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klyon7634


Joined: 13 Jul 2007
Posts: 12661
Location: New York
PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheOsprey wrote:
klyon7634 wrote:
Did osprey really just say a mobile QB is boring football???

LMFAO Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing


so a QB who stands around in the pocket and takes a sack because he cant run is more entertaining than a QB who can move and can avoid sacks and make plays with his leg???

I want some of what this guy is smoking!!!!!!

So i guess in ospreys eyes we would be 14-0 right now if Flynn started.

Wilson can take us to 5 straight Super Bowls, Throw for 4000 yards in each of those seasons and Osprey will still say we would be better off with Flynn. LMFAO

Osprey dude it is ok to admit when you are wrong. It happens to everyone just admit it dude your were wrong.



No. I said a running QB, who takes off on designed runs and rushes out of the pocket when he isn't even pressured (no matter what the outcome), is boring football. I said QB's should only run if they are chased from the pocket with no open receivers or if it is a short QB dive for a first down/touchdown. Big difference.

I just don't think you guys get it. I like a certain style of football. I don't like change. I like the type of offense we had with Matt Hasselbeck, using the run to set up the pass. That's what I live for. When Pete was at USC, that's the style of football he played. It was balanced. He used pocket QB's like Carson Palmer and Matt Leinart. That's the type of football I like to watch. You don't have to like it, but I do. That's what I thought Pete was bringing to the Seahawks, but I was wrong. We are now a run first team with a QB who takes off on a whim. If you guys like to watch that, it's great. I'm happy for you. I'm not here to bring you down, but I find it boring to watch. I want those glory days back. I saw other QB's who I truly believe could've gotten this team to the playoffs and beyond, while playing the style of football I like. I realize I have no control over this though and things are the way they are. I've accepted that, but I still hate it. That's why I've watched very little of the team's games the last few weeks. I've seen enough to know that I find it uninteresting though. That's just my opinion. Like I said, if you guys enjoy it that's great. I don't, but my opinion should have no bearing on your life at all.

I've been quiet the last few weeks, because I knew that stating how I felt would cause an uproar, but I was asked a direct question and I didn't want to be accused of dodging the issue, so I answered truthfully. I don't like seeing "little guys" playing QB and running when it isn't warranted so in all likelihood, I will never like Wilson. That's just my opinion though and everyone thinks differently. What I say or how I think shouldn't effect the lives of other people on this board. I'm used to having unpopular opinions on a wide variety of subjects, so I'm surprised that so many people are shocked by what I said.


Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

i still dont see how you can say thats boring football.
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imani


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 2:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheOsprey wrote:
SaveourSonics wrote:
You are truly sad.

Why should I care how we score if we're putting up 50+ points? Why should it matter if it's "boring football" if it's winning games? At the end of the day, that's what matters. Try evaluating him for what matters and not by what YOU prefer. Who gives a damn what YOU prefer if this way is winning games and blowing teams out. Your perspective is ridiculous.

As for having 60% completion %, Wilson is north of 62% on the year. He has 30+ LESS rushing attempts than Robert Griffin. Is Griffin a bad rookie QB? He also leads rookies in total TDs....you know...the stat that wins games and actually matters. Not your preferences. Luck has less than 60% completion %, is he a bad rookie QB?

Oh, and sorry Russell Wilson isn't Tom Brady or Peyton Manning yet. Actually, sorry that 99% of all NFL QBs in the history of the game aren't Tom Brady or Peyton Manning. Wilson is having an amazing rookie season, and if you can't acknowledge that than your opinion is worthless on the entire matter.

Wilson is a huge reason that Lynch is having the success he is this season. The 50 yarder he had against the Bills last week came on a read option where Wilson gave it to Lynch after suckering the defense into thinking he'd be running it. Our dual threat QB is doing more for the running game than Peyton or Tom could at this point. He's making all of the right decisions and has grown immensely throughout the year. If you don't see that, you probably aren't even watching games. Stop pointing to his amount of attempts, he has no control over that. Let's look at things he does have control over. Despite having nearly 200 LESS attempts than Andrew Luck, he has more passing TDs. That's a stat that Wilson can control. He can also control the amount of games we win, which is more than even you predicted we'd have with him under center. He can also control how many INTs he throws, which is less than a lot of veterans in this league. He can control how many fumbles he has, which is less than Luck despite him running less than Wilson. He can control his YPA, which is more than Luck and Griffin.

Just swallow your pride already. You've been proven wrong. I was proven wrong. We now have the franchise QB of our Seattle Seahawks.



Why do you care what my opinion is? I certainly could care less about your preferences, so why is this bothering you so much? If you don't like what I have to say about Wilson, ignore it and live your life. Don't dwell over something you have no control over.

You bring up Robert Griffin for whatever reason. Personally, I wouldn't want him on my team either, because I don't like that style of football. I like pure pocket passers. I was hoping Wilson would be more like Warren Moon and less like Doug Flutie, but apparently that isn't gonna happen. I love guys like Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Aaron Rodgers, Eli Manning and pocket QB's who are starting to come into their own like, Matt Ryan, Josh Freeman, Andrew Luck and Andy Dalton play an exciting brand of footballl to me. I hate it when QB's take off running for no reason what so ever, but why does what I prefer, bother you so much? Yes, I really like Andrew Luck, but you have to look at him for what he is, largely a one man show. His O-Line is putrid and he has no running game to speak of. Wilson has an advantage here, because he has the benefit of a good O-Line and an excellent running game. Not only that, Luck is taking a team that many people thought would have the #1 pick in 2013 and leading them to the playoffs. A large number of people on the other hand, expected us to be a fringe playoff/wildcard contender.

If you want to lay a bunch of praise on Wilson, fine. That is your right. But I don't see it and I'm not gonna be bullied into forming an opinion I don't have. I don't like Wilson and he has done nothing to turn that opinion for me. Nothing you can say is gonna change my mind, so why do you try so hard? Give up and quit wasting your time. I'm sure you have more important things in your life.

I already said I was wrong about Lynch. I freely admit that. I would have voted against the trade to acquire him and that would have been a mistake. I made a bad call on that one. Take that small victory and move on with your life. Your passion about trying to change my mind regarding Wilson, is commendable, but a bit sad as well. There are way more important things to focus on this time of year. Enjoy the holidays and quit obsessing about my opinion. I was simply asked a question by someone else and I answered it, but you're the one that is spazzing out about it. That time off of the board, must've made you crazy. Laughing


i honestly, i didn't want to jump down your throat with "I told you so's", but i will say this: You may not like change, but that change has given us our first winning record since 2007 and a likely playoff berth...does your personal preference mean more than the success of the team?
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SupeRG00F


Joined: 12 Aug 2012
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheOsprey wrote:
SupeRG00F wrote:
TheOsprey wrote:
imani wrote:
TheOsprey wrote:
SaveourSonics wrote:
Something I would actually like that may be really unpopular after last night.

If the Jets cut Mark Sanchez, I really wouldn't mind signing him as our backup and trading Matt Flynn. He'd be comfortable with Pete's scheme, he'd be fine in short doses, and there would be no pressure to see him play.

I think this would be the best backup QB scenario for us if we dealt Flynn.




On top of the fact that I hate Sanchez and think he completely lacks any instincts and can't read defenses to save his life, I don't see this happening for a completely different reason. Back when Sanchez declared for the draft, it was reported on ESPN that Pete was not happy at all with Sanchez's decision. He felt Mark was nowhere near ready and tried to talk him out of it. According to what I saw on ESPN back then, it got a little tense and there were hard feelings that developed between the two men. If the report was right, Pete is not a big Sanchez fan. Personally, I'd rather trade Flynn and take a chance on a late round QB like Colby Cameron of La. Tech. I see some potential in this kid. He has a very strong, accurate arm.



Soooo (not to be that guy), but when are you going to address this whole Russell WIlson thing. You gave us a REALLY hard time about it in training camp and preseason. I just want to hear your re-evaluation.



I still don't like him and I truly believe Flynn is a better passer. That hasn't changed. Yes, we have scored over 100 points combined the past 2 weeks, but in those games Wilson has only passed for a grand total of 348 yards and in those games combined, he has completed less than 60% of his passes. I know some people will say that he ran for 92 yards and 3 scores, but I'm "old school". Running the football is not his job. That is the job of the RB. Running backs run and Quarterbacks throw, so I don't count those. As far as I'm concerned, he took carries away from Lynch.

Looking further into those two huge victories, I give the vast majority of the credit to Marshawn Lynch and the defense/special teams. In those wins Lynch has totaled 241 rushing yards and 4 TD's and we've also tallied 4 defensive/special teams TD's. In my opinion, Wilson is getting way more credit than he deserves. Has he been a game manager who has done a good job of protecting the football? Yes, but I still see nothing that leads me to believe that he will be the dynamic passer who can lead us to a Superbowl. I truly believe with Flynn as a starter, we'd be a better team. Maybe I'm wrong, but you asked and that's my opinion. I know people will disagree, but that's nothing new. I just have to accept that this is the way it is. Wilson is the QB of this team, whether I like it or not.

Back to the original subject though, I still believe that Mike Vick, Alex Smith and Matt Flynn will be very hot commoditiesthis offseason. Given Vick's contract, injury issues an poor reputation and Smith's lack of a "wow factor", I still believe that Flynn's reasonable contract and the fact that he did play so well for the Packers, make him the best choice for most teams. Trading him now, when the demand will be high, just makes too much sense, since he's gonna be relegated to the bench, if he stays.
Is there absolutley nothing that Wilson can do to prove to you he can throw with the best in the league?



Grow 2 inches, stop running the football unless chased out of the pocket, throw more while completing at least 60% of his passes. Basically, be more like Tom Brady and Peyton Manning.
I never thought Caroll would go for an athletic QB like that either given his history at USC. But Wilson can make the same throws those QB's can AND give an extra dimension by keeping defenses honest. I'm not going to bash you or try to make you think differently because it won't work and I really don't want you to think different Laughing . But to me wilson is making strides to being a prolific passer in this league. He's improving on not running after two seconds in the pocket. Even when he does run outside he's always looking up field to throw the ball. As much as you hate him and don't want to support him, everything you dislike he's improving on(besides height, ha). It's like he's read your posts and picked those exactly to fix. So you are contributing to the team. Wink
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Dools=hawks


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SupeRG00F wrote:
TheOsprey wrote:
SupeRG00F wrote:
TheOsprey wrote:
imani wrote:
TheOsprey wrote:
SaveourSonics wrote:
Something I would actually like that may be really unpopular after last night.

If the Jets cut Mark Sanchez, I really wouldn't mind signing him as our backup and trading Matt Flynn. He'd be comfortable with Pete's scheme, he'd be fine in short doses, and there would be no pressure to see him play.

I think this would be the best backup QB scenario for us if we dealt Flynn.




On top of the fact that I hate Sanchez and think he completely lacks any instincts and can't read defenses to save his life, I don't see this happening for a completely different reason. Back when Sanchez declared for the draft, it was reported on ESPN that Pete was not happy at all with Sanchez's decision. He felt Mark was nowhere near ready and tried to talk him out of it. According to what I saw on ESPN back then, it got a little tense and there were hard feelings that developed between the two men. If the report was right, Pete is not a big Sanchez fan. Personally, I'd rather trade Flynn and take a chance on a late round QB like Colby Cameron of La. Tech. I see some potential in this kid. He has a very strong, accurate arm.



Soooo (not to be that guy), but when are you going to address this whole Russell WIlson thing. You gave us a REALLY hard time about it in training camp and preseason. I just want to hear your re-evaluation.



I still don't like him and I truly believe Flynn is a better passer. That hasn't changed. Yes, we have scored over 100 points combined the past 2 weeks, but in those games Wilson has only passed for a grand total of 348 yards and in those games combined, he has completed less than 60% of his passes. I know some people will say that he ran for 92 yards and 3 scores, but I'm "old school". Running the football is not his job. That is the job of the RB. Running backs run and Quarterbacks throw, so I don't count those. As far as I'm concerned, he took carries away from Lynch.

Looking further into those two huge victories, I give the vast majority of the credit to Marshawn Lynch and the defense/special teams. In those wins Lynch has totaled 241 rushing yards and 4 TD's and we've also tallied 4 defensive/special teams TD's. In my opinion, Wilson is getting way more credit than he deserves. Has he been a game manager who has done a good job of protecting the football? Yes, but I still see nothing that leads me to believe that he will be the dynamic passer who can lead us to a Superbowl. I truly believe with Flynn as a starter, we'd be a better team. Maybe I'm wrong, but you asked and that's my opinion. I know people will disagree, but that's nothing new. I just have to accept that this is the way it is. Wilson is the QB of this team, whether I like it or not.

Back to the original subject though, I still believe that Mike Vick, Alex Smith and Matt Flynn will be very hot commoditiesthis offseason. Given Vick's contract, injury issues an poor reputation and Smith's lack of a "wow factor", I still believe that Flynn's reasonable contract and the fact that he did play so well for the Packers, make him the best choice for most teams. Trading him now, when the demand will be high, just makes too much sense, since he's gonna be relegated to the bench, if he stays.
Is there absolutley nothing that Wilson can do to prove to you he can throw with the best in the league?



Grow 2 inches, stop running the football unless chased out of the pocket, throw more while completing at least 60% of his passes. Basically, be more like Tom Brady and Peyton Manning.
I never thought Caroll would go for an athletic QB like that either given his history at USC. But Wilson can make the same throws those QB's can AND give an extra dimension by keeping defenses honest. I'm not going to bash you or try to make you think differently because it won't work and I really don't want you to think different Laughing . But to me wilson is making strides to being a prolific passer in this league. He's improving on not running after two seconds in the pocket. Even when he does run outside he's always looking up field to throw the ball. As much as you hate him and don't want to support him, everything you dislike he's improving on(besides height, ha). It's like he's read your posts and picked those exactly to fix. So you are contributing to the team. Wink


i thought this was an on going joke but looks like its serious! Even funnier haha! idc what kind of qb we have as long as we win!
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SupeRG00F


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dools=hawks wrote:
SupeRG00F wrote:
I never thought Caroll would go for an athletic QB like that either given his history at USC. But Wilson can make the same throws those QB's can AND give an extra dimension by keeping defenses honest. I'm not going to bash you or try to make you think differently because it won't work and I really don't want you to think different Laughing . But to me wilson is making strides to being a prolific passer in this league. He's improving on not running after two seconds in the pocket. Even when he does run outside he's always looking up field to throw the ball. As much as you hate him and don't want to support him, everything you dislike he's improving on(besides height, ha). It's like he's read your posts and picked those exactly to fix. So you are contributing to the team. Wink


i thought this was an on going joke but looks like its serious! Even funnier haha! idc what kind of qb we have as long as we win!
Hey man, Osprey just isn't understood. There's no reason to bash the hell out of him because he want's something specific for the team, no matter how crazy. It's a shame he's lost joy in the team because of it. I hated Hasselbeck, he made me now want to follow the team(even though it was mostly the o-lines fault.) I'm just trying to see why Osprey feels the way he does and he answered. Everyone chiiiillll Cool
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slender1


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 5:28 pm    Post subject: "hope that Wilson can lead" Reply with quote

SwiftTexan wrote:
I've long been an Osprey sympathizer and I can definitely see where he's coming from so I'll offer my 2 cents. I personally think it's fun to watch a QB break a long run but mostly because I play fantasy football and I can just see the points accumulating (1-1 point ratio for rushing yards, 0.25-1 point ratio for passing yards).

In the past three weeks I've definitely become a fan of Russell Wilson because he's playing mostly mistake free football (for a rookie) and we're winning games and who doesn't love winning? I think he gives us a chance to win every Sunday and that's a good thing. I was actually really critical of him earlier in the season, although not on this board, because he wasn't using his legs. That's a god-given ability right there and to not use that to your advantage is blasphemous. He's been running a lot more lately - be it the read option, scrambles, bootlegs or designed runs - and that's good because Wilson can RUN!



Here's my only critique of Russell. The history of the Superbowl has been entirely dominated by tall, strong-armed, pocket passers who can sit behind the line, dissect defenses and sling it to receivers in tight windows. Wilson makes some great throws but he's not that type of QB that we're talking about in the aforementioned description. It worries me because until he proves he can win it all - it's kind of like going on a date with a girl who just wants to be your friend. You can try all you want to get the big score but you're just not her type and she'll never let you past the goal line. So I'm optimistic because I want to see the Seahawks succeed but part of me worries we'll just be like the Eagles with McNabb - contenders but never successful. I like the win games and be in the playoffs every year but I'd trade it all for one SuperBowl win. I hope Wilson can lead us there and I'm a fan because I like his style of play but I think I'd still trade him for a more traditional QB. Call me crazy but that's how I think.

PS - Not comparing Wilson to McNabb but more that the Eagles were always in the playoffs but could never win it.


One of the noteworthy qualities of Russell's history is his Leadership, a quality he shares with Drew Brees (who is ONE INCH taller than RusselL)
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SaveourSonics


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheOsprey wrote:
You bring up Robert Griffin for whatever reason. Personally, I wouldn't want him on my team either, because I don't like that style of football. I like pure pocket passers. I was hoping Wilson would be more like Warren Moon and less like Doug Flutie, but apparently that isn't gonna happen.


You don't understand. You're right, I don't care what your preferences are. I could not care less if you like mobile QBs or pocket QBs. I don't even care if you like Wilson.

But what you're doing is avoiding facts. You're somehow allowing your preferences dictate your evaluation of him as a player, which is just silly to put it lightly. How can you not admit that he's playing great football for a rookie right now? Let's look at Peyton's rookie season. I'll take Wilson's. Wilson is playing great football right now and has progressed immensely since week 1. I don't care if you never like him, but to refuse to admit you were wrong about how good he would be in the league is sad. Let's be honest, you never expected him to have this kind of success in the league because you HATED his size. You never would have believed me in the preseason if I told you he'd have the highest single game QBR of ANY QB in the league. You wouldn't have believed me if I told you he would have this team in a position to win the division going into the final 2 weeks. You wouldn't have believed me if I told you he'd be in the conversation for ROY.

That's my point. He's already better than you ever expected him to be.
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Brown_Mamba


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Soooo yeahhhhh....about Matt Flynn......
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SaveourSonics


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brown_Mamba wrote:
Soooo yeahhhhh....about Matt Flynn......


Hey take that crap to the Matt Flynn thread!

Oh wait...
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SwiftTexan


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 12:18 am    Post subject: Re: "hope that Wilson can lead" Reply with quote

slender1 wrote:
SwiftTexan wrote:
I've long been an Osprey sympathizer and I can definitely see where he's coming from so I'll offer my 2 cents. I personally think it's fun to watch a QB break a long run but mostly because I play fantasy football and I can just see the points accumulating (1-1 point ratio for rushing yards, 0.25-1 point ratio for passing yards).

In the past three weeks I've definitely become a fan of Russell Wilson because he's playing mostly mistake free football (for a rookie) and we're winning games and who doesn't love winning? I think he gives us a chance to win every Sunday and that's a good thing. I was actually really critical of him earlier in the season, although not on this board, because he wasn't using his legs. That's a god-given ability right there and to not use that to your advantage is blasphemous. He's been running a lot more lately - be it the read option, scrambles, bootlegs or designed runs - and that's good because Wilson can RUN!



Here's my only critique of Russell. The history of the Superbowl has been entirely dominated by tall, strong-armed, pocket passers who can sit behind the line, dissect defenses and sling it to receivers in tight windows. Wilson makes some great throws but he's not that type of QB that we're talking about in the aforementioned description. It worries me because until he proves he can win it all - it's kind of like going on a date with a girl who just wants to be your friend. You can try all you want to get the big score but you're just not her type and she'll never let you past the goal line. So I'm optimistic because I want to see the Seahawks succeed but part of me worries we'll just be like the Eagles with McNabb - contenders but never successful. I like the win games and be in the playoffs every year but I'd trade it all for one SuperBowl win. I hope Wilson can lead us there and I'm a fan because I like his style of play but I think I'd still trade him for a more traditional QB. Call me crazy but that's how I think.

PS - Not comparing Wilson to McNabb but more that the Eagles were always in the playoffs but could never win it.


One of the noteworthy qualities of Russell's history is his Leadership, a quality he shares with Drew Brees (who is ONE INCH taller than RusselL)


First of all - I'm pretty flattered that after 6 years on the forum this was your first post. Apparently my critique of Wilson was enough to bring you out of your shell.

I don't think the Drew Brees example is accurate - they are different players. Brees is much more of a pocket passer (and almost 2 inches taller by the way).

I think Wilson compares more favourably to Warren Moon, John Elway, Steve McNair, Steve Young, Randall Cunningham and ironically - Jim Harbaugh. He's a runner and that sets him apart. He's just a different kind of QB and we're just not used to seeing those guys win Superbowls - maybe it's the beginning of a new era with guys like this but we were told Vick was supposed to usher in a new era and its' been nothing but stand-still pocket QBs hoisting the trophy every year.

EDIT: I realise that some of the guys I compared Wilson to have won superbowls which seems to contradict my point but I still think the height is the issue. When Drew Brees came out people thought he was too short but his supporters said "He's only a couple inches shorter than so-and-so" - But I ask you - what happens if in the 2015 draft there's a QB with a great arm, leadership and all that stuff but he's 5'9" and you say - "He's only a couple inches shorter than Russell Wilson!" and then ten years later there's a QB that's 5'7" and you say "He's only a couple inches shorter than that guy!" Where does it end? There are reasons why having a QB that is short is bad and there are reasons why having a QB that is tall is bad. Why didn't Mutombo become a QB instead of a shot blocking basketball player? I'm not sure what my point is here other than to say I think it's silly to say "He's only a couple inches shorter than Brees" because Brees is already borderline not tall enough so being shorter than him is not a good thing - it's a bad thing. It's not a defense but rather an indictment of Wilson.


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Dr.Seahawk


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 6:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boring football.........really? Boring is 1st and 10 and running it.....2 and 7 and running it..... 3 and 5......screen play......or take a sack hass.... yeah no thanks. Hass was my favorite hawk, but him and holmgren drove me nuts, game after game, after game after game. THAT was boring. To be honest, even when Alexander was running for the record TD's I was bored. You put Lynch behind that same line and Dickerson's record is BLOWN away. Shaun ran like a girl and still racked up big yards.

We still pound the rock and set up the pass, so I dont know what your deal is? You dont like having a QB that doesnt throw it away when the blocking breaks down? Or can roll out of the pocket? Extend the play? This kid is smart, has a good arm (as good as hass or better IMO)

Wilson will own all our QB records when things are said and done and bring us a superbowl win. Franchise QB.
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SupeRG00F


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dr.Seahawk wrote:
Boring football.........really? Boring is 1st and 10 and running it.....2 and 7 and running it..... 3 and 5......screen play......or take a sack hass.... yeah no thanks. Hass was my favorite hawk, but him and holmgren drove me nuts, game after game, after game after game. THAT was boring. To be honest, even when Alexander was running for the record TD's I was bored. You put Lynch behind that same line and Dickerson's record is BLOWN away. Shaun ran like a girl and still racked up big yards.

We still pound the rock and set up the pass, so I dont know what your deal is? You dont like having a QB that doesnt throw it away when the blocking breaks down? Or can roll out of the pocket? Extend the play? This kid is smart, has a good arm (as good as hass or better IMO)

Wilson will own all our QB records when things are said and done and bring us a superbowl win. Franchise QB.
I'm guessing Osprey is around 40 years old (hope i'm right, if not Embarassed ) so he's used to seeing the old school style of football, he doesn't like this "new generation" of QB play. And like I said earlier, it's a shame it's pushing him away from the up and coming Seahawks who seem to just be getting better. (except run D)

Yes everyone think's he's crazy and wrong and he should just get overhimself and join us, but his opinion on what he likes is valid. You could argue against it, but it won't do any good. I think he's said that too Laughing .
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Dr.Seahawk


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 7:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To each his own I suppose. My love of the sport and our team is much deeper then our style of QB and his size.....Hard to argue with the results Wilson is putting up.
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BBIB


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SaveourSonics wrote:
You are truly sad.

Why should I care how we score if we're putting up 50+ points? Why should it matter if it's "boring football" if it's winning games? At the end of the day, that's what matters. Try evaluating him for what matters and not by what YOU prefer. Who gives a damn what YOU prefer if this way is winning games and blowing teams out. Your perspective is ridiculous.

As for having 60% completion %, Wilson is north of 62% on the year. He has 30+ LESS rushing attempts than Robert Griffin. Is Griffin a bad rookie QB? He also leads rookies in total TDs....you know...the stat that wins games and actually matters. Not your preferences. Luck has less than 60% completion %, is he a bad rookie QB?

Oh, and sorry Russell Wilson isn't Tom Brady or Peyton Manning yet. Actually, sorry that 99% of all NFL QBs in the history of the game aren't Tom Brady or Peyton Manning. Wilson is having an amazing rookie season, and if you can't acknowledge that than your opinion is worthless on the entire matter.

Wilson is a huge reason that Lynch is having the success he is this season. The 50 yarder he had against the Bills last week came on a read option where Wilson gave it to Lynch after suckering the defense into thinking he'd be running it. Our dual threat QB is doing more for the running game than Peyton or Tom could at this point. He's making all of the right decisions and has grown immensely throughout the year. If you don't see that, you probably aren't even watching games. Stop pointing to his amount of attempts, he has no control over that. Let's look at things he does have control over. Despite having nearly 200 LESS attempts than Andrew Luck, he has more passing TDs. That's a stat that Wilson can control. He can also control the amount of games we win, which is more than even you predicted we'd have with him under center. He can also control how many INTs he throws, which is less than a lot of veterans in this league. He can control how many fumbles he has, which is less than Luck despite him running less than Wilson. He can control his YPA, which is more than Luck and Griffin.

Just swallow your pride already. You've been proven wrong. I was proven wrong. We now have the franchise QB of our Seattle Seahawks.


It's hilarious because Russell Wilson haters have retracted from the stance that he's not a starting caliber QB, to that his ceiling is Mark Sanchez, to now saying that he's not Tom Brady or Peyton Manning

I literally laughed out loud when I saw that. I mean not only are most QBs who are drafted in the FIRST round not even All-Pro caliber, but the not Peyton Manning or Tom Brady comment, really?

Really? Have Russell Wilson detractors backtracked to that?

And I'm always fascinated by the dual threat Qb being boring assessment. If anything, unpredictability is more exciting but maybe it's just me

But the admission that one would prefer a certain style of play over team success is very revealing

I saw the same revealing comments from Bronco fans last year with Tebow compared to Brady Quinn/Orton
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 12:05 pm    Post subject: Re: "hope that Wilson can lead" Reply with quote

SwiftTexan wrote:


First of all - I'm pretty flattered that after 6 years on the forum this was your first post. Apparently my critique of Wilson was enough to bring you out of your shell.

I don't think the Drew Brees example is accurate - they are different players. Brees is much more of a pocket passer (and almost 2 inches taller by the way).

I think Wilson compares more favourably to Warren Moon, John Elway, Steve McNair, Steve Young, Randall Cunningham and ironically - Jim Harbaugh. He's a runner and that sets him apart. He's just a different kind of QB and we're just not used to seeing those guys win Superbowls - maybe it's the beginning of a new era with guys like this but we were told Vick was supposed to usher in a new era and its' been nothing but stand-still pocket QBs hoisting the trophy every year.

EDIT: I realise that some of the guys I compared Wilson to have won superbowls which seems to contradict my point but I still think the height is the issue. When Drew Brees came out people thought he was too short but his supporters said "He's only a couple inches shorter than so-and-so" - But I ask you - what happens if in the 2015 draft there's a QB with a great arm, leadership and all that stuff but he's 5'9" and you say - "He's only a couple inches shorter than Russell Wilson!" and then ten years later there's a QB that's 5'7" and you say "He's only a couple inches shorter than that guy!" Where does it end? There are reasons why having a QB that is short is bad and there are reasons why having a QB that is tall is bad. Why didn't Mutombo become a QB instead of a shot blocking basketball player? I'm not sure what my point is here other than to say I think it's silly to say "He's only a couple inches shorter than Brees" because Brees is already borderline not tall enough so being shorter than him is not a good thing - it's a bad thing. It's not a defense but rather an indictment of Wilson.


QBs with defensive supporting casts win Super Bowls with almost no exceptions

In fact the few exceptions statistically in the regular season in recent years in the Giants, Saints, and Colts had defenses that stepped up their level of play in the post-season

That's why Peyton Manning won it in a post-season where Peyton Manning had twice as many turnovers as TDs

That's why the Giants defense held the historically great Patriots offense to 14 and 17 points respectively in the post-season

That's why the Saints defense made big plays against 3 former all-PRO Qbs in the playoffs in Kurt Warner, Brett Favre, and sealed the Super Bowl with a pick six vs Peyton Manning.

Winning a Super Bowl has never had anything to do with height, it's just a pattern people have found and tried to make relevant

Kind of like when Peyton Manning was drafted it was a silly article saying that Drew Bledsoe was the only QB who was 6'5 or taller who had even made a Super Bowl


And the idea that 6'2 is an advantage over 5'10 when it comes to seeing over a 6'5 offensive linemen is laughable

You don't throw over people you throw in passing lanes. And it's release point and the size of a QB's hands that matter far more considering if you're 6'6 but have a release point like you're 6'0 it negates your height

Russell Wilson's height hasn't been an impediment in him having a chance to break Peyton Manning's rookie TD record by being far more efficient while doing it

And if the Seahawks fail to reach a Super Bowl this year it won't be because Russell Wilson was too short

If the Seahawks come up short, it will be because they get outplayed and it will probably be because of inexperience showing up in a hostile environment on the road
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