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Manti Te'o
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Burgesskills


Joined: 11 Apr 2006
Posts: 1114
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

He wasn't out of position, SC did a good job of creating space for Redd and McNeal. McNeal did a great job with cuts and showed vision. They didn't crowd the line because they were afraid of getting beat deep by Lee and Woods.

You're crazy.
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ZoomWaffle


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I underatnd the dude is ferocious, emotional, aggressive, and a leader. Thats awesome, I love that in a player and we definitely need that. However, I am just not keen to using a high 1st on a MLB right now. Sure he will help in coverage of TEs and RBs, and he would help the run D, but only as much as our line would allow him to. I just really feel like our line will not keep him clean, and he wont be able to have the impact he is capable of having because of that. Our DBs will still struggle to cover, and our line still will not get to the QB. He wont change the fact that we cant rush the passer, and thats my biggest gripe.

I want a pass rusher who will torment QBs and put an end to us having to endure watching average QBs look good against us because they have so long to throw. The only non-pass rusher that I am OK with in the 1st is Star, and thats because he will directly impact our entire line (which will impact our LBs and DBs), improve our run stopping ability, free up our other linemen (giving them a better chance to rush the QB), and he even offers a little bit of pass rush ability himself. I'm looking at total impact from our 1st round pick, and I think Star or a stud pass rusher would have the greatest impact on our team right now.
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NickButera


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ZoomWaffle wrote:
I underatnd the dude is ferocious, emotional, aggressive, and a leader.


That's the part that keeps me from comparing him to McClain. McClain was a "lead by example" guy. And I always questioned just how effectively that would work. As a role player, (CB, RB, DT, etc...) it's just fine. But when you're the QB and MLB I just feel that you have to be an extroverted leader in order to maximize your effectiveness on the field and lead your respective offense or defense. This is the type of personality Te'o has. His fiery attitude reminds me of a Ray Lewis attitude.

....and as I type that Kiper and McShay said the same Ray Lewis attitude comparison Laughing I'd be OK if he was our pick. Hind sight is 20/20. But as of now he's a top prospect that many teams would want.
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big_palooka


Joined: 30 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NickButera wrote:
ZoomWaffle wrote:
I underatnd the dude is ferocious, emotional, aggressive, and a leader.


That's the part that keeps me from comparing him to McClain. McClain was a "lead by example" guy. And I always questioned just how effectively that would work. As a role player, (CB, RB, DT, etc...) it's just fine. But when you're the QB and MLB I just feel that you have to be an extroverted leader in order to maximize your effectiveness on the field and lead your respective offense or defense. This is the type of personality Te'o has. His fiery attitude reminds me of a Ray Lewis attitude.

....and as I type that Kiper and McShay said the same Ray Lewis attitude comparison Laughing I'd be OK if he was our pick. Hind sight is 20/20. But as of now he's a top prospect that many teams would want.


Mayock loves him. Has a great quote from a coach about how he has 2 heartbeats. 1 as a leader and one for everybody else on the team.
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Burgesskills


Joined: 11 Apr 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I underatnd the dude is ferocious, emotional, aggressive, and a leader. Thats awesome, I love that in a player and we definitely need that. However, I am just not keen to using a high 1st on a MLB right now. Sure he will help in coverage of TEs and RBs, and he would help the run D, but only as much as our line would allow him to. I just really feel like our line will not keep him clean, and he wont be able to have the impact he is capable of having because of that. Our DBs will still struggle to cover, and our line still will not get to the QB. He wont change the fact that we cant rush the passer, and thats my biggest gripe.

I want a pass rusher who will torment QBs and put an end to us having to endure watching average QBs look good against us because they have so long to throw. The only non-pass rusher that I am OK with in the 1st is Star, and thats because he will directly impact our entire line (which will impact our LBs and DBs), improve our run stopping ability, free up our other linemen (giving them a better chance to rush the QB), and he even offers a little bit of pass rush ability himself. I'm looking at total impact from our 1st round pick, and I think Star or a stud pass rusher would have the greatest impact on our team right now.
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Very good points and great post. I understand this. At least you're not saying he is overrated and nonathletic. I myself, want Moore.
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big_palooka


Joined: 30 Mar 2006
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Location: ATL
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Burgesskills wrote:
Quote:
I underatnd the dude is ferocious, emotional, aggressive, and a leader. Thats awesome, I love that in a player and we definitely need that. However, I am just not keen to using a high 1st on a MLB right now. Sure he will help in coverage of TEs and RBs, and he would help the run D, but only as much as our line would allow him to. I just really feel like our line will not keep him clean, and he wont be able to have the impact he is capable of having because of that. Our DBs will still struggle to cover, and our line still will not get to the QB. He wont change the fact that we cant rush the passer, and thats my biggest gripe.

I want a pass rusher who will torment QBs and put an end to us having to endure watching average QBs look good against us because they have so long to throw. The only non-pass rusher that I am OK with in the 1st is Star, and thats because he will directly impact our entire line (which will impact our LBs and DBs), improve our run stopping ability, free up our other linemen (giving them a better chance to rush the QB), and he even offers a little bit of pass rush ability himself. I'm looking at total impact from our 1st round pick, and I think Star or a stud pass rusher would have the greatest impact on our team right now.
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Very good points and great post. I understand this. At least you're not saying he is overrated and nonathletic. I myself, want Moore.


Can someone explain Moore to me? I don't see anything special in his game. His first step is ordinary. Just don't see the hype with him.

Werner IMO is the best looking DE. Most won't agree and that's fine.
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IdigtheRaiders!


Joined: 07 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:
I think a lot of people sleep on Te'o. He's better than most are giving credit for.

On a defense that lacks any heart or soul and had to deal with Slowlando the anti-leader, this is your guy. He's an every down LB, tackling machine who has a innate leadership quality.

This kid will step in day 1, call the plays and lead a defense with authority they tried to get out of Slowlando for 3 seasons.

I would not bet against Te'o. He is a tireless worker. Studies QBs like the great LBs should. Understands concepts on defense and what teams are trying to do.

Drafting Te'o would be a step in the leadership and dedication direction. He's the type Reggie wants to build around and I would have no issue with the pick depending on how they approach FA for Dline and pass rusher.



Pretty much exactly how I feel. I agree that we have bigger needs than MLB, and they need to be addressed at some point before we can hope to have a better football team -- but if Reggie wants to remake the team in his image, Te'o would be a logical choice to start with.
Forget wanting Te'o or not -- did Reggie perhaps tip his hand in that direction by releasing McClain?
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LivingLegendWFC


Joined: 28 Oct 2009
Posts: 11081
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pass rushers are more important for us at this point, but I think the guy has a great skill set and would be a good pick depending on who is available. Jarvis Jones is still number one on my big board, but MLB is a big hole that's going to have to be addressed with McClain being cut.
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Bo_Spice


Joined: 17 May 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Burgesskills wrote:
Quote:
You're basing this all off of numbers though, try watching some game film and then get back to me.

Watch Notre Dame this season and you'll see that his great defensive line keeps him clean and he still misses tackles.

He's not special athletically and will need to play in a 3-4 to be good in the NFL, a scheme that we do not run. I'm not sure how his stats dictate what type of athlete he is, but that's all your basing your argument around. I'm not saying he's a bad athlete, he's just pretty average and that will be evident at the combine.

You can keep basing your argument completely off stats though. Watch the USC game just last week and you'll see him out of position countless times while USC's two small running backs were making their way up the field.

He's not a great prospect and he doesn't fit our scheme.


Wow, I have a read it all now. I have been a ND fan since I was 7 and have watched Notre Dame every Saturday. I have seen Teo and his tenacity, Not athletic? Are you kidding me? Some of you say things, just to say them. Whats funny though if we draft him, youll be the first to sing his praises when he dominates.

He has been the heart and soul of the defense since hes been at South Bend. He is smart, he reads plays, takes correct angles, and is a great tackler. He has lateral quickness and is a great run stopper. Your claiming its the line?? Just more empty claims. Who do you think calls out the plays on defense and makes the reads? He does.

This year hes been on a whole new lever, he cut weight and came in at great shape and has shown a whole new quickness. He is good against the run and pass. He has 7 interceptions because he could read the QB. The staff had confidence in him to cover Marqise Lee near the goal line against SC, the pass was overthrown, but Teo was right with him. Hes probably not going to win the Heisman, but a middle linebacker to be in serious consideration is huge. He is fast and he leaves it all on the field, and like Palooka said, he is an emotional leader that defense will rally around.

Hes going to be a top ten pick, maybe top 5. McKenzie wants smart and dedicated players to build around I wouldnt be surprised if he is a top target. Id love for him, but I also like Moore a lot. I like Jones a lot, even though his health does scare me. Trading back to acquire picks sounds good too.


He doesn't have the speed or quickness to be a sideline to sideline type of linebacker and isn't even that at the college level. I'm not sure why the hell you think he'll be good in the 4-3.

I'll say it again he fits well in a 3-4 and if we move to a 3-4 he'd be a solid fit but if we are going to make that transition we need a pass rusher more than an inside linebacker.
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Burgesskills


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Again, he has plenty of speed and quickness and lateral movement.
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Bo_Spice


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Burgesskills wrote:
Again, he has plenty of speed and quickness and lateral movement.


Where are you seeing this though? Notre Dame's scheme doesn't require him to play side line to side line and their dominant defensive line does a great job of keeping him clean the majority of the time.

When scouting how good a prospect is you have to compare him to previous prospects that were considered good and he's not as good of a prospect as Willis was when he came out. And he's not near the type of athlete that Willis was either.
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Darkness


Joined: 24 Jun 2012
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

big_palooka wrote:
Burgesskills wrote:
Quote:
I underatnd the dude is ferocious, emotional, aggressive, and a leader. Thats awesome, I love that in a player and we definitely need that. However, I am just not keen to using a high 1st on a MLB right now. Sure he will help in coverage of TEs and RBs, and he would help the run D, but only as much as our line would allow him to. I just really feel like our line will not keep him clean, and he wont be able to have the impact he is capable of having because of that. Our DBs will still struggle to cover, and our line still will not get to the QB. He wont change the fact that we cant rush the passer, and thats my biggest gripe.

I want a pass rusher who will torment QBs and put an end to us having to endure watching average QBs look good against us because they have so long to throw. The only non-pass rusher that I am OK with in the 1st is Star, and thats because he will directly impact our entire line (which will impact our LBs and DBs), improve our run stopping ability, free up our other linemen (giving them a better chance to rush the QB), and he even offers a little bit of pass rush ability himself. I'm looking at total impact from our 1st round pick, and I think Star or a stud pass rusher would have the greatest impact on our team right now.
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Very good points and great post. I understand this. At least you're not saying he is overrated and nonathletic. I myself, want Moore.


Can someone explain Moore to me? I don't see anything special in his game. His first step is ordinary. Just don't see the hype with him.

Werner IMO is the best looking DE. Most won't agree and that's fine.


big_palooka wrote:
Moore is a no brainer if he comes out. He's the type Oakland needs.


I thought you liked Moore? I think he looks great. I like Werner a lot too though. This is a great year to have a need at DE/OLB. Can't wait to see who Reggie addresses the D-line with.
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Nodisrespect


Joined: 28 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 5:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darkness wrote:
big_palooka wrote:
Burgesskills wrote:
Quote:
I underatnd the dude is ferocious, emotional, aggressive, and a leader. Thats awesome, I love that in a player and we definitely need that. However, I am just not keen to using a high 1st on a MLB right now. Sure he will help in coverage of TEs and RBs, and he would help the run D, but only as much as our line would allow him to. I just really feel like our line will not keep him clean, and he wont be able to have the impact he is capable of having because of that. Our DBs will still struggle to cover, and our line still will not get to the QB. He wont change the fact that we cant rush the passer, and thats my biggest gripe.

I want a pass rusher who will torment QBs and put an end to us having to endure watching average QBs look good against us because they have so long to throw. The only non-pass rusher that I am OK with in the 1st is Star, and thats because he will directly impact our entire line (which will impact our LBs and DBs), improve our run stopping ability, free up our other linemen (giving them a better chance to rush the QB), and he even offers a little bit of pass rush ability himself. I'm looking at total impact from our 1st round pick, and I think Star or a stud pass rusher would have the greatest impact on our team right now.
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Very good points and great post. I understand this. At least you're not saying he is overrated and nonathletic. I myself, want Moore.


Can someone explain Moore to me? I don't see anything special in his game. His first step is ordinary. Just don't see the hype with him.

Werner IMO is the best looking DE. Most won't agree and that's fine.


big_palooka wrote:
Moore is a no brainer if he comes out. He's the type Oakland needs.


I thought you liked Moore? I think he looks great. I like Werner a lot too though. This is a great year to have a need at DE/OLB. Can't wait to see who Reggie addresses the D-line with.
Well, DA is a A&M guy so i'm sure he's seen plenty. Personally i like Mingo the best.
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Bo_Spice


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nodisrespect wrote:
Personally i like Mingo the best.


Why? He's going to be a major bust.
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ZoomWaffle


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bo_Spice wrote:
Nodisrespect wrote:
Personally i like Mingo the best.


Why? He's going to be a major bust.


If he can add some weight and work on some moves, he is going to be good. The dude has unbelievable physical skills and probably the quickest first step out of any of the DEs in this class.
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Last edited by ZoomWaffle on Thu Nov 29, 2012 6:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
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