5 YAC(#7 in the NFL)

Bowe:
57% catch rate
26% short routes
46% intermediate routes
21% deep routes
7% bomb routes
4.4 YAC(#44 in the NFL)

The belief that Wallace is just some deep threat is outdated.


True, he is now also in the doghouse with his team and drops passes often. But he is also a very talented player.

I'd rather have Bowe, and comparing the stats you did is completely unfair and should not be considered indicative of their quality as WRs.

Wallace had Two time pro bowler Big Ben throwing to him, while Bowe had Matt Cassel for half of the year and Kyle Orton/ Tyler Palko for the other half.

Bowe is great outside of the numbers and in the end zone, Wallace is more suited for the middle of the field and stretching the field deep.


It's fair and it's unfair. Catch rate will be effected by the quality of the QB but at the same time, Bowe also sees more looks because of his QBs and while that won't show up positively on catch rate, it shows up positively on yards, catches and TDs.

And yep, he is in the dog house. Just seems unfocused this year. I'm willing to take the risk though that his focus comes back once his contractual situation is resolved. He's a young WR who looked to be on his way to being a top 5 WR in the NFL before this year.
_________________
The LBC wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Don't worry. Sean Payton would pass the ball in a Tornado.

But would he do it in a Sharknado?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DerekBrink


Joined: 16 Nov 2012
Posts: 378
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wallace was playing fine until Big Ben went down. He wasn't having a huge year but was on pace for a 1,000 yard season.

Either way I'd love the Rams to have Wallace. I don't know if he's a true #1 but having Givens, Amendola and Wallace would be a huge upgrade compared to what we had two or three years ago.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DEE RAWL


Joined: 02 Oct 2007
Posts: 4518
Location: Southern California
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Call me crazy but i just dont like the idea of Wallace or Bowe wearing the horns. Just would rather spend the money elsewhere
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
jrry32


Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 46692
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DEE RAWL wrote:
Call me crazy but i just dont like the idea of Wallace or Bowe wearing the horns. Just would rather spend the money elsewhere


I can understand that...especially with the WRs in this draft. If they chose to spend money on an OT and Safety in FA. I wouldn't care. Hell, if they chose to spend money on 2 safeties in FA, I'd be quite fine.
_________________
The LBC wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Don't worry. Sean Payton would pass the ball in a Tornado.

But would he do it in a Sharknado?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DEE RAWL


Joined: 02 Oct 2007
Posts: 4518
Location: Southern California
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrry32 wrote:
DEE RAWL wrote:
Call me crazy but i just dont like the idea of Wallace or Bowe wearing the horns. Just would rather spend the money elsewhere


I can understand that...especially with the WRs in this draft. If they chose to spend money on an OT and Safety in FA. I wouldn't care. Hell, if they chose to spend money on 2 safeties in FA, I'd be quite fine.


Yeah especially the way William Moore played tonight.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
The J.R.S.


Joined: 15 Feb 2007
Posts: 3817
Location: Next to Waldo
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 1:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrry32 wrote:
The J.R.S. wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
STLRamsFan99 wrote:
Jonezy wrote:
I'd rather Bowe then Wallace myself


I agree with you. Bowe is a complete receiver, Wallace is used as a deep threat mainly.


http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap2000000090196/Wallace-51-yd-TD

Here are their 2011 numbers in a few categories:
Wallace:
64% catch rate
35% short routes
38% intermediate routes
8% deep routes
19% bomb routes
6.5 YAC(#7 in the NFL)

Bowe:
57% catch rate
26% short routes
46% intermediate routes
21% deep routes
7% bomb routes
4.4 YAC(#44 in the NFL)

The belief that Wallace is just some deep threat is outdated.


True, he is now also in the doghouse with his team and drops passes often. But he is also a very talented player.

I'd rather have Bowe, and comparing the stats you did is completely unfair and should not be considered indicative of their quality as WRs.

Wallace had Two time pro bowler Big Ben throwing to him, while Bowe had Matt Cassel for half of the year and Kyle Orton/ Tyler Palko for the other half.

Bowe is great outside of the numbers and in the end zone, Wallace is more suited for the middle of the field and stretching the field deep.


It's fair and it's unfair. Catch rate will be effected by the quality of the QB but at the same time, Bowe also sees more looks because of his QBs and while that won't show up positively on catch rate, it shows up positively on yards, catches and TDs.

And yep, he is in the dog house. Just seems unfocused this year. I'm willing to take the risk though that his focus comes back once his contractual situation is resolved. He's a young WR who looked to be on his way to being a top 5 WR in the NFL before this year.


Perhaps you are right about Wallace regaining focus, but your post reminded me of another, unrelated point; What ever happened to all of the "four pillars" supporters on this forum. I said from the beginning that it would likely make talent acquisition even more difficult and should be reconsidered. Seems like we all agree now that a balance is needed.
_________________


Real sports fans do not condone ESPN.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The J.R.S.


Joined: 15 Feb 2007
Posts: 3817
Location: Next to Waldo
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 1:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DEE RAWL wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
DEE RAWL wrote:
Call me crazy but i just dont like the idea of Wallace or Bowe wearing the horns. Just would rather spend the money elsewhere


I can understand that...especially with the WRs in this draft. If they chose to spend money on an OT and Safety in FA. I wouldn't care. Hell, if they chose to spend money on 2 safeties in FA, I'd be quite fine.


Yeah especially the way William Moore played tonight.


Every year that I have been on this forum there is an offseason debate as to which resources should be put into the WR position. Once again, I'll have to take the stance of putting a major emphasis on getting Bradford better pass catching options.

The emergence of Givens is the only thing that has improved our outlook at that position this year, and although he looks like a promising role player, I don't see him as an "outside of the numbers" or "red zone" type player.

Good offenses can attack any part of the field. We cannot.

We added Richardson who can spread the field horizontally at the line of scrimmage, check.

We added Givens who can stretch the field deep, check.

We have Amendola who can play the short to intermediate middle of the field, check.

Now, we need a guy(s) who can win on the outside, both in the red zone and outside of it.

There's my outlook in a nutshell.
_________________


Real sports fans do not condone ESPN.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jrry32


Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 46692
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 2:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The J.R.S. wrote:


Every year that I have been on this forum there is an offseason debate as to which resources should be put into the WR position. Once again, I'll have to take the stance of putting a major emphasis on getting Bradford better pass catching options.


Who says we aren't advocating emphasizing it? Passing up on FA WRs doesn't mean we believe they should pass on 1st round WRs too. If I don't sign Mike Wallace or Dwayne Bowe, I'm planning on taking Terrance Williams, Justin Hunter or Keenan Allen.
_________________
The LBC wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Don't worry. Sean Payton would pass the ball in a Tornado.

But would he do it in a Sharknado?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DerekBrink


Joined: 16 Nov 2012
Posts: 378
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 4:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DEE RAWL wrote:
Call me crazy but i just dont like the idea of Wallace or Bowe wearing the horns. Just would rather spend the money elsewhere


can you say why exactly? Is it character issues or just don't like the way they play?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DEE RAWL


Joined: 02 Oct 2007
Posts: 4518
Location: Southern California
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 5:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DerekBrink wrote:
DEE RAWL wrote:
Call me crazy but i just dont like the idea of Wallace or Bowe wearing the horns. Just would rather spend the money elsewhere


can you say why exactly? Is it character issues or just don't like the way they play?


Just the fact that we could get perhaps equal talent that is younger for MUCH less of the price in the draft. Wallace is fact and a playmaker but I would prefer a bit more of a bigger true physical dynamic young WR to grow from day one... ie Allen, Hunter, or Williams. I just have never been a fan of Wallace or Bowe in general either.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
jrry32


Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 46692
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 7:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DEE RAWL wrote:
DerekBrink wrote:
DEE RAWL wrote:
Call me crazy but i just dont like the idea of Wallace or Bowe wearing the horns. Just would rather spend the money elsewhere


can you say why exactly? Is it character issues or just don't like the way they play?


Just the fact that we could get perhaps equal talent that is younger for MUCH less of the price in the draft. Wallace is fact and a playmaker but I would prefer a bit more of a bigger true physical dynamic young WR to grow from day one... ie Allen, Hunter, or Williams. I just have never been a fan of Wallace or Bowe in general either.


Ok but you're not considering the opportunity cost here. Your thinking is:
Wallace/Bowe = more expensive
Draft pick = less expensive

But that's only part of the equation. The money we save by drafting a WR is offset by the pick we lose.

So if we sign Wallace, that frees up our first round pick for another position. Whereas if we don't, one would think that we'd use that 1st round pick on a WR and use the money on another position.

Gotta consider the entire picture. So the question is, what makes the best combination to help the team?

For example:
Option 1:
Sign Jairus Byrd
Draft Keenan Allen

vs.

Option 2:
Sign Mike Wallace
Draft Chance Warmack

Frankly, with Kevin Demoff saying that we currently have around 10 million to spend in FA this off-season(with cuts, we'll probably end up around 18 to 20), I'm not sure if we're going after a big name FA.

In that case, it would probably make more sense to sign a 2nd tier FA safety like Glover Quin or William Moore and draft a WR rather than try to sign a 2nd tier WR.

My personal choice would be to draft Terrance Williams with our second 1st rounder...but that's just me.
_________________
The LBC wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Don't worry. Sean Payton would pass the ball in a Tornado.

But would he do it in a Sharknado?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   

Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> St. Louis Rams All times are GMT - 4 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 10, 11, 12  Next
Page 4 of 12

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum




Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group